the neo store

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djbomberman

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....Here is a question that will answer what kinda of person you are.....

You come across a store selling brand new ENLISH Metal Slugs for $279.99 each. What do you do? You already have one and you don't "need" it for you collection. Granted this is hypothetical so NO ONE ELSE KNOWS ABOUT THIS STORE. Do you

A) buy up as many as you can(or ALL of them) and start reselling them and profit from unaware Neo buyers

B) tell others about the great deal you found and share the bargin with others

C) keep the place to yourself and let eveyone else possibly find it themselves

I know that most people will say B. but you know that about 90% of the forum people would "truthfully" pick A. That is why cart prices are the way they are because people here don't look out for others on the forum.....only themselves......in a greedy fashion.....I am getting sick of this whole price bashing thing. What we say isn't going to influence the price....what are wallets say and how much we are willing to spend is how we say it.......actions speak louder than words........
 

baller99

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by BIG BEAR:
You just don't get it do you??? What is it that you don't understand about what I wrote?
Why is Metal Slug sooo high in price you ask??? IT'S RARE that's why! Where else are you going to find an original Metal Slug?? Alot of them are converted with fake inserts.
It's one hell of a game.
Blame 'NGF' and don't support him!! He'll stop destroying carts and artwork!!
We all need to come together and put an end to Dion and his antics!
You're saying Shawn should sell a Metal Slug for $200?? That would be great would'nt it!!! It be SNAPPED UP immediately by someone,not you because it would move that FAST!! Then you know what would happen that same individual who purchase the game for $200 would bump the price to $1000 for the reasons I explained.
BTW ,no need to start a new thread when this one is here.
-BB

not as bad as Pichai, who destroyed 80+ ss4s and admitted it, and like tons of other home carts.

Peter
 

baller99

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by eldios10:
Originally posted by Neo Rasa:
Even Dion himself admitted he was responsible for all price increases in that bullshit plastered 'interview' he did with the Eventgaming.com guy.

I bet Dion is proud of that! I tell you what, I've been reading these posts for a bit now and it seems like the entire neo community is like oppressed people trying to overthrown an evil tyrant(Dion). I just think its truly amazing that one person (Dion) can change so much of the neo geo world. Ahh if only SNK of Japan knew....if only SNK of Japan cared. If Dion truly is the bane of the western Neo Geo world, then just don't buy from him. Obviously he only cares about making money. So if you just don't buy from him, he will eventually lose his incentive and leave. I must admit though, his collection is large enough to feed a small country for months....kinda gross if you ask me.

again this brings up shawn's store, he sponsers them by buying thousands and thousands of dollars in cartridges.

Peter
 

baller99

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Caris Nautilus:
That's right, Look at the KOF 99 and KOF 98 homecarts, dirt cheap now, under 200 each.

Garou should drop alot when the perfect DC port hits.

Bottom line is shawns store is VERY over priced, he fits the description of the typical import store price jacking everything, like the ones here that still charge 80 bucks a pop for used SFC games, and have had the same shit sitting on their shelves for the past 3 years!

Don't buy from shawn, I won't, if no one does he will have to lower his prices, it's thats simple, but if people continue to pay shawns jacked up prices, there is no way in hell he's gonna lower them.




[This message has been edited by Caris Nautilus (edited April 24, 2001).]


Isnt it odd how most import stores do the same thing?
You could be in new york and i could be in san fransisco and all across the country they have import stores doing the same 80-90 dollar used snes games.Even if its the most common jap game on earth, they charge you cause its a import.Fair import prices are on ebay.

Peter
 

baller99

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Caris Nautilus:
That's right, Look at the KOF 99 and KOF 98 homecarts, dirt cheap now, under 200 each.

Garou should drop alot when the perfect DC port hits.

Bottom line is shawns store is VERY over priced, he fits the description of the typical import store price jacking everything, like the ones here that still charge 80 bucks a pop for used SFC games, and have had the same shit sitting on their shelves for the past 3 years!

