OFFICIAL N-G.com Star Trek Thread

aria

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rarehero

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Yeah, it was also bumped at the same time the War Room thread was bumped. I'll just add here what I did there: after losing touch with the show during its first broadcast season, I watched all of DS9 on Netflix and I now feel that it's my favorite Trek show, hands down. Once you get past the "generic Trek blah" episodes of the first 2 seasons, it gets great from seasons 3-7 and is, on average, better per episode than TNG was (though TNG had some of the best episodes in all Trek during that run). I'm mad it took me this long to watch it; they really benefited from being the "dark sheep" and basically being allowed to do whatever while the main Trek producers focused on what they thought would be TNG2: Voyager. I'd stopped watching Voyager after only a few episodes in its first run, and after using Netflix to watch what were supposed to be the "great" episodes and that craptacular Finale, I am glad I didn't bother with it. On the flip side, I'd heard people recommend the final two seasons Enterprise (another one I dropped in its first season) and I was pleasantly surprised--I think that show was finally getting very interesting thanks to a new writer, but too late. I am of the belief that Berman and Braga ruined everything.

It's probably been mentioned elsewhere, but I also recommend the Memory Alpha wiki as an episode companion (I keep it open on my phone as I watch episodes); the people there seem to have transcribed all the best stuff from the book companions as welll as other stuff found from mags and online (e.g. Ron Moore's extensive chat comments about his time on DS9, where you really see all the early versions of concepts he used to make BSG so popular).

Welcome to the dark side.
 

NeoSneth

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Naw. I feel the same way after watching an entire series on Netflix. I even felt that way about Voyager when i finished it.

Let them all simmer for a while after a netflix a thon.
 

SonGohan

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This thread has made me sit down and actually give DS9 a chance. I'm downloading the first season now.
 
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I still think Enterprise is underrated. I enjoyed it quite a lot.

I've never really watched Voyager or DS9 to be honest. Heck, I was way late to the party on TNG as well. TOS is where it's at!

I still enjoy watching episodes here and there but I fear BSG ruined me.
 
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aria

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This thread has made me sit down and actually give DS9 a chance. I'm downloading the first season now.

Be patient with the first two seasons, especially the first one. Move Along Home is so awful it hurts. Once you get through it the good/bad ratio improves on TNG.
 

gum_drops

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I still think Enterprise is underrated. I enjoyed it quite a lot.

I feel the same, it has it's bland episodes like most any series, but I found the majority of them to be entertaining.

I couldn't get into Voyager, I may give it another try sometime but the first several episodes just didn't do much for me.
 

CrackerMessiah

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Be patient with the first two seasons, especially the first one. Move Along Home is so awful it hurts. Once you get through it the good/bad ratio improves on TNG.

This bears an idle quote on a video game site for the sake of emphasis.
 

SonGohan

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Be patient with the first two seasons, especially the first one. Move Along Home is so awful it hurts. Once you get through it the good/bad ratio improves on TNG.

I'm really bad at waiting for shows to get good. Do I have to watch the first two seasons, or can I hop right to the 3rd?

I was told to wait for The Wire to get good, but I couldn't stay interested. I'm kind of like a 6 year old with tv shows.
 

aria

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I'm really bad at waiting for shows to get good. Do I have to watch the first two seasons, or can I hop right to the 3rd?

I was told to wait for The Wire to get good, but I couldn't stay interested. I'm kind of like a 6 year old with tv shows.

I actually think the 2nd season isn't bad at all, just a meh episode here or there. The first also has some good episodes that help set the stage for later.

In fact, if you're a TNG fan you won't find an episode that goes below the very worst of that show in its early seasons. In fact many of the "mediocre" episodes in the first two seasons just felt like TNG episodes on a space station. By mid-way through season two they started digging into the fact that the station isn't moving so they can't change the aliens or morals on a week to week basis as it suits them.

I can tell you to skip the following from the first two seasons with no repercussions (no major threads or characters are introduced): "Move Along Home" and "If Wishes Were Horses" from the first season, "Melora" from the second. That really removes the worst of the entire series, IMO. I'm not a fan of "Second Sight" or "Rivals" from the second season, either --but they were just meh Star Trek, not awful.
 

SonGohan

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I really, really liked the first episode. The second was pretty good. I'm surprised I'm liking it as much as I am. Every time I saw it on tv I completely dismissed it because it wasn't TNG.

I guess my body is ready for it, now..
 

aria

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I really, really liked the first episode. The second was pretty good. I'm surprised I'm liking it as much as I am. Every time I saw it on tv I completely dismissed it because it wasn't TNG.

I guess my body is ready for it, now..

Glad you're liking it so far.

Yeah, it helps that people made it out to be awful when it first came out for not being TNG and not being as uplifiting at times. Honestly, I don't think the "bad" episodes, save for Move Along Home, are all that awful. As for Move Along Home, I read on the Memory Alpha article that they kept cutting down the original idea until they got something really stupid. It also falls victim to a flaw they had early on where aliens would consist of "who's coming through the wormhole this week?": they wouldn't appear again and basically were handled in the same way TNG would visit a planet and never hear from it again. Season one develops the basics of Bajoran/Cardie stuff, the second season starts to add more layers. "If Wishes Were Horses" is just a tad too silly (but would've been a typical early-TNG episode); "Melora" tries to have a social message but never really gels (even the original writer was kind of disappointed).
 

