AES conversions from Tokyo Toy Factory, Neo Ayato.

TonK

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Here is a comparison shot between B2B, MS2 US, MS2 Fake.

2cb1c1f2.jpg
 
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Joneo

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LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

people should start creating fake ebay accounts and destroying his bids to millionaire prices, that is if there's still any of them out there.
It might increase visibility, but wouldn't be too kind to the philanthropic messenger there.
 

CORY

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does someone have a pic of laurent klein ? cause he really scares people.

I don't have his pic yet but I do have his whole confession.


Laurent Klein said:
Toute la vérité rien que la vérité

Suite à ces révélations d'hp man je me suis entretenue avec lui au téléphone longuement,
je suis venu vous dire que ce qu'il dit est exact et je vous expose les faits.
En 2003 une personne m'a contacté pour me proposer des jeux équivalents à des originaux (ce qui ne fut pas le cas)
metal slug et pulstar.Il m'a proposé d'en vendre pour voir si ca marcherait et un premier est vendu
en 2003 en allemagne (retourné et remboursé) puis un second dont je ne me souviens pas ni à qui ni oû (2003-2004 c est loin).
Par la suite j'en ai recommandé 1 et je l'ai vendu dans un magasin japonais, d'autres français sur place se sont joins à moi
pour vendre 3 autre pieces en 2004 (normalement) puis encore 2. A cette période aucun n'a été vendu à l'international (en tout cas
pas par moi) c'est également à ce moment qu'un dernier carton est arrivé et que notre collaboration a céssé.
J'ai alors remarqué que le nombre de jeux dispo dans les magasins japonais était bien supérieurs aux pieces que j'avais vendu.
Provenant de la même source par un autre vendeur? copies chinoises? je n'en sais rien.
A cette époque la loi au japon a changé et sans id card résidant il était devenu impossible de vendre un jeu en magasin pour quelqu'un
avec visa de touriste.La solution yahoo a été testé et les dernieres pieces sont parties sur cette plate-formes avec
la mention "non original" et "pas d'envoi à l'étranger", evidemment le seul qui s'est plaint était un étranger qui n'avait visiblement pas lu le descriptif!
Si une personne peut retrouver ces annonces cela prouvera le tout.
Je vous demande de ne pas vous en prendre à christophe dont la collaboration a été minime. De plus son activité n'existait pas à cette époque
et à ce titre ne mérite pas d'être montré du doigt. Il est le seul à prendre le risque sur le marché en achetant des jeux rares et chers
par sa connaissance parfaite des produits.Par la suite son action pour nettoyer les magasins japonais de tous converts n'est pas une légende, il a pris sur lui
pour parler avec les vendeurs spécialisés afin de leur expliquer quel produit acheter et quel produit ne pas acheter, des relations privilégiés se sont installés
dans les principaux magasins de tokyo. Il a recemment dénoncé une personne (française) qui a vendu + de 50 converts en 2 ans sur yahoo dans une enchère (facile à retrouver 10 millions de yens
avec la photo de la vitrine du célèbre trader rempli de cartes contrefaites. Sachez également que certains magasins sont complices en acceptant des fakes mêmes
vendus comme tel voir super potato qui rachète à la même personne 8 blazing sans poser de question. Sans parler de sofmap qui a l idiotie de racheter des metal slug avec
une etiquette collée au dos "non original neo converted".

