PayPal now allows Buyers to file Disputes from 45 days to 180 days starting in 29 January

vaillian

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Awesome news!!, see guys whining on the internet fixes everything.

Dont like it this new rule if youre an entrepreneur? then go to ebay users like yjjyhgfju, thank him for being a douchebag seller and setting the low standards.
 

Neorebel

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I for one welcome this change. I have gotten burned by the current window of time once or twice. As a seller, more possibility of being screwed, if for example, the buyer breaks the item 179 days later and blames you.
 

aha2940

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I don't think such a big time window is fair. I think 60 days is better, but 180 days is simply too much, it's like giving a 6-month warranty on everything you sell, unless you specify no returns. I think this might reduce the amount of people selling on eBay.

Regards.
 

RAZO

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I have no returns on all my listings and that doesn't mean shit.
 

wyo

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New rule is bullshit, rife for abuse buyer abuse, and a CYA move by PP to pass on late in the day CC chargebacks.

As a buyer, if you haven't received an item within 45 days, file a fucking claim already!

Try taking something back to Best Buy or Staples after 2 weeks. They will laugh in your face. It's ludicrous to expect online sellers to provide 6 month warranties on anything, let alone used goods.
 

HMG

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I have no returns on all my listings and that doesn't mean shit.

Except eBay is more than happy to force a return or automatic refund for joe average buyer.
 

Xavier

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Ebay did some kind of money back guarantee, item not as described deal in the last six months. I called and complained that basically people can complain and get your account frozen for almost anything now. Not a good idea in my opinion I use the page to buy and sell mostly junk to play around with, stuff you can't get at the stores anymore (out of print, discontinued) and maybe some accessories that retail isn't reasonable with say hdmi cables.
Now your opening yourself up to a whole can of worms of people who got buyers remorse etc.

The reps basic answer was put a disclaimer in your ad that you charge a $8 & 15% restocking fee, buyer to pay both shipping back and forth.

I sell old arcade parts frequently and list them as is, I've tried to take returns to be nice and take returns for unhappy people almost all of them have been switcherood or heavily tampered with.
 

RAZO

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That's what he was getting at. And that's why I'm taking Postal Money Orders only from now on. :(

What other alternatives are out there, how about chase quick pay? Money orders are great but a pain in the ass.
 

ki_atsushi

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Amazon Payments comes to mind, but I don't know anything about it.
 

dosdemon

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180 days is an absurd amount of time. A guy tried to claim he never got a camera I sold him 90 days after the fact (obvious buyer remorse) and didn't get shit, under these rules I'd be out a camera and $300?!? awesome.
 

Fox1

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The reps basic answer was put a disclaimer in your ad that you charge a $8 & 15% restocking fee, buyer to pay both shipping back and forth.

I can attest that this means nothing. What happens is the buyer will start the return process and when I mean start the return process I mean click a button that allows him to send it back without my approval (I'm opted out of that Easy return crap but it still does it) and then they click a option that says the item doesn't work which forces the seller to pay for both shipping costs. Of course all items that have been returned so far have either worked fine or the buyer destroyed it.
 

ForeverSublime

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Awesome news!!, see guys whining on the internet fixes everything.

Dont like it this new rule if youre an entrepreneur? then go to ebay users like yjjyhgfju, thank him for being a douchebag seller and setting the low standards.

I'm still curious. How many days after you paid did the seller take to ship the item? How many days after the auction did it take for you to pay? That thread doesn't make you look like a star. Was it not your low standards that lowered the bar here? The old rule of 45 days applied to you to get your money back and you didn't utilize it. The seller is a douche whether there is 5 days involved or 500. Getting your refund in either case doesn't make him not a douche.

What the seller did to you was wrong, but you could have prevented it. It sounds like you're applauding something that is going to rip off a lot of other well intentioned people, like yourself. As a well intentioned buyer, you have the opportunity for a refund. As a well intentioned seller, you're fucked. That said, if someone needs the money they probably aren't going to wait 180 days to scam you for a refund. But for desperate people, their window is a bit longer to use you as a credit card.

By the by, for those that have used Aliexpress, you may have noticed they took an easier route to solve the problem by sending automated emails saying "your purchase protection ends in X days". I don't know if ebay does this, but if not - it sounds like it could have helped you, vaillian.
 

vaillian

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I'm still curious. How many days after you paid did the seller take to ship the item? How many days after the auction did it take for you to pay? That thread doesn't make you look like a star. Was it not your low standards that lowered the bar here? The old rule of 45 days applied to you to get your money back and you didn't utilize it. The seller is a douche whether there is 5 days involved or 500. Getting your refund in either case doesn't make him not a douche.

