Everything Wrong With Resident Evil 6

Taiso

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Easily best Mercs mode in the series.

Prefer Mercenaries 3DS, myself. But I DO like the Mercenaries in RE 6. Probably the only reason I would ever seriously play the game again.

I'd totally buy a HD remaster of the Mercenaries 3D for PS3/Xbox 360. Day one. If they added Leon and Ada, it would be the best thing ever.

I liked the new characters (except Jake) and I love that they are finally utilizing underused characters like Sherry. Hope to see a return of Billy, Rebecca, Barry, Claire, Hunk, Nicolai and many of the other old characters. I would love to see what positions they all took in the world after going through we'd they'd gone through. I mean they have to be doing something interesting.

Boldfaced the ones I care enough about to see return (except Nicolai-see below.)

I always felt Capcom missed the boat by not giving HUNK a full campaign. He should have been one of the characters in Operation: Raccoon City.

I've said it before, but a game where you play as HUNK just after The 4th Survivor would be amazing. He returns with the G-Virus and you start the game as an Umbrella stooge. Then, as the game goes on, he has a crisis of conscience and then rebels against them. I'd say that the moral bent is played out, but being bad guys didn't really work in Operation Raccoon City, and the failing of playing as Umbrella super commandos has nothing to do with the gameplay itself (although that's not too hot, either). there is just nothing fun about playing amoral characters willing to work for corporations that are established in the series' mythology as wholly evil and corrupt.

I mean, can you imagine sequences where he's fighting beside Claire Redfield? That would be friggin' amazing.

Nicolai is dead. That's confirmed in RE 3. The canonical ending, the one that Capcom is going with for the story, has him getting dragged up into a ceiling vent and being mauled by Nemesis. And anyway, he's not that great of a character so why bother? I'd play Carlos again, though. Or even Mikhail, even though that's impossible.

I don't feel the control scheme needs to be changed up at all. RE is RE and I'm happy with the engine in both 6 and Revelations/Mercenaries 3D (although I am not a fan of the weapon farming and costume unlocking systems in Revelations' Raid mode).

I am also for bringing back creeping tension in to the environments. It worked really well in the RE 5 expansion and i thought that they were on to something with the Leon campaign in 6. Tension and survival 'horror' still work as effective emotional factors in video games, as proven in current releases in video games these days that use the aesthetic. People still want it in their RE games, and while some peeps (like Wes) may not get 'scared' playing a video game...many people do and they still want the desperate and isolated feel minus helicopter boss battles and outrunning exploding cities and fighting six thousand foot tall mutant flies.

And please, no more Albert Wesker. Dude's dead. That arc is over. Let him stay dead. The series doesn't need him anymore. It still needs its heroes, though.
 
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ViolentStorm

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Another problem with the series is that Capcom are running out of ideas and this is apparent in the sixth instalment.

In Leon's campaign Helena's sister is a complete rip-off of Rachel's sister Alma in Ninja Gaiden. And another mine cart set-piece is taken from Resident Evil 4

Also it would be nice to change it up a little than having some generic guy with a chainsaw for once.
 

Taiso

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But dude, chainsaws are scary because reasons.

Seriously, I am totally on board with you. Chainsaw enemies are like everything else in the series now. ITs all gotten to be a bit too much noise and bluster. If I never hear another chainsaw in a RE game again, it'll be too soon.

These games need to become less noisy and overblown. They need to return to the thing that made them special to begin with.

If that means diminished returns, so fucking be it. Spend less on developing it (the engine's already in place, so they can save dev costs there), focus on a more intense experience and worry about profits, not units sold. The Dark Souls model. It works for everything. The series will regain its prestige and restore its legacy this way. It's working for S-E with Final Fantasy XIV right now.

Sometimes, a series' integrity is just as important as the dollars and there IS a way to find a balance between teh two.

I hate when people say 'this series needs to go away' or 'this series is fatigued'. Applying that mindset as a rule of thumb is bunk. Assassin's Creed: Black Flag, as well as the Ezio trillogy, proved otherwise. It's not about the series getting old or tired. It's never about that. It's about the quality of successive games in the series.
 

