NEOGEO Land ...

Shuri

Kula's Candy
10 Year Member
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Jul 2, 2012
Posts
294
Really cool concept menu so far. I also love the oldschool "scene" style menu too

My 'dream' concept would be that the final product would be a game-genie style adapter where you would plug your cart into the adapter, and it would dump your own games to sd or an usb stick.
 

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
20 Year Member
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Posts
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I have received a couple of queries relating to just how the available settings seen in the NeoGeo Land demo work. I guess it may be a little confusing to some. There are essentially two ways to select a game in the NeoGeo Land tech demo which I guess adds to that. Here is a quick run through of the settings seen in the video and ways they could be setup to give some quite interesting options.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU
- OPEN WITH
- USE COLOR
- AUTO EXIT

The above settings relate to the main NeoGeo Land menu only (the color setting which also controls the popup border color) and are quite straight forward. 'Open With' is the key code used to force the menu even if you are playing a game. Even with this setting disabled the key code will work once only at boot time. 'Auto Exit' is simply the time until the menu will close itself if left on the main game select page with no interaction.

I have seen many times in various places and forums people with the current xxxIn1 multicarts moan about the select menu always showing and no way to disable it. This is fully addressed in the NeoGeo Land demo.

Code:
ALLOW SELECT
- CTRL WITH
- USE POPUP
- AUTOCYCLE
- BOOT GAME

The above settings relate to how games swap outside of using the main menu method. The Neo Geo by design has a built in method for swapping games, my view is this should be used if the user wishes it. NeoGeo Land enhances this by allowing some configuration, this requires a little more explanation of the settings.

'Allow Select' acts much the same as the MVS game select cabinet SoftDip option. Options are; allow free game changing, only after a coin inserted or disabled.

'Ctrl With' relates to the buttons used to swap games up or down, cabinet owners probably want to use the select buttons while everyone else will want A+B.

'Use Popup' is an enhancement, this brings up a quick game select menu over the game when pressing one of the defined game select buttons. Can be set to show instantly, after a button is held down for a set time and of course disabled. The popup menu closes when the game select button is released, game are selected in the popup menu using the joystick while the game select button is still pressed down.

'Autocycle' controls what happens after a games attract mode sequence ends. It can be set to simply go to the next game in the list (like a standard MVS multiclot), choose a random game or be disabled.

'Boot Game' is simply the first game to boot when the system is powered on.

Ok, so that's the basic settings out of the way you see in the video. What the video does not show well is just what these settings can do and this is where some confusion lies I guess because people have asked questions like why do some game swapping settings have an option to disable, why would anyone want that? Well to answer that I am going to show some configurations of the settings (main ones only) and explain what the result would be.


Code:
BOOT TO MENU = ALWAYS
- OPEN WITH  = (CD)+(START)
ALLOW SELECT = DISABLED
- CTRL WITH  = any option
- USE POPUP  = any option
- AUTOCYCLE  = DISABLED
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

The above setting would work the same as the 161in1 for example. It boots, you choose a game and it starts. At any time you can go back to the main game select menu (instantly ending any playing game). No other game select method is available.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU = DISABLED
- OPEN WITH  = DISABLED
ALLOW SELECT = DISABLED
- CTRL WITH  = any option
- USE POPUP  = any option
- AUTOCYCLE  = DISABLED
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

The above setting would make NeoGeo land act like a single SLOT MVS with a single game only. That would be the selected boot game, in this case Real bout. You cannot change the game.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU = DISABLED
- OPEN WITH  = DISABLED
ALLOW SELECT = WHEN CREDITS or INTRO/CREDITS
- CTRL WITH  = SELECT(1)/(2)
- USE POPUP  = DISABLED
- AUTOCYCLE  = MVS MULTISLOT
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

