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LS what have you done
Metroid or Metroidvania?
- Thread starter LoneSage
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LS what have you done
oliverclaude
General Morden's Aide
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...yet, some truths have to be uncovered empirically to become a precedent and I think the job is done
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I don't care for the original Metroid, or the newer FPS ones (Metroid Prime Pinball is awesome though), but I like all of the other 2D ones I've played (I should probably pick up the remake of 2 for the 3DS one of these days). That said, I much prefer horror fantasy to sci-fi, so, I'm a much bigger fan of the Metroidvania games. SotN remains my favorite, but I also loved HoD, AoS, DoS, PoR & OoE. CotM is okay, but developed by a different team, and it shows.
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I just came here to say that if you are a fan of the 2D Metroids, give Axiom Verge a play if you haven't.
As for the topic, I tend not to dwell too much on which games / series' are better than which. As long as they are good, they should be appreciated regardless of differences / preferences imo. I'm also very glad that we got so many good offerings in this genre during the last 5 years after being mostly absent for 2 generations outside the handheld systems.
As for the topic, I tend not to dwell too much on which games / series' are better than which. As long as they are good, they should be appreciated regardless of differences / preferences imo. I'm also very glad that we got so many good offerings in this genre during the last 5 years after being mostly absent for 2 generations outside the handheld systems.
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It has some cool stuff but tends to get really tedious towards the end. I felt no need to play it past beating it (i.e. to get 100%, etc.)
Music was pretty good.
oliverclaude
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I'm a huge fan of action-adventures and thought about the RPG aspect a lot recently. Action-RPGs have the experience point mechanic, which allows you to grind early on and have it easier for the rest of the game. For a short game like Ys III or Cadash, I don't mind it, but for SotN it's a gamebreaker, because its long and complex. You're overpowered soon, can disregard any tactics and just blaze through enemies and bosses quite easily.
Opposed to action-RPGs, in action-adventures extending your energy is part of exploring the landscape and dungeons. Puzzles have to be solved to gain more energy units, be it hearts or tanks. Some areas are unattainable at first, because you lack other items, thus preventing you from reaching an overpowering status too soon. Some adventure games like Popful Mail go without any energy extension, offering only better armor and healing.
Gaston
Mature's Make-up Artist
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I never tried that, but I thought SotN wasn't that difficult either? Don't recall ever having to grind my way before being able to beat a boss.
Also, try Dead Cells if you dig roguelike aspects. Pretty cool game.
oliverclaude
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Gaston... please, weather SotN is easy or not, the grinding aspect remains intact. It's the players decision to exploit it or not to, but the fact that it's possible is already a design flaw in my opinion, like a game that's broken for score. Konami could have countered it with a time limit (like in Cadash, AC) or a limited enemy number (like in Dahna, MD), yet they didn't. Already tried Dead Cells, nothing to write home about.
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Gaston
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Using time-limits completely alters the feel of a game and limited enemy numbers can lead to other unforeseen problems (even with rigorous testing).
Not catering to grinding nerds who 'exploit' this is the easiest and safest solution because it is a choice the player makes and not a rule enforced by the game.
Ow I love your sycophant lemming behaviour -you're the type who follows but will never lead.
Did you order Oliver C's poster for your bedroom? Hang it next to the Metroid poster you printed in 2008, it will look pretty cool.
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What a clever ape you are. They give you peanuts when you learn a new word?
oliverclaude
General Morden's Aide
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Gaston, Gaston... do you have any idea what the join date of '02 & 10K+ posts mean? And in your case, I don't ask rhetorically. It's being there and participating almost from the source. DevilRedeemed saw guys like you and me coming and going. With your rant, you only make yourself ridiculous at best, absurd at worst. Do yourself a favor and give it a rest.
Adressing your remarks, they doesn't change the fact, that SotN is broken, like many other action-rpgs. A time limit doesn't have to alter the game, it could have been implemented as a reward, like in Super Metroid, or a rank system like in Legend of Oasis. I also don't accept "unforeseen problems" as an excuse. It's not an indie game we're talking about, but KCE.
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4 hours? Is that all everyone else put into this game? I must have sucked pretty bad...
Gaston
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Yes, father?
yes; #nolife (since you're asking 'not rhetorically'). And you're right - he will be here when I have long gone, still being a prick. Doesn't change anything though. Postcount means nothing if 87,6% are dumb comments like "fuck you cunt". He's a dick and I owe him nothing. Plus I get a kick out of it.
Ok, I assumed that -since this is castlevania we were talking about now that you meant a timer at the top of the screen that would add time whenever you'd get rid of an enemy or some other mechanic. If it would be implemented like super metroid, it would work.
Well, the experience would be far more linear for one and backtracking (a major part of SotN) would become extremely boring. They probably tested a lot of things before they settled on SotN as we know it.
Psygnosis8
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I think it’s doable in about 4 hours. I forget what the time limit is to get the bathing suit ending.
Regardless I’ve spent countless hours trying to 100% the game. (It’s the only game I’ve ever done this with). It took me years to find the morph ball jump item.
