Neo CD System Question

VinylBoy · Apr 23, 2003

I apologize if this has been asked before... and it probably has.

I was wondering what type of CD mechanism is the Neo CD based off of and to find out if it is possible to use a CD drive of the same mechanism, but at a faster speed, to possibly speed up the loading time for certain games for the Neo CD system. I'm thinking that this probably wouldn't work, due to the processor and memory buffer of the system, but I thought I would ask.

c.t.h · Apr 23, 2003

Use the search tool. This as been asked 1,000,000+1 times.

VinylBoy · Apr 24, 2003

c.t.h:
Use the search tool. This as been asked 1,000,000+1 times.

And considering that there aren't even 1,000,000 threads in this very forum, I hardly suspect that this question has been asked this many times. Work on your sarcasm, dude. oh_no

*SIGH* I VERY rarely read anything in this particular section of this forum, so forgive me for not being such a tech wizard on the subject. Either answer the question or ignore it. No need for snide remarks.

<small>[ April 24, 2003, 02:45 AM: Message edited by: VinylBoy ]</small>

PrOzErG · Apr 24, 2003

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=search;search_forum=5" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=search;search_forum=5</a>

c.t.h · Apr 24, 2003

VinylBoy:

c.t.h:
Use the search tool. This as been asked 1,000,000+1 times.

Click to expand...

And considering that there aren't even 1,000,000 threads in this very forum, I hardly suspect that this question has been asked this many times. Work on your sarcasm, dude. oh_no

*SIGH* I VERY rarely read anything in this particular section of this forum, so forgive me for not being such a tech wizard on the subject. Either answer the question or ignore it. No need for snide remarks.

It wasn't a snide remark, it's just that people get tired of answering the same questions over and over again. So just use the search tool, as prozerg linked you to it!

VinylBoy · Apr 24, 2003

c.t.h:
It wasn't a snide remark, it's just that people get tired of answering the same questions over and over again. So just use the search tool, as prozerg linked you to it!

It's funny how even people who have been around for a while can STILL be treated like a newbie...

Let's face facts... just about EVERY question that has been asked on these forums have been asked before many times, whether it be on this web page or on the mailing list. From gameplay questions, to game availability and beyond. If everyone had this type of mentality to tell people to "search" it, then there would be no need for these forums at all. Again, all I wanted to know was the mechanism of the Neo CD drive. Yamaha? Mitsubishi? Sony?? I'm certain that everyone has asked about whether or not you could put in a faster drive... but that's not the only thing I'm trying to figure out.

Nevermind... once again I wish that I never started yet ANOTHER thread. Some of you people just need to learn how to be helpful and not so damn spiteful.

c.t.h · Apr 24, 2003

<cough>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004530" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004530</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004370" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004370</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004333" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=004333</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=003924" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=003924</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=003371" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=003371</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=002665" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=002665</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=002507" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=002507</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=001374" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=001374</a>

<a href="http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=00061" target="_blank">http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=00061</a>

</cough>

VinylBoy · Apr 24, 2003

How interesting...
Out of ALL of those wonderful posts you put up there in an attempt to make someone look clueless and idiotic...

Only ONE of the actual threads state that the actual mechanism of the Neo CD Drive is based off of a Toshiba CD drive... and one of the threads don't even exist anymore. A far cry from a standard question that is ALWAYS asked, don't you think?

*SIGH*. TOSHIBA. That's all you needed to say. Was the "this has been asked 1,000,000 +1 times already" really necessary? Because apparently, it REALLY hasn't been asked.

c.t.h · Apr 24, 2003

I don't get what the big deal was - of course it was a Toshiba drive, SNK used toshiba for almost everything - from the ROMS on the aes games to the batterys for the neo geo pocket.

Shame on me for posting helpful links :rolleyes:

VinylBoy · Apr 25, 2003

Well, HELLO!!!
That's why I asked what the mechanism was for I didn't know what it was! And cosidering that in the many threads that you posted it was mentioned ONLY ONCE (purely by accident), then it's not so "common knowledge".

You need to understand that not everyone are not on your supposed "intelectual wavelength" when it comes to these machines. I've never owned a Neo CD system, nevermind decided to go inside or find out the extremely detailed tech specs of it, the AES system, or just about ANY system I have owned. As long as they worked, everything is fine.

