Not even sure what to really say to this.

whisper2053

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As a lot of you are already aware, I am a currently serving active duty Soldier in the U.S. Army, and stationed in Europe for the time being. As such, a large part of the current government shutdown back home has yet to really reach me personally, but I DO follow what is going on with rather avid interest.

Today, the following article has come to my attention. The thread title pretty much sums up my thoughts on this...

http://www.defenseone.com/management/2013/10/shutdown-shame-denying-troop-death-benefits/71480/

Call it a promise placed on hold.

On Saturday, a U.S. Marine was killed in Helmand province. On Sunday, four troops were killed by an IED in southern Afghanistan. Until the shutdown ends, none of their families can expect to receive the “death gratuity” of $100,000 promised to immediately reach them within 24 to 36 hours. Grieving families also cannot expect the military to cover all the usual costs of family travel to meet their loved ones returning home for burial in American flag-draped coffins through Dover Air Force Base. And if the shutdown continues into November, monthly survivor benefits are in jeopardy because the Department of Veterans Affairs has warned it will be out of cash to pay them.

Never before has America faced a government at war and a government shutdown at the same time. Even if much of America forgets the former while enduring the latter, the grim truth of these dueling realities is that they should not coexist given Washington’s central role in prosecuting America’s conflicts.

Now, on the anniversary of America’s longest war, in Afghanistan, a battle that barely brushes against most Americans’ lives, soldiers heading into the fight face greater uncertainty than ever before. That includes the central question of what happens to their families if they don’t make it home.

The death gratuity’s purpose, the Army notes, is to “help the survivors in their readjustment and to aid them in meeting immediate expenses incurred.” Advocates say that bereaved military families they work with often use the money to cover funeral costs, to pay for family travel and to bridge the sudden end to a spouse’s regular paycheck, which cuts off immediately upon death. Life insurance payments continue to be paid, but those typically take a week or so to arrive and, when they do, come in a book of bank drafts that must be deposited in a bank. The death gratuity, by contrast, arrives by electronic transfer for immediate use.

The Pentagon readily acknowledges the benefits breach, but says its hands are tied.

“We've had a number of people die recently and we will be able to pay them, but not until the lapse of appropriation ends,” Pentagon Comptroller Bob Hale said in a phone briefing Friday to explain Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel’s interpretation of last week’s Pay Our Military Act. “We're trying to be helpful through aid societies and others to the family members who are involved in these tragic circumstances. But unfortunately, we don't have the legal authority to make those payments.”

Lawmakers hastily assembled the bill to keep military paychecks coming despite Washington’s shutdown -- and to show Congress and the White House’s commitment to America’s troops despite their mistrust of one another. But the measure’s vague language has sown widespread confusion among active duty military and their families as to what the law does and does not cover. All the questions and the death gratuity’s shutdown-induced stoppage have left active duty troops, some of whom ship off to war this very week, to wonder what will happen if they are killed in action, leaving their wives, mothers, children and husbands behind?

After all, the casualties of war do not stop just because Washington does.

“These benefits are in place to help support people who paid the ultimate price in service to their country, and for our families it is really important that these supports be there,” says Ami Neiberger-Miller of the Tragedy Assistance Program for Survivors, or TAPS, which advocates on behalf of military families. Neiberger-Miller’s brother was killed in Iraq six years ago and she remembers how important the death gratuity was to her family at the time. “These benefits were created by design to support people during the most tragic and terrible moments of their life.”

Hale called the situation “heart-rending.” But he said that the Pentagon is simply “not allowed, by law,” to pay the money due families while the government is shut down.

Advocates working overtime to help survivors figure out travel costs and manage the financial unknowns say that families already reeling from the devastation of loss now suffer a second time -- this time at the hands of a government failing those who give their lives in its service.

“They are benefits that are promised by our country, by all of us, to these families,” Neiberger-Miller says. “When the serviceman swears that oath that says ‘I will protect and defend,’ we make a promise back to that person that if they do die in service to this country that we will take care of their family.”

Right now Washington seems only to be taking care of itself.

I weep for our future if petty rivalries among political parties that should never have existed in the first place have reduced us to...this.

I know that many on here will not really care about this, and most are not touched by this sort of thing directly, but I felt that I had to share. If you read this far...thank you.
 

StevenK

ng.com SFII tournament winner 2002-2023
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This is all starting to make the US look very silly right now, some people need to grow up.

