:siren:

StevenK

ng.com SFII tournament winner 2002-2023
10 Year Member
Nobody seems to mind anything that trump does anymore.
 

Karou

Gandalf Of Gibberish,
10 Year Member
the scapegoat face of the true evil bigtymers...whoopdeedo. even if he is one on a small scale..we will never know anything about...the real.:eye::help:
 

lithy

Most Prominent Member of Chat
20 Year Member

In all serious, what motivates you? Why do you care? What is the best outcome of the office being mired in controversy and investigation for the entire 4 (?) years?

While significant, compare this news to any other 'crazy headline' that people were sure was the straw to break the back for Trump with the goodwill of his base. How much more serious is it? Sure it is technically a felony, but really it's only campaign finance law...meh. Manafort is even easier to dissociate from.

I'm ok with this because it seems like there needs to be a total 'burn it down' moment. Except I think right now, the best case is that the Democrats seize a decade's worth of control for the congress and presidency. While Trump may be the most bumbling, inept criminal to hold office, I don't feel like he is the only one and I'm not sure that solid Democratic control is a 'good' outcome from all of this.

I would rather it sow general distrust of the national parties, but that seems unlikely at best.
 

100proof

Insert Something Clever Here
10 Year Member
In all serious, what motivates you? Why do you care? What is the best outcome of the office being mired in controversy and investigation for the entire 4 (?) years?

While significant, compare this news to any other 'crazy headline' that people were sure was the straw to break the back for Trump with the goodwill of his base. How much more serious is it? Sure it is technically a felony, but really it's only campaign finance law...meh. Manafort is even easier to dissociate from.

I'm ok with this because it seems like there needs to be a total 'burn it down' moment. Except I think right now, the best case is that the Democrats seize a decade's worth of control for the congress and presidency. While Trump may be the most bumbling, inept criminal to hold office, I don't feel like he is the only one and I'm not sure that solid Democratic control is a 'good' outcome from all of this.

I would rather it sow general distrust of the national parties, but that seems unlikely at best.

This is kind of where I am. Nothing is going to lead to this dipshit's impeachment. They could have a video of Trump saying "I murdered Ronald Reagan and love abortion" while wiping his ass with the American flag and his dipshit base will keep on repeating all of his empty slogans (them yelling "lock her up" at tonight's beer hall putsch was the height of sad hilarity) and the spineless Republicans will continue to hold his water because party before country. Doesn't matter how many seats the Dems win in November. They won't have the two-thirds majority to impeach him in the Senate.

My unrealistic hope is that this (Trump's presidency not tonight) will be a defining generational moment and all of the "both sides suck" non-voters and career centrists finally get off their stupid asses and vote consistently to end this Moral Majority nightmare we've been living in the last 40 years. The Republican party in its current state needs to be drowned in the bathtub. The Dems may be corporate whores and the far left are insufferable twats but the alternative is dominionist retards, overcompensating closeted homophobes, white nationalists, thieves and fucking Objectivists.
 

SpamYouToDeath

I asked for a, Custom Rank and, Learned My Lesson.
15 Year Member
In all serious, what motivates you? Why do you care? What is the best outcome of the office being mired in controversy and investigation for the entire 4 (?) years?

I care because I want my government to be run by people with integrity and skill.

The best outcome is that people learn not to elect incompetent blowhards.
 

evil wasabi

The Jongmaster
20 Year Member
Lithy is a kind of “cut off the nose to spite the face” guy.

I am more of a “work with what you got”, and I think the Dems are not as in need to being reset. Here’s why: my problem with Dems is merely that they let any special needs initiative in. Not everyone is up in arms about a gay cake, and I don’t think everyone should be. The flip side is a GOP that has antagonized non-whites, non-Christians, non-straight, and now, non-white grief sympathizers.

So yeah, I would hit the reset on the GOP and bring it back to fiscal conservatism, domestic focus, anti foreign entanglement, and take it out of petty social conservatism.
 

LoneSage

A Broken Man
20 Year Member
I would rather it sow general distrust of the national parties, but that seems unlikely at best.

The Republican party leans so far right now it should really be split into two: the Tea Party base it is now and a new party that resembles the Republican party pre-Moral Majority.
 

lithy

Most Prominent Member of Chat
20 Year Member
I care because I want my government to be run by people with integrity and skill.