En 2007 nous avons repris un lot de jeux us à une personne qui comportait un metal slug 2, le jeu a été ouvert et été un original 100%, ce jeu s'est vendu aux usa via ebay,
sachant que 3 mois plus tard j'ai eu un contact avec atomik pour la 1ere fois qui m a proposé de vendre ses converts (en tant que convert) ou plutot 2008, dans les titres proposés il y avait
blazing,slug 2,btg,u11. Le temps a passé et 1 an et demi après l acheteur s'est plaint, je lui ai dit d ouvrir la carte mais il m a surtout parler des différences
insert original / jeu en sa posséssion. Il a été remboursé sans problème et notre communication n a pas céssé depuis bien au contraire.
A chaque voyage au japon je voyais de plus en plus de faux jeux en vitrine et pas de mon ressort.En 2008 autre évenement ennuyeux suite à un achat yahoo d'un ultimate 11 vendu à un
marseillais le jeu s'est avéré non original, ce fut la dernière fois que nous avons acceptés de vendre les titres possible faux (sauf provenant de collectionneurs connus). Le jeu lui a été
échangé contre un autre original. La même année une personne de la ville avec qui j'avais des problemes relationnels a écopé d'un slug japonais faux (sciemment remis) , jeu remboursé
par la suite intégralement.
HPman m'a dit qu'il voulait faire le lien entre moi et atomik ,que nous étions du même groupe et sur ce point c'est faux,nous ne sommes pas un groupe mais simplement une relation de boulot,
il proposait des jeux,je propose aux clients qui cherche des converts bien faits et ca va pas plus loin, comme d'ailleurs d'autres personnes qui font des converts pour nous depuis 3 ans
à travers la france sans qu'il n'y ai rien d'illicite. Atomik je le connais depuis 2007 environ,nous parlons au téléphone,depuis 1 an nous avons une excellente relation de boulot MAIS uniquement
dans un cadre 100% légal et honnête, je ne l ai jamais rencontré. D'ailleurs le vrai problème ce n'est pas atomik c'est l'utilisation qui est faite de son travail. Tout le monde a cherché a avoir
des converts de mieux en mieux faits et que ce soit son prédécésseur ou lui par la suite le travail est magnifique. Hpman m'a dit qu'il en avait vendu en tant qu'original vraiment je n'en sais rien
demandez le lui il ne me rends pas de compte, nous ne sommes pas associés sur les off set il en fait ce qu'il en veut en les vendant à qui en veut, il ne controle pas par la suite ce qui est en fait.

Pour brikinger tout le monde a fait un cinéma pas possible mais c'était quoi le problème? il a fait un produit superbe de a à z bien supérieur à n'importe quel autre, nous en avons pris une 40 aine
mais la aussi en aucun cas nous avons commandés ou pris part à la fabrication du titre. Il en a d'ailleurs vendu à certains d'entre vous et cela ne me concerne en rien c'est son bébé en somme.

Je précise également que nous avons eu aussi de nombreux cas de tentatives de fraude, dernier en date cet été un membre de ngf a tenté de nous refiler un kof 2000 us.

Je tiens à dire aussi qu'il ne faut pas accabler philippe mon associé qui est parfaitement intégre et qui m'a toujours poussé a arreter les slug à l époque, c'est un ami fidèle qui est droit en tout point.
Il ne mérite en rien que l'on mette sur son dos 3 ans d'errements.

Pour conclure je voulais vous dire, et surtout à ceux que je connais bien avec qui j'ai un bon contact et aussi aux amis qui m'ont pardonné, que je m'excuse sincèrement pour ce qui s'est passé,il fallait crevé l'abcès
histoire de se libérer d'un poids ,voila qui est fait, je ne demande pas d'indulgence particulière simplement d'avoir le même traitement que d'autres quand ils ont fait une faute.
Merci d'avoir pris le temps de me lire.

Laurent

So yeah, he confessed absolutely everything in there. He didn't denied anything written in the e-mails that HPMAN got from hacking his account. I'm not sure if all the e-mails have been translated yet but for those who don't read french, he said some really unpardonable/unforgivable stuff in there. Like how it was easy to scam japanese people over the others and how he didn't want to deal with internationnal buyer because that there is a better chance that they recognise his counterfeits.

On top of that, he still have the audacity of asking us to keep Philippe out of the drama, like he have the rights to ask anything... He said that Philippe asked him many times to stop the Metal Slug counterfeit business but he didn't listen to him. He said that Philippe has always been a stand up guy. As I said in another post, if Philippe was such an honest person, why he didn't stopped the scam ? This is pricesely why this shitstorm will follow him to his grave from now on. He had all the infos and power to stop everything but he didn't do it.

We also learn some new stuff in Laurent Klein's confession such as the presence of a mysterious third man involved in the scam and the reason why they started to sell their counterfeits on Yahoo auctions (new law forbidding foreigner to sell their stuff in store without a citizen ID). We also learn that some japanese stores were perfectly aware of the counterfeits but they decided to still sell them for a prenium (that's probably because they've paid a prenium for them in the first place... Do you have anything to say Christophe Ratel ? I know you're reading this also).
 
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MCF 76

Metal Slug Mechanic
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Well TTF is giving me a full refund for B.S. AES and he even requested after making him aware of this topic here that I send it to Shawn for verification. Or a reputable member that could verify it for me. So, I know that my copy of B.S. was legit or, it would have been known soon enough to everyone here in the community. So for this I do give him that, for being understanding in my situation of all this drama. This was just such a slap in the face because I've delth with TTF alot in the past and everything I got was always just perfect and in immaculate condition from him.
 