Edit - if the government suddenly can't pay out the money it owes, the citizens should stop paying the government the tax monies they owe. I'm 100% sure there has been something set up to make this illegal though, it never works both ways with government.
 
Last edited:

Rot

Calvin & Hobbes, ,
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Sadly this is really... really.. really stupid. I find all this to be an extortion. They will do anything to get over with this shutdown situation.

Advice -get yourself home soldier. You better than all know that serving abroad has nothing to do with the heavily pushed agenda of "keeping us safe in America".
 

68k

Tung Fu Rue's Prize Student
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The shutdown is designed to draw attention and be as painful to the general public as possible.

Unfortunately, this forum is as blue as makismo's balls, so you won't get much support here.
 

Teddy KGB

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Of all the budgeted items to cut... :( Hopefully this shit is over soon.
 

Lemony Vengeance

Mitt Romney's Hairdresser,
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personally I think BOTH SIDES are wrong, and they're placing the american citizens in the middle. Time for us to replace every last one of them.
 

GutsDozer

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Terrible. If our Government can't pay the men and women fighting and dying to protect us that's just sad. The Government shutdown and won't pay our military but they still sure in the hell are still collecting taxes. It's sickening.
 

GohanX

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I couldn't read all of the article, it was pissing me of too much. I would consider this pretty fucking essential.
 

Jibbajaba

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personally I think BOTH SIDES are wrong, and they're placing the american citizens in the middle. Time for us to replace every last one of them.

This is exactly how I feel. Having anyone blame one party or the other is exactly what they want. The fact is that almost all politicians in Washington are dirty and the system itself is broken.
 

Phyeir

My only regret is that I have... Boneitis!
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And the screwdown continues.

Can't be bothered to keep open air memorials open, but the House gym is still open.

That's peanuts compared to the real issues in all this but it just illustrates this is all about making things uncomfortable for the average citizen, on our own dime, by the way.
 

El Maricon Loco

Galford's Poppy Trainer,
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The whole thing is fucked, there really is no excuse for this, there are really no excuses for issues and stances on both sides. You'd have to be a fucking moron to be a hardline proponent of either side of our political diaper bag as it stands.

I have a good mind to go down there and start whipping my gold bars at people's heads.

Gold Or Diamonds cares about teh people.
 

evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
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paying off the survivors of a dead soldier on time...

wow.

like the family's problems begin and end there. Doesn't matter if the families wait for money. They should be busy grieving. Besides, that money is only going to our Communist Azn masters as they go crazy at Walmart.
 

Dr Shroom

made it in japan
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Terrible. If our Government can't pay the men and women fighting and dying to protect us that's just sad.

Protect you from what exactly? Some ragheads from the other side of the world? Oh and their women and children too, fuck them, they deserve to get drone-bombed.
Those fuckers I tell you, trying to take away your freedom! How dare they! Just because they never tasted the sweet fruit of freedum! Just jealous IMO.
 

ggallegos1

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sad. I'm a reservist, so we didn't have drill (no check this month), but that's chump change compared to the benefits that those soldiers were expecting their families to have if they passed being robbed due to sheer stubbornness. I would hate to be deployed right now and think "Man, if i go on this route and we get hit, and I die, my family won't be taken care of. at all." Talk about a morale kill.

it's sad that things are the way they are. Politicians who we elected had the power to change things, however they just sit and continue to get paid while the people who they are sworn to represent and protect suffer. assholes.
 

famicommander

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If you're concerned about your family getting checks in the event you die in a war during a government shut down, I advise not fighting in a war of aggression in the first place. Sorry, but I have no sympathy for anyone who works for any government in any fashion. If your income comes from government you are a thief. The money you are paid was expropriated by force from someone else. You have no right to complain about your income being taken away because your income is itself stolen.

They should actually shut down the government, instead of just shutting down some bullshit and then pointing fingers at each other for it.

I didn't ask anyone to cross the ocean and shoot any brown people on my behalf. I shouldn't have to support your family if you end up getting killed by one of the people whose country you're obliterating. Don't ever give me the bullshit that you're protecting anyone's freedom, either.
 

DangerousK

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If you're concerned about your family getting checks in the event you die in a war during a government shut down, I advise not fighting in a war of aggression in the first place. Sorry, but I have no sympathy for anyone who works for any government in any fashion. If your income comes from government you are a thief. The money you are paid was expropriated by force from someone else. You have no right to complain about your income being taken away because your income is itself stolen.

