Leaked document shows U.S. Govn't collecting phone records of 90-100 million Verizon users

Earthquake24

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U.S. government secretly collecting data on millions of Verizon users: Report

By Olivier Knox, Yahoo! News
White House Correspondent


 Can you hear me now? Eep. The National Security Agency (NSA) has been collecting telephone records of millions of Verizon customers – right down to local call data – under a top-secret court order issued in April, Britain’s The Guardian newspaper reported late Wednesday. UPDATE: The Administration responds, defending a "critical tool" against terrorism and underlining that the government is not listening in on anyone's calls.

Under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) order, the Guardian reported, Verizon Business Services must provide the NSA “on an ongoing daily basis” with information from calls between the U.S. and overseas – but also with calls entirely inside the United States. Calls made entirely overseas were not affected. It was unclear whether phones in other Verizon divisions -- its regular cell phone operations, for instance -- were similarly targeted.

Guardian writer Glenn Greenwald, a frequent and fierce critic of the national security state’s expansion since 9-11, writes in his bombshell report that:

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The order, issued April 25 and valid through July 19, requires Verizon to turn over the numbers of both parties, location data, call duration, and other information – though not the contents of the calls.

The White House initially declined comment, but a senior administration official defended the activities described in the Guardian piece without confirming the specific report.

"On its face, the order reprinted in the article does not allow the Government to listen in on anyone's telephone calls," the official, who requested anonymity, said by email. "The information acquired does not include the content of any communications or the name of any subscriber."

And "information of the sort described in the Guardian article has been a critical tool in protecting the nation from terrorist threats to the United States, as it allows counterterrorism personnel to discover whether known or suspected terrorists have been in contact with other persons who may be engaged in terrorist activities, particularly people located inside the United States," the official said.

Congress has been "regularly and fully briefed" on such practices, which occur under a "robust legal regime" and "strict controls and procedures...to ensure that they comply with the Constitution and laws of the United States and appropriately protect privacy and civil liberties," the official said.

Judge Roger Vinson’s order relies on Section 215 of the PATRIOT Act. That part of the law, also known as the “business records provision,” permits FBI agents to seek a court order for “any tangible things (including books, records, papers, documents, and other items)” it deems relevant to an investigation.

Democratic Sen. Ron Wyden of Oregon, who sits on the Senate Intelligence Committee, has repeatedly sounded the alarm about the way the government interprets that provision -- though he is sharply limited in what he can say about classified information. Wyden and Democratic Sen. Mark Udall of Colorado, another committee member, wrote a scathing letter to Attorney General Eric Holder in Sept. 2011 warning that Americans would be "stunned" if they learned what the government was doing.

The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) denounced the scope of the surveillance. "It’s analogous to the FBI stationing an agent outside every home in the country to track who goes in and who comes out," said Jameel Jaffer, ACLU Deputy Legal Director. The organization's Legislative Counsel, Michelle Richardson, bluntly branded the surveillance "unconstitutional" and insisted that "the government should end it and disclose its full scope, and Congress should initiate a full investigation."
 

dspoonrt

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SSDA (same shit different administration). It's sad that this isn't at all surprising.
 

mr_b

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Eh, I just assume this has been happening since 9/11. I honestly don't care if they are doing it. I got nothing going on. If it helps with criminal investigations in any way more power to them.
 

evil wasabi

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I honestly don't care if they are doing it. I got nothing going on.

Still a terrible argument.

You're talking about giving power to the same government that shoots women and kids for no good reason. Who executes an unarmed man in a room and says "he was going for his sword."

The government is a bunch of bullies. Don't empower them.
 

Tung Fu ru

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Is this really a surprise? I'm sure there is much more corrupt things that most the government does on a daily basis, we just don't hear about it.
 

Pope Sazae

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Is there anyone in another country I can call to make my number more interesting to the white house?
 

SonGohan

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Lagduf just popped the biggest anti-government boner, the likes of which hasn't been seen since Thomas Paine.
 

mr_b

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Still a terrible argument.

You're talking about giving power to the same government that shoots women and kids for no good reason. Who executes an unarmed man in a room and says "he was going for his sword."

The government is a bunch of bullies. Don't empower them.

All gov's shoot women and kids for no reason, so that is neither here nor there.

I'm all for shooting a criminal suspect, fuck 'em all. Were you in the room to confirm he was just sitting there and not going for his sword? I know a lot of cops, and while cops aren't equal to Gov, but anyone with power abuses it from time to time. I hear stories all the time from my brother and his cop buddies of them taking extra liberties on suspects. I have no problem with it at all. It's not hard to keep your nose clean and live your life.
 

lithy

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All gov's shoot women and kids for no reason, so that is neither here nor there.

I'm all for shooting a criminal suspect, fuck 'em all. Were you in the room to confirm he was just sitting there and not going for his sword? I know a lot of cops, and while cops aren't equal to Gov, but anyone with power abuses it from time to time. I hear stories all the time from my brother and his cop buddies of them taking extra liberties on suspects. I have no problem with it at all. It's not hard to keep your nose clean and live your life.

I see that we've crossed over from apathy toward our freedoms to active malice.
 

mr_b

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Yeah I'm probably guilty of that. I have no tolerance for criminals or even suspects. I tend to operate more under the guilty until proven innocent instead of innocent until proven guilty.
 

Tacitus

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This has been going on for years and the infrastructure supporting it has been around longer.

Google:

Room 641a

There are other projects that do the same thing, but that's a good starting point.
 

evil wasabi

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All gov's shoot women and kids for no reason, so that is neither here nor there.

