Former UK Prime Minister: "We are no longer a great power"

LoneSage

A Broken Man
20 Year Member
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/-we-are-no-longer-a-great-power-the-trouble-with-brexit

We are no longer a great power. We will never be so again. In a world of nearly eight billion people, well under one per cent are British.

We are a top second-rank power but, over the next half century – however well we perform – our small size and population makes it likely we will be passed by the growth of other, far larger, countries.

In recent decades, we have consoled ourselves that we “punch above our weight” in international affairs. I think that was true: but that was then, and this is now.

Pretty interesting speech. stevenk and other British folk, how did this make you feel?
 

StevenK

ng.com SFII tournament winner 2002-2023
10 Year Member
I haven't read the article as I should really be in bed now, but going off the excerpt, yeah, of course he's right. Britain's position in the world has long been untenable, we rode the wave of the industrial revolution well, having instigated it, but no wave lasts forever. We are a small nation with relatively few inhabitants and all outliers settle down eventually.

Our future as a nation of influence quite clearly to anyone with a couple of brain cells lied within the EU - much is made of Germany's control there but the EU speaks English and the legal framework is all English, our sway was equal to that of any nation and we are fools to ditch it.

But.

When I look around at the nations of the world with power, they are no longer the countries that interest me. I wouldn't want to live out my days in any of the G8 countries if I was handed a free pass to anywhere. I just want a peaceful life now, my ego, along with my patriotism, went out the window with my testosterone levels. I like historical buildings and cider, leave the flag waving to the 20 year old meatheads.
 

evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
20 Year Member
That's a weird point to make. Percentage of population never determined greatness until this age of conditioned self effacement, the equivalent of defending a mugger as a victim of white privilege.
 

lithy

Most Prominent Member of Chat
20 Year Member
Still got the bomb. That puts you in the top 10 at least.
 

Lagduf

2>X
20 Year Member
Just so we’re clear Pakistan also has the bomb and they’re nowhere near the top 10.

Or even top 100.

North Korea too :emb:
 

SouthtownKid

There are four lights
20 Year Member
That's a weird point to make. Percentage of population never determined greatness
Well, it wouldn't if they produced or innovated anything. Like Japan or South Korea or something. But they don't. Or if they were sitting on some desired natural resource, like oil or whatever. But they're not.

In terms of importance, they've been in irreversible decline for the past 70 years, and at a hyper accelerated rate for the past 40.
 

thermaltreasure

Ninja Combat Warrior
What did it mean to be a great power in the world? Influence? Exploitation? Decline was always going to happen, but the hyper acceleration of the past decade has been a sight to behold. We are now looking at the break up of the union and the cronyism/corruption is like something out of mid 90s Russia.

I absolutely despise Brexit with every fiber of my being. The sheer arrogance and ignorance displayed by Brits towards the EU boogeyman was kind of our start of all the conspiracy nonsense and misinformation. The EU as an institution is not perfect but ripping ourselves away from the Bloc is a terrible idea with a select few out to line their pockets.

That said, I think there will be a deal. The EU will work it to the wire, they don't fuck about. And the media will then paint the UK as having defeated the infidel, because that's the kind of retarded pork pie bowler hat mentality the country runs on. Except Kent the garden of England now looks like the moon
 

theMot

Reformed collector of junk
10 Year Member
In terms of importance, they've been in irreversible decline for the past 70 years, and at a hyper accelerated rate for the past 40.

This. Even though The allies won WW2, the casualty was Britain’s position as a world power. Saddled with debt, the country never figured out how to recover. Compare it to Germany who’s recovering was remarkable. Still a lot of old money there and it’s still an important trading market but it’s no super power. Australia used to be aligned strategically with Britain but since the 80’s our big brother is now the USA.
 

evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
20 Year Member
Well, it wouldn't if they produced or innovated anything. Like Japan or South Korea or something. But they don't. Or if they were sitting on some desired natural resource, like oil or whatever. But they're not.