Don't buy from shawn, I won't, if no one does he will have to lower his prices, it's thats simple, but if people continue to pay shawns jacked up prices, there is no way in hell he's gonna lower them.




[This message has been edited by Caris Nautilus (edited April 24, 2001).]


but i dont think the kofs dropped cause there was a perfect port.They dropped cause it was just a kof game.

Peter
 

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Silent_Scope:
"If you dont' like the price, get lost or don't buy it. No one forces you to get those games...bla bla bla..."
That means we'll never have any chance to play those games unless we are "rich", right?

Dude, of all of your 2000+ posts, this has to be the most idiotic one. If you don't have the money for a Ferrari, you will not be able to drive one on a regular basis, so either put up or shut up. In the words of the infamous, this system is for the "executive class" gamers.
 

Lou Gojira

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">In the words of the infamous, this system is for the "executive class" gamers.

Are you stating fact or stirring up shit? No offense kiselgof, but this "executive class" aspect of the Neo Geo was something brought on by overzealous, and in the case of **** greedy and egotistical sellers, not by SNK. Sure the games are going to be expensive, but there are different types of high prices: "Steep" and "You gotta be f**king kidding me!". Sure, $200-$350 is steep, but with a little saving of money, most people who want these games can get 'em at this cost. Hell, I can, and I'm not raking in huge amounts of money at some high paying job, driving a BMW, and flying to Paris for lunch with a supermodel. If SNK had in fact intended to market this system to the "executive class" (gawd I hate that term with a purple passion) they would've come out the gate with $600-$800 games from the beginning. Plus, they never would've bothered releasing a lower cost CD system.

This system was never meant to be a "rich people only" system, it was shoved in that direction by sellers. Jeez, you'd think getting to own a Neo Geo was like applying for membership at some country club to hear some people talk. That's where the dismay originates with me, and I'm sure with a lot of other people. It's this whole exclusivity bullshit, it's very nauseating and unnecessary. Nothing against anybody here, but I'd personally love to see the collective aspect of Neo Geo fade away like 80's hair bands. They're games that are meant to be played and enjoyed. If you want to invest in something, go buy antique coins or fine wine...

Just my thoughts. Man, I need sleep...

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Lou Gojira:
Are you stating fact or stirring up shit? No offense kiselgof, but this "executive class" aspect of the Neo Geo was something brought on by overzealous, and in the case of **** greedy and egotistical sellers, not by SNK.

Stirring up shit because I like to see opposite views just like the one you are about to present.
smile.gif


<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2"> Sure the games are going to be expensive, but there are different types of high prices: "Steep" and "You gotta be f**king kidding me!". Sure, $200-$350 is steep, but with a little saving of money, most people who want these games can get 'em at this cost.

"Most" people who have regular jobs, families and responsibilities, could not have afforded to spend $200+ on Neo games in the early 90s when they were coming out at an average rate of about two titles a month. What "most" people can afford, are the current going rates for the early common games, and they are fine with it. However, when time comes for more desired titles inflated by supply and demand laws, so too come the cries of unfair pricing strategies.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2"> If SNK had in fact intended to market this system to the "executive class" (gawd I hate that term with a purple passion) they would've come out the gate with $600-$800 games from the beginning. Plus, they never would've bothered releasing a lower cost CD system.

SNK came out with a specific business strategy meant to influence the serious arcade gamer looking for gaming experience of far higher quality than afforded by the market at the time. Whatever SNK's idea behind the system was, the collective gamers' opinions deemed the system a luxury gaming item. SNK released the CD system with the hope of profitability as well as the hope of market share infiltration. Heck, even Porsche has introduced the Boxster as a lower cost alternative.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2"> This system was never meant to be a "rich people only" system, it was shoved in that direction by sellers. Jeez, you'd think getting to own a Neo Geo was like applying for membership at some country club to hear some people talk.