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SNKorSWM

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I wonder if Philippe = Laurent, like how InsaneClown = Crakokain.
 

Orpheus

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I have to turn in but I also want to point out that if you take a close look at pictures that both Wolf and chris ray have posted you will see that there is a pattern that is consistant in both. It is a series of circles with dots in the middle of them. This is the result of scanning of the original inserts that were used as source material. It seems that the fact that they (the counterfeiters) must utilize scans (since they do not have access to the original art files) is the main weakness in that can expose the fakes.

I would recommend that anyone looking to buy expensive carts demand the same size and resolution pictures from the seller so that you can identify these tell tale patterns.
 

Chapp

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@ MCF 76:

I am glad you could have a refund.

As I said, this seller is smart enough to not to sell his conversions in his own shop or, at least, not directly. ;)

But, the fakes these persons made still exist and are out there for sale. You may come across such a fake by buying from a Japanese shop, on eBay or from a collector, who could be someone you know.

My advice still stands: open your carts and check the PCBs. Also, pay very close attention to the insert/sticker/manual.

:)
 

chrisr

Known Scammer and One Deluded Individual, NeoGeoFr
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I have to turn in but I also want to point out that if you take a close look at pictures that both Wolf and chris ray have posted you will see that there is a pattern that is consistant in both. It is a series of circles with dots in the middle of them. This is the result of scanning of the original inserts that were used as source material. It seems that the fact that they (the counterfeiters) must utilize scans (since they do not have access to the original art files) is the main weakness in that can expose the fakes.

I would recommend that anyone looking to buy expensive carts demand the same size and resolution pictures from the seller so that you can identify these tell tale patterns.

Take a good look at your Double Dragons, Kizuna Encounters, or Ultimate 11s, and you will see the same exact thing as well. I think it is very telling, but people are not ready to hear.
 

Tacitus

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I have to turn in but I also want to point out that if you take a close look at pictures that both Wolf and chris ray have posted you will see that there is a pattern that is consistant in both. It is a series of circles with dots in the middle of them. This is the result of scanning of the original inserts that were used as source material. It seems that the fact that they (the counterfeiters) must utilize scans (since they do not have access to the original art files) is the main weakness in that can expose the fakes.

I would recommend that anyone looking to buy expensive carts demand the same size and resolution pictures from the seller so that you can identify these tell tale patterns.


They are called "rosettes" and are a tell-tale sign of authentic from fake if you know what you are looking at.

They are NOT the result of scanning, but they are a barometer and clue as to how they were printed and how the image was acquired. you're confusing them with pixelation.

Pixelation is the "blockiness" or the printing, we all know what this is. Rosettes are a a result of the printing process.

You can have one without necessarily having the other.
 
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Tacitus

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Rosette example:

Typically, they are the result of a multi-color printing:

cmyk-rosette.gif


They can show up scanned on hi-res scanners.

It's also featured as an image filter in Photoshop, but it can easily be spotted once you know what you're looking at. You use this filter to mimic and offset print digitally.
 

Joneo

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So the absence of rosettes just helps weed out lower-resolution fakes, right?
 

NeoSneth

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will scanners eventually be able to smooth out the edges? I think this is just going to get even more difficult to deduce in the future.

I might try some confocal images of the paper to see if there are any similarities...
 

Tacitus

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So the absence of rosettes just helps weed out lower-resolution fakes, right?

Ehhh... not really.

The size/look/texture helps weed them out. They're present in offset printing, not in all digital printing.

You can fake them, but they're very easy to weed out.
 

Tacitus

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will scanners eventually be able to smooth out the edges? I think this is just going to get even more difficult to deduce in the future.

I might try some confocal images of the paper to see if there are any similarities...

The problem with that is that it's a two step process...

Acquire the image at the "right" resolution for the rosettes present.

Write the image to the medium and replicate it.

the compression/decrompession process that goes on during that along with image acquisition fucks it up, hence no "perfect fakes" that FTL was claiming.

To do it "close to perfect", you'd need original art or to make your own, clean it up and replicate it, printing in in an offset printer, etc.

It ain't easy, you'd need to be an expert and have the right tools.. it's also expensive as hell.
 

Zellez

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To do it "close to perfect", you'd need original art or to make your own, clean it up and replicate it, printing in in an offset printer, etc.