Again... all YOU had to say was TOSHIBA. Frankly, I doubt you even knew that, considering that you told me to research it in the first place. After all of this, I can understand EVEN MORE why people leave this scene. oh_no

NeoGoaT · Apr 25, 2003

This is from Chris Mullins' Neo Geo faq:

----Man, the NEOGEO CD is too slow! Can't I put in an 8x CD-ROM drive in my NEOGEO CD?
Well, it may depend on one's computer skills, as it depends on wiring the CD interface to the controller on
the NEOGEO CD.. But all that work may be for naught, because most of the access time depends on what
speed the games are produced at. Most are still produced at 1x,so anything higher than a 6x or 8x drive is
not necessary at all. A 4x drive may not be necessary, so unfortunately one is stuck with slow access times.
The translation itself is EXTREMELY difficult, and only one place (MAS Systems) has pulled off a
translation. And, it was a Saturn-CDZ, which had no speed increase in it at all.
With the advent of Neo CD emulation, load times are extremely fast and games have no slowdown
whatsoever. CD games are worth buying if only to play with an emulator, because the emulators currently
out are that good. I would actually suggest selling the original system and playing the games with an
emulator if possible, as they (NeoCD I think is the name of my favorite) blow away the original's
performance. No more reading chapters out of the Hunchback of Notre Dame while waiting for Bakumatsu
Roman Gekkano Kenshi to load, I guess.

The majority of it is pointless emu waffle but the fact that MAS managed to jam a Saturn CD Drive in there yet got no decrease in loading times would suggest it's a waste of time. I'm way out of my depth tech-wise here but I would imagine the whole system (memory buffer etc, as you said) is designed around the standard single speed CD-Rom. You could always take Chris' advice and get a Neo CD emu :rolleyes:

Lovecraft0110 · Apr 25, 2003

It is true that the CD replacement question has been asked innumerable times (and I have been among the 'offenders' myself), but what are we supposed to talk about here, if not about the same old questions of yore?.

Let's face it, the Neo-Geo world is not the most creative area as far as gaming goes...99% of what is posted in any of the diverse forums here is a rehash of some other older post, and so on ad infinitum. So VinylBoy's post was as valid as any other, I think.

c.t.h · Apr 25, 2003

And I made an attempt to answer it, I listed quite a few posts. People are wayyyy too touchy here.

Takumaji · Apr 25, 2003

NeoGoaT:
This is from Chris Mullins' Neo Geo faq:

----Man, the NEOGEO CD is too slow! Can't I put in an 8x CD-ROM drive in my NEOGEO CD?
Well, it may depend on one's computer skills, as it depends on wiring the CD interface to the controller on
the NEOGEO CD.. But all that work may be for naught, because most of the access time depends on what
speed the games are produced at. Most are still produced at 1x,so anything higher than a 6x or 8x drive is
not necessary at all. A 4x drive may not be necessary, so unfortunately one is stuck with slow access times.
The translation itself is EXTREMELY difficult, and only one place (MAS Systems) has pulled off a
translation. And, it was a Saturn-CDZ, which had no speed increase in it at all.
With the advent of Neo CD emulation, load times are extremely fast and games have no slowdown
whatsoever. CD games are worth buying if only to play with an emulator, because the emulators currently
out are that good. I would actually suggest selling the original system and playing the games with an
emulator if possible, as they (NeoCD I think is the name of my favorite) blow away the original's
performance. No more reading chapters out of the Hunchback of Notre Dame while waiting for Bakumatsu
Roman Gekkano Kenshi to load, I guess.

Click to expand...

The majority of it is pointless emu waffle but the fact that MAS managed to jam a Saturn CD Drive in there yet got no decrease in loading times would suggest it's a waste of time. I'm way out of my depth tech-wise here but I would imagine the whole system (memory buffer etc, as you said) is designed around the standard single speed CD-Rom. You could always take Chris' advice and get a Neo CD emu

Ah, there it is, the infamous Mullins quote I was referring to a couple of times.

It started the rumours that spread till today... yes, it IS possible to put a fast CD drive into your NGCD. NeoGoaT, you're right, the NGCD's Toshiba drive is standard PC compatible, but that alone doesn't help in any way. You'd have to replace the controller pcb and get faster cache RAM, among other things such as checking/rewriting BIOS calls, taking care of the sync between data loading and processing, etc....etc....etc....

