Hey NG.com - I really want your honest opinion on this issue.

[TonK]

A little backstory.

This guy was called out for scamming a while back, but lied his way out of it.

I eventually caught him.

But he has an alcohol addiction, and used it as a crutch.

What do you think should happen?

What would happen to him here?

http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=37846

I'm just puzzled by the "I'm looking the other way cause he has a problem."

 

[rarehero]

Don't look the other way.
That is effectively a passive way of enabling their addiction.
Make them accountable for their actions.
Addiction is not an excuse,
and letting an addict use their addiction as an excuse will only
give them the perception you condone their actions.
Am I in the ball park? I didn't read the thread.
I'm on my phone right now.

 

[fake]

I read the thread a few days ago but didn't know about his drinking. Since he's supposedly refunding the buyer I think he should be forgiven but have some negative rep explaining what he did so that people who deal with him in the future know his deal. That said, you shouldn't take his drinking problem into account. Yeah, being drunk makes you do some stupid shit, but it doesn't turn you into a scam artist as far as I know.

I think whether addiction is a "disease" or a choice is debatable. Yeah, addicts of couse voluntarily start doing whatever they become addicted to, but a lot of the time they're predisposed to becoming addicted - self-medicating due to broken homes, growing up in a rough area, etc.

 

[Steve]

Don't look the other way.
That is effectively a passive way of enabling their addiction.
Make them accountable for their actions.
Addiction is not an excuse,
and letting an addict use their addiction as an excuse will only
give them the perception you condone their actions.
Am I in the ball park? I didn't read the thread.
I'm on my phone right now.

+1. It's a cop out on his part.
Addiction or not, everyone gets treated the same. You fail to live up to your end, you failed to live up to your end. No excuses. I agree that this is a passive form of enabling him. He needs to be held to the same standards like everyone else.

 

[Poonman]

Drunk driving and drunk scamming are the same....you unintentionally do bad things to people and you deal with the consequences.

End of story.

 

[Dr Shroom]

Pistol whip.

 

[elixir]

He has a wife and kid at 21, hasn't he been punished enough already?

Although I don't understand how he's capable of participating in the PCB hobby in his situation, because I've been there and I know that shit's expensive.

 

[cdamm]

i also read the thread you posted on here a few days ago. while i feel blaming the addiction is kind of a cop out, i dont think he should be banned from a forum as long as he makes everything right. that being said- if he ever wants to buy/sell things there again he has absolutely shredded whatever reputation he may have had (im not a member over there and i dont know the guy). He needs to be on some sort of probation (maybe a forced tag with info to the threadfor a period of time) and when he wants to buy/sell, maybe he has to ship before taking payment. he needs to prove to you guys over there that he can be trusted. While some may never trust him again, it's on him to rebuild his reputation from less than zero. just my opinion- i've seen too many people needlessly banned from sites over something stupid. 5 great years thrown away for 1 shitty day. If he is a valuable contributer to the forum let him build himself back up from the bottom. -as long as he makes everything right.

 

[BobbyPeru]

Yeah, I couldn't have bought any of this stuff at 21. I was busy getting into dept for a useless degree.

I don't know though, what do you do in this kind of situation on an internet forum?

Some kind of permanent mark? Ban? Exclusion from market transactions?

There are only so many repercussions in this situation.

 

[rarehero]

I read the thread a few days ago but didn't know about his drinking. Since he's supposedly refunding the buyer I think he should be forgiven but have some negative rep explaining what he did so that people who deal with him in the future know his deal. That said, you shouldn't take his drinking problem into account. Yeah, being drunk makes you do some stupid shit, but it doesn't turn you into a scam artist as far as I know.

I think whether addiction is a "disease" or a choice is debatable. Yeah, addicts of couse voluntarily start doing whatever they become addicted to, but a lot of the time they're predisposed to becoming addicted - self-medicating due to broken homes, growing up in a rough area, etc.

Whether our not some one is predisposed to addictive behaviors
is a very interesting discussion.
The predisposition due to abuse or environmental conditions psychologically
speaking, to me, is valid as an underlining root cause to addictive behaviors.
Still doesn't make it an acceptable behavior though.
No free pass, if the predisposition is an issue then the true way to
solve the issue is through counseling, not via chemical dependency.

 

[Dio Brando]

Personally, I am the kind of guy who likes to forgive, and I don't believe he should be banned entirely. Sure, he didn't fess up and try to fix the problems until after he was caught, but, as humans, we all make mistakes. However, I don't believe he should get off scot-free. He still did something wrong and needs to be punished, even if he sees the errors of his ways. At the very least, he should not be allowed to sell or buy on the forums for an extended period of time.