The best outcome is that people learn not to elect incompetent blowhards.

The only person you want in office is one who will not seek the office. Public service is (well, should be) an imposition. The catch 22 it anyone who says, "I want to be president", should be immediately disqualified.

Lithy is a kind of “cut off the nose to spite the face” guy.

I am more of a “work with what you got”, and I think the Dems are not as in need to being reset. Here’s why: my problem with Dems is merely that they let any special needs initiative in. Not everyone is up in arms about a gay cake, and I don’t think everyone should be. The flip side is a GOP that has antagonized non-whites, non-Christians, non-straight, and now, non-white grief sympathizers.

So yeah, I would hit the reset on the GOP and bring it back to fiscal conservatism, domestic focus, anti foreign entanglement, and take it out of petty social conservatism.

I won't argue that characterization. And I will admit I am unlikely to vote for a major party any time soon, so my thoughts can definitely be considered an outsider perspective and maybe both sides are happy with their respective party.

But, to me, while the GOP might be the ones at the front, with fun, simplistic, hateful, slogans, the Democrats have perpetuated all of the policies they campaign against. DACA instead of meaningful immigration reform, an endless cycle of international entanglement and escalation of drone strikes that drives most modern terrorism, and no movement on prison or drug policy. All of these things have significant impact on all of the various non-majority people that you mentioned and while they are championed by the GOP, they are never seriously challenged by the Democrats.

The GOP might be more reprehensible on the surface but in some ways doesn't that make the Democrats more dangerous? They would rather leave thing in place so they can continue to go back to that well for the election cycle. If you remove that adversary you run the risk of being challenged on your record.

Basically it take two to tango, and these two parties are having a ball.

The Republican party leans so far right now it should really be split into two: the Tea Party base it is now and a new party that resembles the Republican party pre-Moral Majority.

They only lean right in the sense of what 'right' currently means in our political spectrum. The GOP is not a party of conservative government, only conservative (read: backwards) social policy.
 

SML

NEANDERTHAL FUCKER,
20 Year Member
The only person you want in office is one who will not seek the office. Public service is (well, should be) an imposition. The catch 22 it anyone who says, "I want to be president", should be immediately disqualified.

Maybe if we started locking a few up, it would be.

The big problem, whatever size and shape the government happens to be, is in holding the powerful accountable. That's in the public or the private sector.

I don't think I can take the small government types seriously again until it becomes clear that "accountability" means something beyond privatizing schools.

Where's the Damocles Party? I'm ready for it.
 

SpamYouToDeath

I asked for a, Custom Rank and, Learned My Lesson.
15 Year Member
The only person you want in office is one who will not seek the office. Public service is (well, should be) an imposition. The catch 22 it anyone who says, "I want to be president", should be immediately disqualified.

That's why it's so vitally important that elected officials have limited power and exercise that power in view of the public. If you get rid of the rules, or stop caring when politicians break them, you're telling those politicians to continue misbehaving.
 

StevenK

ng.com SFII tournament winner 2002-2023
10 Year Member
The only person you want in office is one who will not seek the office. Public service is (well, should be) an imposition. The catch 22 it anyone who says, "I want to be president", should be immediately disqualified.

This is an unhelpful, tired old cliché now, and it's helped in the public's acceptance of the worst of politician's behaviour.

To say they're all bad apples like they're all the same is clearly a nonsense. Sure, the best of them might be a two day old windfall granny smith with a couple of bruises but the worst of them are the dog shit it landed in.
 

SML

NEANDERTHAL FUCKER,
20 Year Member
DlQOeDUXgAAWwF8.jpeg

This is one of Manafort's jurors.

Duncan described herself as an avid supporter of President Trump, but said she was moved by four full boxes of exhibits provided by Mueller’s team – though she was skeptical about prosecutors' motives in the financial crimes case.

“Certainly Mr. Manafort got caught breaking the law, but he wouldn’t have gotten caught if they weren’t after President Trump,” Duncan said of the special counsel’s case, which she separately described as a “witch hunt to try to find Russian collusion,” borrowing a phrase Trump has used in tweets more than 100 times
 
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