And why not? Who better to appreciate the true arcade experience at home than the people willing to invest the money? People purchase Van Gogh and Degas prints for wall decoration purposes and don't even take the time to understand the art. "Rich" differs from what "executive class" means to me. You don't have to be rich to fly first class, to shop at Barcelino, or to drive an NSX. Yet, it is the "executive class" of people willing to appreciate the items and requiring a certain standard of quality and service who will manage their budgets carefully in order to attain this comfort of living.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">It's this whole exclusivity bullshit, it's very nauseating and unnecessary. They're games that are meant to be played and enjoyed. If you want to invest in something, go buy antique coins or fine wine...

They ARE games, but who will truly appreciate the beauty of these arcade titles? The same crowd of sheep idolizing every offering from Squaresoft or Capcom? The same 3-D fanatics who paid $500 for their PS2s?

The exclusivity issue is not based on the price. There is no $50,000 country club fee to join the Neo community. Instead, you have to show your passion for the games and patience and dedication to finding the titles you want for the price you are willing to pay. If one just wants to play, go get NeoRage X, the CD system, or the sub-par ports. If one wants the true experience, get the MVS or the home cart system, understanding that the latter is subject to a collecting hobby that drives up the value of the items. Either way, the only people who bitch are the communists. What are we gonna bitch about next? Maybe Mensa, and how they should lower their "exclusivity" requirements to allow all the mental-puzzle challenged people to be a part of their club.

smile.gif
Yeah, I know that's a fallacy, but it just fits in so beautifully, doesn't it? In the end, the prices will fall, the bandwagon hoppers will drop out, and the ones remaining will be those who appreciate the art and craftsmanship (along with a group or rich people who like to stare at colorful stripes on their shelf).

Sincerely,

Mikhail
www.shockmatrix.com
 
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oye, I don't want to read 4 pages of lenghty posts, can someone summerize what in the hell all this is about?
 

baller99

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by kiselgof:
They ARE games, but who will truly appreciate the beauty of these arcade titles? The same crowd of sheep idolizing every offering from Squaresoft or Capcom? The same 3-D fanatics who paid $500 for their PS2s?

The exclusivity issue is not based on the price. There is no $50,000 country club fee to join the Neo community. Instead, you have to show your passion for the games and patience and dedication to finding the titles you want for the price you are willing to pay. If one just wants to play, go get NeoRage X, the CD system, or the sub-par ports. If one wants the true experience, get the MVS or the home cart system, understanding that the latter is subject to a collecting hobby that drives up the value of the items. Either way, the only people who bitch are the communists. What are we gonna bitch about next? Maybe Mensa, and how they should lower their "exclusivity" requirements to allow all the mental-puzzle challenged people to be a part of their club.

smile.gif
Yeah, I know that's a fallacy, but it just fits in so beautifully, doesn't it? In the end, the prices will fall, the bandwagon hoppers will drop out, and the ones remaining will be those who appreciate the art and craftsmanship (along with a group or rich people who like to stare at colorful stripes on their shelf).

Sincerely,

Mikhail
www.shockmatrix.com


that sir was the most idiotic post i have seen since Dion stopped posting here.
How can you talk about videogames as luxury items?Videogames are supposed to be entertaining things to get your mind off of life.Do you really think even if people are millionaires, they are stupid enough to buy 800 dollar games, for just fun?
Get a fucking life you jerk. And save some of you money.

Peter
 

Viewpoint

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Peter,
I'll go a step futher with that. Video Game COLLECTING is a luxery. Anyone can play Videogames but, Collecting them costs money, time and patience. It just poinst out that some people have no patience when they buy a Videogame for X amount of dollars. That's where the real high prices come from. Supply and Demand. The Playstation 2 last X-Max showed just how fucking impatient people are. Some people just HAD to own one instead of just waiting for the 2nd run of systems to come out. Anyone who busts a nut trying to get one who paid over MSRP was just dumb. Working in a Gamestore this last X-mas I saw a LOT of greedy people. If you got the money tho then by all means do what you want with it. But don't expect any respect out of everyday joes becuase you bought it for $600.00 or more.

