DavidG: Facts, Speculation, and Possible Conclusions

[Razoola]

There are a couple of things that are missing in the original post Id like to point out which I feel warrant an edit....

1) In the case of AF3 a knowledge of plastics or PCB design is not needed as a Japanese cart can simply have artwork replaced. Others have already mentioned it, even buying the cart for 500 is not a big out for the return involved if 8000 was indeed the original asking price.

2) The AF3 cover artwork photoshopped proof chamane provided in his thread is missing. This is quite a large fact, a bigger fact than the PCBs designed pictures.

A full scan of the cover artwork appeared and I can confirm chamanes findings on the cover at least. I cannot confirm its the actual artwork as I have never seen the cart but others never questioned the picture chamane provided in his thread. It also looks identical to the artwork used on billy box which he posted. The same photoshop edit can be seen.

This full scan can be made public but I have decided not to unless none of the game owners have an issue with it. I have no issue sharing most of the front section where the photoshop changes can clearly be seen.

 

[Macaw]

This is fuckn funny

 

[SSS]

Man, so chamane could have saved 29900 if he had just bought his cart directly from kenny.

 

[Adderall]

Man, so chamane could have saved 29900 if he had just bought his cart directly from kenny.

Yes. Take note that this is the only time Kenny has the cheaper price

 

[alec]

I remember reading (probably over a year ago now) that the different regions had minor ROM differences and therefore the carts couldn't have been art swaps. I've heard there are a few Neo titles that do. If Razoola says it could have been an artswap then I'm sure it could have been. Not too many people know more about the ROM files than he does (actually I can think of none).

 

[SSS]

Yes. Take note that this is the only time Kenny has the cheaper price

 

[Battlesmurf]

A lot of these are things that many people have wondered about. I guess it also boils down to "this thing couldn't have happened without lots of assistance to the seller (i.e. the middleman)- then again what does any of that matter if people aren't willing to pursue action and all of the involved parties seem to be content with where things are". I get the feeling that many of the questions on this thing are going to be left unanswered.

I wish I was in a position to make a bad call with that kind of money lol. I get pissy if I get a busted PCB on eBay.

Some things that get me are:

In this quote DG claims Tonk kept asking for more money and upped the value of the games. Maybe Tonk knew or found out they were fake and went with it, why ealse would DG give Tonk more money unless Tonk was blackmailing DG?

In another post Tonk even brags about getting more money also.

And what stunt did John supposedly pull?

Just asking questions cause I have been following this since the beginning and still want to know the whole story and conclusion.
If some people have no problem wasting money, then wast some on a lawyer.

 

[evil wasabi]

A lot of these are things that many people have wondered about. I guess it also boils down to "this thing couldn't have happened without lots of assistance to the seller (i.e. the middleman)- then again what does any of that matter if people aren't willing to pursue action and all of the involved parties seem to be content with where things are". I get the feeling that many of the questions on this thing are going to be left unanswered.

I wish I was in a position to make a bad call with that kind of money lol. I get pissy if I get a busted PCB on eBay.

those aren't important questions. The only question that demands an answer from Jason is:

Were the games made before or after Sep 2001?

 

[rcantor77]

This is all very nice to have the evidence nicely sumed up in one thread, but what has been bugging me for a very long time is some things that Billy had said earlier in the year.

In one post, he mentioned that he had a copy of Davids Tax Return in his possession...
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...US-(-REPORT)&p=3509673&viewfull=1#post3509673

Again, it is not, because I also have a picture of his tax return papers as well which he also sent me months ago.

And then later the same day, he commented that he had seen David's Record of Employment... in fact he said WE, meaning other buyers (and TonK) I presume...
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...US-(-REPORT)&p=3509701&viewfull=1#post3509701

Yes, we have the ROE paper as well, and they do show SNK Corporation of America on them as the employer. But regardless, none of these factors (in my own personal opinion) swayed me or my feelings over the games authenticity in either direction. For me, all I had to do was see and hold the games in my own hands.

So if David is not David, why can we not see these pictures once and for all...? Or were these comments lies too.

 

[brentsg]

I would assume such documents would be relatively easy to fake.

 

[rcantor77]

I would assume such documents would be relatively easy to fake.

Yeah maybe so, but I am also curious as to whether they even existed at all and therefore making the comments to be lies...

 

[evil wasabi]

This is all very nice to have the evidence nicely sumed up in one thread, but what has been bugging me for a very long time is some things that Billy had said earlier in the year.

In one post, he mentioned that he had a copy of Davids Tax Return in his possession...
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...US-(-REPORT)&p=3509673&viewfull=1#post3509673



And then later the same day, he commented that he had seen David's Record of Employment... in fact he said WE, meaning other buyers (and TonK) I presume...
http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...US-(-REPORT)&p=3509701&viewfull=1#post3509701



So if David is not David, why can we not see these pictures once and for all...? Or were these comments lies too.

Kind of important for members to remember here - the people who bought the games got to see these papers. They had access to a lot of information that has not been posted here. Maybe they could establish that they were entitled to it. So far, davidg hasn't found anyone else entitled to it, and neither have the buyers. They have all ignored the begging and demanding of the small tymers. And yes, that includes me. I haven't seen the documents either. I don't expect to. But I do kind of laugh when people are like "show me the papers!!1!"

 

[Jon]

Kind of important for members to remember here - the people who bought the games got to see these papers. They had access to a lot of information that has not been posted here. Maybe they could establish that they were entitled to it. So far, davidg hasn't found anyone else entitled to it, and neither have the buyers. They have all ignored the begging and demanding of the small tymers. And yes, that includes me. I haven't seen the documents either. I don't expect to. But I do kind of laugh when people are like "show me the papers!!1!"

