JROK output to InFocus X1? (Hrz Freq?)

Hello,

I've been messing with this problem for about 3 weeks now and still haven't figured out what the problem is, but I do think I may be onto something. I was hoping someone here might be able to offer some insight.

Here's the deal, I have an InFocus X1 projector and I want to use my Supergun/MVS setup with it. When I try (using the s-vid out on the JROK to the s-vid in on the X1), I can get a picture, but the bottom is cutoff, the screen bounces, and the screen flashes.

I have tried to use two different MVS boards (1-slots) both of which run into the same exact problems. I have also tried a homecart system which worked absolutely perfectly!

I originally thought the problem was that the projector didn't support the neo's resolution (320x224), but that hypothesis failed when the homecart worked perfectly.

I have tried every single video setting on the projector and double checked everything. I am still at a loss and am only getting more frustrated

After doing some more thinking and research, I am starting to think that the problem is with the Horizontal Frequency output by the MVS. Using the JROK as I understand I am outputting a 15kHz Horizontal Line Frequency. The projector's specifications (found at: <a href="http://www.infocus.com/products/productview.asp?site_lang=1&site_region=1&prod=x1&c=4)" target="_blank">http://www.infocus.com/products/productview.asp?site_lang=1&site_region=1&prod=x1&c=4)</a>
list the H-Sync Range: 31.5 – 80 kHz
and the V-Sync Range: 50 – 85 Hz (85Hz at XGA only)

This is something I didn't notice before. My guess is that the projector can't properly sync with the MVS as the MVS is at 15 and the projector can only go as low as 31.5

Can anyone comment on this? Am I on the right track?

Could anyone please offer any suggestions as to how to solve my problem? I'm going to look into using an upscan convertor (as the projector can accept VGA) to hopefully bring the signal of the MVS up to a useable level with the projector.

Can anyone suggest a good upscan convertor to use?
Any comments or suggestions are greatly appreciated as I am almost at a loss here.

Thank you very much!

The home system outputs 15KHz also...so why it worked, I don't know.

Damn, I figured that the homecart was outputting at something higher.

Hmm... now I'm lost again. Every other system I have works perfectly with the projector, but the most important one (the Neo!) won't! Arh.

I appreciate the reply Reznor.

Does anyone have any ideas?

Have your tried emailing James @ JROK to see if he has any ideas on what might cause this?

I know if I run the S-video (from my JROK) into my stereo receiver and then out to the TV, I get different type of lines and distortion in the picture. If I hook it up straight to the TV, its perfect.

Perhaps there is something in the output of the JROK that prevents it from displaying correctly on the Projector.

Im not sure what can be causing the issue but I was sure the X1 could support that low of a refresh. I know my LP500 can go that low.

I would recomment the upscan converter if anything else but you might want to see if there is any firmware updates you cna do for the X1 first that can help you out.

OK, I read the manual for the projector online, and it does support 15KHz for Svideo and composite. The 31-80KHz is for VGA signals.

See if James can send you the sync regenerator prototype board. He sent me one because I had a problem with Primal Rage on my TV.

sometimes arcade boards don't output a perfectly stable, clean sync (since you can usually adjust just about everything on the monitor itself).. a circuit that relies on the perfect timing can be thrown off by that.

Thanks for the replies guys!

Decepticon, I did update the firmware to ver. 1.8 which include "better video sync'ing", but unfortunately it was a no go. Did your projector work with your Neo without a problem? Did you have to adjust anything?

Reznor, what problems did your Primal Rage board run into when used on a your TV if you don't mind me asking? Also what exactly is the sync regenerator prototype board? Does it allow you do make adjustments to the sync output?

Arakon, your idea makes sense and I would like to try to test it. Is there anyway you know of of hand to adjust the sync from the board or converter rather than the monitor?

Thank you very much again guys!

The color was weird. I think the timing was weird enough to activate the TV's Macrovision encryption stuff.

But it has an adjustment for sync on the board.

God damnit.

Okay, quick update:

I e-mailed James about the convertor and he was just as confused as I am. I asked about the Sync Regenerator board and he was more than happy to send one my way (Thanks James!).

I'm using a ver.3 RGB/NTSC convertor Jrok along with the Sync Regenerator and went ahead and updated to the latest firmware available for the X1 projector.

