FIXED! Infinity debunked. Xbox One is the official name.

[Taiso]

Given the backlash that Microsoft is getting regarding used games sales etc…is it feasible that one publisher, let’s say Capcom, could handle used games sales on PS4 differently than on Xbone for the same game? Could we see a situation where Resident Evil 7 on PS4 might not have the same restrictions as Resident Evil 7 on Xbone?

If so…that could have major implications for the future relationships with 3rd party publishers. Right now, we are assuming most publishers are in favor of the whole DRM issue…but what happens if they begin to listen to the public and don’t institute it when not necessary. Inherently, right off the bat then the PS4 alternative would be a lot more attractive to consumers. And with the promise of greater sales…wouldn’t it make it more attractive to publishers to focus on the PS4? I mean, isn’t that the whole problem with the Wii U right now? That making games for it is currently not financially attractive to 3rd parties? Could we see the same thing happening to Microsoft?

Well, since we're playing armchair analysts here, and we've been with the hobby long enough to recognize the trends AND some of us actually work in the electronics industry. I will posit my own thoughts.

I don't believe the publishers will implement DRM for one console and then not implement it for the other. They will end up getting pantsed if they do that, and it will be a waste both in terms of money to implement the infrastructure and also the waste in man hours, materials and resources on the DRM console version.

If one console's third party titles will not have DRM and the other one will, vendors like Gamestop and Best Buy are going to hard sell the non DRM console. Everybody everywhere that sells used games as a business model, even down to eBay and Amazon, will work to not only promote the purchase of a console that enables them to keep moving product, but the side effect of this is that it will choke out the DRM console all the more.

DRM is the hot topic in gaming right now. Companies like EA and Ubisoft were able to sort of get away with it because there were always a large variety of options for console gamers to fall back on. But when the options are narrowed down to two, DRM or no DRM, regardless of the publisher, people are going to flock to the option that allows the consumer the greater control with what they purchase. And companies like EA and Ubisoft have to be very careful right now. There is already strong negative sentiment towards them about DRM, and this could only result in more PR damage.

And no matter what anyone tells you, believe this for it is gospel truth and I would swear on it. Companies DO care how they are perceived. They secretly loathe having to do the song and dance for their consumers, but they do it because the damage takes a long time to repair. Nintendo and Sony let their secret loathing out of the bag in previous years and people hated them for it. Now it's Microsoft's turn to take the plunge. Look out below.

Sony even TROLLED better than Microsoft at E3. That whole 'here is how you share used games' video is an amazing flame, one for which Microsoft has no answer. And how does a Japanese company out-troll an American company in this day and age? Sony trolled Microsoft. Microsoft trolled its consumer base.

So I don't think publishers would have a split business model. Whichever console sells more, that is the way the industry will go.

So if you care about ownership of what you buy and don't want to put up with draconian DRM, buy a PS4 and a Wii U and do not entitle Microsoft to have their way with you.

Even this is not a guarantee that you won't see DRM. It may come eventually. But properly, in the right time, when the industry figures out the right way to implement it without burning the whole thing down.

.02

 

[NeoSneth]

Given the backlash that Microsoft is getting regarding used games sales etc…is it feasible that one publisher, let’s say Capcom, could handle used games sales on PS4 differently than on Xbone for the same game? Could we see a situation where Resident Evil 7 on PS4 might not have the same restrictions as Resident Evil 7 on Xbone?

If so…that could have major implications for the future relationships with 3rd party publishers. Right now, we are assuming most publishers are in favor of the whole DRM issue…but what happens if they begin to listen to the public and don’t institute it when not necessary. Inherently, right off the bat then the PS4 alternative would be a lot more attractive to consumers. And with the promise of greater sales…wouldn’t it make it more attractive to publishers to focus on the PS4? I mean, isn’t that the whole problem with the Wii U right now? That making games for it is currently not financially attractive to 3rd parties? Could we see the same thing happening to Microsoft?

the DRM is mostly for publishers with some added benefits to the consumer with digital rights. We don't know how the revenue stream will work out, but the industry is betting on taking a cut of used game sales. Capcom is probably a bad example because they have been dying to get a cut of used game sales. Just look at their recent attempts to prevent it.

None of this prevents you from trading in your game to GS. It just inhibits trading to your buddy without also transferring the digital rights. which probably has a fee.

I'm on the fence with the online connectivity. On one hand, I can't imagine a large set of gamers that dont have broadband. And if they don't, how big of a market segment is that? It's probably the same subset that doesnt have an HDTV yet.
i work in technology, and having to cater to the lowest common denominator is not always an option. You try to accommodate them, but it's not always the best decision. M$ is already talking about extending it to a week or a code system.