SonGohan

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They need to return to the thing that made them special to begin with.

You mean the late 90s? I'd argue what made them special was not only the games themselves, but also in combination of the era they were released. It's natural that later games would pull stuff from RE, and RE would continue to pull from other games (let's not pretend that Alone in the Dark didn't happen). Even if they went back and made a game like the first Resident Evil, there would be people who would roll their eyes and go "great, running past zombies, collecting medallions, and fighting plants that come out of the floor. I've never done that before."

People will always bitch about this series. It's a popular franchise, after all. Give me Resident Evil 4 - 6 over 1 - 3 any day.
 

Taiso

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You mean the late 90s? I'd argue what made them special was not only the games themselves, but also in combination of the era they were released. It's natural that later games would pull stuff from RE, and RE would continue to pull from other games (let's not pretend that Alone in the Dark didn't happen). Even if they went back and made a game like the first Resident Evil, there would be people who would roll their eyes and go "great, running past zombies, collecting medallions, and fighting plants that come out of the floor. I've never done that before."

People will always bitch about this series. It's a popular franchise, after all. Give me Resident Evil 4 - 6 over 1 - 3 any day.

I don't think they should go back to fixed camera angles. I prefer the control scheme of 4-6/Revelations a LOT more than the old style. But I think a fixed camera angle game could work for a particular platform as a gimmick release. Say, a 3DS exclusive title or a Wii U game or even a PSN/XBL release.

I'm more talking about the tone of the series, which I pointed out in my post. Survival horror is not dead, and lots of people still want it. Especially for this series.

5 was pushing it with all the noise and bluster, but I think that game is better than people give it credit for.

In 6, the higher action pace and the gimmick vehicle levels take time away from building a proper, involving narrative. Resident Evil's first mission statement has always been narrative. Creating a cinematic experience that draws the player into the conflict on an emotional and visceral level. 6 got away from that, and the bad narrative pacing is affected by the game's focus on ramping up the action gameplay beats. The game has an Uncharted parkour sequence that is completely out of place IMO. The game continually misfires in these respects. It has a serious identity crisis.

You can say you like it and you can say the series borrows from other games all the time (I don't agree entirely with that), but I don't really care about that. It just doesn't work for me, and it didn't work for a lot of people for well established reasons that have been explained ad nauseum on the journalist sites as well as in countless internet forums.

Fans bitch about everything. Zelda fans bitch about Zelda and Street Fighter fans bitch about Street Fighter. You can't make these people happy.

Just remember that when most people were bitching about RE 5's supposed flaws, I was defending it and saying I liked it. I know how to adjust to the changing tone of the series as the market's tastes evolve.

But 6 just doesn't work on all of the levels that have classically engaged the fans. And you can't just tell people to 'accept this because it's good.' Not all of the criticisms levied against 6 are unfair. A good number of them are spot on.
 
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neo_mao

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I haven't play RE6, so I can't really comment on it...but I will say it does look really over the top and kinda crazy...but I will also say that it looks like a good time and that I would probably enjoy it....

But anyway, I'm optimistic for future games. RE Revelations was such an awesome game. It had a fair mix of tension and action that I think would satisfy both the old fans and the dudebro fans...

They just need to follow that direction for RE7 and they will be golden.
 
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neo_mao

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Also, Capcom should make RE Mercenaries 2 for the Vita
 

Taiso

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But anyway, I'm optimistic for future games. RE Revelations was such an awesome game. It had a fair mix of tension and action that I think would satisfy both the old fans and the dudebro fans...

They just need to follow that direction for RE7 and they will be golden.

I laugh at the notion that RE: Revelations isn't a 'full RE game' because it was on a portable.

It hit all the right notes of tension and action. It had a perfect balance of the two, and it even did story hopping. Unlike RE 6, which had three separate campaigns that crossed over, Revalations had a single narrative where you swtiched roles as the story required.

Also, it used the RE: Mercenaries 3D engine which is the PERFECT evolution of the 4 engine.

