NEOSD MVS Support thread !

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
No worries =D The behaviour we are seeing on our carts DOES NOT happen on originals. I know this because I play those originals and it does not happen. I think you are mistaking a minor issue that might happen on originals with this much more noticeable issue which only occurs on our neo SD.

Well yes and no. :)

Yes because we are talking about different things and they should not be confused. You do have issues with the NeoSD on your setup that need solving which are seperate.

No because what I am talking about is not a case of 'might happen on originals'. It is 100% certinity that it will happen on originals. Normally I would not make a issue over it (and it may seem petty) but this important at the moment because we are talking about it relation to a new peice of hardware (the NeoSD). It needs to be very clear the pixel glitching phenomena raised is in no way related to the neoSD doing something wrong. Using words like 'might happen' or 'probably' in referance to what I said on the matter only raises confusion. This is what Im trying to eliminate for the reader, confusion where fact is known and understood.
 
Last edited:

Mr. Mort

Another Striker
Joined
Jan 21, 2014
Posts
312
In regards to the crackling sound in MS5 at the bottom of the elevator sequence, I get that sound every single time on my legit MVS cart. As others have already stated, this is normal.
 

Sceptre_JLRB

Not so MEGA, eh?
Joined
Aug 21, 2016
Posts
99
In regards to the crackling sound in MS5 at the bottom of the elevator sequence, I get that sound every single time on my legit MVS cart. As others have already stated, this is normal.

Thank you so much for confirming that! :-)

So, to sum up: The crackling sound in MS5 and the pixel glitching at palette RAM access are NORMAL artifacts in original game carts running on real hardware, though they are not appreciable on emulators.
 

GadgetUK

Robert Garcia's Butler
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,280
Thank you so much for confirming that! :-)

So, to sum up: The crackling sound in MS5 and the pixel glitching at palette RAM access are NORMAL artifacts in original game carts running on real hardware, though they are not appreciable on emulators.

It depends on what you are seeing as pixels artifacts! The issue I saw when I tested last night - on Metal Slug is was very noticable on the 2nd level, almost like the original flickering pixel issue reported - all over the top 1/3 of the screen. But I couldn't recreate it today at all.
 

Sceptre_JLRB

Not so MEGA, eh?
Joined
Aug 21, 2016
Posts
99
It depends on what you are seeing as pixels artifacts! The issue I saw when I tested last night - on Metal Slug is was very noticable on the 2nd level, almost like the original flickering pixel issue reported - all over the top 1/3 of the screen. But I couldn't recreate it today at all.

However, take in mind that when the 'classic' hortz-line glitch happens, it's quite noticeable and much more distinguishable, given that the glitched lines are constantly present and flickering, they are not something puctual, and they don't correspond to missing pixels, but they rather track or missplace sprite pixels. Beware, anyone should consider these criteria when facing this potential issue.
In addition, as reported, I earlier got a quite similar glitch very prominently in my Bang Bang Busters .neo file, which I finally solved out just by using the romset from a different source.
 

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
It depends on what you are seeing as pixels artifacts! The issue I saw when I tested last night - on Metal Slug is was very noticable on the 2nd level, almost like the original flickering pixel issue reported - all over the top 1/3 of the screen. But I couldn't recreate it today at all.


This is why I'm trying to say its very important the words used to describe this. The first issue you had (shown in your short video) that was fixed in the test firmware is not what I would call pixel glitching, it was at the sprite level and not pixel level. If you watch that video again you will notice how the lines are the size of sprite tiles and track with the sprites. The pixel glitching I reference is not tied to sprites at all.

I have gone through the 2nd level of metal slug now and I did see pixel glitching at the top of the screen once at the point where the first boat appears as you walk across the bridge. That is totally normal. I did not see any issue that could compare in any way to what the original video shows.

Care is needed here again though to instantly feel the NeoSD at fault because there is also a different situation that is also very normal that can happen with games which is more close to what the first video shows. If you load crossed swords 2, start the game with the knight , give yourself the infinate magic cheat and start the game. When there are three baddies on the screen use the magic spells and watch the top of the screen. That is also glitching at the sprite level but it is totally normal, the effect is hilighted here however given the color of the sprites. Something like that happening at the top of the screen would be more unnoticed in Metal Slug. However if you were to load the 'Metal Slug 2 Turbo' hack you would see this type of sprite glitching (like crossed swords 2) quite often at the top of the screen.

