Aero Fighters 3 U.S. AES Discovered!

NeoSneth said:

The Ray Young thing baffles me as well. The guy made quality items. Did he literally disappear or did some people bring litigation against him?

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Decided to have a last hurrah and attempt a large-scale scam of both Trieu and Shawn; needless to say he was no longer able to operate after that. He seemed to have access to high-quality printing equipment, there are rumors he's worked with bootleggers in Europe and elsewhere. Even before he went rogue he strongly hinted that he could make indistinguishable fakes.

LWK said:

I am so sick of this OMG I'M SO OLD SCHOOL IN THE NEO SCENE. Get the fuck over yourself son.

The neo scene is a fucking train wreck of behavioral disorder issues.

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Calm down, DudeBro. The Neo scene can't be all that bad. If it is, then why have you been hanging on for the last 11 years?
You're a lifer, like most of the rest of us. We're all fucked up, in one way or another. It's what binds us.

Report – Part 2 of 3.

Aero Fighters 3 Cartridge Components.

1. CLAMSHELL CASE.

The clamshell case the game came in was original SNK make and in overall excellent, like new condition. There were virtually no signs of shelf wear, although the clear plastic had stretched a bit with age which is typical. The case had what I call the “matte-style” clear plastic that is a bit rougher to the touch and a bit more opaque than the clearer, smoother case that became more common in later releases. In my experience, the matte style is very typical of most 1995-1996 era titles, while the clear smooth style is more common in later releases (for example, all of my Neostore exclusive English releases are of the clear smooth style).

There was no Neo Geo seal sticker on the case. The owner advised me that all games he acquired were opened by him when he received them which is why there was no sealing sticker.

The most noteworthy aspect of the case was, of course, the barcode on the bottom right of the rear. The barcode is an adhesive sticker with black print. The size and weight of the sticker is similar to other releases of the era, complete with rounded corners. Matched up to other “barcode sticker” games of the era, nothing appears abnormal about the sticker, although some releases place the title of the game under the barcode instead of the top. The black ink on the barcode is smeared in spots typical and consistent with the ink on barcodes for other games of the era.

The barcode to me is significant. Not all Neo Geo releases had bar codes, but many games released in 1995-1996 did in fact have a barcode sticker on the original case. Not all games of the era necessarily had a barcode (for example, the copy of Samurai 3 I examined did not have a barcode. If this game was faked, then the faker didn’t stop at making a manual, insert and sticker, but also went through the trouble of creating, printing and cutting a barcode on different paper stock with different ink.

That being said, we must now look at the printed barcode number. The barcode number for AF3 is 7-24678-24734-4. The game was released in November 95. For comparison purposes, please note the following:

Galaxy Fight – February 95 – 7-24678-24722-1
World Heroes Perfect- June 95 – 7-24678-24725-2
Stakes Winner – October 95 – 7-24678-24731-3
Real Bout Fatal Fury – January 96 – 7-24678-24736-6
Neo Turf Masters – February 96 – 7-24678-24739-9

As you can see, the number slots in perfectly sequentially between Stakes Winner and Real Bout Fatal Fury. Whoever made this barcode was either an SNK employee or someone who did some serious homework on not only making it consistent with other stickers of the era physically, but also that the number matched the surrounding releases sequentially.

2. CASE INSERT.

The insert appears to be of the same paper stock, type and glossiness as other known official releases of the era. The paper measurements are identical.

The insert exhibited mild to moderate indentation marks along the top and bottom, lining up with the holes on the case. In my experience after purchasing brand new cartridges, it usually takes some amount time before these marks become pronounced (maybe a couple of months or so).

The blue stripes on the cartridge are of an identical hue to both Aero Fighters 2 and Metal Slug cartridges. The measurement of the stripes on the insert is identical to the measurements on the Samurai 3 I compared it to.

The print quality is excellent. It is closer to Fatal Fury 3 and Samurai 3 than Stakes Winner US, although all appear to have minor differences in print quality. Offset printing method was certainly used.

The image on the face of the insert is bright and colorful, as is the game logo. An important note about the image on the face of the insert – the Video System logo on the top of the MVS flyer obscures part of the fireball that is hidden in the Japanese version. So, the only place this part of the fireball is visible is on the US insert. Also, there is an area obscured by the blue SNK logo on the Sonic Wings 3 AES cart that is also obscured by the control diagram on the MVS flier. This part of the fireball is visible only on the AES version. In both cases, there are no indications of a photoshop job, which suggests that whoever made this had the original art for the game.