Still nothing. Exact same problem. Using the Sync Regenerator, if I turn it too far it throws the picture out of sync and messes up the colors, but it does this independently of the projector. So I can have a miscolored picture that is distorted, that is then jumping and flashes due to the projector.

Holy fucking hell this is pissing me off.

I am absolutely out of ideas without a prospect in mind.

Any comments or suggestions are very very much appreciated. Thanks!

You've probably done this already, but try the same converter on a regular TV just to make sure it works properly, and then try it on your projector with a non-NeoGeo JAMMA board.

That's the strange thing. It works perfectly on my 27" Sony Trinitron. Other JAMMA boards run perfectly on my TV as well.

I was recently able to try some older Jamma boards on the projector (TMNT, Wrestlefest, Crime City, and Final Fight) and they ALL ran into the exact same problems that my MVS does.

My Hyper64 on the other hand works perfectly. So I'm pretty sure that it has something to do with the lower resolution that the older games are using.

Still though, the Neo homesystem which uses the same resolution (doesn't it??) has the MVS works perfectly.

Do you think an UpScan Convertor might be my next step. I'd just hate to buy one and have it not solve my problem.

Thanks much for the reply,

Chris,
After seeing your projector in action myself, I'm just going to throw this out there: I think it just plain hates JAMMA games--period. Remember how we tried all my arcade PCB's on your projector and they all did the same thing? There is just something that the projector does not like about SOMETHING on those games.

Though, I must admit, the problem did look like the video was out of sync. Like, if you could somehow mess around with the horizontal hold or something, that would probably fix the problem. It sounds like you've already tried that, though, and it still doesn't help.

I am at a loss to how the Hyper 64 works on it. That just does not make sense. There's got to be some kind of answer there. Something that's different from standard JAMMA games that the Hyper does, but they don't.

I hope you get your problem fixed. Your projector kicked ass and probably had the best picture I've seen when it comes to high definition stuff.

Jon

The home Neo is exactly the same as the MVS. Hyper64 is 15KHz also, so I have no idea why the others don't work.

You might try contacting the manufacturer of the projector to see if they can offer any help.

Oh, one addition: the games I brought to your house were Wrestlefest, Crime FIGHTERS, TMNT, and Final Fight. And, for some reason, Wrestlefest does the exact same thing even on your TV. Which just leads me to believe that the Jamma harness doesn't like Technos games for some reason.

Jon

A couple of things you could try...

Put the S-Video signal through a TV or VCR that has Video Out and connect the Video Out signal to the projector, you may find the TV cleans up the Signal enough to display on the projector.

Make sure the Projector is detecting the video signal correctly, some get confused and choose one that isn't correct. Try to select the nearest one, if it has the option to, try selecting NTSC-M (or NTSC 3.58 or just NTSC).

Projectors are digital and require perfect video signals to display pictures, it sounds like something is slightly off and the projector isn't picking it up.

Try those first anyway.

Good suggestion LaserActive, I'll try that once I get my Gun finished... which may be awhile as the S-video out on the Jrok just decided to die on me

Jon, Wrestlefest's problem was a whole different problem entirely, which is why it showed up on wrong on the TV. It's problem was I'm almost sure with the Vertical Sync and Jrok. The projector's problem seems to be something else as it's "symptoms" are not the same as when a PCB is out of sync, unless it's a different form of being out of sync.

Still at a loss, going to try running the composite through a VCR...

Kristoff:

Decepticon, I did update the firmware to ver. 1.8 which include "better video sync'ing", but unfortunately it was a no go. Did your projector work with your Neo without a problem? Did you have to adjust anything?

Click to expand...

I dont have a Supergun to test it with but when I had my original Neo it played fine.

Sorry but I dont know much about Superguns to be able to help. From the technical side of projectors however I have a fair amount of experience, I have owned an LP230 and 500, have setup home theaters using many different brands, and helped people out with theirs.

Best of luck to you on this mission.

[edit]
By the way got any pics of your X1 in action?

I was thinking of getting one but from the specs it appears to be too similar to my 500 and not worth the upgrade...also know a good place to get bulbs?

<small>[ August 08, 2003, 08:43 PM: Message edited by: Decepticon ]</small>