You didn't ask for this??! I think you did, when you demanded games stay the same price.
M$ games are listing at $60 thanks to all of this. PS4 then quickly stated they expect the same price at launch, but i haven't seen it. There is no reason in this day and age that games should still be this cheap. It's why you get rehashed IP, because big title games are a financial burden.

 

[SonGohan]

I dunno, I think he mentions it around the end @11:40ish?

That was great. I need more 'murica in my accents, though.

 

[Taiso]

You didn't ask for this??! I think you did, when you demanded games stay the same price.
M$ games are listing at $60 thanks to all of this. PS4 then quickly stated they expect the same price at launch, but i haven't seen it. There is no reason in this day and age that games should still be this cheap. It's why you get rehashed IP, because big title games are a financial burden.

Question #1: Can we please have games stay the same price?

Question #2: Can we please be forced to purchase unwanted hardware, authenticate our identities on a daily basis and not be able to lend games to friends and family for free?

Two very different questions.

And there are multiple answers for the question we DID ask.

 

[MilkManX]

Amazon poll via FB shows the PS4 winning by a lot..

http://www.techspot.com/news/52915-...ing-the-xbox-one-in-amazon-customer-poll.html

 

[SonGohan]

Amazon poll via FB shows the PS4 winning by a lot..

http://www.techspot.com/news/52915-...ing-the-xbox-one-in-amazon-customer-poll.html

Holy shit

I mean, is it possible that MS doesn't give a shit about this and plans to stubbornly go forward with their plans? Or is there hope that they'll take a second look at what they're wanting to implement and possibly change?

 

[Taiso]

Holy shit

I mean, is it possible that MS doesn't give a shit about this and plans to stubbornly go forward with their plans? Or is there hope that they'll take a second look at what they're wanting to implement and possibly change?

I believe it's entirely possible.

Remember all the arrogance Sony displayed with the PS3 when they first announced it?

And how they kept the course and said obnoxious things like "People will get a second job to own a PS3"?

Sony was on top of the world when they announced PS3. PS2 was still doing gangbusters, and has/had arguably the best game library of all time.

They got fat and overconfident and look what happened. It took years - YEARS - before they changed their tune.

Microsoft won the core gamer console war last generation. Even though the PS3 eventually outpaced it worldwide, Xbox 360 still has more units sold in the primary markets of USA and UK. And the current high selling phenomenon of the military FPS multiplayer scene is largely driven by the perception that it is played on Xbox Live.

They are fat and overconfident. Just like Sony was.

 

[Average Joe]

Amazon poll via FB shows the PS4 winning by a lot..

http://www.techspot.com/news/52915-...ing-the-xbox-one-in-amazon-customer-poll.html

hahaha... wow

 

[Takumaji]

Holy shit

I mean, is it possible that MS doesn't give a shit about this and plans to stubbornly go forward with their plans? Or is there hope that they'll take a second look at what they're wanting to implement and possibly change?

Not sure whether it would be possible to introduce dramatic changes at this stage of the Xbone development. It has been designed from the ground up with all that DRM and spying junk in mind, taking some or all of it away would mean re-designing major parts of the system and servers which seems very difficult to me now that they've let the cat out of the bag during their last few official presentations.

If they're going forward with the original plan, I can only hope that they will get punished for it by the customers. Then again, people have a short memory, this will be forgotten when the next CoD comes out... ah well, how does the saying go, the spirit ist willing but the flesh is weak...

 

[NeoSneth]

what spying junk?

Anonymous developer in Reference to Kinect One:

By default it's on, listening for "Xbox On". You can turn it off tho, and turn the console like OFF off. OFF off is required for Germany / other countries that require it (no vampire appliances) [...] It has to be plugged in for the console to post. You can turn off everything it does from the settings. Think of it like airplane mode for the iPhone. You can't just unplug the cellular radio, but you can turn it off.

Playing with friends

>What fee? There is no fee to play your games at your friends house. Never has, never will. Even x360 digital downloads could do that.

 

[Takumaji]

what spying junk?

 

[NeoGeoNinja]

You didn't ask for this??! I think you did, when you demanded games stay the same price.
M$ games are listing at $60 thanks to all of this. PS4 then quickly stated they expect the same price at launch, but i haven't seen it. There is no reason in this day and age that games should still be this cheap. It's why you get rehashed IP, because big title games are a financial burden.

You've got me here. I don't get this comment. You're suggesting $60 for a game is cheap, presumably vs the Hollywood outlay that these so-called talented studios make creating cover shooter A, FPS shooter B or track racer C? Even sequel D, E & F?

 

[68k]

View attachment 4620

hahaha

 

[Taiso]

Wes, you were wondering if Microsoft would just barrel on in their current mindset?

As Paul Bearer might say...OOOOHHHHH YES!

