NEOSD PRO - The New Terranonion Neo Geo Product March 2018.

massimiliano

ネオジオ,
15 Year Member
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Apologies if it has been asked/answered already but I couldn't find details.
Is there any chance that the extra slots will be available to be cycled through the normal multi-slot (MV2-4-6) cabinet select buttons? I mean, would that be possible to have a seamless "slo-7" i.e. using a slot-4 plus Neosd-pro, instead of having to pop up the menu an select the pro virtual slots?

Thanks!
 

Gaston

Gai's Trainer
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Jan 15, 2003
Posts
1,349
Apologies if it has been asked/answered already but I couldn't find details.
Is there any chance that the extra slots will be available to be cycled through the normal multi-slot (MV2-4-6) cabinet select buttons? I mean, would that be possible to have a seamless "slo-7" i.e. using a slot-4 plus Neosd-pro, instead of having to pop up the menu an select the pro virtual slots?

Thanks!

Still on the table as far as I could see. They're considering the option but no word on it's inclusion in the final product yet.
 

massimiliano

ネオジオ,
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Thanks #oldGaston , I think it would be the ice on the cake honestly... let's wait and see.. otherwise I'll gladly buy a used NeoSD MVS from someone upgrading, running two of them on the mv-4!
 

ledfrog

Neo Bubble Buster
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How would all this integrate with the marquee lights?

I mean if a NeoSD Pro was in slot one and three regular games were in the others, would the first marquee stay lit while cycling through the first four virtual slots and then move on to marquees two, three and four as you get to the other slots?
 

massimiliano

ネオジオ,
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How would all this integrate with the marquee lights?

I mean if a NeoSD Pro was in slot one and three regular games were in the others, would the first marquee stay lit while cycling through the first four virtual slots and then move on to marquees two, three and four as you get to the other slots?

Interesting question...I guess from a "UI" prospective, the marquee for the NeoSD slot should be a generic one, and the LED should be on, on that one, for each game it has...maybe adding a quick off-on each time you hit the button, until moving normally to the next slot? Anyway, is the logic about managing the LEDs in the BIOS or the board connected to the button?
 

ledfrog

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Interesting question...I guess from a "UI" prospective, the marquee for the NeoSD slot should be a generic one, and the LED should be on, on that one, for each game it has...maybe adding a quick off-on each time you hit the button, until moving normally to the next slot? Anyway, is the logic about managing the LEDs in the BIOS or the board connected to the button?

These were the questions I had when I saw the first NeoSD come out. I don't usually play my MVS using a SuperGun because I love the realism of playing it on a full cabinet. As such, I try to keep everything working as close to original as possible. With the virtual slots, I thought that it would be cool if these slots could match up to the currently lit marquee light in a 4-clot cabinet. In that setup, you could use a NeoSD with 4 virtual slots and basically have the one real slot acting like a real 4-slot arcade without ever having to open up the control panel to swap cartridges. You can set them virtually, change out the marquees and no one would be the wiser.

But the question you posed is one that I don't know the answer to...where do the marquee lights get their information from? I assume it's physical in nature which would make sense seeing as how all SNK would have had to do originally is make the marquees light up based on which slot is currently "on." I doubt the NeoSD would have the capability to change this considering it only uses one physical slot. :( I'd guess if it were to work, there would have to be some sort of external wiring/setup to trick the marquee lights into thinking they were being activated as you switch the games.
 

neodev

Neosd Tech
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256
These were the questions I had when I saw the first NeoSD come out. I don't usually play my MVS using a SuperGun because I love the realism of playing it on a full cabinet. As such, I try to keep everything working as close to original as possible. With the virtual slots, I thought that it would be cool if these slots could match up to the currently lit marquee light in a 4-clot cabinet. In that setup, you could use a NeoSD with 4 virtual slots and basically have the one real slot acting like a real 4-slot arcade without ever having to open up the control panel to swap cartridges. You can set them virtually, change out the marquees and no one would be the wiser.