They should actually shut down the government, instead of just shutting down some bullshit and then pointing fingers at each other for it.

I didn't ask anyone to cross the ocean and shoot any brown people on my behalf. I shouldn't have to support your family if you end up getting killed by one of the people whose country you're obliterating. Don't ever give me the bullshit that you're protecting anyone's freedom, either.

So are you one of these dumb shit anarchists that thinks they are so cutting edge? Maybe you run around at Halloween with the hoodie and face covered to look like a real rebel. One day you will be sucking on the government teat like those you claim to hate so much.
 

evil wasabi

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The government is bloated right now, and it is growing. People are seeking government positions because they have no idea what else they can do that has benefits and security. But in terms of an Adam Smith view, they are non productive members of the economy, and that's bad. The bigger public industry becomes, and the greater the magnitude of public service, the more risk our country faces to bankruptcy. But never has a country been bankrupted by private endeavor.
 

OMFG

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If you're concerned about your family getting checks in the event you die in a war during a government shut down, I advise not fighting in a war of aggression in the first place. Sorry, but I have no sympathy for anyone who works for any government in any fashion. If your income comes from government you are a thief. The money you are paid was expropriated by force from someone else. You have no right to complain about your income being taken away because your income is itself stolen.

They should actually shut down the government, instead of just shutting down some bullshit and then pointing fingers at each other for it.

I didn't ask anyone to cross the ocean and shoot any brown people on my behalf. I shouldn't have to support your family if you end up getting killed by one of the people whose country you're obliterating. Don't ever give me the bullshit that you're protecting anyone's freedom, either.

The National Guard and Reservists that helped your state during the wildfires and flooding this year are affected by this as well.
 

famicommander

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The National Guard and Reservists that helped your state during the wildfires and flooding this year are affected by this as well.
So?

Emergency response happens amongst private individuals all the time and the scope and efficiency of emergency response and disaster relief would be much more vast absent the government security blanket. Government is inefficient, reactionary, and corrupt. One of the reasons the damage was so bad was because people seem to be of the mind that the state is responsible for their safety in an emergency.
 

Pope Sazae

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So?

Emergency response happens amongst private individuals all the time and the scope and efficiency of emergency response and disaster relief would be much more vast absent the government security blanket. Government is inefficient, reactionary, and corrupt. One of the reasons the damage was so bad was because people seem to be of the mind that the state is responsible for their safety in an emergency.

How old are you? No way you are older than 21, hell you are probably just another dumb shit teenager.
 

DangerousK

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So?

Emergency response happens amongst private individuals all the time and the scope and efficiency of emergency response and disaster relief would be much more vast absent the government security blanket. Government is inefficient, reactionary, and corrupt. One of the reasons the damage was so bad was because people seem to be of the mind that the state is responsible for their safety in an emergency.

Hopefully you won't be begging for help if a wildfire is about to burn your humble abode down.

Even better would be if you are trapped in it, begging and crying like a little girl for help.
 

hyper

fresh out of fucks
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bans guns at home

sends them to islamist syria
 

OMFG

The Portuguese Chop
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So?

Emergency response happens amongst private individuals all the time and the scope and efficiency of emergency response and disaster relief would be much more vast absent the government security blanket. Government is inefficient, reactionary, and corrupt. One of the reasons the damage was so bad was because people seem to be of the mind that the state is responsible for their safety in an emergency.

Around 1999, my unit was assigned to help rescue those trapped due to Hurricane Floyd. Part of the task force I was assigned to noticed that there were people trapped in basements. Most EMTs and rescue services were spread thin due to the inability (or funding). When we went in, we pulled out a family from the basement that drowned. Had we have gotten the word sooner from the municipality, we would've swept the area quicker even while the water was still rising.


Also, you mentioned that all that receive income from the government are thieves. So by your logic, this means that those that collect Social Security are also "thieves".

Your shitty attempt to troll this thread is laughable.
 

Poonman

macebronian
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DangerousK, I dunno man....

Ad hominem attacks, wishing death and insulting someone for voicing displeasure with the status quo?
What the fuck....

Anyway, I've worked on 2 army bases so far...most of these "soldiers" are just rejects who can't get a job anywhere else, lot of lesbians just dyking it out with their GFs, lots of kids training for a few hours then playing CoD for the rest of the day, some are young dads trying to make ends meet......I'd say 1% of the population on ANY domestic army base has any business working as professional killers for the government.

The rest of them are a waste of time and money.
 
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