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dragynchylde

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First of all thank you kiselgof for that well thought out post, you did a great job. Second, Baller do you even think before you post? Correct me if I'm wrong but NO ONE needs video games to live. Therefore gaming as a hobby is a luxury. Hell even fun is a luxury, life would suck without it but life goes on. Maybe you should reread kiselgofs post again. Bring a dictionary to help you with the big words, as I'm certain you missed the point the first time.

[This message has been edited by dragynchylde (edited April 25, 2001).]
 

dragynchylde

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First of all thank you kiselgof for that well thought out post, you did a great job. Second, Baller do you even think before you post? Correct me if I'm wrong but NO ONE needs video games to live. Therefore gaming as a hobby is a luxury. Hell even fun is a luxury, life would suck without it but life goes on.
 

dragynchylde

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First of all thank you kiselgof for that well thought out post, you did a great job. Second, Baller do you even think before you post? Correct me if I'm wrong but NO ONE needs video games to live. Therefore gaming as a hobby is a luxury. Hell even fun is a luxury, life would suck without it but life goes on.
 

Viewpoint

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Hate it when that happens.
smile.gif




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Lou Gojira

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Alrighty then. *pop knuckles* This is getting good. I'm a sucker for a debate, but I just wanted to throw out a disclaimer now in saying that my opinions are just that, and are not to be misconstrued as me thinking of them as Bible truths. I'm not out to "prove anybody wrong" or "make people look stupid". Okay, now let the games begin...

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">"Most" people who have regular jobs, families and responsibilities, could not have afforded to spend $200+ on Neo games in the early 90s when they were coming out at an average rate of about two titles a month.

Good point, but also keep in mind that SNK wasn't releasing games at the feverish pace Sega and Nintendo were. When you figure the price of four Genesis or Super Nintendo games could've got you a real arcade game on the Neo Geo, it makes reasonable sense that if you wanted the Neo Geo games, you'd prioritize. The other consoles were aimed at the mass market obviously, so why did they release so many games a month? By your logic, if you owned the system, you'd have to buy every single game. That translates to upwards of $500 a month for the other systems, while Neo Geo was still sitting at $400, providing you had the need to buy every game released that month (all two of them). Hmmm, in that perspective, it would almost seem like Genesis and Super Nintendo should've been the systems of choice for the "executive class".

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">SNK came out with a specific business strategy meant to influence the serious arcade gamer looking for gaming experience of far higher quality than afforded by the market at the time. Whatever SNK's idea behind the system was, the collective gamers' opinions deemed the system a luxury gaming item. SNK released the CD system with the hope of profitability as well as the hope of market share infiltration.

Another interesting point, and it makes sense. If you'll notice, you and I both are saying this exact same thing. It's the collective gamers (i.e. collecters) that have made the games so outrageously high today. Whereas you're saying it's cool, I'm saying it's ridiculous. Unless I'm mistaken, the Neo Geo was originally planned as a rental only system. When this idea fell apart, SNK marketed it for sale. However, and again, if I'm wrong, please say so, SNK did a helluva lot to fight the prices back down to a reasonable figure. They released the systems at a 50% price drop for a while, and kept the meg count of the games relatively low (especially by today's 700+ meg standards), thus keeping the system and games within reach of the working class, those blue collar types like me who sit in a lower to middle class tax bracket. SNK shot for quality first, and it's obvious. Unfortunately, people generally want quantity, so they fell behind.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">And why not? Who better to appreciate the true arcade experience at home than the people willing to invest the money?