But the question you posed is one that I don't know the answer to...where do the marquee lights get their information from? I assume it's physical in nature which would make sense seeing as how all SNK would have had to do originally is make the marquees light up based on which slot is currently "on." I doubt the NeoSD would have the capability to change this considering it only uses one physical slot. :( I'd guess if it were to work, there would have to be some sort of external wiring/setup to trick the marquee lights into thinking they were being activated as you switch the games.

Yes, there are 2 topics on this. Let me explain how the NeoSD Pro slot switch works, as I think this has not been properly explained yet.

First the game slot switch. It's in the horizon, but it's not currently finished. There are some challenges on this, related to the backup ram.
The key is that the cart must trick the bios, because when scanning the slots, it will only see 1 slot populated, and thus, only 1 slot will appear in the
soft dips configuration, and the bios won't write the game switching register, but there are ways to make it switch games anyways (although you'll need to use
neosd menu to configure softdips).
Right now, to switch games, there are 3 ways:
- Hold A,B,C,D while booting (on MVS) or also holding one and pressing Reset (on AES), this will boot to flash slots 1,2,3,4 respectively.
This is the fastest way, and also works on arcade mode. As RAM slot starts empty, on MVS there is no way to select the RAM slot using this method, because
it's always empty on boot. On AES, as you can reset while running, holding A+B and pressing Reset will switch to the RAM slot (if any game was loaded first).
- Using the NeoSD menu. Just enter the menu as if you were going to flash a new game, then select Launch Last Game, and a list with the 5 slots will appear, select the
one you want to launch and enjoy. This is the slowest way.
- Using the new In-Game Menu. You can now enable an ingame menu (in the new non-pro firmware 1.07 it's available too, for cheats). This menu has an option to change
the slot, just select the new one in the list, and it will reboot to that game. It has a very handy fast-reboot method for known bioses that will make this switch really
fast, skipping the bios test screens or unibios boot screen, for almost-like-multislot-board-switch experience :).

Because the original slot switch is handled internally by the bios, the best way to do this would be adapting the bios to know it has a NeoSD connected, and
scan its slots using the command ports it provides, and populating its internal slot structures as a real multislot, and using the bios slot switch sequence to
properly do that like a real multislot (instead of writting to the slot selection port, telling the NeoSD to switch slot).

This works fine for single slot boards, but for multislots, it's a different matter. Of course, having just a NeoSD in the board will behave properly, like a single slot, but
having more games, starts the trouble, because we have the bios doing its work, not knowing about the NeoSD.
When doing the slot switch methods mentioned above, as the board needs to be reset (so the bios sees the new game, and all its structures and backup ram are in sync), after switching
the NeoSD slot, it's possible that another of the installed carts is selected by the bios to boot, so you'll need to cycle them using the cart selection button
to return to the NeoSD physical slot, and the game you selected will be there.
When the single button slot switch is added to the NeoSD Pro, as it uses the same button the bios uses to switch slots, it will switch the slots itself, so it will switch to another cart.
If you keep switching carts, when you arrive to the NeoSD cart, NeoSD will switch its slot, so, you'll need to cycle through all installed carts to switch the slot.
Say you have Blue's Journey and Spinmaster in NeoSD Pro, and have a Windjammers cart in other cart slot. Pressing the MVS slot switch button would cycle Windjammers, Blue's Journey, Windjammers, Spinmaster...
Also the bios attract will cycle that way. It's unavoidable, because the bios sits in the middle, and we can't touch it.
Also, in the case of multislots with NeoSD and more than 1 cart, it's recommended to have the Continuous backup ram save mode, as there might not be enough backup ram slots to hold all games at once
and some games would reset to default when selected.


