Is driving a right or a privilege?

[StevenK]

I was just reading a news report about a group of lads racing on the road that ended up with one of them dead and the judge mentioned driving being a privilege, not a right.

Is that right? What's the difference? Who hands out privileges?

I just want to read lithy and 'duf's beautiful minds in action on a lazy Saturday.

 

[Fritz]

Seeing as how hard it is to get your license suspended in the US even with multiple DUIs, it is more of a right.

 

[famicommander]

That's not how to spell privilege.

 

[StevenK]

That's not how to spell privilege.

This is why I appreciate better minds

Edit edit edit

 

[lithy]

Some people believe that because we now have licenses, registration, and all manner of bureaucratic control of the operation of a vehicle that somehow this is the natural state of things. In that regard, driving has generally become a privilege but the ability to freely purchase, use, and dispose of property without permission or interference from government is a natural right of man and a car is not unique in any way.

This idea is easily refuted by the fact that if you have enough land or permission to use enough private land you can drive a car without any of the typical paperwork. Like many other things, government monopolized something (roads in this case) and then 'generously' allowed the public, who actually paid for and own the roads, to use the public roads subject to stipulations and permission of course.

If driving is a privilege, what would stop walking or cycling from becoming a privilege in the same fashion.

 

[StevenK]

Ah, the good stuff

 

[lithy]

Ah, the good stuff

Tried not to disappoint.

 

[rarehero]

There's an old man on my street, I know what car he drives because he always drives to the shared post office boxes and he only lives about 5 houses down. One day I saw he had gotten into a wreck, I thought to myself he must have gotten side swipped on the road while parked, we live on a busy street people speed down. My neighbor actually had a parked car totalled by a speeding car that rear ended it.

One day I was driving out of the neighborhood and got stuck behind him. He was going 30 in a 50. I had to stay behind him because I had to be in the lane to turn onto the highway, it was dangerous and anger inducing. No wonder why he got in an accident, his Sunday speed driving probably caused it. I respect people's rights to drive, but not if it's a danger to others. That old man should not be on the road.

 

[LoneSage]

Some Muslim woman whined about and sued - because America - that she had to wear her burka for her driver's license picture. The judge ruled driving is a privilege and not a right. This was about 20 years ago but I remember it because it was the news of the week at the time. Anyways, any faggots who think they're free can go on and live off the land for all I care. lithy has issues and is not to be trusted.

 

[SouthtownKid]

Of course it's a privilege. If it wasn't, blind people could do it, kids with no training or testing could do it, people handicapped without motor function could do it, and there would be thousands more automobile/pedestrian deaths hourly.

If you want to find some word other than "privilege" to describe it, that's fine. But the idea it's a "right" is inane even for lithy. If you want to make vapid slippery slope arguments about what will happen if they turn walking into a privilege, what about flying an airplane? If driving is a right, why isn't flying?

Actually, never mind. I'm sure lithy will now say flying should be a right as well. He'd rather every American be able on a whim to at any time fire up an airplane and plow it into whatever and whoever they want, rather than compromise his wooly-headed libertarian ideals.

 

[Takumaji]

It's a privilege for which you have to acquire a license. Once that is done, it becomes a documented right as long as you conform to the traffic rules.

 

[joe8]

Technically, it's a privilege. But so many people want to drive, or need to for their work, that it's hard for authorities to strip them of their license, unless there's a very good reason (ie, they get caught for serious, or multiple traffic offenses). So, in practice, it's treated as something that's in between a right and a privilege.

It's a privilege that's necessary for the functioning of society. It's not a luxury.

 

[LoneSage]

I'll say this, though. In America where public transit is either nonexistent or extremely inconvenient in most cities, I haven't a clue how people who don't drive live. I imagine horribly.

Take away someone's car in America you may as well cut off their legs, and that's a fact, Jack.

 

[theMot]

Your moms a privilege.

 

[madmanjock]

I’m wondering at what point a privilege becomes a right.

It’s a right to bare arms in America, and people do buy guns because so many other people have guns so it can feel necessary to protect yourself. Or maybe it’s because of the gun culture. Or maybe something else I don’t really understand having not grown up in the USA.

Over here gun ownership is restricted to a very small portion of the population with firearm licenses e.g. farmers for shooting pests, or for toffs to go hunting. It’s more a privilege to own firearms, as its very difficult to get a license to own one here compared to America.

Going back to cars, every fucking dick and their mum has a car in Delhi. The driving test over there is basically non existent (drive round a car park and if you fail you can bribe your way to a pass anyway). Driving standards, road positioning and traffic jams are all way worse than in most other countries I’ve visited.

In India I’d say cars have become a right to those that can afford to buy them. The poorer families may need to settle for a tuktuk or scooter.

Over in more developed countries in which higher restrictions are in place over who they issue a driving licence to, it feels more like a privilege to have a driving license.

 

[Heinz]

Everything is a privilege here, rights are implied and subject to interpretation of our barebones constitution.

The very fact that you require a license says it all. Firearm ownership is a privilege, by golly that ones drilled into your head so much I think most people are terrified of holding a license. Lots of little ways to land yourself in hot water. What I do find somewhat hilarious is that you need not a license to buy an automobile but to drive it!? Oh no no you must hold the special card sir. It's like saying you can own a gun but you can't shoot it!

