So this generations "beat 'em up renaissance" is over? Thoughts?

[FeelGood]

I guess it started with segas SPIKEOUT on the xbox some months back, and ended a few days ago with the release of rockstars THE WARRIORS.


i preordered and bought SPIKEOUT based onhype on this board. very disappointed as i thought the game blew ass in a major way. overly difficult because of cheap unnavoidable cunt punches to the forehead and a pretty boring fighting system with an unimaginative charge up system.


i sorta skipped the rest, only checking out reviews and videos etc. all looked pretty stale and boring.

then i rented warriors last night and put a few hours into into it. i pretty much hate all rockstar games since they are shallow, ugly, poorly made games hidden behind adult content. i rented warriors since im a fan of the movie and love the beat em up genre of games.

its pretty good, since the context of the movie lends itself perfectly towards rockstars talents. beat em up is prolly the shallowest of all the genres in the hitstory of the world. you walk around and punch/kick people in the nuts.


SO, the game is classic rockstar. ugly ass graphics reminiscent of a ps2 release game. clunky controls and the heavily abused and molested "graffiti" aspect that seems to be in every game these days.

in all honesty the warriors liscense makes this game, no ifs ands or buts. to me though, its enough to make it a fun beat 'em up. the combat isnt all that bad, with your basic light/heavy/grab fighting system and the ability to interact with your surroundings in the form of throwing people into walls and through windows is always fun.

there seems to be three ultimate goals this game tries to incorporate. fighting, looting, and vandilism. its like one part fighting force, one part state of emergency and one part graffiti (move the thumstick across the line pattern on the screen without straying too far from the line).

EDIT: oh yeah forgot to mention the multiplayer aspect makes the ugly graphics even uglier. you will appear on a single screen if you are close to eachother, but you can seperate if you want and explore the levels on your own. goes into split screen when you are further from eachother. overall they did a pretty good job of it but you cannot seem to choose which warrior you want to control, which is bogus.

also, i hear if you beat the game you unlock an original double dragon arcade CLONE with two members of the warriors fighting their rivals instead of billy and jimmy lee. im looking forward to that.

so overall, its prolly the pinnacle of what some people like to call a rennaissance. i wish it was made by a better developer though. its a 7/10.

 

[Magician]

...I dunno, 2D fighters died years ago, how did that make you feel?

Beat'em ups, like fighters, just didn't make the transition to 3D well.

...save VF of course.

 

[Kirk Foiden]

Hmm. Right now, I'm not exactly too thrilled with it. Though I have a different opinion. For both Dreamcast and Xbox, I found Sega to be the closest guys to doing it right. But both times, they really put the diffilculty up there. However, once I got past the difficulty, I realized they actually had good gameplay, in them. I do agree that they tend to put the difficulty curve just a bit too high, in their games. I do appreciate the challenge, but the beat-em-ups were never really meant to kill you off right away, they usually were meant to ease you into it. So both Zombie Revenge and Spikeout tended to be a bit too out of reach for most people.

Spikeout was a game I worked on, until I got good enough to make real progress. Like Zombie Revenge, it's great stuff, and fully featured once you get past the fustrations, even the Charge idea was nice because unlike some types of charges, you can actually work charges while in a combo, to make nice finishers or links. It's much better than making you stand there and then charge. Still, if there was a way to bring the difficulty down, Spikeout would've been this gen's winner, IMO.

Though it doesn't completely qualify as a normal beat-em-up, I would probably give the true honorary award to the Xmen Legends series. It does play around with the RPG aspect, but when it comes to the brawler aspects, I think it's done it better than just about anybody.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles qualifies for the "So much chance to be a contender, but failed to remember what made it great" award, of this generation.

 

[GregN]

The beat em up trend isn't down and out yet, boppers... There's an old man making his return slowly down the block by the name of Final Fight Streetwise. Back in the day, he used to wreck em all with stellar gameplay, and simple, fun fighting engine. Can the original gang that started it all prove that the 3rd dimension is where it's at?

There have been numerous packs of boppers coming and going, but no one set has taken the 3D crown just yet. The only notable contenders have been from Sega's turf calling themselves Zombie Revenge, and Spikeout. Too bad 1 of them had terrible controls and both had a high difficulty spike kept them from reiging as king of the hill.

New meat Beat Down and Urban Reign put up a good fight, but they just proved that the good old days were the best after all with their linear gameplay, potty mouths, terrible stories, and lack of 2 player story modes.

Looks like the crew from Coney has proven their worth after all with an awesome story, 2player co-op mode, slick minigames, and unlockable goodies that keep you coming back for more.

That's all for tonite boppers. You stay cool.

 

[genjuro1]

Urban Reign is very good. All it needed was a 2 player story mode. If they make a sequal with this feature, and tweak/add to the fighting system, It will be my second favorite 3D brawler behind The Fist of the North Star Import for PS1.

 

[EX_Andy]

Keep an eye out for Dead Rising on the 360. I really hope that game is good.