Zero Satori

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Just as a suggestion (if one is considering skipping-about Enterprise): I found that every episode with Andorians drove me wild; the relationship between Johnathan "I'm a good guy but I have to do bad things" Archer and a race of "I don't care about anyone else but I'm not completely sadistic" people forged perhaps the best juxtaposition of Federation standards with another world since the random outposts of Kirk's age.
 

aria

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Just as a suggestion (if one is considering skipping-about Enterprise): I found that every episode with Andorians drove me wild; the relationship between Johnathan "I'm a good guy but I have to do bad things" Archer and a race of "I don't care about anyone else but I'm not completely sadistic" people forged perhaps the best juxtaposition of Federation standards with another world since the random outposts of Kirk's age.

Jeffery Combs, who was awesome as the Andorian captain, absolutely killed it on DS9.
 

Comrade Porn King Mikhail

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I was told to wait for The Wire to get good, but I couldn't stay interested. I'm kind of like a 6 year old with tv shows.

I was sucked in within the first two episodes. If The Wire doesn't click right off the bat, it's unlikely to be any different down the line.

I gave Voyager a full season and gave up. Even going through a few scant Borg episodes down the line, I couldn't get attached to the characters. All this talk of DS9 makes me want to go through it again, but I'm unlikely to convince the gf to give it a shot.
 

SonGohan

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That's the first time I've read that about the wire. Every time that show is brought up I've always heard that you gotta give it time.

As far as DS9, I'm really loving the show. I'm glad I started from the beginning, because now I'm invested in the characters. Seeing Q so early on was a pleasant surprise, too. It's actually a pretty smart move on their part to have Chief O'brien as a main character, as well as other TNG characters come and go. It gives it a sense of familiarity, while building up the new cast. I'm actually excited I have a bunch of seasons left to go.
 

Lagduf

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Season 3 and 4 of the Wire are the best I think, but I think season 1 is quite good. Only season you have to possibly sit through and give it a chance is season 2 which starts slow and has some real terrible characters.

One day I will sit down and watch DS9 all the way through.
 

Comrade Porn King Mikhail

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That's the first time I've read that about the wire. Every time that show is brought up I've always heard that you gotta give it time.

As far as DS9, I'm really loving the show. I'm glad I started from the beginning, because now I'm invested in the characters. Seeing Q so early on was a pleasant surprise, too. It's actually a pretty smart move on their part to have Chief O'brien as a main character, as well as other TNG characters come and go. It gives it a sense of familiarity, while building up the new cast. I'm actually excited I have a bunch of seasons left to go.

Agreed. When they focus less on the kids and more on the struggles of the Federation to contain a new threat, the show really picks up steam.

With The Wire, yes the future seasons have amazing character developments and superb story-telling. But really it all starts in the beginning and just expands upon the universe. It's like Mad Men. Sure, the characters evolve and new people come into the mix, but if you don't like who/what Don Draper and the ad agency are in the beginning, it's unlikely to really change all that much down the line.

I know that first judgements are not the best way to evaluate a show, but a lot of times they can very accurate and can spare a lot of time. Watching the first several episodes of Justified, I knew that no matter what Timothy Olyphant did he would not live up to my expectations of him in Deadwood. The best of the shows that I've seen, catch you immediately and never let up. ST:TNG is probably one of the few examples for me where there is a stark difference in quality between the first season and the later episodes (I feel like I'll get yelled at for this).

If you're like me in this case (somewhat less patience for shows), I just wouldn't recommend watching the rest of The Wire if the first, say, three episodes don't draw you in.
 
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I was sucked in within the first two episodes. If The Wire doesn't click right off the bat, it's unlikely to be any different down the line.

I gave Voyager a full season and gave up. Even going through a few scant Borg episodes down the line, I couldn't get attached to the characters. All this talk of DS9 makes me want to go through it again, but I'm unlikely to convince the gf to give it a shot.

It sounds like you need to track down a new girlfriend that hasn't seen DS9 yet. Problem solved.
 

SonGohan

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Honestly, I don't think the "bad" episodes, save for Move Along Home, are all that awful.

So I'm watching episodes, and enjoying them. Then I came across this, and all I could think about is the quote above. I almost don't want to watch it because I don't want it to ruin the show for me.

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aria

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Wow, that was an awful episode.

As far as I'm concerned, they only get better. I caught it back when it debuts and started to waver on DS9; when I went back through the ep still sucked but the series recovers from it quick.

However, thanks to it I like to say "Only children start at the first shap." Days from now you may start thinking "Allamaraine, count to four..." :uhoh:

I mentioned it earlier, but that was an episode where they apparently had an elaborate first draft with lots of cool scenes but then quickly found they couldn't afford anything and slapped together what you watched. Quark was especially painful, I think that was the worst portrayal of his character...well, there's one more season one or two episode (can't remember which) where he does something so outrageous at the beginning that Sisko should've sent him out an airlock, but as a character he isn't as annoying as he was in Move Along Home.

I'm enjoying hearing what you think of episodes.
 

Segata_Sanshiro

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A lot of the Voyager cast are having to quit acting and get real jobs now.

Has anyone ever been to a Star Trek convention? What's the male to female ratio like?
 
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