The Walking Dead TV series courtesy of AMC.

If only the writers of this show spent this much time discussing and developing the plot instead of writing the nonsense they've been coming up with.

HeartlessNinny said:

If only the writers of this show spent this much time discussing and developing the plot instead of writing the nonsense they've been coming up with.

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You don't seem to be following the show that well to begin with. I guess you'll either stop watching/caring, or continue to complain about it here.

~Anselm~

Anselm said:

You don't seem to be following the show that well to begin with. I guess you'll either stop watching/caring, or continue to complain about it here.

~Anselm~

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More like the fact I don't take apologists seriously.

I complain about it because I wish it was better. If I don't care, I wouldn't mention it at all. I will never, for instance, complain about Glee, because I don't give a shit about it. Such is my way, and I don't ask for your approval (or anyone else's).

HeartlessNinny said:

More like the fact I don't take apologists seriously.

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Which is always your contention every time you poopoo something other people can intelligently defend.

"I don't like this and I know what's good, so anybody that disagrees is an apologist."

I got called out for the same type of thought process in this very thread (I don't care what others have to say when they disagree with me) and while I don't believe I was an apologist for the show, I checked my thoughts and realized 'You know what, people are making some sense about this' and adjusted my thought process to account for the fact that maybe, just maybe I don't know this show better than anyone else.

That may not work for you. That's fine.

But there is plenty of discourse going on here that more than stands up to your scrutiny.

HeartlessNinny said:

I complain about it because I wish it was better. If I don't care, I wouldn't mention it at all. I will never, for instance, complain about Glee, because I don't give a shit about it. Such is my way, and I don't ask for your approval (or anyone else's).

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We all want it to be better. But that doesn't make it the absolute turd, or the 'dumb fun' you keep going on about it being.

It's a flawed product but it has decent merit and is more thoughtful than you're giving it credit for being.

The funniest and most accurate reviews of this show by far are on Grantland:

http://www.grantland.com/blog/holly.../37985/the-walking-dead-recap-target-practice

http://www.grantland.com/blog/holly...ad-recap-bring-your-daughter-to-the-slaughter

I couldn't stop laughing as well as nodding since most of those thoughts went through my head as well.

Let's waste some bullets on target practice?
Dale has a headstart and yet Shane finds him in the middle of nowhere?
Lori, if you're worried about Carl are you really letting him sit there at your knees watching the walker slaughter instead of running away to the house?
Does Carl have some of Wolverine's blood in his veins?
How many freaking chickens and roosters do they have here? Did someone raid the county fair?

I like some of the changes from the graphic novel. I think expanding Rick's villain role is a great direction since he was never given enough depth in the comic. Hershel's casting is right on point. Sophia's ending was the only reasonable way to end this dragging corpse of a season.

Additionally, re-reading the first 18 issues over the long weekend made me realize that Kirkman speaks much better than he writes. His dialogue in the comic and the TV series has oftentimes been stilted, cliched, and outright boring. I can't help but imagine these characters and stories in the hands of Neil Gaiman, Michael Brian Bendis, Alan Moore, or a host of other more talented writers. If the story was not about zombies but rather a post-apocalyptic or war-zone scenario, I don't think it would have generated this kind of hype. Even comparing Kirkman to a contemporary like Brian Wood you start questioning his writing abilities. He interviews incredibly well and you can tell he has some great ideas, but why don't they turn out just as good on paper and, subsequently, on film?

I really enjoy zombie stories. I thus really enjoy the Walking Dead in both of its formats. With all the shortcomings, it is still a really enjoyable and, at times, thoughtfully written piece on human relationships. But every time I read it I want it to turn into Watchmen, Dark Knight Returns, or The Preacher. The same way, I want the TV series to rival The Wire, Mad Men, or The Shield. And it falls just short.

As a quick followup, I am not strictly complaining about Kirkman. I have not read Invincible, and I do think his more recent Walking Dead narrative is much better than the early issues, to the point where I'd love for him to do a redux on the three-four story arcs in the beginning. I am also enjoying the changes being implemented into the TV series to make it a fresh product.

That said, I can't stop wishing that it was better, because this is that golden idea that has a chance to be the best ever. Kind of like LeBron had a chance to be the best ever. And watching both of these reach that level is a disappointment because you know that the groundwork is there for something truly game breaking.

Taiso said:

Which is always your contention every time you poopoo something other people can intelligently defend.

"I don't like this and I know what's good, so anybody that disagrees is an apologist."

I got called out for the same type of thought process in this very thread (I don't care what others have to say when they disagree with me) and while I don't believe I was an apologist for the show, I checked my thoughts and realized 'You know what, people are making some sense about this' and adjusted my thought process to account for the fact that maybe, just maybe I don't know this show better than anyone else.

That may not work for you. That's fine.

But there is plenty of discourse going on here that more than stands up to your scrutiny.

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You're neglecting one important detail: Despite the fact that you seemed a bit riled by what I said about your own comments about the show, I don't think you're an apologist and never have.

You have defended the show intelligently, and admitted it has flaws. Hell, you even agree with me about what a lot of those flaws are. I find the show disappointing, and you don't. That's fine.

But that guy basically asserted the attitude that anyone who thinks the show is sub-par couldn't possibly have anything worthwhile to say. In other words, anyone who disagrees with him is wrong.