What the seller did to you was wrong, but you could have prevented it. It sounds like you're applauding something that is going to rip off a lot of other well intentioned people, like yourself. As a well intentioned buyer, you have the opportunity for a refund. As a well intentioned seller, you're fucked. That said, if someone needs the money they probably aren't going to wait 180 days to scam you for a refund. But for desperate people, their window is a bit longer to use you as a credit card.

By the by, for those that have used Aliexpress, you may have noticed they took an easier route to solve the problem by sending automated emails saying "your purchase protection ends in X days". I don't know if ebay does this, but if not - it sounds like it could have helped you, vaillian.

How much is the % that some buyer will abuse this system? 1%? Also if someone really abuses this system and buys something for 600$ lets say or any amount of money this is good for you as a seller, because you as a business get 600$ or any amount of credit for free without any interests for 6 months. As long as you send the item with tracking number he cant scam you in telling he hasnt received the item.

Also 45 days is redicolous, 1 month is the minimum time these days to receive packages if you buy from japan for example or other countries. Count in some delays or if your package gets into costumes office and you have easily 2 months. Its just fair that people should have the right to test their products for a decent amount of time if its workable or counterfeit and other issues.

I dont see how it is hurting me both as a seller and buyer. I as a gamer and game collector get my shit together and know what i am selling to people, the only people who are complaining are the leeches who go out and buy retro games or any kind of stuff without knowing the stuff they are buying except the prices on ebay. Of course these people are now crying since its not as easy as it used to be if buyers have such a amount of time to return the products if isnt as working or as described what the seller has told. It will just make the playing field more even for people who have more experience with the subjects of the items they are selling vs people who are just reselling without any experience about the stuff.

How many days after you paid did the seller take to ship the item? How many days after the auction did it take for you to pay?
it was immediate payment and it took over 45 days like i said in the thread
 

ForeverSublime

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Interesting perspective. I partly disagree - I mean, when I sell something neither of us are credit cards. There is no "I have your money for 6 months interest free". The transaction is over and that's it. You have my item.

Thanks for the thorough response!

In the end, the right amount of time should be however much time it takes to find out if you've been ripped off.
 

wyo

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How much is the % that some buyer will abuse this system? 1%? Also if someone really abuses this system and buys something for 600$ lets say or any amount of money this is good for you as a seller, because you as a business get 600$ or any amount of credit for free without any interests for 6 months. As long as you send the item with tracking number he cant scam you in telling he hasnt received the item.

Also 45 days is redicolous, 1 month is the minimum time these days to receive packages if you buy from japan for example or other countries. Count in some delays or if your package gets into costumes office and you have easily 2 months. Its just fair that people should have the right to test their products for a decent amount of time if its workable or counterfeit and other issues.

I dont see how it is hurting me both as a seller and buyer. I as a gamer and game collector get my shit together and know what i am selling to people, the only people who are complaining are the leeches who go out and buy retro games or any kind of stuff without knowing the stuff they are buying except the prices on ebay. Of course these people are now crying since its not as easy as it used to be if buyers have such a amount of time to return the products if isnt as working or as described what the seller has told. It will just make the playing field more even for people who have more experience with the subjects of the items they are selling vs people who are just reselling without any experience about the stuff.


it was immediate payment and it took over 45 days like i said in the thread

Pay for faster shipping then you cheap bastard. Plus nothing's stopping you from opening a case on day 44 if you haven't received it by then. 180 days is a fucking joke. It should be 2 weeks after receipt of the item or 45 days, whichever is sooner. If you think people aren't going to abuse this, think again. I recently had someone try to return an item after 5 months because he didn't need it any more. He had used it for those 5 months as well. I politely told him to fuck off. Under the 180 day policy you know motherfuckers like that are gonna claim not as described and try to pull a fast one.
 

SNKorSWM

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So then paypal hold the money for up to 180 days? Well that means if you need to liquidate some stuff for immediate funds, you're outta luck.
 

Nickrb

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So then paypal hold the money for up to 180 days? Well that means if you need to liquidate some stuff for immediate funds, you're outta luck.

No, although occasionally sellers are subject to short term fund holds.

If the buyer paid with a credit card they could file a chargeback after 45 days anyway, depending on the terms of their card. This change sucks and continues a negative overall trend regarding seller liability, but it isn't as drastic as it seems. Chargebacks can even happen after 180 days if allowed by a particular buyers credit card (this is rare but it happens).

It really doesn't matter what paypal says- the defacto policy is whatever VISA and Mastercard say it is and even the largest retailers in the world kowtow to their demands.
 
