*UPDATED* NeoGeo proto screenshots

roker

DOOM
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Perhaps the French community will give him a better welcome and treat him with common decency and kindness.

You contribute nothing to the scene. The reason these roms are still locked away 30+ years later is because of leaches like yourself.
 

Fygee

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CPV6yxj.jpg
I forgot about the Billy Microsoft Clip-Art saga.
 

Tempest

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Someone had mentioned that Billy's Dunk Star proto might be an earlier version than the new one that was posted. Does anyone know if this is true? What about Last Odyssey? Is the new version the same as the one Billy has? Just curious.
 

Raguy

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Tempest, it was an assumption by me.
When two men have the same proto, they are afraid about which has the inferior version.

Supergun is a very special case.
See what he is saying on french forum.


So, as I understand it, you say that I have not answered your question about Dunk Star. So I went back to see and it looks like you asked me to upload a video of Dunk Star?

Well this is very easy to answer! I CANNOT upload a video of Dunk Star. And here is why:

I am not just a game player and collector. I am also a game historian and preservationist. (for many systems, not just neogeo!) And I've been helping prototype owners protect their rom data for over 2 decades. Being in this position is both good and bad. On the one hand, I get to see and play many rare games that most people do not. But at the same time, the arrangement is such that I am only allowed to do so under the strictest of limitations. And my agreements with these individuals cannot be broken. When it comes down to it, trust is everything, and my loyalty must always be to them.

Now, as an example, regarding the Dunk Star game, I am not in control of that particular rom. It just doesn't belong to me! It is not my property. So I don't have permission to release that rom set. Do you understand?

Because (and only because) you had ALREADY posted some EMU shots of Dunk Star, and since I had already posted some on my own website years ago, it was an opportunity for me to get your attention. The owner allows me a little freedom, but I took it about as far as I could go.

Now, I do also have a lot of prototypes of my own. And yes, even some neogeo prototypes. However, once again, even when it comes to my own protos, I still have to be protective of them. (as I’m sure you have been equally protective of your own over the years)

I hope this explanation has answered your question. Thank you.
 

basic

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Tempest, it was an assumption by me.
When two men have the same proto, they are afraid about which has the inferior version.

Supergun is a very special case.
See what he is saying on french forum.
lol @SuperGun is "special"
 

Tempest

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Tempest, it was an assumption by me.
Ah ok. I was hoping one of them might be an earlier version since WIP Neo Geo protos are so rare.

I am not just a game player and collector. I am also a game historian and preservationist. (for many systems, not just neogeo!) And I've been helping prototype owners protect their rom data for over 2 decades. Being in this position is both good and bad. On the one hand, I get to see and play many rare games that most people do not. But at the same time, the arrangement is such that I am only allowed to do so under the strictest of limitations. And my agreements with these individuals cannot be broken. When it comes down to it, trust is everything, and my loyalty must always be to them.
I do understand what he's saying here. I have several Atari prototypes that I can't release due to the owners wishes. I would never betray that trust because that trust is the only reason I was permitted to review the prototype in the first place and once you lose that trust you never get it back. However I was given them by people so I could do a full review and post my findings, so I don't understand why someone would give him a rom and forbid him from posting information about it (it's not like it hurts the value of the proto, in fact it probably increases it). That just seems weird.

Now, I do also have a lot of prototypes of my own. And yes, even some neogeo prototypes. However, once again, even when it comes to my own protos, I still have to be protective of them. (as I’m sure you have been equally protective of your own over the years)
I guess he means he needs to 'protect his investment' or whatnot. The funny thing I've seen about people who do this is that they never realize that it's very rare for a prototype to be truly one of a kind. While they sit on a prototype hoping to fund their retirement with it some day another copy pops up and is sold and dumped and their copy has a dramatic drop in value. I've seen this happen many times over in the Atari world (Pink Panther for the 2600 is the most current one that comes to mind).

It's true that Neo Geo protos are much rarer than Atari protos, but obviously multiple copies of most protos do exist. Someday someone will dump one of them and the 'investors' will be in for a rude awakening.
 

basic

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Ah ok. I was hoping one of them might be an earlier version since WIP Neo Geo protos are so rare.


I do understand what he's saying here. I have several Atari prototypes that I can't release due to the owners wishes. I would never betray that trust because that trust is the only reason I was permitted to review the prototype in the first place and once you lose that trust you never get it back. However I was given them by people so I could do a full review and post my findings, so I don't understand why someone would give him a rom and forbid him from posting information about it (it's not like it hurts the value of the proto, in fact it probably increases it). That just seems weird.