RE: Revelations is a fantastic, FULL Resident Evil game (I disagree with any contrary notion) and, in my opinion, a better game than 6. The HD release on PS3 and Xbox proved it has the goods.

My only gripe with 6 is the loot system for the Raid mode. Feels like artificial padding. I like the short burst co-op objective based gameplay of Raid mode, though. They really should ahve based loot gathering and costume unlocks on a grading system, like with RE 4 and RE: Mercenaries 3D, rather than on a lottery system and level grinding. No matter how much i like an RE game, they're asking for too much in terms of repetition.
 

evil wasabi

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I laugh at the notion that RE: Revelations isn't a 'full RE game' because it was on a portable.

lmao...

How the hell did you trick your wife into marrying you?

If I saw you playing a portable I would divorce you on the spot.
 

Wachenroder

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Nicolai is dead. That's confirmed in RE 3. The canonical ending, the one that Capcom is going with for the story, has him getting dragged up into a ceiling vent and being mauled by Nemesis. And anyway, he's not that great of a character so why bother? I'd play Carlos again, though. Or even Mikhail, even though that's impossible.

Damn didn't know he was canonically dead. Thought he was just MIA and doing shifty shit in background. I could have sworn I read some files on him in RE5 or some other game talking about what he's been up to since RE3. Ah well that sucks.

I agree with you on giving Hunk his own campaign. That's one of the advantages of RE6's multiple campaigns approach. You can give all kind of characters their own campaigns. Sucks they gave up RE6 so quickly. I wonder what kind of new campaigns/side stories they had planned.
 

SonGohan

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You can say you like it and you can say the series borrows from other games all the time (I don't agree entirely with that), but I don't really care about that. It just doesn't work for me, and it didn't work for a lot of people for well established reasons that have been explained ad nauseum on the journalist sites as well as in countless internet forums.

Fans bitch about everything. Zelda fans bitch about Zelda and Street Fighter fans bitch about Street Fighter. You can't make these people happy.

Just remember that when most people were bitching about RE 5's supposed flaws, I was defending it and saying I liked it. I know how to adjust to the changing tone of the series as the market's tastes evolve.

But 6 just doesn't work on all of the levels that have classically engaged the fans. And you can't just tell people to 'accept this because it's good.' Not all of the criticisms levied against 6 are unfair. A good number of them are spot on.

You just criticized RE6 for being "too uncharted" like, and then say you don't agree entirely with my comment that it borrows from other games (and then say you don't care about that). You're being silly. Nobody is saying "accept this because it's good." You're the one acting like an authority figure in trying to tell everybody "everything wrong with Resident Evil 6." Don't act like the only people who exist are the people who don't like it. There are plenty of people who do. In fact, I'd argue that all the people bitching about it have wildly different views on how it should be "fixed." Good luck with trying to please people with your fantasy RE game tailored to your tastes and how you think it should be done. Chances are, the people who bitched about RE6 would bitch about your game, too.

I mean, by all accounts, you admit that the gameplay is there and it's fun. Why would you let the fact that they didn't use your fan-fiction overshadow that?
 

thatdemoguy

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Id play the shit outta Taiso's RE6.

Also I did 1000/1000 the game....just saying.

O.
 

Taiso

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You just criticized RE6 for being "too uncharted" like, and then say you don't agree entirely with my comment that it borrows from other games (and then say you don't care about that). You're being silly. Nobody is saying "accept this because it's good." You're the one acting like an authority figure in trying to tell everybody "everything wrong with Resident Evil 6." Don't act like the only people who exist are the people who don't like it. There are plenty of people who do. In fact, I'd argue that all the people bitching about it have wildly different views on how it should be "fixed." Good luck with trying to please people with your fantasy RE game tailored to your tastes and how you think it should be done. Chances are, the people who bitched about RE6 would bitch about your game, too.

I mean, by all accounts, you admit that the gameplay is there and it's fun. Why would you let the fact that they didn't use your fan-fiction overshadow that?

I explained all this but you were so eager to discredit my views that you just glossed over the most important point.

Resident Evil is not primarily about gameplay and never has been.

it's firstly about an immersive emotional experience. The gameplay has NEVER, EvER been king in an RE game.