The above setting would make NeoGeo land act like an original MVS multislot. The boot game would be Real Bout FFS and you can swap games up until a game starts. After that you cannot swap games until after game over.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU = DISABLED
- OPEN WITH  = DISABLED
ALLOW SELECT = WHEN CREDITS or INTRO/CREDITS
- CTRL WITH  = SELECT(1)/(2)
- USE POPUP  = INSTANTLY
- AUTOCYCLE  = MVS MULTISLOT
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

The above setting is like previous but the popup menu can be used to quickly select a different game. Instead of having to potentially press the game select button multiple times you use the joystick to navigate the menu until you release the game select button.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU = DISABLED
- OPEN WITH  = DISABLED
ALLOW SELECT = WHEN CREDITS or INTRO/CREDITS
- CTRL WITH  = SELECT(1)/(2)
- USE POPUP  = INSTANTLY
- AUTOCYCLE  = DISABLED
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

Only a slight change from the last. Set like this the selected game will never change unless the user desires it. The benefit here is you will always see the attract mode of the currently selected game until it is changed.

Code:
BOOT TO MENU = DISABLED
- OPEN WITH  = (CD)+(START)
ALLOW SELECT = WHEN CREDITS or INTRO/CREDITS
- CTRL WITH  = SELECT(1)/(2)
- USE POPUP  = INSTANTLY
- AUTOCYCLE  = DISABLED
- BOOT GAME  = REAL BOUT FFS

Lastly, this setting would allow swapping like the previous method but if you wanted to change game during gameplay you could force yourself back to the main menu and forfit the game.

I hope this clears things up.

My personal view is games should never be allowed to be swapped while a game is playing and thus the ideal setting would be to have 'OPEN WITH' always disabled. Because however previous multicarts use a method to force the select menu, plus I can understand the frustration when losing your first life after scoring only 100 points. The setting is in the NeoGeo Land tech demo.
 
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GadgetUK

Ace Ghost Pilot
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,323
This looks very impressive! I hope there's a cartridge that can run this one day!
 

Fygee

Bewbs! Z'OMG, Teh BEWBS!,
20 Year Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2001
Posts
3,999
Damn Raz, I love it when you talk dirty like that. ;)
 
Last edited:

Rot

Calvin & Hobbes, ,
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Posts
11,441
Raz likes to keep things close to his chest... he doesn't like to make promises he can't make...

xROTx

PS. I'm all for banning Raz if he doesn't produce this... :D
 

Rot

Calvin & Hobbes, ,
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Posts
11,441

I don't know you man... SORRY... but if I would "threaten" to ban Raz for something I'd like done for the scene...

...I'd suggest that I'm not the most awesome guy to get noticed by...:D

xROTx
 

pixeljunkie

Whilst Drunk., I Found God., Booze = Bad.,
20 Year Member
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Dec 12, 2003
Posts
7,130
Raz likes to keep things close to his chest... he doesn't like to make promises he can't make...

xROTx

PS. I'm all for banning Raz if he doesn't produce this... :D

this gave me a hearty chuckle
 

Montatez

Aero Fighters Flyboy
Joined
Jun 7, 2012
Posts
2,078
I don't know you man... SORRY... but if I would "threaten" to ban Raz for something I'd like done for the scene...

...I'd suggest that I'm not the most awesome guy to get noticed by...:D

xROTx

Lol it was a joke. I would not actually agree witht that.
 

ckchan

Shlong King,
20 Year Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2001
Posts
326
Hopefully we can see a real product in the near future!
 

Tanooki

War Room Troll
Joined
May 24, 2016
Posts
1,745
Real product or not, I'd just say thanks anyways just for the tease. The fun of the possibility of it all with such a well crafted menu with so many options that don't ghetto up the experience or hose up some of the games in some respect like the 161 and friends do is a nice piece of encouragement. If he decides to take it from teasing to selling, I'd like to hope I would have the funds to buy one eventually. I really do like the concept of an all inclusive kit cart like that where you can just put the one thing in your MVS, lock the sucker up, and keep things safe with it just left in the slot. Not saying it's bad to buy games or enjoy what you have, but it would in a way collecting aside really prioritize what you love best so you want to keep it around. The 161in1 has done that for me as I've picked up a few games on it as they're just that good and others have given me a taste so I went and bought it too. Neat projects like this can be a gateway.
 