I'm all for shooting a criminal suspect, fuck 'em all. Were you in the room to confirm he was just sitting there and not going for his sword? I know a lot of cops, and while cops aren't equal to Gov, but anyone with power abuses it from time to time. I hear stories all the time from my brother and his cop buddies of them taking extra liberties on suspects. I have no problem with it at all. It's not hard to keep your nose clean and live your life.

Read the reports on how the police changed their story over the days following the execution, and you'll have a better understanding of what you're trying to debunk.
 

evil wasabi

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Yeah I'm probably guilty of that. I have no tolerance for criminals or even suspects. I tend to operate more under the guilty until proven innocent instead of innocent until proven guilty.

I hope no one in your family is ever allowed to carry a gun.
 

lithy

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I hope no one in your family is ever allowed to carry a gun.

Are we allowed to hope that he or someone in his family is ever wrongly arrested and then beaten mercilessly because well, cops should have no tolerance for suspects?
 

evil wasabi

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Are we allowed to hope that he or someone in his family is ever wrongly arrested and then beaten mercilessly because well, cops should have no tolerance for suspects?

Go for it. I'm currently hoping that his brother and his brother's cop buddies get arrested as suspects of some crime, related to their likely nature as C students and bullies, and then get raped to death while in holding.
 

cannonball

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I have no tolerance for criminals or even suspects. I tend to operate more under the guilty until proven innocent instead of innocent until proven guilty.

One of the stupidest things I've seen anyone say on this forum...and that's saying something.
 

mr_b

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Eh wish for it all you want. Doubt it will happen though. If you've spent any amount of time around law enforcement you'd have a better understanding of what is seen day in and day out. You guys might not agree with my views and that's fine. I just tend to see things in a very black and white nature and not much room for grey area. I know I'm close minded on a lot of things and been told it many times as well. I don't try to cover it up.
 
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Tacitus

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Eh wish for it all you want. Doubt it will happen though. If you've spent any amount of time around law enforcement you'd have a better understanding of what is seen day in and day out. You guys might not agree with my views and that's fine. I just tend to see things in a very black and white nature and not much room for grey area. I know I'm close minded on a lot of things and been told it many times as well. I don't try to cover it up.

I've spent plenty of time around law enforcement and I will tell you that people who think like yourself are the reason it gets a bad rap. There's a reason why there is police discretion.

Were you mad when your brother Dredd judged you?
 

mr_b

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I've spent plenty of time around law enforcement and I will tell you that people who think like yourself are the reason it gets a bad rap. There's a reason why there is police discretion.

Were you mad when your brother Dredd judged you?

Haha, very true VT.

Yeah the public's perception of law enforcement is definitely generated by what I've said, no doubt. But everyday being lied to your face and getting shit from every person when trying to just do your job only further pushes those in law enforcement to be that way and throw discretion out the window. Those officers that can have discretion day in and day out in all facets of their job deserve a big applause. There's no way I could do it and I know there are many who for their own sanity can't have discretion 100% of the time. I agree they should stop doing the job at that point but being realistic about it, that's easier said than done.
 

evil wasabi

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Haha, very true VT.

Yeah the public's perception of law enforcement is definitely generated by what I've said, no doubt. But everyday being lied to your face and getting shit from every person when trying to just do your job only further pushes those in law enforcement to be that way and throw discretion out the window. Those officers that can have discretion day in and day out in all facets of their job deserve a big applause. There's no way I could do it and I know there are many who for their own sanity can't have discretion 100% of the time. I agree they should stop doing the job at that point but being realistic about it, that's easier said than done.

If they think everyone is "lying" to them, maybe they have a poor grasp on the truth.

There's no excuse for the police brutality that exists in this country. Zero excuse.

Do police officers even know what their jobs are? Do they remember why they joined the force? Seems like they just needed a steady paycheck and a gun to make them feel less like losers.
 

mr_b

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If they think everyone is "lying" to them, maybe they have a poor grasp on the truth.

Walk into the projects and try to get a straight story.


Do police officers even know what their jobs are? Do they remember why they joined the force? Seems like they just needed a steady paycheck and a gun to make them feel less like losers.

Oh they know what their jobs are and I'm sure most remember why they joined the force, but then reality sets in and the world/job isn't what you thought it was. There are so many professions out there that if you spoke to people fresh in the field and those who were 10 yr vets would very rarely be on the same views and opinions be it Cops, Doctors/Nurses, Teachers...

I don't argue that those who don't have discretion 100% of the time should be doing their job, but then you'd find you don't have anyone to do the job. All I'm saying is I don't fault public service people for being hardened. In my opinion, I don't see how you can't be after so many years of going through the shit day in and day out.
 

neo_mao

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Oh they know what their jobs are and I'm sure most remember why they joined the force, but then reality sets in and the world/job isn't what you thought it was.

Not trying to flame you or anything man, but what exactly did they think the job was going to be? It should be kind of a given that the life/work of a cop is going to be tough.

There are so many professions out there that if you spoke to people fresh in the field and those who were 10 yr vets would very rarely be on the same views and opinions be it Cops, Doctors/Nurses, Teachers...

You are absolutely right. But veteran doctors, nurses and teachers should not be abusing the people they are supposed to be serving either...no matter how disallusioned they are by their jobs.

I don't argue that those who don't have discretion 100% of the time should be doing their job, but then you'd find you don't have anyone to do the job. All I'm saying is I don't fault public service people for being hardened. In my opinion, I don't see how you can't be after so many years of going through the shit day in and day out.

I'm sorry but that isn't a good enough excuse. If you can't do your job properly, then you shouldn't be doing it all.

This applies to everyone...but even more so to people in law enforcement who have an obligation to serve people by maintaining justice and order. I'm sorry dude but nothing you are saying is registering with me.
 
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