The meg count logo on the face and spine are totally consistent with other titles of the era, as is the NeoGeo logo below the face image.

Now, here is another interesting part of this insert: The white SNK logo on the spine. It is highly unusual for an English snaplock AES release to have a white SNK logo on the spine. In fact, EVERY English AES game with one exception has a blue logo. The exception is World Heroes Perfect. Interestingly, WHP is also a 1995 game. A possible explanation is that there was simply too much blue on the spine to also have the logo be blue, otherwise the entire spine would be just blue and grey. Plus the spine with the white logo matches quite nicely with Aero Fighters 2, a 1994 game. An equally plausible explanation is that SNK was lazy and just did it this way with no rationale. In my opinion, this actually works against the argument that the game is fake, because anyone faking the game would probably not be likely to risk purposefully including such an abnormality, nor would such a thing be overlooked in light of the precise attention to detail that would be required for other areas of the game.

The rear of the insert has the 4-image block layout. This is absolutely correct of games of the period, despite the fact that the Japanese games were already becoming more and more elaborate for the rear insert. Stakes Winner Jap is very mundane on the back, but Sonic Wings 3 has full page art on the rear insert. This was what NGF used on their US cartridge, for example. However, Samurai 3 US, which was a December title, kept to the 4 block layout.

The title on the rear exclaims “Aero Fighter takes off in a fighter plane!” This is the same as the language at the top of the rear of Aero Fighters 3 English CD, and again is very typical of games of the period to have the same language on both the AES cart and CD. The explanation under the photos on the rear is very similar to the rear of the CD, although there is a longer and more elaborate explanation on the CD. Again, very typical and correct for games of the period. The warning language on the bottom of the rear insert is bolded at the bottom which if I recall is rather unique amongst other period titles.

Under the SNK logo on the spine in very crisp small print is "S-9511". This represents a November 1995 release. similar print (although positioned slightly differently) can be found on the RBFF (S-9601), Samurai 3 (S-9512) and Stakes Winner (S-9510) inserts. The font and positioning of this code is highly consistent with these other releases.

Additionally noteworthy to me is the blue "3" in the logo on the spine. To my knowledge, I have not seen this blue "3" in the logo font on any other artwork for this title. It seems much easier to simply take the metallic "3" that is exhibited in the logo where it appears everywhere else and transfer it to the spine rather than create or try to find a 3, and then make sure the blue color gradient matched the rest of the spine logo.

Overall, it was quite apparent to me that the insert was totally correct and indistinguishable from what an authentic SNK produced release would look like.

[COMING IN PART 3 – the manual and cart sticker, conclusions and more… stay tuned]

Thanks geddon_jt.

I really liked the info about the bar codes and the dates.

Looking forward to pt. #3.

With the bar codes you have

Galaxy Fight – February 95 – 7-24678-24722-1
World Heroes Perfect- June 95 – 7-24678-24725-2
Stakes Winner – October 95 – 7-24678-24731-3
AF3 is 7-24678-24734-4
Real Bout Fatal Fury – January 96 – 7-24678-24736-6
Neo Turf Masters – February 96 – 7-24678-24739-9

I'm curious if there is a game with a '5' as the last number. This seems like a sequencing of when games were made/released/ etc (very similar to some record companies that put a release number on their records, like RLP001 RLP002 etc).

If there is, cool, but if not does that lead to believe we are indeed missing one more home release?

OrochiEddie said:

With the bar codes you have

cI'm curious if there is a game with a '5' as the last number. This seems like a sequencing of when games were made/released/ etc (very similar to some record companies that put a release number on their records, like RLP001 RLP002 etc).

If there is, cool, but if not does that lead to believe we are indeed missing one more home release?

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The last digit on a UPC is a check sum digit for the scanner. The first digits of the UPC is a prefix--7 means goods. The fist six digits of the UPC are SNK USA's regiterd bar code number. The last five, excluding the check sum, is the SNK product number. And, the four digit S-number on the spine is the release date.

I don't know if SNK used the Check Sum as a special key for numbering released titles; however, it kinda does look that way.

Galaxy Fight – February 95 – 724678247221
World Heroes Perfect- June 95 – 724678247252
Stakes Winner – October 95 – 724678247313
AERO FIGHTERS 3 - NOVEMBER 95 -724678247344
Real Bout Fatal Fury – January 96 – 724678247366
Neo Turf Masters – February 96 – 724678247399

Enter the 12 digit UPC code into the GTIN-12 GTIN Check Digit Calculator. You will see, the UPC code check digit.