It never HAD to have good gameplay in order to be considered a worthy game.

So when I say the gameplay is good, that doesn't mean it's many, MANY crimes should be summarily excused or dismissed. The game engine is fine. Everything else is wrong with it.

The Uncharted sequences and vehicle combat sequences suck. They're just terrible, out of place and give the game a serious case of identity crisis that stunt its narrative flow and completely destroy any sense of tension or atmosphere.

And it's not just that RE 6 is a bad RE game. It's a bad game because even as a narrative experience, it continually hamstrings itself at every opportunity.

You can call my ideas 'fan fiction' in an attempt to discredit their validity, and by association my viewpoint, all you want. I won't go on the attack and respond in kind. But you are wrong to say that just because the game isn't what I wanted storywise, that I can't accept anything else.

I liked Resident Evil 5's story just fine, and it was NOTHING like what I would have done.

So I proved to you, right there, that the game doesn't have to have the story I want for me to enjoy it.

Same goes for Revelations, which is a better game than 6 and also had a story unlike anything like what I was expecting.

So I dismiss, entirely, your notion that the game has to be exactly what I want it to be in order to enjoy it or identify it as a quality product.

lmao...

How the hell did you trick your wife into marrying you?

If I saw you playing a portable I would divorce you on the spot.

Speaking of people sounding silly...
 
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Taiso

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Oh don't get all sensitive. So you hide in your bathroom playing portables. Big deal.

Yeah, because otherwise my wife would find out and divorce me.

So please don't tell her.
 

Tarma

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Resident Evil 6 is an awful, awful, awful game for a title within the RE series.

RE6 needs to become the "dead" Bobby Ewing entry to the series imo, with no further references to its existence.

If Capcom want to look at taking the gameplay away from its roots then they need to look long and hard at what Naughty Dog have done with The Last of Us.

Otherwise go back to RE4 mechanics with next gen graphics and a decent story.

Oh, and Capcom - YOU DO NOT NEED TO EMPLOY FUCKING GODAMN CO-OP PLAY DURING THE MAIN STORY TO SELL YOUR GAME. If you want to add multi-player do it through Mercenaries or something similar.
 

SonGohan

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I explained all this but you were so eager to discredit my views that you just glossed over the most important point.

Resident Evil is not primarily about gameplay and never has been.

it's firstly about an immersive emotional experience. The gameplay has NEVER, EvER been king in an RE game.

It never HAD to have good gameplay in order to be considered a worthy game.

So when I say the gameplay is good, that doesn't mean it's many, MANY crimes should be summarily excused or dismissed. The game engine is fine. Everything else is wrong with it.

The Uncharted sequences and vehicle combat sequences suck. They're just terrible, out of place and give the game a serious case of identity crisis that stunt its narrative flow and completely destroy any sense of tension or atmosphere.

And it's not just that RE 6 is a bad RE game. It's a bad game because even as a narrative experience, it continually hamstrings itself at every opportunity.

You can call my ideas 'fan fiction' in an attempt to discredit their validity, and by association my viewpoint, all you want. I won't go on the attack and respond in kind. But you are wrong to say that just because the game isn't what I wanted storywise, that I can't accept anything else.

I liked Resident Evil 5's story just fine, and it was NOTHING like what I would have done.

So I proved to you, right there, that the game doesn't have to have the story I want for me to enjoy it.

Same goes for Revelations, which is a better game than 6 and also had a story unlike anything like what I was expecting.

So I dismiss, entirely, your notion that the game has to be exactly what I want it to be in order to enjoy it or identify it as a quality product.

Resident Evil has been about game play since 4, what on earth are you talking about? And you chalk that up as your most important point? So, because you feel RE has never been about game play, you want to argue that it no longer matters when it actually does have it, and when it actually is king? When you talk about RE, you're acting like you're describing losing your virginity. "Immersive and emotional experience" lmao.

And I called your ideas fan-fiction because that's what they are. There's nothing valid about them other than that's what you think should happen. I'm not saying you can't accept a storyline that you don't want. What I am saying is that you already didn't accept a storyline you didn't want, and wrote up paragraphs of fan-fiction that you think is better. Good job?