Well, you DID get to see AF3 and PS2 so, don't sell yourself too short there, Charlie.

You're more of a "medium tymer" in this situation because of that.

Jon

 

[dcsas]

this one time i ate boiled peanuts

 

[hyper]

Chaz has a minty JP Ninja Masters home cart

Solid medium tymer

 

[rcantor77]

Kind of important for members to remember here - the people who bought the games got to see these papers. They had access to a lot of information that has not been posted here. Maybe they could establish that they were entitled to it. So far, davidg hasn't found anyone else entitled to it, and neither have the buyers. They have all ignored the begging and demanding of the small tymers. And yes, that includes me. I haven't seen the documents either. I don't expect to. But I do kind of laugh when people are like "show me the papers!!1!"

Why exactly is that funny to ask... David has scammed a number of people huge sums of money... it has come to light that he is not actually David. So why would any of the buyers or others invloved feel compelled to keep this information secret anymore.

If the 'small tymers' as you put it, should not be privy to this information then there was no point at all in Bobak starting this thread and sharing the 'evidence' that there is for the 'small tymers' to see. The 8 or so people involved might as well just chat about it in PM.

The fact still remains that Billy and others saw (and still have) documents that made them believe he was David and worked at SNK, we are all claiming he is not so why not share these documents so the community can add more evidence to the discussion... there should be no more 'I must protect the seller's privacy' anymore... these are huge accounts of theft, fraud and deception.

 

[evil wasabi]

Why exactly is that funny to ask... David has scammed a number of people huge sums of money... it has come to light that he is not actually David. So why would any of the buyers or others invloved feel compelled to keep this information secret anymore.

If the 'small tymers' as you put it, should not be privy to this information then there was no point at all in Bobak starting this thread and sharing the 'evidence' that there is for the 'small tymers' to see. The 8 or so people involved might as well just chat about it in PM.

The fact still remains that Billy and others saw (and still have) documents that made them believe he was David and worked at SNK, we are all claiming he is not so why not share these documents so the community can add more evidence to the discussion... there should be no more 'I must protect the seller's privacy' anymore... these are huge accounts of theft, fraud and deception.

The information doesn't come because you ask/demand/beg. It comes because some members take it, and decide to share it.

Like roms.

 

[Xian Xi]

this one time i ate boiled peanuts

with rootbeer I hope.

 

[rcantor77]

Yeah maybe... I am only pointing out that there is other evidence out there that has not surfaced yet. I am not demanding anything.

If TonK and others were so determined to uncover David as to whoever he really is, then i'm curious as to why this has not become available for more to see.

Unless..... it never existed in the first place and people mentioned that they had seen it to try and influence the sales in some way.

But as most of them have stated that the games are fake, then I am surprised why they keep this info to themselves as if they still hold some allegiance to David.

Either way, I don't sepcifically want to see it... but Bobak is compiling all the eveidence and there is some more that could be of some use if it became available.

 

[evil wasabi]

Yeah maybe... I am only pointing out that there is other evidence out there that has not surfaced yet. I am not demanding anything.

If TonK and others were so determined to uncover David as to whoever he really is, then i'm curious as to why this has not become available for more to see.

Unless..... it never existed in the first place and people mentioned that they had seen it to try and influence the sales in some way.

But as most of them have stated that the games are fake, then I am surprised why they keep this info to themselves as if they still hold some allegiance to David.

Either way, I don't sepcifically want to see it... but Bobak is compiling all the eveidence and there is some more that could be of some use if it became available.

Believe it or not, Tonk helped a lot in trying to get details on "davidg" (not saying i did it, but I know the people involved), but ended up saying hell with it after the beating he took here. Why bother? The buyers aren't going to sue "davidg", and the members don't want Tonk around.

The real question is why the buyers have been mostly useless.

 

[Tacitus]

If TonK and others were so determined to uncover David as to whoever he really is, then i'm curious as to why this has not become available for more to see.

If I were to venture a guess, it's because they still have something to lose and releasing that information would jeopardize whatever that something is.

Additionally, you'd be amazed how much high-end fraud and white collar crime doesn't get prosecuted or even settled. Much of this is due to difficulty in recovery of funds, embarassment and shame on the part of those defrauded. The fact this crosses international lines only increases the difficulty.

There are ways to put the legal boots to David if this is true. The people involved would just have to put the work in to do so.

For example, if the money used as payment to David was sent through a third party, he probably didn't declare this on his taxes as income. Tie the transactions together and you have a case. Not difficult.

Another example would be if David had them receive the money under false pretenses or as part of a criminal conspiracy. You could compel them to act if you were to take legal action against them to recover it.... or even inform them of the situation. This would "solve the problem" of cross-border prosecution.

Both of these would be cases entirely domestic to Canada.

There are a few other ways to work it beyond that. It's just a matter of those who may have been defrauded taking action.

 

[Tacitus]

One thing that could "force" David or Jason to act or even come clean would be fairly straight forward.

How many people ordered Daedalus converters or 161's direct from him?

I'll bet you that wasn't declared on his or Judith's taxes either. At the price he was selling them, that's a very large amount of coin that the Canadian government didn't get their sticky, syrup covered hands on.

Just a thought.

Remember what got Al Capone, Spiro Agnew, Michael Milken...

 

[Xian Xi]

One thing I'm worried about is if this does go to court is that it makes headlines since it's for video games. I hope it doesn't attract other bootleggers into the Neo scene wanting to make some of that money.

 

[distropia]

The real question is why the buyers have been mostly useless.

Because in a deep part of their hearts, they would like AF3 to be legit to have a complete collection?

 

[Tacitus]

Because in a deep part of their hearts, they would like AF3 to be legit to have a complete collection?

Certainly, they existed... Those blinded by ambition.