 

[Takumaji]

Personally, I am the kind of guy who likes to forgive, and I don't believe he should be banned entirely. Sure, he didn't fess up and try to fix the problems until after he was caught, but, as humans, we all make mistakes. However, I don't believe he should get off scot-free. He still did something wrong and needs to be punished, even if he sees the errors of his ways. At the very least, he should not be allowed to sell or buy on the forums for an extended period of time.

What he said.

 

[Hot Chocolate]

Personally, I am the kind of guy who likes to forgive, and I don't believe he should be banned entirely. Sure, he didn't fess up and try to fix the problems until after he was caught, but, as humans, we all make mistakes. However, I don't believe he should get off scot-free. He still did something wrong and needs to be punished, even if he sees the errors of his ways. At the very least, he should not be allowed to sell or buy on the forums for an extended period of time.

+1

 

[2D_mastur]

Being a wino isn't an excuse for cheating people. I say ban scum like this, cheating people out of their hard-earned cash is a terrible, premeditated crime.

 

[subcons]

If he didn't have 100 positive feedback and wasn't an established member, I'd say ban him obviously. But for that very fact, it seems like his problems are a legit excuse in light of his apologies. As long as everyone gets they're stuff/money back, I say let him stay. It'll be well known that he's unstable, so whoever is willing to deal with him will have to make that judgement call on their own.

 

[cannonball]

No excuse. If he scams again (and he will), it will be nobody's fault but the people who let him continue to do business there.

 

[GregN]

Pistol Whip

Pistol whip.

Agreed.

I dunno about you, ToNK, you find yourself in situations like this alot, not to be a bitch, but don't you think it has as much to do with you as it does with him? Go to therapy - I do, and it's helped me a fuckload. Negotiate with the therapist if you have to if you don't have health insurance or can't afford it.

I know how you feel though man, I HATE liars and scammers and criminals.

Perma IP ban that bitch. Don't put up with his bullshit!

You can even be a Nazi like NeoGAF and not allow free email accounts, but that would probably be a shitload of work for you, right?

 

[Luke Moerse]

by banning him you'd actually be doing him a favor

he wouldn't be able to scam people anymore...so he'd have less ill-gotten funds to buy booze with

 

[Marek]

I have an alcohol problem.

I have an addiction to pussy.

Do I catch any breaks because people feel sorry for me? no.

 

[Average Joe]

forgiving someone online is a hell of a lot different than forgiving someone in person

in person it's easier to keep an eye on someone

on the internet it's easy to lack accountability when you're potentially hundreds of miles away from each other

it gets even trickier when you're talking about those PCBs you guys buy/sell that are stupidly expensive

empathy goes a long way but sometimes it's best not to take it too far as well

i suppose i'd adopt cautious optimism in this instance instead of true forgiveness until a time comes where he's proven himself trustworthy (maybe not ban him but let his shady dealing history be known and disallow him from buying/selling on those forums and let him stick to ebay)

i can relate to alcohol issues (pretty far in the past at this point, but still...) but i sure as hell can't relate to letting my problems spill into other peoples' laps

drug and alcohol abuse aren't an excuse for doing terrible things to other people

fuck up your own life all you want but the second you fuck with someone else's that's when you've lost the privilege of trust and you have no right to expect others to forgive you

we should strive to lean towards forgiving the transgressions of others, but let's face it, as a race we're generally not that good at forgiving so it's not to be expected (sadly)

 

[fake]

Just pointing this out: If you ban him, couldn't he just make a new account and pretend to be someone else?

 

[xhiltch]

Just pointing this out: If you ban him, couldn't he just make a new account and pretend to be someone else?

this is inevitable and he would probably do this even if his old account had a custom rank; but at least he would have to rebuild his post count and buy/sell feedback history. which is really the only yard stick for credibility. imo. ...and TonK WILL find him if he pulls this crap again.

 

[GregN]

Just pointing this out: If you ban him, couldn't he just make a new account and pretend to be someone else?

This is why Neo GAF are nazis and aggressively modded. But that still won't keep him away. I was banned from there for racist comments 1 year ago, but have changed my ways and am back under a different name.

Ban him for 3 months, and if he comes back and has changed his ways, keep him on, that's what I would do.

 

[Cavalry]

I'd give him a time out and spank his bottom.

 

[SNKorSWM]

Japhei has a meth addiction!?