Soundwave GI
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Nice topic, my two favorite series. I am admittedly biased being that "metroidvania", as it's called nowadays, is my favorite sub-genre. I think SM and SOTN hold up very well today. I usually go through both again once every couple years.
I remember both being universally acclaimed when they released and deservedly so. Everyone I knew was playing SM when it came out...SOTN to a lesser extent as people were getting on the 3D bandwagon, but it's no less of a masterpiece.
SM had amazing atmosphere and is really one of the first games where I appreciated how much sound could contribute to the overall makeup of a game. Sure, there were plenty of catchy tunes in a lot of great games for NES and SG, but the sound capabilities of the SNES put it in another class for me. In SM particularly, the music (and lack thereof at certain times) really added a lot of depth to the feel of the game. Add to that the map, great graphics, great control and non-linear exploration and you have a recipe that many games have been trying to mimic since its release.
I feel SOTN is the same in a lot of respects at it's time. In a market flooded by so many garbage 3D titles cashing in on new tech, it had fantastic art, precise controls, great lite-rpg elements and a soundtrack, IMO, that is still the best of any game to date.
If you are a fan of the genre, it's a great time. There are quite a few noteworthy titles to play. Axiom Verge is quite good as mentioned here already. Some other good ones are Shadow Complex, The Mummy Demastered (believe it or not) and the newest Strider. There are quite a few more, but the one that takes the cake for me is "The Messenger" on Switch. It's the most fun I've had with a game in ages. It starts out very much like Ninja Gaiden before becoming more Metroid 1 and finally going full on SM. Also, it incorporates some lite-rpg and quest elements, using unlockable abilities and and a really cool element that has you go from 8-bit to 16-bit modes that represent the part of the story that has you playing in current time and future.
I remember both being universally acclaimed when they released and deservedly so. Everyone I knew was playing SM when it came out...SOTN to a lesser extent as people were getting on the 3D bandwagon, but it's no less of a masterpiece.
SM had amazing atmosphere and is really one of the first games where I appreciated how much sound could contribute to the overall makeup of a game. Sure, there were plenty of catchy tunes in a lot of great games for NES and SG, but the sound capabilities of the SNES put it in another class for me. In SM particularly, the music (and lack thereof at certain times) really added a lot of depth to the feel of the game. Add to that the map, great graphics, great control and non-linear exploration and you have a recipe that many games have been trying to mimic since its release.
I feel SOTN is the same in a lot of respects at it's time. In a market flooded by so many garbage 3D titles cashing in on new tech, it had fantastic art, precise controls, great lite-rpg elements and a soundtrack, IMO, that is still the best of any game to date.
If you are a fan of the genre, it's a great time. There are quite a few noteworthy titles to play. Axiom Verge is quite good as mentioned here already. Some other good ones are Shadow Complex, The Mummy Demastered (believe it or not) and the newest Strider. There are quite a few more, but the one that takes the cake for me is "The Messenger" on Switch. It's the most fun I've had with a game in ages. It starts out very much like Ninja Gaiden before becoming more Metroid 1 and finally going full on SM. Also, it incorporates some lite-rpg and quest elements, using unlockable abilities and and a really cool element that has you go from 8-bit to 16-bit modes that represent the part of the story that has you playing in current time and future.
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Castlevania SotN isn't broken until you get the rare Crissaegrim sword drop from Schmoo in the Reverse Library, then, the enemies/bosses are completely and utterly fucked (good damage and hits many times--it's like Freddy Krueger doing E. Honda's hundred hand slap). That said, I died plenty of times playing through SotN the first time and I think it has a decent level of difficulty. Sure, if you grind, it gets easier, but that's true of almost any game that has an experience level progression system (except for Phantasy Star II; I swear, it seems like it doesn't matter how much you level up in that game, you always feel like you're on the losing end of enemy encounters).
Soundwave GI
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Very true. That and Dust are two that I have played, but not finished so I can't offer an opinion from start to finish.
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Mummy Demastered looks pretty cool. Going to check it out. Loved Shadow Complex.
Soundwave GI
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Agreed on SOTN. The nice thing about being able to grind to make the game easier is that it's optional. Some people like to grind early to be a bit overpowered and then just coast through and enjoy the game. There isn't a need for that if you want a challenge. I'm somewhere in between on that. Games where the enemies level with you defeats the purpose somewhat if it's 1:1.
Soundwave GI
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The Mummy goes on sale here and there, so it can be had for a good price on any system...It was originally only on Switch, but now on XBO and PS4 as well. The Messenger was just on sale for Switch, but ended on 12/10. I can't recommend that game enough. It's also on PC and I think eventually for Xbox it will release.
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Those who like "Metroidvania" should check out Wonder Boy III The Dragon's Trap (Sega Master System, modern systems) and Shape Shifter (PC Engine CD).
Soundwave GI
Rugal's Thug
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That's a good one...Wonder Boy Dragon's Trap was also remade for XBO, PS4 and Switch. I haven't played it yet, but the upgrade is supposed to be purely aesthetics while keeping the original gameplay and layout intact.