I guess he means he needs to 'protect his investment' or whatnot. The funny thing I've seen about people who do this is that they never realize that it's very rare for a prototype to be truly one of a kind. While they sit on a prototype hoping to fund their retirement with it some day another copy pops up and is sold and dumped and their copy has a dramatic drop in value. I've seen this happen many times over in the Atari world (Pink Panther for the 2600 is the most current one that comes to mind).

It's true that Neo Geo protos are much rarer than Atari protos, but obviously multiple copies of most protos do exist. Someday someone will dump one of them and the 'investors' will be in for a rude awakening.
long story short, ignore much of what he says. it's just a bunch of window dressing to make himself look more important and part of some exclusive inner circle so people think he should and must be involved in anything proto related.
 

basic

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Dear Supergun
I was going to ignore it, but "Are those words really yours?"
When I left NEOGEO.COM, in my last reply, I said I'm a scammer and it's all a lie, it's true and it's OK
It's cruel to tell people who don't believe to believe, so it's okay to be a liar

If you say that all my posts + videos are lies, you don't have to believe it, and I'll do my best to prove it.
No matter how much you prove it, there are many cases in the Internet society that are said to be counterfeit fraud.

Even if I talk about the disaster, or about my body, I feel like I'm getting sympathy, so I don't want to talk about it, and I don't want to receive sympathy.
Right now, I just want to listen to the stories of the NEOGEO world, answer them, have fun, and finish with 9/5.

This form is a very good place, it was a place close to my wishes in the place to report, thank you very much

i guess we shall see what happens on the 5th.
 

SuperGun

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…However I was given them by people so I could do a full review and post my findings, so I don't understand why someone would give him a rom and forbid him from posting information about it (it's not like it hurts the value of the proto, in fact it probably increases it). That just seems weird…

Yes, this is normally true. But your forgetting the key differences between them. 99% of Atari 2600 protos have only 1 or 2 roms or EPROMs inside them. Quick, easy, and convenient to desolder, read and save the data, and then reassemble afterwards. Even the smallest Meg count Neogeo games have a minimum of 6 chips on them. And 99% of the protos I’ve dumped have double that, if not more. Secondly, what I do is very different from yours. It isn’t some simple 32kb rom file that someone emails me to “check out” or “review”. Rather my task usually involves actual physical neogeo cartridges sent to me, which are even sometimes already damaged, for which I have to work on them over the course of several days.

These people are only interested in preserving and saving their personal proto cartridge and the data contained within. This is where the stipulations come into play. In those cases, I am NOT a “reviewer”. The person is entitled to whatever they ask me to do or not to do and I happily agree as it is preserving what could otherwise be lost forever, and yes, at the same time, allows me who cares greatly about the particular subject matter, to see these unique games.

…I guess he means he needs to 'protect his investment' or whatnot. The funny thing I've seen about people who do this is that they never realize that it's very rare for a prototype to be truly one of a kind. While they sit on a prototype hoping to fund their retirement with it some day another copy pops up and is sold and dumped and their copy has a dramatic drop in value…

Again, normally 100% true, and I agree with this philosophy. But, Regarding Dunk Star, it is NOT my rom data and therefore it is NOT my “loss” in value to be had. The owner made/makes his/her choices and that’s that.
 

Tempest

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These people are only interested in preserving and saving their personal proto cartridge and the data contained within. This is where the stipulations come into play. In those cases, I am NOT a “reviewer”. The person is entitled to whatever they ask me to do or not to do and I happily agree as it is preserving what could otherwise be lost forever, and yes, at the same time, allows me who cares greatly about the particular subject matter, to see these unique games.
Fair enough.

Again, normally 100% true, and I agree with this philosophy. But, Regarding Dunk Star, it is NOT my rom data and therefore it is NOT my “loss” in value to be had. The owner made/makes his/her choices and that’s that.
I wasn't talking about your protos specifically, just 'prototypes as an investment' people in general
 

Tempest

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You mean "hoarders"?

Also known as "anti-videogame community morons" or AVCM'S.
To me those 'prototypes as an investment' people are more like those uber rich people who buy famous paintings and lock them away in their vaults. They don't loan them out to museums nor do they hang them in their houses, they just sit in a vault somewhere where no one can see them until they're sold to another 'investor' who does the same thing.
 