If they did then that may mean that there is another title (#5) between NOV and DEC '95 and two more titles (#7 and #8) between JAN and FEB '96.

Tyranix95 said:

The last digit on a UPC is a check sum digit for the scanner. The first digits of the UPC is a prefix--7 means goods. The fist six digits of the UPC are SNK USA's regiterd bar code number. The last five, excluding the check sum, is the SNK product number. And, the four digit S-number on the spine is the release date.

I don't know if SNK used the Check Sum as a special key for numbering released titles; however, it kinda does look that way.

Galaxy Fight – February 95 – 724678247221
World Heroes Perfect- June 95 – 724678247252
Stakes Winner – October 95 – 724678247313
AERO FIGHTERS 3 - NOVEMBER 95 -724678247344
Real Bout Fatal Fury – January 96 – 724678247366
Neo Turf Masters – February 96 – 724678247399

Enter the 11 digit UPC code into the GTIN-12 GTIN Check Digit Calculator. You will see, the UPC code check digit.

If they did then that may mean that there is one title another title (#5) between NOV and DEC '95 and two more titles (#7 and #8) between JAN and FEB '96.

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wouldn't those be the three titles that were not released in the US on AES?

I mean, it could make sense, unless those numbers exist on other titles.

thanks Geddon, that was an interesting read. Roll on part 3...

Geddon_jt said:

...In my opinion, this actually works against the argument that the game is fake, because anyone faking the game would probably not be likely to risk purposefully including such an abnormality, nor would such a thing be overlooked in light of the precise attention to detail that would be required for other areas of the game.

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spot on.

I know old lurker noobs don't count for much on here ... but I still wanted to chime in and thank Geddon_jt... so...

Thank you Geddon_jt

I really appreciate the digging you did to put this together.

So according to the spine this was intended as a Nov 1995 release.

Is there any more evidence out there that employees could buy games pre-launch like this? If so then it could be by default they printed some number of art sets up for each game in each region and variations would come with different print runs which were probably incurred as the games sold and demand was evaluated. So rather than produce 1000 JP copies of a game, they produced 1000 carts and then labeled them as they were sold.

It would be interesting as more games are acquired from this seller to hear about any differences between the versions bought directly from SNK and those the public bought. Even if they are the same, it would still be cool to have that verification.

Michael Yagami said:

Calm down, DudeBro. The Neo scene can't be all that bad. If it is, then why have you been hanging on for the last 11 years?
You're a lifer, like most of the rest of us. We're all fucked up, in one way or another. It's what binds us.

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I'm not really uncalm. My posts come off real chaotic. Its sad nobody other then giby knows how I am in person. Its all good. I am firmly in the MVS buttcrack these days.

OrochiEddie said:

wouldn't those be the three titles that were not released in the US on AES?

I mean, it could make sense, unless those numbers exist on other titles.

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Here's the main problem, the check sum digit is only one digit, and big compaines, like SNK, publish more than a single digit numbers worth of games in a year. That's why they use the five digit item number, less the check sum. But, it is possible if the company only publishes somthing like 10 titles or the publisher intetionally selects UPC codes with check sums that cycle (repeat or loop).

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'95 AES JP & US Releases:

Galaxy Fight – February 95 – 724678247221 (JP & US AES)
Quiz King of Fighters - 3.10.95 - (JP AES)
Double Dragon - 3.31.95 (JP & US AES)
Super Sidekicks 3 - 4.7.95 - (JP & US AES)
Fatal Fury 3 - 4.21.95 - (JP & US AES)
Savage Reign / Fu'un Mokujiroku - 5.26.95 - ( JP & US AES)
World Heroes Perfect- June 95 – 724678247252 (JP & US AES)
Kabuki Klash / Tengai Makyo Shinden - 7.2.95 - (JP AES)
King of Fighters '95 - 9.1.95 - (JP & US AES)
Pulstar - 9.29.95 - (JP AES)
Stakes Winner – October 95 – 724678247313 (JP & US AES)
Master of Syougi / Shogi no Tatsujin - 10.13.95 - (JP AES)
Voltage Fighter Gowcaizer / Chojin Gakuen Gowcaizer - 10.20.95 -(JP & US AES)
AERO FIGHTERS 3 - NOVEMBER 95 -724678247344
Samurai Shodown 3: Blades of Blood - 12.1.95 - (JP & US AES)