Gamefan

OldSkool4Life,
20 Year Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Posts
3,728
Raz likes to keep things close to his chest... he doesn't like to make promises he can't make...

xROTx

PS. I'm all for banning Raz if he doesn't produce this... :D

That's why we love you Rot, always a kidder!!!
 

-SD-

Camel Slug
Joined
May 10, 2016
Posts
510
This is very impressive :buttrock: Looking forward to seeing how the project advances.
 

Tyranix95

Chang's Grocer
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Jun 30, 2010
Posts
4,593
At this post rate, a ban will be the least of his worries. :eek_2:

He's gonna have to worry about all the plane tickets to Finland. :lolz:

Real product or not, I'd just say thanks anyways just for the tease. ....

... he doesn't like to make promises he can't make... PS. I'm all for banning Raz if he doesn't produce this... :D
 

cyd

New Challenger
Joined
Feb 3, 2013
Posts
62
So might such a project contain the multi cab circuitry for thrash rally ? if so I would be down for four ;)
 

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
20 Year Member
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Posts
4,662
when you type neogeo.land into your browser you can see raz´s poc....isn´t that awesome?!

That is nothing to do with me, not sure who registered that domain, was it you?
 
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Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
20 Year Member
Joined
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Posts
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Here is a youtube video of how NeoGeo Land now sits. Be sure to read the discription. remember to view at 720p60.



This is how this proof of concept stands currently (7th October), it has been this was for a few months. Bear in mind I am not a pixel artist so most is ripped including the sound fx, remember to view at 720p60 also. Game swapping is hilighted in this video and a couple of different configurations are shown to give a real feal of whats happening. Acting like a single game cart or a multislot system. Automatic game swapping (end of game attract mode), manual swapping and also swapping using the popup menu are shown. I guess changing games via the main menu is also shown.

A few people did not believe what they saw in the last video which I guess is not surprising given how well the proof of concept works. But to clarify: game swapping in this proof of concept is triggered by and coded at the 68000 level only. It is not trickery using PC and techniques to fake something that is impossible on real NeoGeo hardware. This is running on an emulation testbed (not MAME) emulating banking and port mapping as it would be on the physical hardware and nothing more.

If this was ever made, it would not be the first neogeo device to do banking or port mapping in this way. There are physical bootleg NeoGeo games and converters that do this in the same way already. It is not any new magical mojo on the hardware side. The logic controllers needed are custom bank switches to compliment the bankswitches already on the PROG and CHA boards.

The real magical mojo as I mentioned before is happening on the 68000 code side. Code acts as a interface between any bios type on the host system (MVS/AES) and games on the would be cart. This means the Bios believes there is only one game and will not overload MVS backupRAM and other bios features with data every time a different game is selected. Everything needed by the games is stored on the carts internal memory (softdips, highscores etc) and is controlled accordingly.

As I mentioned in the previous video, this may never come to anything more than it is now. This still stands. I started work on this really to simply confirm to myself that my vision of how a multicart should work on a neogeo system could actually be done. In this respect I have been 100% successfull as the potential obsticles I saw have been overcome. Everything needed to turn a single SLOT NeoGeo (MVS or AES) into a truly multi onboard game system acting identical to the MVS multislot is covered, even on the AES. All by simply plugging the cart in, no other hardware modification required.

The whole concept may stay in this state permanatly.
 
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Rot

Calvin & Hobbes, ,
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Posts
11,441
I like it...

I'd like to make it happen... even if I have to beat the hell out of Raz:D

xROTx

PS. I think... I'll support this one... /rotbackingtehRaz.com....
 
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