Something I've learned playing Neo Geo games this week

FilthyRear

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These posts come off as if the ones who have given you rebuttals don't understand the topic at hand. "Goor or bad"? People mixing up "good vs bad" with "different" isn't the issue.

Yes arcade vs console is different obviously. You do understand that most arcade games require hours upon hours upon hours of practice to clear?

"I credit fred through battle garegga in 30 min, but spend 90 hours collecting items in zelda. Zelda is deep! Garegga idk..it's just an arcade game".


That's the vibe I'm getting!

lol "credit fred"
 

edd_jedi

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"I credit fred through battle garegga in 30 min, but spend 90 hours collecting items in zelda. Zelda is deep! Garegga idk..it's just an arcade game".

And the vibe you're giving off is Zelda is crap because it's not on the Neo Geo. Equally short-sighted I'm afraid, there's much more logic to my argument. You're seriously trying to tell me any linear shoot em up has the depth of a Zelda game made since the mid 90s? :lol: Replaying the same 30 minute game over and over and over to get a better score is not the same as playing a game that actually takes a long time to complete (or in BOTWs case even to get 17% of the way through it!)
 
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FilthyRear

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And the vibe you're giving off is Zelda is crap because it's not on the Neo Geo. Equally short-sighted I'm afraid, there's much more logic to my argument. You're seriously trying to tell me any linear shoot em up has the depth of a Zelda game made since the mid 90s? :lol: Replaying the same 30 minute game over and over and over to get a better score is not the same as playing a game that actually takes a long time to complete (or in BOTWs case even to get 17% of the way through it!)

"logic"
 

XxHennersXx

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Lengthy does not equal depth, or else we’d be talking about Desert Bus being the deepest game of all time.


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andsuchisdeath

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And the vibe you're giving off is Zelda is crap because it's not on the Neo Geo. Equally short-sighted I'm afraid, there's much more logic to my argument. You're seriously trying to tell me any linear shoot em up has the depth of a Zelda game made since the mid 90s? :lol: Replaying the same 30 minute game over and over and over to get a better score is not the same as playing a game that actually takes a long time to complete (or in BOTWs case even to get 17% of the way through it!)

Such a generic retort. I've never stated my preferences, but my point is totally irrelevant of preference so it seems that you're throwing whatever you can at the wall, hoping to see what sticks.

It's clear that you've never spent time learning to clear an arcade game. That's fine.

But the presentation style of your argument is becoming faultier by the day.

You have been exposed
 

ForeverSublime

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These posts come off as if the ones who have given you rebuttals don't understand the topic at hand. "Goor or bad"? People mixing up "good vs bad" with "different" isn't the issue.

Yeah, I'm disappointed they're not receptive to discussion - it's not for a lack of enthusiasm. If RPGs have taught me anything, it's that we're not at a high enough level to pass this NPC's dialogue. Did we miss a side quest?
 

oliverclaude

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You're seriously trying to tell me any linear shoot em up has the depth of a Zelda game made since the mid 90s?

You're seriously suffering from depth-blindness, credit_fredd...

...and regarding innovation, any Zelda game from before the mid 90s had more to offer than any after, along with more frames per second. Think about it, the first was already non-linear in structure. It's like gaming world's Last Videotapes of Marcel Duchamp, only that they're real this time.
 

edd_jedi

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It's clear that you've never spent time learning to clear an arcade game. That's fine.

I had a Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition arcade machine in my bedroom for 5 years in the 90s. I'd hazard a guess I could school you on that game following the hundreds of hours I spent on it. If you're going to call out someone for talking bollocks, don't do the same yourself. All I see here is a bunch of people who can't comprehend the difference between an arcade game and something deeper.
 

edd_jedi

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Just to add, as frustrating as it is, I keep coming back to NTM for more. Got two trophies now. So it's a decent game in that respect, even if the physics from a 'real' golfers point of view is a car crash.
 

andsuchisdeath

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I had a Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition arcade machine in my bedroom for 5 years in the 90s. I'd hazard a guess I could school you on that game following the hundreds of hours I spent on it. If you're going to call out someone for talking bollocks, don't do the same yourself. All I see here is a bunch of people who can't comprehend the difference between an arcade game and something deeper.

I state that the depth deficit that you imagine in arcade games is due to you never learning to clear one (which you've yet to refute).

So in turn you speculate that you can "school" me in a vs. fighter.

Makes sense!
 