Goal! Goal! Goal! - ( No AES)
Power Spikes 2 - ( No AES)
Puzzle de Pon! - ( No AES)

'96 AES JP & US Releases:

Real Bout Fatal Fury – January 96 – 724678247366
Chibi Marukochan Deluxe Quiz - 1.26.96 (JP AES)
Neo Turf Masters – February 96 – 724678247399 (Note: Master list - 3.1.96)
Breakers - 3.21.96 - (JP AES)
Magical Drop 2 - 4.19.96 - (JP AES)
Art of Fighting 3: Path of the Warrior - 4.26.96 - (JP & US AES)
Over Top - 5.24.96 (JP AES)
Metal Slug - 5.24.96 - (JP & US AES)
Ninja Master's - 6.28.96 (JP & US AES)
Ragnagard / Shinoken - 7.26.96 - (JP AES)
King of Fighters '96 - 9.27.96 - (JP & US AES)
Kizuna Encounter / Fu'un Super Tag Battle - 11.8.96 - (JP & US AES)
Samurai Shodown 4: Amakusa's Revenge - 11.29.96 - (JP & US AES)
Stakes Winner 2 - 12.13.96 - (JP AES)
Super Sidekicks 4: The Ultimate 11 - 12.20.96 - (JP & US AES)
Waku Waku 7 - 12.27.96 - (JP AES)

Neo Driftout - (No AES)
Neo Mr. Do! - (NO AES)
Pleasure Goal 5-on-5 Street Soccer / Futsal - (NO AES)
Puzzle de Pon! R - (NO AES)
Super Dodge Ball / Nekketsu Toukyu Densetsu - (NO AES)
Tecmo World Soccer '96 - (NO AES)

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Finally, information worthy of "100k+ things you never knew about Neo Geo", and people are appreciating for what it's worth.

Of course, now that this information is commoditized, the next game that pops up will need further scrutiny.

Thank you Geddon. I cannot wait until the third part.

DangerousK said:

One thing I will say though is that the Ray Young stuff shocked the shit out of me.

I had some brief business with him in 2003-2004 and had nothing bad occur then.

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Same here. I didn't do much business with Ray, but like you did a bit and had nothing but good service. Was really surprised when all the shit that went down happened...

Geddon_jt said:

That was precisely what the original owner told me would happen back in those days, although he didn't go so far as to say that it what definitely happened with this game. He suspects that perhaps it is just based on the fact that no other copies have surfaced.

More to come on that in the "provenance" section coming later. LOL. Gotta finish the rest first! The real juicy stuff about the game is coming later tonight.

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So, you got to talk with the original owner of those carts?
That's very interesting if my understanding is correct.

FTL said:

So, you got to talk with the original owner of those carts?
That's very interesting if my understanding is correct.

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I'm curious: FTL is the opposite of FTW or mere coincidence?

FTL said:

So, you got to talk with the original owner of those carts?
That's very interesting if my understanding is correct.

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Yes he did.

Quite a few times.

FTL said:

So, you got to talk with the original owner of those carts?
That's very interesting if my understanding is correct.

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Why do you care?

As a professional printer, the analysis of the insert has me convinced about as well as possible without me having it in my own hands. Of course, I might be the only person here that would take a $30k Aero Fighters 3 cart and immediately pop in into my Neo since I actually love the game.

GohanX said:

As a professional printer, the analysis of the insert has me convinced about as well as possible without me having it in my own hands. Of course, I might be the only person here that would take a $30k Aero Fighters 3 cart and immediately pop in into my Neo since I actually love the game.

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Did you have any problem with what I had stated earlier?

BonusKun said:

Why do you care?

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He's jelly because he will never own that game.

Am surprised FTL isnt replying point for point against Geddons report.



JS

I think the games are real but lets say the buyers of these games who can afford to drop 30k on a game without missing it....were not 100 percent convinced but convinced just enough to fork out the money before more scrutiny was done on the game, either way on proof or no proof on the off chance it was real. Because if they didnt act quick and delayed buying the game and the games got sold on to others and then the game turned out real, they would be kicking themselves knowing they just may have lost the chance to ever complete their collection. I think thats the main reason 2 have sold so quick.

LWK said:

I am so sick of this OMG I'M SO OLD SCHOOL IN THE NEO SCENE. Get the fuck over yourself son.

The neo scene is a fucking train wreck of behavioral disorder issues.

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Hehehe I tend to notice that online. I could probably be included in that assessment.

But I've met some members in person and they were some of the most laid back, awesome folks I've run into.