Does this look more like what you saw in Metal Slug? If you are sure it looked more like the first issue in the short video then I would suggest trying to catch a small video of it.

[edit]
Just for reference what I call pixel glitching you can see clearly in SamSho5 (xbox hack) on the title page after inserting a coin. You will see black pixels dancing around halfway down the screen. That is the paletteRAM access causing pixel issues in full affect.
 
Last edited:

GadgetUK

Robert Garcia's Butler
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,280
I hear what you are saying but it's not quite the same problem - it really isn't, or perphaps it is but its excarebated by the test firmware I am running on? I can see what you are talking about by playing the original games, and I see the glitching you refer to on all 3 of my MVS with original carts. Rather than confuse things with more videos and stuff I would prefer to park this problem for now until other firmware updates are released. I can upload the video later if required but right now us focussing on this like its a huge problem is just going to confuse things imo. But I thank you for pointing out what could be mistaken as a problem - we've certainly already had the Pulstar issue do that!!!
 
Last edited:

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
I hear what you are saying but it's not quite the same problem - it really isn't, or perphaps it is but its excarebated by the test firmware I am running on? I can see what you are talking about by playing the original games, and I see the glitching you refer to on all 3 of my MVS with original carts. Rather than confuse things with more videos and stuff I would prefer to park this problem for now until other firmware updates are released. I can upload the video later if required but right now us focussing on this like its a huge problem is just going to confuse things imo. But I thank you for pointing out what could be mistaken as a problem - we've certainly already had the Pulstar issue do that!!!

Yes I understand, I'm on the identical firmware to you at the moment btw but I dont have a 1FZ. What I'm trying to do it park these graphical situations into seperate boxes so anyone else who sees these issues onscreen can first get an idea on what is normal beavior before posting about it. In your case you are not 100% sure which box it belongs in (normal or neosd issue) so I agree with you, if you still get it after new firmwares a video showing what you see would be very goood.
 

GadgetUK

Robert Garcia's Butler
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,280
In your case you are not 100% sure which box it belongs in (normal or neosd issue) so I agree with you, if you still get it after new firmwares a video showing what you see would be very goood.
I think maybe I wasn't clear enough - The problem is worse than normal, so I do know which box it belongs in. I just don't know whether its related to the last firmware update, or whether my fixing my clock jitter has anything to do with it. ie. code (well, not code as such, VHDL) over compensating for what used to be a jittery clock.
 
Last edited:

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
I think maybe I wasn't clear enough - The problem is worse than normal, so I do know which box it belongs in. I just don't know whether its related to the last firmware update, or whether my fixing my clock jitter has anything to do with it. ie. code (well, not code as such, VHDL) over compensating for what used to be a jittery clock.

Yes, it wont be pixel glitching caused by palette RAM access which is the point I'm making only because that is totally normal.
 
Last edited:

Jag-Master

"Hey, are we done here?..., Cause I'm losing my bu
Joined
May 7, 2008
Posts
910
@NeoSD

Is there a way to access the NeoBuilderUI Tool software? Cannot seem to access it from the download or support section from the website.
 

neosd

Neosd Developer
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Posts
946
@NeoSD

Is there a way to access the NeoBuilderUI Tool software? Cannot seem to access it from the download or support section from the website.

Hello,

We enable downloads acces once we ship NEOSD.
So if we have shipped your neosd, go to downloads section, and click on recover your password. You have to put the same email address you used to purchase the NEOSD on the store.

Thanks
 

Jag-Master

"Hey, are we done here?..., Cause I'm losing my bu
Joined
May 7, 2008
Posts
910
Hello,

We enable downloads acces once we ship NEOSD.
So if we have shipped your neosd, go to downloads section, and click on recover your password. You have to put the same email address you used to purchase the NEOSD on the store.

Thanks


Thanks, I was able to get the downloads.
 

dkarDaGobert

Kuroko's Training Dummy
Joined
Feb 17, 2013
Posts
70
NeoSD sent me a new firmware for my 4slot today.
Seems like the fix works. I dont get any more crashes with sd card in which was the problem before (it was only working with ingame-trigger-menu disables + arcademode + no sdcard inside).

so id say you can concentrate now on your to-do list :)

another nice thing you could maybe add:
is it possible to get an option like "force neosd as first boot device"?
after i flash a game i have to switch between the slots until i the find the game flashed on the neosd.