Again, good point, and I agree with you on that. However, when the prices go to astronomical levels and the people who would appreciate the games themselves and not use them as bragging rights to their friends get left out in the cold, that's where the problem occurs. I've worked creativly a time or two, and I can ask myself (A)"Would I want people buying my comics to store away and hope to turn a profit on them later?" or (B)"Will I want people buying my comics to appreciate the work put into the art and story?" I'll take B everytime. Why? Well, either way, I get paid, but to know that all my extra effort and sleepless nights are appreciated by people who actually read the book, that makes it worth it. SNK still gets paid either way when they sell their games at $200-$350 a pop. But why do you think they go to all the extra trouble in graphical detail and game-play? It's so people will appreciate the hard work and loving care put into their products. If it was meant to be "expensive toys only a few people can afford", then why would they go to the trouble of making the games with such a wide appeal? Or why are they sweating the quality so much? Hell, to make it cut and dry, they could make nothing but Legend of Success Joe's for the next few years and slap a ridiculous price on them if they weren't wanting to appeal to a large number of people.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">The exclusivity issue is not based on the price. There is no $50,000 country club fee to join the Neo community. Instead, you have to show your passion for the games and patience and dedication to finding the titles you want for the price you are willing to pay.

Amen brother. But wouldn't you agree that more people would be buying games and not relying sometimes solely on emulators if the price was a little more realistic? Sure, you can buy Magician Lord for $20 or less now, but who wants to seek out 10 year old games when you got the likes of MOTW and Kizuna Encounter just aching to be played? I'm not saying hand the games out for free, if you appreciate them, pay for them. I'm just saying that the path this hobby has taken is sad because potential fans are being lost to the likes of those anti-2D capitalists at Sony.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">In the end, the prices will fall, the bandwagon hoppers will drop out, and the ones remaining will be those who appreciate the art and craftsmanship (along with a group or rich people who like to stare at colorful stripes on their shelf).

True, but that's a sad way of viewing it. Why does it have to come to an end so people can get a chance at it? Why can't they enjoy it now with everybody else? I know I'm sounding like some candy-assed white liberal by saying that, but I'm trying to be realistic and fair here. Yeah, I know bitching about cart prices ain't going to do shit, but bitching about the attitudes might. This ain't no clique, no exclusive club, or anything, just games that SNK believed in. I think if we all started appreciating the products instead of sometimes just trying to turn profits off of them, it would be a lot better experience for everybody. Maybe SNK's vision of people wanting quality over quantity could come to be a reality after all.

*stepping down from the soap box*
Thanks,
-Lou-

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">By your logic, if you owned the system, you'd have to buy every single game.

While I understand your analogy, Lou, that is not what I wanted to imply. From what I have experienced while working as a sales clerk, the majority of the regular gaming public buys 1-2 titles a month on average. Obviously, I do not have any other statistics that would disprove this, but if one was to need one new title each month, they would certainly be able to afford the mass market $40-50 SNES title rather than the $250 Neo Geo title.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">It's the collective gamers (i.e. collecters) that have made the games so outrageously high today. Whereas you're saying it's cool, I'm saying it's ridiculous. Unless I'm mistaken, the Neo Geo was originally planned as a rental only system.

You're absolutely right. However, in terms of aiming at the rental market, does that not by itself show a tendency for exclusivity? SNK did not market the MVS for personal use, nor has any arcade company marketed their high-end, and high-quality, machines for personal use. At the same time, while it is indeed unfortunate that the gamers have dictated the pricing strategies for these games, it's inevitable for the majority to express their opinion and influence society.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">However, when the prices go to astronomical levels and the people who would appreciate the games themselves and not use them as bragging rights to their friends get left out in the cold, that's where the problem occurs.

In terms of your comic books, certainly you would rerelease them for the fans if the demand was there, would you not? Yet if you were for some reason unable to do that, it's just natural that supply and demand would take over and inevitably price a lot of the people out of the market. Unfortunate indeed, but that's the way the world works. Once again, I can certainly appreciate your points and your "white liberal view"
smile.gif
, but having been through communism first-hand, I see active competition as an extension of the natural selection process.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Amen brother. But wouldn't you agree that more people would be buying games and not relying sometimes solely on emulators if the price was a little more realistic? Sure, you can buy Magician Lord for $20 or less now, but who wants to seek out 10 year old games when you got the likes of MOTW and Kizuna Encounter just aching to be played?