 

[Baseley09]

Pardon my not following modern games much but did the Namco Nina game ever come out?

 

[Mike Shagohod]

I'm sorry but none of the 3-D roving brawlers/beat 'em ups can compare to the glory days of the genre. They first off don't look right. The companies are trying waaaaaaaaaay to hard to make them mirror real life, with street fads and slang and things that just look stupid in a quasi realistic setting. It was meant to be a surrealistic take on real life, with outlandish gangs with odd names (Mad Gear anyone?) with cookie cutter B-Movie plots.

it might be 2005, but Final Fight, Bare Knuckle II, Rushing Beat, Bad Dudes, Double Dragon I & II (Arcade) , and of course Downtown Nekketsu Story (River City Ransom) still are king of the hill. Instead of all this focusing on trying to jazz things up with Def Jam Vendetta looking hooligans, and contemporary muscial scores and shit, everyone from SEGA down the line to Capcom with their shit for brains "Final Fight Streetwise" needs to deliever some high resolution 2-D roving brawler goodness in the vein of yesteryear. So what if Johnny Come Lately & his Condom Leak crew don't get it. They'll either play what the older brothers are playing to not be a punk bitch, or simply miss out on a good game. Instead our buying choices are dictated by the whims of the brain dead majority. Oh well... I'm off to try and beat my best score on Bare Knuckle II on the Hardest Difficulty, starting off with only 3 lives and no continues...

AND THE FINAL SCORE = 385,080

Initials MIM

GK

 

[beelzebubble]

Hmm. Right now, I'm not exactly too thrilled with it. Though I have a different opinion. For both Dreamcast and Xbox, I found Sega to be the closest guys to doing it right. But both times, they really put the diffilculty up there. However, once I got past the difficulty, I realized they actually had good gameplay, in them. I do agree that they tend to put the difficulty curve just a bit too high, in their games. I do appreciate the challenge, but the beat-em-ups were never really meant to kill you off right away, they usually were meant to ease you into it. So both Zombie Revenge and Spikeout tended to be a bit too out of reach for most people.

Spikeout was a game I worked on, until I got good enough to make real progress. Like Zombie Revenge, it's great stuff, and fully featured once you get past the fustrations, even the Charge idea was nice because unlike some types of charges, you can actually work charges while in a combo, to make nice finishers or links. It's much better than making you stand there and then charge. Still, if there was a way to bring the difficulty down, Spikeout would've been this gen's winner, IMO.

Though it doesn't completely qualify as a normal beat-em-up, I would probably give the true honorary award to the Xmen Legends series. It does play around with the RPG aspect, but when it comes to the brawler aspects, I think it's done it better than just about anybody.

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles qualifies for the "So much chance to be a contender, but failed to remember what made it great" award, of this generation.

im glad you put the time in to get good at it. thats the only way you are gonna find out how good it is.

sorry feelgood if you spend enough time with it there are no cheap hits.

 

[roker]

Urban Reign is good when you reach 30% (the other 29 missions suck ass). The biggest problem with that game is getting caught with a barrage of attacks on your back, then it's juggle, re-dizzy, juggle, re-dizzy, 100% combo by the comp.

They really need to fix this if they do a sequel.

The best 3D beat'em up still has to be Dynamite Cop/Dynamtie Dekku 2

I didn't care for the play mechanics in Spikeout, I've yet to play Beat Down (most tell I'm not missing much), and I'll rent The Warriors soon and give my opinion.

I'm trying to get a hold of Fighting Force

The new Final Fight looks like shit. I don't know how it'll play, but the exaggerated American thugs have turned into realism/gritty bullshit. It's like the Japanese have lost their inspiration. I always associate street beat'em ups with that weird take on American culture that the Japanese Developers came up with in the 80s and 90s.

These days, they're making it boring and realistic.

it's a shame and I think they need to get in touch with their roots

 

[Lastblade]

I have not played The Warrior, so I don't know if that is any good.

But if you consider Ninja Gaiden/Black as a beatem up (and I do), it is hands down the winner (and it is not even close).

Urban Reign is not bad, I would say it is the runner up.

Everything else sucks IMO.

 

[Loopz]

Over before it ever began.
The classics dominate and always will.
Until Treasure or a real development house attempts this, it just wont happen.

Urban Reign is fucking boring, not even worth mentioning in the same breath as SoR/Final Fight. Sheeeeeeeeeeeeit. It's like a slightly better Def Jam Vendetta, and that ain't saying much.

 

[LoneSage]

Until Treasure or a real development house attempts this, it just wont happen.

I liked Wario World quite a bit.

 

[Amano Jacu]

Pardon my not following modern games much but did the Namco Nina game ever come out?

Unfortunately yes, it did, it was called Death by Degrees and it sucked big time, you had to use the right analog stick to do the punches and kicks...

Anyway I've played The Warriors a bit and as much as I love Rockstar's GTA games, I don't think I can't get into this one. And I don't like stealing shops and people in this game, I thought the Warriors gang had a better sense of honor that just being plain regular thieves.