XxHennersXx

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I had a Street Fighter 2 Champion Edition arcade machine in my bedroom for 5 years in the 90s. I'd hazard a guess I could school you on that game following the hundreds of hours I spent on it. If you're going to call out someone for talking bollocks, don't do the same yourself. All I see here is a bunch of people who can't comprehend the difference between an arcade game and something deeper.

All I have said is 1) NTM isn’t as “random” or my score wouldn’t be consistent due to luck. 2) All aspects of “depth” you have stated are just length.

Long does not mean deep.


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edd_jedi

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I state that the depth deficit that you imagine in arcade games is due to you never learning to clear one (which you've yet to refute).

So in turn you speculate that you can "school" me in a vs. fighter.

Makes sense!

Yes, I learned to clear SF2CE. Back then I could complete it in single player on hardest dip switch setting without losing a round, winning most rounds perfect. So I assure you, I understand what you're saying. Spending loads of money to "credit fred" a fighting game vs learning to beat it with a single credit is exactly the depth you are talking about. It's also the entire point of this thread, which people still don't seem to get after four pages.
 

edd_jedi

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Long does not mean deep.

I've already responded to this, but as you apparently didn't bother to read it, deep and long are not mutually exclusive. Zelda is not "just running around collecting things" for a long time. RPGs are not just "fighting enemies" for a long time. If you can't understand that games like Zelda, Shining Force, Final Fantasy etc are deep as well as long, in a way that arcade games like NTM are not, you either don't like those kind of games (which is fair enough) or have never played them yet still think your opinion is valid.
 

andsuchisdeath

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Spending loads of money to "credit fred" a fighting game vs learning to beat it with a single credit is exactly the depth you are talking about.

Fighting games aren't the strongest example, so no this is not "exactly the depth I'm talking about".
 

FilthyRear

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Yes, I learned to clear SF2CE. Back then I could complete it in single player on hardest dip switch setting without losing a round, winning most rounds perfect. So I assure you, I understand what you're saying. Spending loads of money to "credit fred" a fighting game vs learning to beat it with a single credit is exactly the depth you are talking about. It's also the entire point of this thread, which people still don't seem to get after four pages.

Stop acting like a daft COONT.
 

ForeverSublime

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Yes, we've gone 4 pages while pretending "arcade games" were never released on home consoles.

Sometimes I call the Capcom hotline and tell them my console ate my credit, just for nostalgia.
 

RAZO

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I could beat anyone here at Eternal Champions. I'm pretty sure I can.
 

madman

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Something I've learned reading this thread this week: edd_jedi has a case of teh gheyz.
 

ForeverSublime

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Just to add, as frustrating as it is, I keep coming back to NTM for more. Got two trophies now. So it's a decent game in that respect, even if the physics from a 'real' golfers point of view is a car crash.

By the way, have you checked out Warzard (not a Neo game)? If you like games with upgrades and badges and that motivates you, it may be up your alley. It does that different than most arcade games.

Whether or not upgrades and badges are explicitly awarded and taught ("You obtained: X", "It does Y"), they exist across genres and platforms. Some games choose to give you these upgrades over time, while others choose to let you learn about them through discovery. Perhaps you have a preference for how they're presented in one medium compared to (not) in another.

To the "arcade game" style's credit, it appears to do a better job of blending the narrative and the action. Instead of obtaining a skill that cuts 3 frames and combos into a move, I've had it all along. I can then say it was I who changed as time goes on, not the character on the screen, and not merely aesthetically. The Street Fighter cab you had was probably a lot better at creating a cohesive narrative experience (becoming a great fighter, and traveling the world to find someone worthy to challenge you. . . in an arcade) than a lot of role playing games not just of that time, but through today.

If the developer decides not to feed you with carrots, then hopefully they've created AI and Level Design that progresses appropriately so you feel like it's you that actually leveled up, and not just obtained a key to unlock the next area.

To your earlier observation, don't get too hung up on the 50% power reduction in the rough, as a real golfer. If you're a real person whose had real conversations, do you feel the same when dialogue doesn't change appropriately in an RPG whether you have 1% or 100% HP? Perhaps if it's enjoyable, run with it. Changing the punishment may be better for the simulation, but not the game. Car crashes may not be fun in real life, but as a game, well, to each their own.
 
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XxHennersXx

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You're using your phone to text, instead to play?! You're either an A-grade collectard or a fuckin' professor.

Pretty sure of everyone here you’re the last person to call someone a “collectard” but I really don’t understand your statement “Using your phone to text instead to play?”. Tapatalk is an app that makes it easier to use forums that aren’t designed for mobile (such as this one.)
 
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