And people hated Resident Evil 5 when it came out, in droves, but you liked it. There was probably dozen other RE purists giving bulletpoint lists of why it was horrible, not RE, and had loads of fan-fiction that they thought would've made it better. There will always be people like that. You just happen to be one of the ones for 6.
 

Taiso

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Resident Evil has been about game play since 4, what on earth are you talking about? And you chalk that up as your most important point? So, because you feel RE has never been about game play, you want to argue that it no longer matters when it actually does have it, and when it actually is king? When you talk about RE, you're acting like you're describing losing your virginity. "Immersive and emotional experience" lmao.

It's not about gameplay and never has been. Without a suitably creepy and intense atmosphere, if it was all action beats and parkour sequences, people would have been casing on this series when 4 came out for the same reasons they case on 5 and 6.

You disregard other peoples' feelings on the subject because you don't share it, but by and large people like RE because of the atmosphere and tension. It's the same reason they gravitate to Silent Hill or any other survival horror franchise.

This is maybe the weakest argument you've ever made at this site. The fact that you're willfully ignoring the truth to prop up your side of this is really not like you at all.

And I called your ideas fan-fiction because that's what they are. There's nothing valid about them other than that's what you think should happen. I'm not saying you can't accept a storyline that you don't want. What I am saying is that you already didn't accept a storyline you didn't want, and wrote up paragraphs of fan-fiction that you think is better. Good job?

So what, man? So I typed up some paragraphs of what I think would make for a better story. Why do you have a problem with this?

It's because your original argument was that 'I wouldn't be happy unless the story was exactly what I wanted it to be.'

You tried to discredit my entire argument by saying I was writing 'fan fiction.' The fact that you have to resort to attacks on my nerdiness for the series (and that's really what's at the root of your straw man associations) is also a sign of a weak argument on your part.

And people hated Resident Evil 5 when it came out, in droves, but you liked it. There was probably dozen other RE purists giving bulletpoint lists of why it was horrible, not RE, and had loads of fan-fiction that they thought would've made it better. There will always be people like that. You just happen to be one of the ones for 6.

Sounds to me like YOU'RE the one acting like the authority figure here, observing how their criticisms are rooted in fan sensibilities and lacking completely in obbjectivity.

I like 5. It is still not a great game. It has flaws.

Just like 6. The only difference is that I don't feel 5's flaws are crippling. 6's are, in my opinion.

I think it's odd that you feel you have to champion 6 to the internet when you clearly aren't one of those 'fanboys.'

I still like you and all, but I don't agree with you here.
 

OrochiEddie

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What I'm hearing is that we need another Dino Crisis....or Onimusha

Or Dino Crisis Onimusha cross-over.

Samurais fighting Dinosaurs.

Think about it.

Great video game or greatest video game?

I'll let you figure it out
 

SonGohan

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Alright! Multi-quotes! Let's do this

It's not about gameplay and never has been. Without a suitably creepy and intense atmosphere, if it was all action beats and parkour sequences, people would have been casing on this series when 4 came out for the same reasons they case on 5 and 6.

You disregard other peoples' feelings on the subject because you don't share it, but by and large people like RE because of the atmosphere and tension. It's the same reason they gravitate to Silent Hill or any other survival horror franchise.

This is maybe the weakest argument you've ever made at this site. The fact that you're willfully ignoring the truth to prop up your side of this is really not like you at all.

Maybe it's been too long for you to remember, but I vividly remember there were people who didn't like RE4 because it was so different. I also remember those people coming back around when they saw old footage of RE4, and trying to tell people that's what a RE game really is. That's the first time I started hearing "it's a good game, but not a good RE game" shenanigans.