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Rig

Tarma's Gun Polisher
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PayPal (eBay) is such a shitty company. Absolutely terrible change.
I think this means I'm 100% done with the pair for selling anything. (Usually only sell stuff I can't get rid of via Craigslist.)
 

aha2940

AH, A, COLUMBIAN!,
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Because of this, I've seen many auctions that offer no return option. Basically if something is wrong with whatever they sent you, you are screwed.


Sent from my mobile device using Tapatalk
 

Xavier

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Yeah but that doesn't really work because Paypal/Ebay will force you to accept a return or a total refund.
You need to either have a return policy or don't and lose seller discounts and show up at the end of search results and be forced to accept returns anyways.

I think they want to directly compete with Amazon and so they've been making all kinds of return policies. It won't work because they aren't Amazon.

It gained its fame through auction style listing, most of it's items are used or left over discontinued new old stock/surplus,
they as a company don't carry an inventory or fulfill any orders.

I look forward to the coming spinoff. They've lost focus.
It's so easy to say well we've had a 2% rise in revenue consistently over the last few years.
Really that's not very good because online spending is up say 15% every year, so really you've lost 65% market share.

Biggest thing I don't like about Ebay lately is they don't have any traffic anymore.

Since they don't have to fulfill orders or store/catalog anything the least they can do for thier fees is make a webpage that works.
The same errors/system problem have been broke for 10 years. Spend some money on some coders/programmers.
The mobile apps have been updated and work better from time to time.

The messaging system frequently doesn't work. Some messages don't show up right or at all. Some don't send out and old random messages appear from time to time. They won't let you contact people directly because they fear they'll lose thier final valuation fees.
The messaging system is good though because it can show when somebody is being shady or is in the wrong and in a dispute they can look it up and verify that that's what really happened.

Searching items is hard. 500 usb cables from China for $5 shipped always pop up when looking for something else. The search engine is still flawed even though the've tried to outlaw multiple listing for the same item.

Things that turn other people off over the years
Not accepting alternative payments other than paypal
Sellers not being able to leave negative feedback
these return policies
Making it harder to sell maintain an account
Ceiling shipping charges, most you can charge to send a Neo cart is $4, I guarantee you can't send one that cheap even down the street.
Charging a % of that shipping charge on your final valuation fee
the fees, I've had fees invoices for almost $450 for a month (not counting paypal fees), frequently if I had a bad month I've spent more on fees than total gross sales. If you want to sell/auction more then a few items a month you need a store, then you'll have little to no listing fees. Bad side is these listings show up at the end of the search results.
 
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Rig

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Because of this, I've seen many auctions that offer no return option. Basically if something is wrong with whatever they sent you, you are screwed.

Like Xavier said, this doesn't matter. Buyer will just claim the item was not as described, open a case, and eBay will side with them (even if you say "no returns/ho refunds/item as is). You'll have to refund and they'll either grab your funds to pay the buyer or they'll take your PayPal account into the negative/send to collections if you don't cover the funds.
 

wyo

Banned for trolling, misinformation
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Like Xavier said, this doesn't matter. Buyer will just claim the item was not as described, open a case, and eBay will side with them (even if you say "no returns/ho refunds/item as is). You'll have to refund and they'll either grab your funds to pay the buyer or they'll take your PayPal account into the negative/send to collections if you don't cover the funds.

Generally, they do force the buyer to at least return the item though, unless it's counterfeit.
 

Giga_Power32bit

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This is what happen's when one major bitch of a entity control's the whole online auction world and has it's also the payment processor such as paypal. If only yahoo auction's didn't cease to exist so many year's ago in the U.S. Problem is who can really compete against e-bay maybe amazon if they were to do their own online auction service as a side service to it's core product.
 
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Xavier

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I think this whole things overblown, no credit card companies going to just let people return or cancel transaction's after six months with out ONE HELL of a good excuse. People who try will have thier accounts closed.

It will be a pain in the ass though. This is going to draw out even more scammers, deadbeats, time wasters ,wishy washy mind changers and so on. Everytime it'll take up a good part of a day to fight them off, you'll need to remember the transaction find the details and call Paypal. I think this guaranteed returns item not as described started about a year ago and it's been pretty rough already.

Remember a couple years ago when they had those Back to the Future shoes? That brought out a pretty good group of people. Advertising is good but the best thing for EBay's image is these free PR articles on the net, papers and nightly news. Man buys genuine Rembrandt on Ebay for $5 thought it was fake.

I've stayed away from Craigslist because I don't trust the quality of it's users especially in this region but Ebay's customers aren't much better anymore and the ads are free and no fees. I Put an ad up a couple months ago screened them and made a sale and a trade. Hey why not, I'll be doing it more often now I guess.
 
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