PS: whats the soccer brawl title under my account name?! :D
 

Rot

Calvin & Hobbes, ,
Staff member
Joined
Jul 8, 2003
Posts
11,368
PS: whats the soccer brawl title under my account name?! :D

Dumbass...

It's taken you over 3 and a half years to reach 46 posts...

Some members can get that title in a day...

It will change with posts made...

xROTx
 

dkarDaGobert

Kuroko's Training Dummy
Joined
Feb 17, 2013
Posts
70
i prefer quality over quantity, how about you? :D


Dumbass...

It's taken you over 3 and a half years to reach 46 posts...

Some members can get that title in a day...

It will change with posts made...

xROTx
 

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
another nice thing you could maybe add:
is it possible to get an option like "force neosd as first boot device"?
after i flash a game i have to switch between the slots until i the find the game flashed on the neosd.

This is not as easy to do as it sounds as the boot order does not just depend on the SLOT the NeoSD is in. It also depends on the game on the NeoSD, the first boot game is handled by the Bios.
 

dkarDaGobert

Kuroko's Training Dummy
Joined
Feb 17, 2013
Posts
70
ah ok, and it depends on which cart has the lowest rom size, am i right?
is this feature possible for a future unibios release?
 

GadgetUK

Robert Garcia's Butler
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Posts
1,280
This is not as easy to do as it sounds as the boot order does not just depend on the SLOT the NeoSD is in. It also depends on the game on the NeoSD, the first boot game is handled by the Bios.
Very interesting I didn't know that! What dictates which game boots in which order?
 

neodev

Neosd Tech
Joined
Nov 28, 2016
Posts
256
Very interesting I didn't know that! What dictates which game boots in which order?

Detecting neosd is not easy, because it will pose as a genuine cart, and there is no way to tell it apart from an actual original cart. In order to be able to detect it, we would need to add some kind of magic access combination that would trigger a specific result, but that is not tripped during normal game usage.

Also, I think the boot order (Razoola will correct me if wrong) depends on which game contains an eyecatcher animation (neogeo logo). I think the bios priorizes booting the game that contains an animation.
 

Razoola

Divine Hand of the UniBIOS,
Staff member
Joined
Nov 12, 2002
Posts
4,630
Detecting neosd is not easy, because it will pose as a genuine cart, and there is no way to tell it apart from an actual original cart. In order to be able to detect it, we would need to add some kind of magic access combination that would trigger a specific result, but that is not tripped during normal game usage.

Also, I think the boot order (Razoola will correct me if wrong) depends on which game contains an eyecatcher animation (neogeo logo). I think the bios priorizes booting the game that contains an animation.

You are right it does depend on the eyecatcher logo, the bios will make the first game the first game that holds the old style logo. Even knowing this, changing the order is still not easily possible for other reasons. You could have the NeoSD fake it to force it to boot first (will need to be in slot1) but that is going to give side effects, and like you say, move things away from how an original cart works.

In theory I could add something into a future unibios to detect the NeoSD (in SLOT1) and then force the UI based on a button check done within the unibios. So that would not change the booting order on multislots but may help multislot owners get to the UI on startup.
 
Last edited:

poodude

B. Jenet's Firstmate
Joined
Jul 16, 2008
Posts
405
I get an illegal instruction crash in unibios 3.0 while trying to run v-liner on my mv-1fzs. The game runs fine until I insert a credit which throws up that screen in unibios. Anyone able to get this to run? I tried with both sets. Also does the joystick version of irritating maze work on the neo SD?
 
Last edited:

Sceptre_JLRB

Not so MEGA, eh?
Joined
Aug 21, 2016
Posts
99
I get an illegal instruction crash in unibios 3.0 while trying to run v-liner on my mv-1fzs. The game runs fine until I insert a credit which throws up that screen in unibios. Anyone able to get this to run? I tried with both sets. Also does the joystick version of irritating maze work on the neo SD?

As Razoola said 5000 posts ago, this is totally normal since V-Liner does not recognize the normal "Coin" button. The solution is to play in AES mode activating the 1000-credit cheat with the UniBIOS (actually, it's also playable in MVS mode, but it is exception-prone).

The same applies for Jockey Grad Prix, where it is necessary to activate the 9999-credit cheat in order to play, although there are no UniBIOS exceptions and it can be played in MVS mode.

As for Irritating Maze, you can activate the joystick cheat with the UniBIOS, too.
 
Top