About the marquee lights. They are selected by the bios based on the cartridge slot the bios has selected to run, so, if you have NeoSD pro on slot 1 and Windjammers in slot 2, whatever game you have loaded
in NeoSD, it will light the 1st EL panel, regardless of which game is selected. We could try writting to the panel selection port, but the bios could override it (and probably will) anytime.
Anyways, it's planned that the NeoSD will output the currently selected game through its USB port. It's a CDC device, so it will appear as a serial port on most windows and linux systems, so you could
plug it into a RPi or simiar for more advanced marquees selection, like having a LCD screen and show the proper game screenshots...
 

Hine62

Krauser's Shoe Shiner
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Posts
229
Hi neodev,

I noticed that most of the problems in a multi slot with FW 1.06 and 1.07 have to do with attract/demo cycling. I'm wondering if a bios mod would fix this or if there are other loading errors happening because of cart size/file errors.
 

neodev

Neosd Tech
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Nov 28, 2016
Posts
256
Hi neodev,

I noticed that most of the problems in a multi slot with FW 1.06 and 1.07 have to do with attract/demo cycling. I'm wondering if a bios mod would fix this or if there are other loading errors happening because of cart size/file errors.

No, that's a different issue. It's caused because the write signals and data still arrive to an unselected cart in the multislot boards, so if you have a game that doesn't use banks in the neosd, and change to one that uses banks, the bankswitching writes will be captured by the neosd, and will incorrectly try to switch banks when there aren't any, so when you return to the neosd game, the banks aren't reset, because the game is not supposed to be able to switch them, and wrong data may be present there.
 

Hine62

Krauser's Shoe Shiner
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Posts
229
This makes sense because games run fine when only the neosd is inserted. I have a bunch of carts, so I'll try some different slot arrangements with banked and no bank carts.
 

neodev

Neosd Tech
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Nov 28, 2016
Posts
256
Did you request a 1.07 beta firmware? we have a fixed firmware that will solve that for you. I have a pending firmware to send to a person who still had issues with its 4-slot, maybe it's you :)
 

Hine62

Krauser's Shoe Shiner
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Jul 15, 2005
Posts
229
That's me. I sent an email last night with a list of games that were split into different sizes. I was trying to see if there was a correlation between cart size and error. It looks like I was correct. Larger roms use p1, p2, etc bank switching... It was interesting that the largest carts didn't have this problem. Maybe large carts only have one p1, bank switch more c1, c2, etc.? I could as be that there are rom errors...

I find it impressive that neogeo could play games that were more involved as the system got older. It was really a one of a kind platform. :)
 

ledfrog

Neo Bubble Buster
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Mar 9, 2017
Posts
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Anyways, it's planned that the NeoSD will output the currently selected game through its USB port. It's a CDC device, so it will appear as a serial port on most windows and linux systems, so you could
plug it into a RPi or simiar for more advanced marquees selection, like having a LCD screen and show the proper game screenshots...

Thanks for the detailed explanation...this helps a lot! It sounds like using a single slot board is the way to go and with that new USB output, it could be possible to either get individual marquess to light up or just go with a single larger marquee. :)
 

nono2lozere

Quiz Detective
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Mar 6, 2017
Posts
80
Anyways, it's planned that the NeoSD will output the currently selected game through its USB port. It's a CDC device, so it will appear as a serial port on most windows and linux systems, so you could
plug it into a RPi or simiar for more advanced marquees selection, like having a LCD screen and show the proper game screenshots...
Something like that:
From http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showthread.php?276192-Help-with-lcd-marquee-project
It's for 161-in-1 multicart but this is a proof of concept of what can be done.
 

Hine62

Krauser's Shoe Shiner
Joined
Jul 15, 2005
Posts
229
a MVS version about NeoSD PRO AES would be sell?

I believe the first post in this thread says AES is first, MVS second. No dates have been set yet. You can follow their twitter account to get updates...
 
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yoshi41

Super Sidekicks 2
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Dec 29, 2012
Posts
106
Just received mine. Very fast shipping by DHL (I usually hate private shipping companies).

Another quality product from TO. :cool:

Loading games to RAM slot is much quicker.