You disagree with me about the show and I don't have a problem with that. But if someone just says, in effect, "This show is great and you just don't understand its greatness," I do have a problem with that, because there's a difference.

I had a local installer come in to pick up a part and he noticed my Walking Dead calendar. We had a quick one minute discussion about the graphic novel. Then I said that the show is slightly disappointing, to which he replied that he doesn't own a TV.

Whenever people say that I don't really know what to come back with. Cool? Sorry to hear that? Not even one for DVDs? What about porn? Do you watch movies on your computer? Do you live in a yurt?

You say "That's Awesome...."

Kiselgof said:

I had a local installer come in to pick up a part and he noticed my Walking Dead calendar. We had a quick one minute discussion about the graphic novel. Then I said that the show is slightly disappointing, to which he replied that he doesn't own a TV.

Whenever people say that I don't really know what to come back with. Cool? Sorry to hear that? Not even one for DVDs? What about porn? Do you watch movies on your computer? Do you live in a yurt?

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He was just trying to say he is better than you...

norton9478 said:

You say "That's Awesome...."

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No way. You say

Kiselgof said:

Do you live in a yurt?

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Probably the best reply. If he asks what a yurt is, tell him that if he had a tv then he would know.

Kiselgof said:

As a quick followup, I am not strictly complaining about Kirkman. I have not read Invincible,

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Invincible is good but some times he just goes on these violence for violence sake tangents. He does have a better handle on superheroes then some of the top writers working for Marvel and DC and unlike over in Walking Dead so far besides Mark( Invincible ) and Atom Eve( maybe ) he's willing to kill off just about everyone

Kiselgof said:

I had a local installer come in to pick up a part and he noticed my Walking Dead calendar. We had a quick one minute discussion about the graphic novel. Then I said that the show is slightly disappointing, to which he replied that he doesn't own a TV.

Whenever people say that I don't really know what to come back with. Cool? Sorry to hear that? Not even one for DVDs? What about porn? Do you watch movies on your computer? Do you live in a yurt?

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I'd be like "oh really? Well, I don't own a bed." If there's anything worse than one of those hipster-faggot "I don't own a tv" guys, it's a one-upper douche.

It can be a fun game. Play it sometime.

HeartlessNinny said:

You're neglecting one important detail: Despite the fact that you seemed a bit riled by what I said about your own comments about the show, I don't think you're an apologist and never have.

You have defended the show intelligently, and admitted it has flaws. Hell, you even agree with me about what a lot of those flaws are. I find the show disappointing, and you don't. That's fine.

But that guy basically asserted the attitude that anyone who thinks the show is sub-par couldn't possibly have anything worthwhile to say. In other words, anyone who disagrees with him is wrong.

You disagree with me about the show and I don't have a problem with that. But if someone just says, in effect, "This show is great and you just don't understand its greatness," I do have a problem with that, because there's a difference.

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I never said anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. And I think the show is subpar on some levels as well. I didn't say it is great and you don't understand it, I basically said you simply don't understand it. Your arguments lacked comprehension of what actually happened in the scenes you were complaining about. I cited multiple reasons and explanations of why you truly just don't understand what you were ranting about.

When you complain about stuff that the writers ACTUALLY addressed, and then get mad at the show because you didn't get it, I have to conclude you aren't following the show very well.

~Anselm~

Soilwork said:

I'd be like "oh really? Well, I don't own a bed." If there's anything worse than one of those hipster-faggot "I don't own a tv" guys, it's a one-upper douche.

It can be a fun game. Play it sometime.

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"I don't have a typewriter."

Agent Sands said:

"I don't have a typewriter."

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I am aware that someone with a typewriter is a better artist than I.

Anselm said:

I never said anyone who disagrees with me is wrong. And I think the show is subpar on some levels as well. I didn't say it is great and you don't understand it, I basically said you simply don't understand it. Your arguments lacked comprehension of what actually happened in the scenes you were complaining about. I cited multiple reasons and explanations of why you truly just don't understand what you were ranting about.

When you complain about stuff that the writers ACTUALLY addressed, and then get mad at the show because you didn't get it, I have to conclude you aren't following the show very well.

~Anselm~

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So let me see if I have this straight. You're telling me -- again! -- that the reason I don't like the show is I don't understand it.

You know what, I'm going to go ahead and continue to not have any respect for your opinion on this matter. I understand the show just fine, and if you think condescending to me is going to win me over, you have another thing coming. If there's one thing I won't abide it's people talking down to me without cause, so kindly fuck off and go argue with someone who's your intellectual equal -- assuming the kindergarten has gotten out by the time you read this.

That picture is pretty incredible. Better than Etch-A-Sketch art.

They should just shut down after this year and either make an annual miniseries or movies.

I'll be missing this tonight because of a pinball tournament. I'll just catch up with the repeat next week and stay out of this thread lol. It's been going downhill lately with too much drama anyway. The drama is good - don't get me wrong - but I'd rather see more zombie killing!

Beefy Hits said:

I'll be missing this tonight because of a pinball tournament. I'll just catch up with the repeat next week and stay out of this thread lol. It's been going downhill lately with too much drama anyway. The drama is good - don't get me wrong - but I'd rather see more zombie killing!

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the mid-season finale was last week. you wont miss anything this week.

Good to know. Whew!