And I'm not disregarding your feelings. I'm only pointing them out, along with everybody else's who has been ragging on the RE series since as early as 4. In fact, I would argue that it's you who is disregarding people's feelings who actually like the new RE games because you don't share them. There are people who like the atmosphere in RE6 (hell, I'm one of them). I don't need a script flipped to make Sherry a badass in order to enjoy it better. You do, and that's great (and also weird, tbh), but I'm only pointing out the million other things a million other people would change. Some people's dicks would get hard over a Chris/Leon campaign. Hell, let's add a Leon/Ada sex scene while we're at it. I mean, since we're just throwing stuff out there that we want to see. Tell me you don't want to see that, Taiso. Why don't you ignore that truth to prop up your side of the argument.

So what, man? So I typed up some paragraphs of what I think would make for a better story. Why do you have a problem with this?

It's because your original argument was that 'I wouldn't be happy unless the story was exactly what I wanted it to be.'

You tried to discredit my entire argument by saying I was writing 'fan fiction.' The fact that you have to resort to attacks on my nerdiness for the series (and that's really what's at the root of your straw man associations) is also a sign of a weak argument on your part.

God, Taiso, where the fuck did I say I had a problem with your weird fan-fiction? Are you threatened by the mere fact that I pointed it out? My whole god damn point in bringing that up was to prove the point that you're only one guy out of a million others who have different views on why they think the series is bad and how they think they could improve it. That's all. Would you rather I call it something else? We're both fucking nerds for even talking about this right now. I'm not condescending to you because of your nerdiness. My username is SonGohan, for christ's sake. It's easy for you to be offended, miss the point, and chalk it up to a weak argument so whatever. Let your hair ruffle as the point soars past you. Myself, and many others were fine with the story.

Sounds to me like YOU'RE the one acting like the authority figure here, observing how their criticisms are rooted in fan sensibilities and lacking completely in obbjectivity.

I like 5. It is still not a great game. It has flaws.

Just like 6. The only difference is that I don't feel 5's flaws are crippling. 6's are, in my opinion.

I think it's odd that you feel you have to champion 6 to the internet when you clearly aren't one of those 'fanboys.'

I still like you and all, but I don't agree with you here.

Before I respond to this last part, I want to pat myself on the back for rustling your jimmies so much that I'm seeing typos come out of you for the first time. How awesome is that?

But, no, I'm not an authority figure on this. If I sit in my computer chair and say something like "I see people bashing this game," I'm just being objective. Regardless of why they're bitching about it, I'm only pointing out that it already happens. Has been happening as far back as 4 (and maybe earlier, but I wasn't involved with any internet community at the time to be aware of it). And I would hardly say that I'm championing RE6. I would say that you're railing against it, and that it's also weird as fuck to create this topic, what, almost a year and a half later? Were the first dozen threads shitting on RE6 not enough? If anything, this thread arouses my curiosity so much, and for different reasons, that I almost feel compelled to come in here and chime in.

I mean, at least I didn't say your wife should divorce you or comment on your need to play RE while shitting or whatever else was said.
 

evil wasabi

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I love Taiso and all, but he's really defensive about this. To the point of being silly.

And Wes has a point: the RE series has exhibited excellent gameplay. People come out hating on the series until they play it. People who play it, and have the ability to figure it out, enjoy it.

Someone wants to talk about how the story in RE6 could be fixed? Dude, who cares? The story in the entire series is a complete joke. You want to know other series containing zombies where the story is a complete joke? Walking Dead; The Night/Dawn/Day series of movies; just about anything that has zombies comes party with bad story telling. Why? Maybe because the entire concept of the zombie is intrinsically FUBAR. That the concept of reanimated dead tissue and giving it purpose appeals to immature thinking and brings with it storytelling on the same immature level. But big deal.

People don't want to play movies. They want to play games; beat monsters; figure out puzzles. You want all that together? Last of us tried. Fun game. Stupid story. Tried really hard. And if I had the brain of a 13 year old kid, I might want to argue in defense of it. But I don't.

If the game is fun, that's all that matters. If you hate on a game without beating it, then you're being ignorant, or incompetent. If you hate on the game after beating it, then resell it to some other sucker. You know what games I don't own? Samurai Shodown IV.
 

evil wasabi

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I mean, at least I didn't say your wife should divorce you or comment on your need to play RE while shitting or whatever else was said.

You have a very backhanded way of talking about people shitting, while claiming that you did not.
 
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