 

[genjiglove]

Where is this rumor about MS making it a weekly check in or whatever.

 

[SonGohan]

Wes, you were wondering if Microsoft would just barrel on in their current mindset?

As Paul Bearer might say...OOOOHHHHH YES!

Oh Jesus Christ. I wish I could just not care, but they're so interesting when they act like this

 

[Average Joe]

"Mattrick believes consumers will choose Xbox One for its suite of exclusive services and applications like an improved Xbox Live, as well as Skype, Twitch TV, SmartGlass, and Kinect."

i only know what two of those things are and i don't give a damn about either of them

i'm sure once i find out what the other two things are/do i won't give a damn about them either

 

[NeoSneth]

You've got me here. I don't get this comment. You're suggesting $60 for a game is cheap, presumably vs the Hollywood outlay that these so-called talented studios make creating cover shooter A, FPS shooter B or track racer C? Even sequel D, E & F?

Chrono Trigger was $80 at launch in 1995. I paid $50 for TMNT II on the NES in 1990. That was a lot of dough for a kid, but we're adults now.
You don't think $60 is cheap after 20+ years of inflation?

$60 in 1990 is $106.75 in 2013.

Imagine if you were a gamer in the 80's.

 

[FAT$TACKS]

Chrono Trigger was $80 at launch in 1995. I paid $50 for TMNT II on the NES in 1990. That was a lot of dough for a kid, but we're adults now.
You don't think $60 is cheap after 20+ years of inflation?

$60 in 1990 is $106.75 in 2013.

Imagine if you were a gamer in the 80's.

Thats actually a pretty good question.

I'm not really sure on this one if $60 is cheap after 20+ years of inflation as I am not buying the same item with the same cost to produce in the same size market. If anything with the profits the big companies are pulling in it should seem the games should be cheaper.

Then again its 60 bucks then and getting a nice cart with a book and box, or as some companies are trying to push, 60 for a digital item I don't even own.

I think It would be rather interesting to see the numbers on something like this.

 

[Lagduf]

I'd pay more than $60 for a digital copy of a game if I was the sole owner of the game and could freely transfer it. Not sure how that technology would work, it'd still most likely be dependent on some kind of service provider to transfer the license, however, I'm sure Steam and the like are here to stay.

 

[Earthquake24]

Here are the 'policy documents' MS and their staff were supposed to be emphasizing for any potential interviews with game press/media from E3 and forward:

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/license

How Games Licensing Works on Xbox One

posted June 06, 2013 at 3:02 PM

With our modern architecture, Xbox One games will load more quickly, will be always accessible from the cloud, and there is no physical limit to the size or scope of the content provided.

Here are our platform policies and capabilities for game licensing – all of which will be made available when Xbox One launches later this year:


•Buy the way you want—disc or digital—on the same day: You’ll be able to buy disc-based games at traditional retailers or online through Xbox Live, on day of release. Discs will continue to be a great way to install your games quickly.


•Access your entire games library from any Xbox One—no discs required: After signing in and installing, you can play any of your games from any Xbox One because a digital copy of your game is stored on your console and in the cloud. So, for example, while you are logged in at your friend’s house, you can play your games.


•Share access to your games with everyone inside your home: Your friends and family, your guests and acquaintances get unlimited access to all of your games. Anyone can play your games on your console--regardless of whether you are logged in or their relationship to you.


•Give your family access to your entire games library anytime, anywhere: Xbox One will enable new forms of access for families. Up to ten members of your family can log in and play from your shared games library on any Xbox One. Just like today, a family member can play your copy of Forza Motorsport at a friend’s house. Only now, they will see not just Forza, but all of your shared games. You can always play your games, and any one of your family members can be playing from your shared library at a given time.


•Trade-in and resell your disc-based games: Today, some gamers choose to sell their old disc-based games back for cash and credit. We designed Xbox One so game publishers can enable you to trade in your games at participating retailers. Microsoft does not charge a platform fee to retailers, publishers, or consumers for enabling transfer of these games.


•Give your games to friends: Xbox One is designed so game publishers can enable you to give your disc-based games to your friends. There are no fees charged as part of these transfers. There are two requirements: you can only give them to people who have been on your friends list for at least 30 days and each game can only be given once.


In our role as a game publisher, Microsoft Studios will enable you to give your games to friends or trade in your Xbox One games at participating retailers. Third party publishers may opt in or out of supporting game resale and may set up business terms or transfer fees with retailers. Microsoft does not receive any compensation as part of this. In addition, third party publishers can enable you to give games to friends. Loaning or renting games won’t be available at launch, but we are exploring the possibilities with our partners.