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly. However, I do not believe that many of these people would give the same amount of respect to the art and hobby. Also, by even mentioning Kizuna Encounter in the same sentence as MOTW, you are rendering your whole argument, and all such arguments thereafter null and void! :P (EDIT: alright, can someone please be kind enough to show me how to do the little face with the tongue sticking out)

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Why does it have to come to an end so people can get a chance at it? Why can't they enjoy it now with everybody else?

All good things come to an end. Life and death are a continuous cycle that drives us to success. The Neo will die, but something else will come out and take its place. Amen to you too, brother.

Sincerely,

Mikhail
www.shockmatrix.com

EDIT: Face edit

[This message has been edited by kiselgof (edited April 25, 2001).]
 

Lou Gojira

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Very interesting points kiselgof. I admit, your opinion sounds like it's made a 360 degree turn from the "put up or shut up" philosophy you seemed to have last night. Thing is, I'm going back and reading my post, reading yours, and thinking to myself: "It sounds like a matter of perspective." Kinda' like I see the glass as half empty and you see it half full, but either way we both acknowledge the glass has water in it.

Yeah, I realize that some things in society are set to stay. The comic book example you gave really hit the nail on the head. One time I shelled out $30 for a first print run copy of Faust #1, only to find a fourth print copy of the exact same book for maybe a quarter over the cover price a week later. You talk about disgusted, to say I was pissed would be an understatement.

I think the important thing to do at this point, for me anyway, is to try and get the word out that if you want Neo Geo games, there are alternatives to bank-breaking collector's prices. Myself, I happen to be a firm believer in the Phantom-1 convertor from !Arcade!, and no, Ray isn't sending me a check or games to say that. I think this product equalizes the market a lot for everybody. If you want the home cart, go spend that amount. If you want the game, invest in the convertor and snap up MVS carts for dirt cheap prices. That's how I'm playing MOTW, Kizuna Encounter (oops, put 'em in the same sentence again!
wink.gif
), Magical Drop III, Blazing Star, and Shock Troopers 2.

So, I guess that's what it comes down to. If we within the community don't like the current pricing trend in home carts, we need to get word out about alternatives. Neo CD systems, MVS cabs, Phantom-1 convertors, not to mention spreading the word about stores that sell reasonably priced home carts. I'm planning something for Fan Scene that will hopefully help this along. Hope it works...

Thanks,
-Lou "more liberal than he
probably thinks
wink.gif
" Gojira-

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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Lou Gojira:
Very interesting points kiselgof. I admit, your opinion sounds like it's made a 360 degree turn from the "put up or shut up" philosophy you seemed to have last night...Kinda' like I see the glass as half empty and you see it half full, but either way we both acknowledge the glass has water in it...

...I'm planning something for Fan Scene that will hopefully help this along. Hope it works...

I must say, the put up or shut up philosophy applies specifically to people who do not back up their arguments, instead succumbing to whining tactics. It's an oversimplification, and perhaps a crude assessment of the situation, but sometimes being direct is the only way to deal with people who are not willing to evaluate both sides of the issue.

Some view the glass as half-full, others as half-empty. I see it as... too small. An existing glass implies a goal and a limitation. Reaching specific goals leads to comfort, satisfaction and eventual stagnation. Instead, opt for the impossible, and despite the setbacks and disappointments along the way, achieve the best possible.

I wish you luck with FanScene, because I too look forward to alternatives in continuing to enjoy this hobby.

Sincerely,

Mikhail
www.shockmatrix.com

EDIT: UBB code correction


[This message has been edited by kiselgof (edited April 25, 2001).]
 
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