What's happening in Spain could be done in the US?

distropia

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Spain's situation: massive family bankrupcy, banks being richer than ever and hoarding homes at ridiculous prices, families losing that homes and a life's savings, unemployed people is rising very quick, we have the worst politicians ever...
Does that happen -more or less- also in the US, right?

Take a look at what Spain is doing:
http://www.elpais.com/fotogaleria/Protesta/Movimiento/elpgal/20110517elpepunac_3/Zes/62

Even Washington Post shows this:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/todays_paper?dt=2011-05-19&bk=A&pg=1

It doesn't matter if you're young, old, snob or hippie... democracy means you can express your dissapointment with politicians and bankers. A new pacific revolution of people's rights.

Could it be possible in the US? Afaik, you're screwed up also, right?
 

TonK

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I'll be honest.

I was interested, then I clicked the links - I have no idea what I'm supposed to be reading/looking at.

Spain's situation: massive family bankrupcy, banks being richer than ever and hoarding homes at ridiculous prices, families losing that homes and a life's savings, unemployed people is rising very quick, we have the worst politicians ever...
Does that happen -more or less- also in the US, right?

Take a look at what Spain is doing:
http://www.elpais.com/fotogaleria/Protesta/Movimiento/elpgal/20110517elpepunac_3/Zes/62

Even Washington Post shows this:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/todays_paper?dt=2011-05-19&bk=A&pg=1

It doesn't matter if you're young, old, snob or hippie... democracy means you can express your dissapointment with politicians and bankers. A new pacific revolution of people's rights.

Could it be possible in the US? Afaik, you're screwed up also, right?
 

aria

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I heard about the Spanish protests a bit here and there (esp. on Reddit and then the NYT), but it sounds sort of unfocused.

The US doesn't have quite the same economic problems Spain does --it doesn't have the same level of unemployment, either.

Still, I give mad props for this sign:

18lede_madrid2-blog480.jpg



Here's their manifesto in English:
Manifesto (English)
We are ordinary people. We are like you: people, who get up every morning to study, work or find a job, people who have family and friends. People, who work hard every day to provide a better future for those around us.

Some of us consider ourselves progressive, others conservative. Some of us are believers, some not. Some of us have clearly defined ideologies, others are apolitical, but we are all concerned and angry about the political, economic, and social outlook which we see around us: corruption among politicians, businessmen, bankers, leaving us helpless, without a voice.

This situation has become normal, a daily suffering, without hope. But if we join forces, we can change it. It’s time to change things, time to build a better society together. Therefore, we strongly argue that:
  • The priorities of any advanced society must be equality, progress, solidarity, freedom of culture, sustainability and development, welfare and people’s happiness.
  • These are inalienable truths that we should abide by in our society: the right to housing, employment, culture, health, education, political participation, free personal development, and consumer rights for a healthy and happy life.
  • The current status of our government and economic system does not take care of these rights, and in many ways is an obstacle to human progress.
  • Democracy belongs to the people (demos = people, krátos = government) which means that government is made of every one of us. However, in Spain most of the political class does not even listen to us. Politicians should be bringing our voice to the institutions, facilitating the political participation of citizens through direct channels that provide the greatest benefit to the wider society, not to get rich and prosper at our expense, attending only to the dictatorship of major economic powers and holding them in power through a bipartidism headed by the immovable acronym PP & PSOE.
  • Lust for power and its accumulation in only a few; create inequality, tension and injustice, which leads to violence, which we reject. The obsolete and unnatural economic model fuels the social machinery in a growing spiral that consumes itself by enriching a few and sends into poverty the rest. Until the collapse.
  • The will and purpose of the current system is the accumulation of money, not regarding efficiency and the welfare of society. Wasting resources, destroying the planet, creating unemployment and unhappy consumers.
  • Citizens are the gears of a machine designed to enrich a minority which does not regard our needs. We are anonymous, but without us none of this would exist, because we move the world.
  • If as a society we learn to not trust our future to an abstract economy, which never returns benefits for the most, we can eliminate the abuse that we are all suffering.
  • We need an ethical revolution. Instead of placing money above human beings, we shall put it back to our service. We are people, not products. I am not a product of what I buy, why I buy and who I buy from.
For all of the above, I am outraged.
I think I can change it.
I think I can help.
I know that together we can.I think I can help.

I know that together we can.

It sounds like pretty unfocused disappointment with the system without outlining a solution, beyond a vaguely defined "ethical revolution" aimed at their economic system.

This may or may not be a related question: but is marijuana legal in Spain?
 