I didn't like Spikeout nor Urban Reign, either. In 3D these games really lose all their pleasure.

 

[bloodriot]

oh it's far from over......

*new* Crime fighters gang wars KONAMI
TMNT 3
Marc Ecos getting up?
Gauntlet the 7 sorrows (the new golden axe arcade I'm tellin you....)

it isn't going to be over for at least a year If you ask me.....

shaolin monks wasn't so bad....
Plus I think warriors and monks seems to be doing well?

if the do make sequels then they can refine these brawlers.... inital games get better with fine tunning

EG

SOR1
RE1
Double dragon

and also you guys forgot that super double dragon for the SNES is the best beat em up ever and it is IMO anyway

 

[Takumaji]

I like Urban Reign, but it's more like a fighter than a typical brawler.

Spikeout isn't too shabby as well, dunno why ppl always judge games like that based on difficulty. Unfair? Pheck it, better luck next time.

I laughed when I saw Warriors because I found it silly at first that someone actually based a game on a rotten old movie like that, but I admit that I liked some parts of it.

Still, UR is one of my faves of the current-gen beat'em ups, it's just a bit too technical for some ppl.

 

[bloodriot]

UR is more like a fixed plain fighter than a beat em up... the way I see it...

why play UR when you can play a better fighter like T5?

 

[beelzebubble]

yeah i see the potential with UR but im with riot on this one, too simple to be enjoyed as a fighter and lacks the long scrolling/free roam of a beatem up.

id personally take defjam over it with the mixing up style specializations to get your own individual style and the emphasis on story and character tailoring.

 

[K_K]

Unfortunately yes, it did, it was called Death by Degrees and it sucked big time, you had to use the right analog stick to do the punches and kicks...

Anyway I've played The Warriors a bit and as much as I love Rockstar's GTA games, I don't think I can't get into this one. And I don't like stealing shops and people in this game, I thought the Warriors gang had a better sense of honor that just being plain regular thieves.

I didn't like Spikeout nor Urban Reign, either. In 3D these games really lose all their pleasure.

the warriors didn't have any sense of honor when it came to stealing. to quote the film "everything is out there, we just gotta find what's worth stealin" and when it came to fighting it was kick ass and go, they aren't some mafia, they're a street gang of teenage thugs. the filmportrays them as something more than they really are and portrays the gang life as something badass too. but in the end the warriors were nothing more than a bunch of 18-21 year olds who lived in coney island and stole to get what they needed. but i'm talking about the movie, i have no idea how it might be portrayed in the game. if they try to make it come off like that though well then rockstar is once again a bunch of idiots

 

[SNKJorge]

I still play Super Double Dragon, Street of Rage, Bad Dudes, etc...
and I don't get bored. SpikeOut =

 

[bloodriot]

yeah i see the potential with UR but im with riot on this one, too simple to be enjoyed as a fighter and lacks the long scrolling/free roam of a beatem up.

id personally take defjam over it with the mixing up style specializations to get your own individual style and the emphasis on story and character tailoring.

lolz that's kinda nasty but funny well at least it's better than marvel nemisis am i rite? lolz

I still play Super Double Dragon, Street of Rage, Bad Dudes, etc...
and I don't get bored.

AMEN Brother!? it just doesn't get much better than Super Double Dragon

 

[LoneSage]

Super Double Dragon was pretty weak and easy as fuck. The game was literally in perpetual slowdown, as evidenced by the fade-out when the character walks out of the area.

 

[Korigama]

Renaissance? Considering the bulk of what's actually being made and released, more like postmortem twitching.

 

[roker]

I've been playing the Warriors for the last few days and frankly, I'm not impressed

it's OK for an average action/adventure type game, but I wouldn't say it's a real fighter

You have all these objectives you need to fulfill, it's not like you're walking around beating the shit out of people, but more like "Ok, you need to spray paint this, steal this, beat these guys up in this time limit, run over here, throw this, PLAY SOME STUPID MODERN CLICHED STEALTH, etc."

Urban Reign, while an OK game, plays more like a real brawler, ditto on Shoalin Monks

 

[FeelGood]

i totallu forgot about shoalin monks but i hear thats pretty good.

my bro and i beat warriors in about 15 hours and have no real desire to play it anymore. the supposed "double dragon clone" you unlock after beating the game (and the 6 or so "flashback" missions that tell how the warriors formed and how various members joined up) is a bullshit excuse of a brawler. basically they ripped off the start screen and the intro of double dragon (where the thugs punch a bitch and take her away. garage door opens and billy/jimmy step out). the game doesnt attempt to be double dragon at all. the levels and models use the same ugly warriors 3D engine just ina psuedo side scrolling fashion. levels do not attempt to mimic double dragon at all. basically its trash.


definately do not buy this game. its a fun rental but even i regret the $8 fagbuster charged me for it ($8 to rent a game? why dont u just fuck me in my ass next time).


the quest for a decent replayable brawler continues.