 

[Takumaji]

Someone who is dangerous for other people because he/she/zombi is too stupid to drive properly should get the license (i.e. right to drive) revoked. So you can't go to work without a car? Tough luck, you should have thought about that before, you're not a kid anymore.

 

[madmanjock]

Someone who is dangerous for other people because he/she/zombi is too stupid to drive properly should get the license (i.e. right to drive) revoked. So you can't go to work without a car? Tough luck, you should have thought about that before, you're not a kid anymore.

I wish that was the case here.

Usual rules are 12 points then ‘you’re out’. I got 3 points for speeding a few years back (52 mph in a 40 mph zone, I missed the change in speed sign) and it sticks on my license for 3 years. It’s very difficult to get the full 12 points unless you’re a total retard.

But when you get to 12 points, you can claim that a suspension from driving would inflict 'exceptional hardship'. So we have people with 30 points + still with their licences here. Our courts are too soft.

There are 46 motorists on UK roads with more than 30 POINTS

With drivers supposed to face bans once they accumulate 12 points, it means some have been given special dispensation to keep their licence despite totting up enough to lose it 2.5 times over.

www.thisismoney.co.uk

 

[Burning Fight!!]

Reminds me I have to pass my license test on the 19th lol. It’s a short test but almost everything is a critical fault that will boot you out immediately.

I learned how to drive long ago but never needed to living in tiny countryside towns then São Paulo which has a pretty good metro and bus system. Just doing it to be able to move my stuff with my own vehicle when needed and that’s it lol.

 

[Takumaji]

I wish that was the case here.

Usual rules are 12 points then ‘you’re out’. I got 3 points for speeding a few years back (52 mph in a 40 mph zone, I missed the change in speed sign) and it sticks on my license for 3 years. It’s very difficult to get the full 12 points unless you’re a total retard.

But when you get to 12 points, you can claim that a suspension from driving would inflict 'exceptional hardship'. So we have people with 30 points + still with their licences here. Our courts are too soft.

There are 46 motorists on UK roads with more than 30 POINTS

With drivers supposed to face bans once they accumulate 12 points, it means some have been given special dispensation to keep their licence despite totting up enough to lose it 2.5 times over.

www.thisismoney.co.uk

To make things clear, I'm for revoking licenses if there has been a serious problem before, not a fan of a points system (we have that as well).

 

[lithy]

Of course it's a privilege. If it wasn't, blind people could do it, kids with no training or testing could do it, people handicapped without motor function could do it, and there would be thousands more automobile/pedestrian deaths hourly.

If you want to find some word other than "privilege" to describe it, that's fine. But the idea it's a "right" is inane even for lithy. If you want to make vapid slippery slope arguments about what will happen if they turn walking into a privilege, what about flying an airplane? If driving is a right, why isn't flying?

Actually, never mind. I'm sure lithy will now say flying should be a right as well. He'd rather every American be able on a whim to at any time fire up an airplane and plow it into whatever and whoever they want, rather than compromise his wooly-headed libertarian ideals.

Imagine where the Wright brothers would be if they needed a safety inspector's permission for their craft and a license demonstrating aeronautical competency before they attempted their flight. Still riding bicycles, that's where. Hope they're wearing their helmet though, could get a citation if they don't.

Like most, you think just because something would be legal (driving blind) that the blind would suddenly take to the streets en masse. Most people are generally reasonable and should be trusted instead of tut-tutted by the nanny state. For egregious examples, negligence causing death is already a punishable crime.

And again, all these issues are solved if you take away the government roads. Private roads could require whatever they want. You think you need roads, but just think how much more value companies like Amazon get from the interstate highways systems. Just another wealth transfer where the average person gets crumbs from trillions of dollars spent and are told it's such a great deal for them.

 

[lithy]

I’m wondering at what point a privilege becomes a right.

It’s a right to bare arms in America, and people do buy guns because so many other people have guns so it can feel necessary to protect yourself. Or maybe it’s because of the gun culture. Or maybe something else I don’t really understand having not grown up in the USA.

"God created men, Col. Colt made them equal." is a quick and easy way to say why someone might buy a gun. You guys have occasional knife attacks. Generally we do not, likely because guns are more effective and available sure, but either way shouldn't the victims be able to defend themselves if possible? A firearm can be effective regardless of the physical strength of the person.

Although I would say (and I think plenty of recent Supreme Court decisions say that same) that gun ownership for self-defense or hunting is not the primary reason that our Second Amendment exists. That would be the ability of the people to 'secure a free state' meaning defense against the government itself.

Also, 'bear arms' fyi.

 

[wataru330]

Lol@ non standardized, non government roads.

What the actual fuck? Gravel here, pot holes fixed (maybe) when Joe-Bob recons he can get around to it, no interstate system…

…you’ve had way to much to drink, lithy.

 

[neo_mao]

Most people are generally reasonable and should be trusted

Spoiler:

 

[BeefJerky]

I haven't a clue how people who don't drive live. I imagine horribly.

The trick is to live walking distance of anywhere you need to be. I live no more than a 30 minute walk from everywhere I go on a regular basis and I can rent a car if I'm going out of town.

It's pretty goddamn nice not having to sit around in traffic every day. I haven't a clue how people who drive everywhere live. I imagine horribly.