LoneSage

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I see a few Teenagers in College always talk about revolution.

But they're just TiC.
 

distropia

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They're making a huge popular assembly to elaborate a big list with the points they want to change. This sunday is (local) electoral day and they're proposing not to vote any of the two main political parties. This is not a two day flame, its gonna be a long war against the politics and banks. It is not logical to be on crisis and politics and bankers raise their salary. Something similar to what happens here in the US with the business men on big banks and assurance corporations.
 

Lovecraft0110

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Just a bunch of sheepish whiners, if you ask me.

What we need is substantial, qualitative change, beginning with a new constitution that rectifies the many structural errors of the present one. One of those, for example, is the fact that unlike Germany, whose federal system is based on the principle of symmetry (i.e. every state has the same privileges and competences), our seventeen comunidades autónomas (i.e. states) are very, very far from being equal in terms of competences or, what is worse, representation in parliament.

Main reason I emigrated; of everyone I knew back in college, only the ones who went abroad made made something of themselves. Hell, one of my best friends is an MBA whose only job in the last 5 years has been to lug suitcases at the airport, and he considers himself lucky!
 

evil wasabi

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Eurosclerosis is best seen in the football leagues where two or three cubs hold all the money and power and farm talent from the rest of the league as those small teams teeter on administration, hoping for some kind of a payout.

And the people too are just there to provide for the rich families that own that continent.

The people deserve better. But it only starts with a bloody revolution where they drag the rich out and skin them alive, man woman and snobbish children.
 

distropia

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There's a lot of things we have to change in this world. Talkin' bout Spain, we have to change the laboral system completely. The actual spanish system is against competitivity, a lot of taxes to be paid before you even start a business, a lot of burocracy, and if you hire someone else he can be your worst enemy. The syndicates are part of the problem.

I don't really understand how we can have international super businesses like Telefonica, and all the energy monsters.

Once you live outside, you see things in a very different way.
 

neobuyer

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In the US the people we should have our eyes on are the stealth-legions of aging baby-boomers who aren't going to go out quietly and with stoicism like the 'greatest generation' who were raised in the great depression and not the camelot of JFK or thereabouts.

These fuckers are going to make the AARP into something that isn't going to be pleasant for any of us young people.

Think about it.
 

SNKorSWM

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That's why you should opt not to pay social security tax.
 

distropia

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Maybe I should have titled this thread: "are we sheeps shepherded by politicians and bankers?"
 

aria

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I'm still not sure what's going on, so I'll just throw on some gasoline:

This whole thing would have never happened had Catalan independence been granted.

Free Catalonia from Spanish tyranny!

¡Visca Catalunya lliure!

To our Basque comrades: Elkartasuna/Solidaritat!
 

Lovecraft0110

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I'm still not sure what's going on, so I'll just throw on some gasoline:

This whole thing would have never happened had Catalan independence been granted.

Free Catalonia from Spanish tyranny!

¡Visca Catalunya lliure!

To our Basque comrades: Elkartasuna/Solidaritat!

Oh, fuck off already, Bobak!

:angry:
 

Takumaji

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Maybe I should have titled this thread: "are we sheeps shepherded by politicians and bankers?"

Trouble is that the influence of bank trusts, the industry and their butt-buddies in various political parties is an integral part of the current system in Spain and elsewhere. If we want to change it, we first have to change ourselves. That's why I support the Spanish revolution movement and hope it will spill over to Germany as well. There's similar anger bubbling in the cauldron over here, it's time to release it.

Fuck the system. :D
 

K_K

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Eurosclerosis is best seen in the football leagues where two or three cubs hold all the money and power and farm talent from the rest of the league as those small teams teeter on administration, hoping for some kind of a payout.

And the people too are just there to provide for the rich families that own that continent.

The people deserve better. But it only starts with a bloody revolution where they drag the rich out and skin them alive, man woman and snobbish children.

i'd love to see the galacticos dragged out and skinned alive on the streets of madrid by a bunch of angry deportivo coruna fans.
 

abasuto

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The US doesn't have quite the same economic problems Spain does --it doesn't have the same level of unemployment, either

I'd guess it's probably the same if the US was honest about our unemployment numbers.

Europe in general takes the "are you of working age, able bodied, yet not working ?" as you're unemployed.

We have an entire check list of reason why a middle aged person in perfect health who is out of work and wants work will not be counted as unemployed when we release the stats.
 

neobuyer

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I just want to Cruz on over to Penelope when I think of Espania and it's palefaced, dark eyed women...
 
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