Let me tell you, I would not want to do such a mod.

Btw., I think that Emu recommendation is bullshit. If ppl have probs with load times, they should get a MVS setup or a homecart with a Phantom instead of bitching about the horror of waiting 30 seconds.

If anyone is interested, PM/mail me and we can go into more detail about it.

VinylBoy · Apr 25, 2003

c.t.h:
And I made an attempt to answer it, I listed quite a few posts. People are wayyyy too touchy here.

No... your first answer was, "Use the search tool. This as been asked 1,000,000+1 times." That's not an answer to the question I was posting. It wasn't until I returned your drama that you tried to actually make an attempt at doing so.

But back to the subject matter... I know that the chances of this actually working are not good and that people have always speculated on making a Neo CD system with a faster CD Drive. It probably didn't have anything to do with the drive itself, but the other components within the system that wouldn't be able to handle the more powerful hardware. However, it did seem as if people were just trying to put in just ANY regular CD Drive and not one that had the same mechanism of its original. And I don't know how true or false Chris Mullins' FAQ is, but if I had the time and the parts, it would be interesting to try and make a faster Neo CD drive with an entirely new casing and setup.

Takumaji · Apr 25, 2003

VinylBoy:
[...] But back to the subject matter... I know that the chances of this actually working are not good and that people have always speculated on making a Neo CD system with a faster CD Drive. It probably didn't have anything to do with the drive itself, but the other components within the system that wouldn't be able to handle the more powerful hardware. However, it did seem as if people were just trying to put in just ANY regular CD Drive and not one that had the same mechanism of its original. And I don't know how true or false Chris Mullins' FAQ is, but if I had the time and the parts, it would be interesting to try and make a faster Neo CD drive with an entirely new casing and setup.

That would rock my world, man. Believe me, I would be one of the first to buy it, but there are some serious problems to be solved. You'd need a compatible drive, a new drive controller, different cache/work RAM, and... ...there's the main problem, I guess the m68k CPU can only use/address certain types of RAM modules, mostly of the ancient types, so you would have to build a daughter board containing the entire data i/o and the RAM management, together with some sort of interface or buffer that can be used by the CPU.

Man... imagine a small, elegant black box, about the size of a DC, with a 52x drive and a new system design that lets you play LB2 CD like a cart... buttrock drool_2 drool .... well, a man can dream can he...

kernow · Apr 25, 2003

Takumaji:

VinylBoy:
[...] But back to the subject matter... I know that the chances of this actually working are not good and that people have always speculated on making a Neo CD system with a faster CD Drive. It probably didn't have anything to do with the drive itself, but the other components within the system that wouldn't be able to handle the more powerful hardware. However, it did seem as if people were just trying to put in just ANY regular CD Drive and not one that had the same mechanism of its original. And I don't know how true or false Chris Mullins' FAQ is, but if I had the time and the parts, it would be interesting to try and make a faster Neo CD drive with an entirely new casing and setup.

Click to expand...

That would rock my world, man. Believe me, I would be one of the first to buy it, but there are some serious problems to be solved. You'd need a compatible drive, a new drive controller, different cache/work RAM, and... ...there's the main problem, I guess the m68k CPU can only use/address certain types of RAM modules, mostly of the ancient types, so you would have to build a daughter board containing the entire data i/o and the RAM management, together with some sort of interface or buffer that can be used by the CPU.

Man... imagine a small, elegant black box, about the size of a DC, with a 52x drive and a new system design that lets you play LB2 CD like a cart... buttrock drool_2 drool .... well, a man can dream can he...

I've had dreams about this, but where would one 'shove' the data

Neo CD System Question

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

c.t.h

Maxima's Barber

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

PrOzErG

Sacrifice is pleasure, , ,

c.t.h

Maxima's Barber

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

c.t.h

Maxima's Barber

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

c.t.h

Maxima's Barber

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

NeoGoaT

Mickey's Coach

Lovecraft0110

Ace Gho,

c.t.h

Maxima's Barber

Takumaji

Master Enabler

VinylBoy

Vanessa's Drinking Buddy,

Takumaji

Master Enabler

kernow

The Goob Hunter