What have I done!?

[Buro Destruct]

Verytrhax, aside from being buddhist and all...

You went from the Best AV to arguably the worst AV.

Your avatar sucks balls.

The furor (pun maybe intended) over the Nazis even today is really just egotistical bullshit. People feel if they immediately jump to an anti-Nazi position it automatically makes them a better person since it denotes they have the cognitive ability to distinguish right from wrong.

Grow up, the Nazi swastika isn't even technically the same shape, it "spins" in the opposite direction of the manji.

 

[GoSpits]

People feel if they immediately jump to an anti-Nazi position it automatically makes them a better person since it denotes they have the cognitive ability to distinguish right from wrong.

Grow up, the Nazi swastika isn't even technically the same shape, it "spins" in the opposite direction of the manji.

I agree. You can go to your local museum and view some of the pottery, especially urns, that have the design on them.
Obviously placed to protect their dead from evil's taint, members of the ignorant populace often will remark at the "Nazi symbol," as many refer to the swastika or sauvastika and walk away quickly in disgust.
On your last point, though, I touched on this on page one: the spin and angle has differing connotations, depending on the culture, time and belief system at the moment of its usage. You are right, though, with the Nazi's usage versus its traditional appearance.

 

[Verythrax]

Verytrhax, aside from being buddhist and all...

You went from the Best AV to arguably the worst AV.

I don't think so. Despite the fact that the manji symbol fits perfectly my beliefs and values, I only chose it as avatar because:

- I know what it means;
- I love Blade of the Immortal (and the usage of this symbol/name is simply perfect);
- I really tough that at least 90% of the people here, since have at least an above average knowledge of the Orient, would regognize the symbol right away.

And just as a note, I'm not Buddhist, but they have all of my respect.

 

[Crovax]

Your avatar sucks balls.

The furor (pun maybe intended) over the Nazis even today is really just egotistical bullshit. People feel if they immediately jump to an anti-Nazi position it automatically makes them a better person since it denotes they have the cognitive ability to distinguish right from wrong.

Grow up, the Nazi swastika isn't even technically the same shape, it "spins" in the opposite direction of the manji.

That's exactly right, but for some reason its become hard-wired into all (most) of us as a culture to have such a reaction. I've even seen that same knee-jerk reaction in myself before. About 5 years ago, a friend of mine was studying all sorts of eastern philosophy, particularly Qi-gong. we were at the library, and I happened to see that he had a Manji drawn on one of his sheets of paper. I reacted as if it was a swastika until he, to my embarassment, pointed out the direction of the arms.

I also remember another controversy over the Manji just a couple of years ago. Apparently some of the Pokemon cards Nintendo released here in the US had the Manji on them, and a whole shitload of parents got upset because they thought it was tied to Nazi ideas. They made a big enough impact that Nintendo altered the art for all future printings. Just shows you how ignorant the majority of Americans can be to this particular symbol.

Great topic btw. Its amazing what you find in creative from time to time.

 

[galfordo]

I reacted as if it was a swastika until he, to my embarassment, pointed out the direction of the arms.

nub.

But seriously - I'm sure that just about everyone has that same reaction unless they're exposed to Buddhist culture. It doesn't make you an idiot, or a hick or whatever.

I also remember another controversy over the Manji just a couple of years ago. Apparently some of the Pokemon cards Nintendo released here in the US had the Manji on them, and a whole shitload of parents got upset because they thought it was tied to Nazi ideas. They made a big enough impact that Nintendo altered the art for all future printings. Just shows you how ignorant the majority of Americans can be to this particular symbol.

If something looks close enough to a Nazi symbol, and brings back horrible memories for people, it's not easy for them to just say "oh, well it's turning the other way - i'm cool now."

If it's close enough in shape or form to bring back whatever unpleasantness that the original symbol would bring back, then people will find it objectionable. I don't see what's so strange about that.

 

[tsukaesugi]

 

[GoSpits]

On a slightly different, but also slightly similar note, there are many things that people could be horrified by but because they aren't as ingrained into our minds as what the Nazis did, people are ignorant towards them.

For example:
Vlad Tepes
- How many people get offended when they see Dracula? Few, but that's because the real story rarely gets heard.

Nanjing
- Not many even would know what country this Town is in, let alone its historical significance, but what happened there cannot be denied.

Tutsis, or Gikongoro, for that matter
- People's ignorance is rarely at a higher plane than when discussing the plight of those in Africa, the Middle East, South America and SE Asia. I apologize for only using the African reference, but I'm sure you all understand my point.

We all have likely made a mistake, one way or another, in reacting to a historical or cultural relic from one outside our own, but our advantage is that we took that err and learned from it.
Only by learning can we open our minds and become fully be aware and conscious in our lives.

 

[galfordo]

We all have likely made a mistake, one way or another, in reacting to a historical or cultural relic from one outside our own, but our advantage is that we took that err and learned from it.
Only by learning can we open our minds and become fully be aware and conscious in our lives.

Very true - well said.

 

[Crovax]

If it's close enough in shape or form to bring back whatever unpleasantness that the original symbol would bring back, then people will find it objectionable. I don't see what's so strange about that.

I just looked up some more details on the story, and I had some details wrong. First, the cards were imported--never meant for sale in the US. Second, the result wasn't a change in art for the US market (iit had already been removed), but a discontinuing of the card In its native Japanese market.

Yeah, it isn't strange to find something that brings back unpleasant memories objectionable, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that people lashed out at something in ignorance. Following the saying, "if you don't like it, don't watch," there's nothing that says a person has a right to play Pokemon. If they didn't like it, they didn't have to buy the cards. In the case of Verythrax's av, this thread serves as all the explanation it needs, as it is clearly, not the same symbol the Nazis used.

Simply put, we're not culturally aware as a nation, as evidenced by both this thread and the Pokemon fiasco.

 

[NeoCverA]

The symbol's empowered by what we allow it to command over us.

 

[Nesagwa]

eh nevermind.

jesus christ. http://www.jrbooksonline.com/

 

[The_Chosen_One]

Well, the Nietche relation is more Philosophical than anything else. If you read any of Nietche's books including The Antichrist you'll see where Hitler derived most of his beliefs. Now to be fair he twisted the majority of them to his whim, but you can clearly see where he got them and he's admitted it a number of times. Nietche's philosophy on it was that the AntiChrist so to speak is a Superman. The one who is first. He is better or stronger or smarter or whatnot than the rest of humanity. So he succeeds, and furthers evolution until eventually the rest of humanity reaches his level then he is normal again, and eventually another Superman will arise. Hence humanity will ever be on the course of becoming better.

Hitler believed that man was him. He believed he was evolving humanity into a better era. Hence the idea the jews were below him etc.

I really wish I coud remember where I read the part about the Swastika though. I'll try to dig it up for you.

 

[GoSpits]

I really wish I coud remember where I read the part about the Swastika though. I'll try to dig it up for you.

Hey, thanks. If the thread is dead, could you PM me?
I'm getting too tired to post anything intelligent right now, so I'll save more thoughts for tomorrow.

 

[Insaneclown]

Yes, He did and a waste of a poll it is!

 

[Benimaru]

+1 asap