In terms of importance, they've been in irreversible decline for the past 70 years, and at a hyper accelerated rate for the past 40.

Sitting on a natural resource hasn't made Saudis a world power. Producing electronics hasn't made Korea a world power.

World powers seem to be countries that have the clout to tell other countries what to do.

When the UK is forced to atone for their displacement of cultures over the past few centuries, then I will believe they are not a world power. Until then, they are just that creepy old father telling his children that he's broke and how some bum on the street has more than him.
 

@M

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,
20 Year Member
It doesn't have to be this way. Make Mr. Bean prime minister and you'll be top dog again by morning, even if the Koreans steal his precious Teddy and hold it for ransom.
 

LoneSage

A Broken Man
20 Year Member
The UK did Hong Kongers dirty. Granted, even in the 90s the UK knew they couldn't stand against a rising China - but they should've fought harder for the Hong Kongers.

PS: I'm glad the British Museum exists and I hope they never give in to the woke generation.
 
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evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
20 Year Member
The UK did Hong Kongers dirty. Granted, even in the 90s the UK knew they couldn't stand against a rising China - but they should've fought harder for the Hong Kongers.

PS: I'm glad the British Museum exists and I hope they never give in to the woke generation.

That's a fact. Hong Kongese people have a raw deal, but it's not like they don't get to hear "real news" all the time about how bad democracies end up, with people shooting people everywhere, and corrupt politicians, and drugs, war, etc.
 

norton9478

So Many Posts
No Time
For Games.
20 Year Member
They’re all just spokes on a wheel. This one’s on top, then that one’s on top, and on and on it spins, crushing those on the ground
 

evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
20 Year Member
They’re all just spokes on a wheel. This one’s on top, then that one’s on top, and on and on it spins, crushing those on the ground

The obvious powers have the eyes of the world on them

“I’m not a power”

Then proceeds to help China accelerate the transition clauses.
 

lithy

Most Prominent Member of Chat
20 Year Member
I'm only being half facetious

NK too...?

The expense of maintaining the DMZ and a deterrant military presence on the peninsula for 60+ years plus whatever money we send them ostensible for aid, hell I might put them above the USA.
 

Lagduf

2>X
20 Year Member
The list of nuclear powers really is fucked.

How did Pakistan have the scientific and industrialcapacity to build a bomb in the first place.

I guess it’s more about having the balls to go ahead and build the bomb. We are talking about 75 year old technology at this point.
 
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lithy

Most Prominent Member of Chat
20 Year Member
The list of nuclear powers really is fucked.

How did Pakistan have the scientific and industrialcapacity to build a bomb in the first place.

I guess it’s more about having the balls to go ahead and build the bomb. We are talking about 75 year old technology at this point.

Yeah, in reality, all of Western Europe 'has' the bomb. They just don't have any at the moment.

Other things invented in the US in 1945 include the microwave oven and cruise control.
 

LoneSage

A Broken Man
20 Year Member
How did Pakistan have the scientific and industrialcapacity to build a bomb in the first place.

China basically gave it to them. That single act made Pakistan practically a vassal state to China, not so different from China and NK's relationship.

Blame the fuckhead Soviets who got fooled by the Chinese to jumpstart their nuclear program.

PS Straaya don't have nukes!
 

StevenK

ng.com SFII tournament winner 2002-2023
10 Year Member
Murica fucked Britain on the nuke post WW2, having helped develop it. The British nuclear program was well ahead of the American program until the US got pulled into the war, then they accelerated things on a scale the Brits couldn't do after years of war so they pulled out of their own plans and helped the US develop theirs on the condition that the results would be shared.

Post WW2, America changed their mind and kept it for themselves.

At least this is what it says in the RAF museum in London. It's free, we go a lot. Trying to explain to my kids that the (fake) nuke that they're sitting on to eat their sandwiches could kill hundreds of thousands is a solid demonstration of how we get so detached from it all.
 
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