As we move into this new generation of games and entertainment, from time to time, Microsoft may change its policies, terms, products and services to reflect modifications and improvements to our services, feedback from customers and our business partners or changes in our business priorities and business models or for other reasons. We may also cease to offer certain services or products for similar reasons.



In the months ahead, we will continue to listen to your feedback as we meet with our partners in the ecosystem to bring additional detail about our policies.



We are excited about this new generation of games and entertainment and look forward to sharing more news with our fans.

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/connected

Xbox One: A Modern, Connected Device

posted June 06, 2013 at 3:03 PM

Xbox One will deliver new benefits for gamers that are only possible with a system designed from the ground up to be ready and connected. Here are just a few examples:


•A new generation of games with power from the cloud: Because every Xbox One owner has a broadband connection, developers can create massive, persistent worlds that evolve even when you’re not playing.

•Your Xbox One is always ready: Xbox One is designed to run in a low-powered, connected state. This means your system, games and apps are always current and ready to play—no more waiting for updates.


•Stay connected to your friends: Never miss an opportunity to play games with your friends or to catch up with family on Skype. Use Skype in Snap mode to chat while you play games or watch TV. Or enjoy group video Skype calls with people around the world, all from the comfort of your living room.


•Access your entire games library from any Xbox One—no discs required: After signing in and installing, you can play any of your games from any Xbox One because a digital copy of your game is stored on your console and in the cloud. So, for example, while you are logged in at your friend’s house, you can play your games.


•Buy the way you want—disc or digital—on the same day: You’ll be able to buy disc-based games at traditional retailers or online through Xbox Live, on day of release.



Networking Technologies



A range of advanced technologies will make these scenarios possible, including:



•Superior wireless performance and coverage throughout the home: Xbox One is equipped with a gigabit Ethernet port and 802.11n wireless. With 802.11n, Xbox One can use the 5GHz wireless band which eliminates considerable interference from other devices in the home, such as cordless phones, Bluetooth devices and microwaves. Xbox One uses two wireless antennas, versus one in Xbox 360. This provides dramatically better coverage and sustained performance, which means faster internet speeds in more areas of your home.

•Faster connection to a world of smart devices: With Wi-Fi Direct, Xbox One can speak directly to smart wireless devices and connect to them through the cloud. This means your smartphone or tablet will interact with Xbox One seamlessly.

•Future proofed with power from the cloud: Microsoft has created a global network of more than 300,000 Xbox Live and Windows Azure servers, to help creators realize their visions of what is possible with a connected system.


Networking Requirements



To ensure Xbox One works optimally and can offer the experiences described above, it is designed with the following networking requirements:



•For an optimal experience, we recommend a broadband connection of 1.5Mbps. (For reference, the average global internet connection speed as measured recently by Akamai was 2.9 Mbps). In areas where an Ethernet connection is not available, you can connect using mobile broadband.


•While a persistent connection is not required, Xbox One is designed to verify if system, application or game updates are needed and to see if you have acquired new games, or resold, traded in, or given your game to a friend. Games that are designed to take advantage of the cloud may require a connection.


With Xbox One you can game offline for up to 24 hours on your primary console, or one hour if you are logged on to a separate console accessing your library. Offline gaming is not possible after these prescribed times until you re-establish a connection, but you can still watch live TV and enjoy Blu-ray and DVD movies.



At Xbox, we’ve always believed in a connected world of games and entertainment. With Xbox One, we are planning for a connected future. We can’t wait to show you what’s to come.

 

[Taiso]

MA. rep Michael Capuano doesn't like the Spybone,

 

[FAT$TACKS]

MA. rep Michael Capuano doesn't like the Spybone,

Yeah, good ol MS is not the only one trying to get in on that game. Thats one of the reasons I've been taking it serious. If they were the only one then maybe.. just maybe there would be a chance we wouldn't be seeing data mining from tv but nope... This crap has been going on for a while. I just never expected it to be in a game system.
I'm it will happen if we stay quiet and let it, and even if we try to act it may still be just a matter of time.

http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph...&s1=20120304206&OS=20120304206&RS=20120304206

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012...u-now-verizon-patent-listens-in-on-customers/

http://www.fiercecable.com/story/ve...od-determines-if-viewers-are-laugh/2012-11-30

http://blogs.reuters.com/mediafile/...l-recognition-freaks-out-potential-customers/

This shit has been going on for quite a while. Anyone who thinks it's paranoid to think that the kinect may end up being a tool to watch you, is someone who has not been paying attention. I've still yet to see any kind of intelligent arguement against the posibillity of such a thing happening.

 

[68k]

Just one subpoena away...

 

[Taiso]

I agree with Spoon when he said "Fuck that shit. Hold on to what's good for as long as you can."

I may put it in my sig after my Martin quote. Good company, indeed.