It ain't easy, you'd need to be an expert and have the right tools.. it's also expensive as hell.

It seems like you always assume that it's difficult to have access to professional offset printing.
Maybe it really is in US, but due to direct experience, I can guarantee you that in Germany, Italy and Japan you can just walk in a good typography, give them your file and have it printed as long as you are willing to pay the bill. I suppose in France is not different.

If we talk about hundreds and hundreds of copy then it would be different, but I don't think this applies to the conversion market since it's a niche that would be easily filled with less than 100 copies.
 

Tacitus

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It seems like you always assume that it's difficult to have access to professional offset printing.
Maybe it really is in US, but due to direct experience, I can guarantee you that in Germany, Italy and Japan you can just walk in a good typography, give them your file and have it printed as long as you are willing to pay the bill. I suppose in France is not different.

If we talk about hundreds and hundreds of copy then it would be different, but I don't think this applies to the conversion market since it's a niche that would be easily filled with less than 100 copies.
I don't assume that. In fact, it's easier than it was 10 years ago due to technology, economy and access.


I'll counter with this:

It may not be as difficult there, but that's not the "trick" or the really difficult part.

Acquiring the image, processing it and printing it at the same quality without distortion, pixelation or other manipulation is the REALLY difficult part. No printer can do that perfectly and cheapy.. it's super expensive and extremely difficult to do. It's not worth it at $30k.. or even $100.
 
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16-bit

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The result of this is that shops are going to have to start displaying high end aes carts with the boards exposed. Someone should make a youtube demo video on how to open AES carts if it hasn't been done already.

So what JP carts are part of the counterfeit series? Metal Slug 1, Quiz Chibi, Pulstar, Blazing Star, Big Tournament Golf, any others?
 

Zellez

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Acquiring the image, processing it and printing it at the same quality without distortion, pixelation or other manipulation is the REALLY difficult part. No printer can do that perfectly and cheapy.. it's super expensive and extremely difficult to do. It's not worth it at $30k.. or even $100.

I agree on it, the acquisition and the processing are surely harder than the printig itself (that's why I wrote my post. The idea I got from reading yours was that people could not access to offset printing and would be forced to go for digital).

As for being worth for $30k I'm pretty sure it would be if you have the right connections.
Feel free to believe me or not, but before landing in the videogame industry I've had the following working experience during my college days:
1 - banks and hospitals archives management company (scannerization and indicization)
2 - advertising agency

In the first one, which was quite a few years ago, I've seen and used daily scanners worth well more than $40k. Those machines would acquire with no distortion at all, extremely high fidelity colors and pointless to say, huge magnification. They were even able to perfectly acquire x ray results, which for the period was really hard to achieve in the proper way. I believe today the quality of high-end scanners has surely improved.
Anyway at the time, during off-work, I was free to use those machines if I needed to scan a few personal documents. Today I still have some friends working there, and the possibility of having access to the scanners (now even newer) through them is still open.

During the second experience, I've seen how some people, given the adeguate amount of time, a powerful PC and a large enough file, can do basically everything with a digital document. We all see and laugh at those photoshop disasters on the internet website, but for eveyone of them, there are hundreds of well done jobs.
So recently, during the pursuit of high quality inserts for my MVS only titles, I was quoted 2.000/2.500 euro for a clean up of an high quality scan of an MVS flyer. I can't tell how the file would have really been at the end of the treatment since I did not went ahead due to the cost, but I was assured that it would be like the original and ready to be perfectly printed with professional offset machines. The person that was going to do the job is a professional comics colorist, and without going into details, the process would require a clean off/refill of the printing process (such as all the empty areas in the rosettas) and then a full recolorization. I know very well that this is a lot of work, but in those days of sinking economy every penny is a treasure (and you all know how incredibly low are the salaries for those that work in the manga/comics industry). Maybe the final art would not be exactly as the original due to the recolorization, but at least there would be no sign of previous scannerization.

Anyway if we go back again to the AF3 topic, with no disrespect to anyone involved, in my opinion the only way to verify if the game was ever produced or not is through SNK-Playmore databases and glossary. Considering that IPs are the most important asset of every videogame company, even a messy one such as SNK will have this information stored.


Back to the TTF and NA topic, it would be nice to know what other games were falsified. Has Twinkle ever been done? Considering that the majority of the insert is white, it would simplify things (although the art quality on the origina front of the insert is already lower than other titles)
 

N30_G30_speed

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