Lach

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To me those 'prototypes as an investment' people are more like those uber rich people who buy famous paintings and lock them away in their vaults. They don't loan them out to museums nor do they hang them in their houses, they just sit in a vault somewhere where no one can see them until they're sold to another 'investor' who does the same thing.
Yeah a hoarder.
 

Tempest

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Yeah a hoarder.
I suppose so. My definition of a hoarder are those people who grab any piece of junk just because it's somehow related to gaming. You know, the people who have 40 broken consoles that they swear they'll fix some day or boxes of unopened software that they never even got around to sorting all piled haphazardly in a basement or closet. I actually got rid of a lot of my unused stuff years ago because I was afraid of turning into that person.
 

Lach

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I suppose so. My definition of a hoarder are those people who grab any piece of junk just because it's somehow related to gaming. You know, the people who have 40 broken consoles that they swear they'll fix some day or boxes of unopened software that they never even got around to sorting all piled haphazardly in a basement or closet. I actually got rid of a lot of my unused stuff years ago because I was afraid of turning into that person.
Hoarders come in all shapes and sizes, some have neat vaults and call themselves 'collectors' with 'investments'. Others fit your description.
 

Tarma

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To me those 'prototypes as an investment' people are more like those uber rich people who buy famous paintings and lock them away in their vaults. They don't loan them out to museums nor do they hang them in their houses, they just sit in a vault somewhere where no one can see them until they're sold to another 'investor' who does the same thing.

We're talking about videogames here are we not? What is the purpose of a videogame if not to be played and enjoyed by a wide audience?

Even if the game is a failure (which clearly the vast majoritiy of Neo protos are - which is why they went unreleased) it was intended to be played, to find an audience.

You don't generally play with a painting or a statue, yes they were generally intended for an audience, but can be enjoyed in photos or videos.

If you can't play a videogame - what's the fucking point?
 

sirlynxalot

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The Japanese developer of the relatively recently found neogeo proto Dragons Heaven was interviewed and said he was distraught that the game was found and that the unfinished/unpolished game was shown to the public. The programmer for the recently released Marble Madness 2 also previously requested the owners of the physical prototypes not distribute the game. This sort of thing also leads to a pressure on unreleased games either being shared narrowly or not at all.
 

Neo Alec

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The Japanese developer of the relatively recently found neogeo proto Dragons Heaven was interviewed and said he was distraught that the game was found and that the unfinished/unpolished game was shown to the public.
Yeah, but wasn't he unhappy that the game was never finished/released and his work went to waste? Most if not all of the Neo Geo protos we're talking about here are finished games.
 

Tarma

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The Japanese developer of the relatively recently found neogeo proto Dragons Heaven was interviewed and said he was distraught that the game was found and that the unfinished/unpolished game was shown to the public. The programmer for the recently released Marble Madness 2 also previously requested the owners of the physical prototypes not distribute the game. This sort of thing also leads to a pressure on unreleased games either being shared narrowly or not at all.
Well I think that perfectly underlines the issue - these games are unfinished or that bad (most likely either due to being misconcieved from the start, or simply because they're unfinished) that the original developers are embarrased by them.

When you go for a shit do you look into the bowl and go "aye, that's a keeper right there" or do you flush it away?

There's a place for shit and it's not in anyones videogame collection.

Unless you're Silly Shitt, in which case your home is probably full of barnacle encrusted turds.

Protos: They either need to be binned or shared. There's is absolutley no logic to hoarding them as they may as well fall into the former category.
 

Neo Alec

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This is such a tired old argument. Just because the games were deemed not commercially viable in their time doesn't mean they're nothing but garbage today.
 

Tarma

Old Man,
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This is such a tired old argument. Just because the games were deemed not commercially viable in their time doesn't mean they're nothing but garbage today.

So in your world, shit / unfinished games age like fine wine do they?

That crap ferments over 25+ plus years into the champagne of gaming?

Well, fuck me, maybe you're on to something, because the asshole hoarding this crap ain't talking about lemonade prices to share this dross.

It's a shame that you feel this way. Just let it go... this stuff belongs in the past, like old girlfriends.
 

Neo Alec

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No, I didn't say they age like fine wine. For me there are definitely elements of curiosity and lost history/'archaeology' to it. Since I've already played everything released back in the day for my favorite console, there's a thirst to see what else there could have been.

I don't think you and sirlynxalot necessarily want to see these Neo Geo protos stay buried, so I'm not sure what the goal of your argument is.
 
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