Here some samples (loading time in secs)...

Alpha Mission II 6
Last Resort 6
Robo Army 6
Thrash Rally 6
Spin Master 9
View Point 9
Top Hunter 11
Pulstar 25
Blazing Star 27
Metal Slug X 39

And 4 additional flash slots are available for permanent (bigger) favorites.

I would say, loading time to flash slots is about the same as the non-pro version.

Very happy with the cart. :)

I'm wondering, if the audio jack would work for a 2 player Thrash Rally setup.

PS: "Launch current game" should be renamed by something like "Launch game from slot".
 

neosd

Neosd Developer
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Posts
946
Just received mine. Very fast shipping by DHL (I usually hate private shipping companies).

Another quality product from TO. :cool:

Loading games to RAM slot is much quicker.

Here some samples (loading time in secs)...

Alpha Mission II 6
Last Resort 6
Robo Army 6
Thrash Rally 6
Spin Master 9
View Point 9
Top Hunter 11
Pulstar 25
Blazing Star 27
Metal Slug X 39

And 4 additional flash slots are available for permanent (bigger) favorites.

I would say, loading time to flash slots is about the same as the non-pro version.

Very happy with the cart. :)

I'm wondering, if the audio jack would work for a 2 player Thrash Rally setup.

PS: "Launch current game" should be renamed by something like "Launch game from slot".

Hey, glad you already got it.
How the package arrived ? was everything ok ?

Alex,
 

neosd

Neosd Developer
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Posts
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I'm wondering, if the audio jack would work for a 2 player Thrash Rally setup.

About your serial port question :

There is a surprise for neosd pro owners, we will disclose this on Terraonion FPGA Direct video next month.

Stay tuned, you are going to love this ;)
 
Last edited:

yoshi41

Super Sidekicks 2
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Dec 29, 2012
Posts
106
Package arrived in good shape. And very quick, took only one day. Thanks!

Looking forward to your video. :)

Hope you also announce upcoming products. I really like your stuff and I can imagine how much time you invest. Keep up the good work.
 

phoenixdownita

Cheng's Errand Boy
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Posts
114
Just received mine. Very fast shipping by DHL (I usually hate private shipping companies).

Loading games to RAM slot is much quicker.

Here some samples (loading time in secs)...

Alpha Mission II 6
Last Resort 6
Robo Army 6
Thrash Rally 6
Spin Master 9
View Point 9
Top Hunter 11
Pulstar 25
Blazing Star 27
Metal Slug X 39

.....

Holy crap that is fast .... very fast ..... I so much want it .... decisions decisions.
 

neosd

Neosd Developer
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Posts
946
Package arrived in good shape. And very quick, took only one day. Thanks!

Looking forward to your video. :)

Hope you also announce upcoming products. I really like your stuff and I can imagine how much time you invest. Keep up the good work.

Two projects will be anounced and we will open sales this same day, next friday we will get the final production preseries and we will submit the final production batch after validating everything is ok.

So expect a quite small production window since the anouncement and the shipments.

BTW be prepared to be amazed with what we will show there. This is another level what we have done this time
 

yoshi41

Super Sidekicks 2
Joined
Dec 29, 2012
Posts
106
Two new projects. Wow. Makes me very curious!

Hopefully something for SCD+SS.
 

yoshi41

Super Sidekicks 2
Joined
Dec 29, 2012
Posts
106
A couple of screenshots. :eye:

Slot selection menu

neosd_aes_pro_107_menu_launch.jpg

In-game menu

neosd_aes_pro_107_ingame_menu.jpg

In-game slot change

neosd_aes_pro_107_ingame_change.jpg

In-game cheats

neosd_aes_pro_107_ingame_cheats.jpg

To enable cheats, download this zip file and copy the content to the root directory of the SD card.

I'm not using cheats at all. Just to push the console to the limit, enable infinite laser/homing/grenade in Last Resort. :glee:

Apologies for the bad picture quality.
 
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