Guys..? Are those KOF background hand-drawn or rendered?

Samuray

Another Striker
10 Year Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Posts
314
Feels so strange to be asking this, but maybe I have been an idiot all these years....

I always thought SNK's stages, so the backgrounds in fighting games, were bascially the peak of pixel art. That implies to me that they have been hand-drawn, so to say. Assembled pixel by pixel in a painstacking manner.

I've been playing early KOFs with a friend and I was sure he'd be aaaaall over those background graphics....but he's lukewarm on them, says many parts of them are pre-rendered and to him don't look very appealing, because rendering goes for realism, and 4096 colors aren't enough for that.

That completely boggled my mind. Sure, there are some rendered objects here and there....the gears in KOF95's Mexico stage, obviously. But ....the USA stage of the same game? That's all rendered are therefore not all that impressive?

His words have shook me a little, probably because he is a graphics designer by trade...so what he says does carry some weight. Have I been wrong all this time? Are KOF stages (or MOTW or LB) not the epitome of amazing?

Disclaimer: I'll always find them beautiful as fuck, no matter what. But I'm curious if he might be talking nonsense after all.
 

titchgamer

Guerilla Warrior
Joined
May 31, 2018
Posts
1,731
If hes expecting realistic GFX from a system thats 20+ years old then he may need to re-evaluate his expectations.
 

Ip Man

BBLLOOOO__HHAARRDDDDDD!!!!,
15 Year Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2006
Posts
4,334
rendered or not, any one who isn't impressed with kof 95's backgrounds is in the wrong place.
 

Dr Shroom

made it in japan
15 Year Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2005
Posts
23,233
Wasn't 97 the first with pre-rendered backgrounds?
 

ptrix4u2c

Mega Shock!!
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Posts
100
Wasn't 97 the first with pre-rendered backgrounds?

Don't think so. 96 had tons of pre-rendered touches. Even some small FMV before stages too. I think 96 still looks pretty nice. Reminds me of FFVII backgrounds in a good way.
 

joe8

margarine sandwich
15 Year Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2007
Posts
3,725
Feels so strange to be asking this, but maybe I have been an idiot all these years....

I always thought SNK's stages, so the backgrounds in fighting games, were bascially the peak of pixel art. That implies to me that they have been hand-drawn, so to say. Assembled pixel by pixel in a painstacking manner.

I've been playing early KOFs with a friend and I was sure he'd be aaaaall over those background graphics....but he's lukewarm on them, says many parts of them are pre-rendered and to him don't look very appealing, because rendering goes for realism, and 4096 colors aren't enough for that.

That completely boggled my mind. Sure, there are some rendered objects here and there....the gears in KOF95's Mexico stage, obviously. But ....the USA stage of the same game? That's all rendered are therefore not all that impressive?

His words have shook me a little, probably because he is a graphics designer by trade...so what he says does carry some weight. Have I been wrong all this time? Are KOF stages (or MOTW or LB) not the epitome of amazing?

Disclaimer: I'll always find them beautiful as fuck, no matter what. But I'm curious if he might be talking nonsense after all.

I like some of the backgrounds of KOF. But in general they are not as good as some of the backgrounds in other SNK games, like Last Blade, MOTW, the Fatal Fury Series, and Samurai Shodown.
To see what the Neo is actually capable of, you need to look at the MOTW and Last Blade backgrounds, as those have a more modern look. Or some of the last KOF games like 2002 and 2003, have more modern-looking backgrounds. KOF backgrounds look good when they are on an RGB PVM or arcade monitor, with scanlines, which is what they were drawn for. They don't look so good on component, on a regular CRT TV.
 

thermaltreasure

Ninja Combat Warrior
Joined
Apr 6, 2013
Posts
529
Those 95 backgrounds are godlike. The aforementioned elevator/cog stage, the waterfall, Neo Geo Land, harbour side, Korea burning tree etc.
 

Leback

Stakes Winner
Joined
Apr 27, 2017
Posts
98
I work as a 3D artist and don't see why rendered stuff needs to look realistic. But anyway show him the Last blade games if you can, they are in my opinion a true work of art! Or Samurai Shodown 3 and 4, both got some really moody hand drawn backgrounds.
 

Samuray

Another Striker
10 Year Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Posts
314
Yeah, we¡ll be getting to "Last Blade" and MOTW...I was just wondering if his assessment was correct that all backgrounds from at least 95 forward have rendered elements. As I said, the USA 95 stage always struck me as a hand drawn piece of art, but he says nope, it's rendered.

He agrees that many backgounds are fantastic, but unlike me he isn't blown away by pretty much all of them. :)
 

suicidekiller

Host for Orochi,
Joined
Feb 3, 2003
Posts
1,595
I don't get your point? Yes, some elements are pre-rendered, but what's so bad about it? The mountains in the background for example in this KoF '95 stage. I don't think all stages from KoF '95 onward have rendered elements in them but some of them do (MotW helicopter comes to mind).

kof95-stage-brazil.gif


garou-markofthewolves-background-kevin2.gif
 

Samuray

Another Striker
10 Year Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Posts
314
I don't get your point? Yes, some elements are pre-rendered, but what's so bad about it?

To me? Nothing, I LOVE those backgrounds! :)
My friend isn't a fan of mixing hand painted stuff with rendered objects though. And the initial question was whether not only objects but whole backgrounds are in fact rendered (95 USA stage), which I absolutely did not know. Always thought that was hand drawn.

Still love everything about KOF but I wanted to make sure my friend isn't wrong...had a hard time believing this.
 

joe8

margarine sandwich
15 Year Member
Joined
Oct 25, 2007
Posts
3,725
To me? Nothing, I LOVE those backgrounds!
My friend isn't a fan of mixing hand painted stuff with rendered objects though. And the initial question was whether not only objects but whole backgrounds are in fact rendered (95 USA stage), which I absolutely did not know. Always thought that was hand drawn.

Still love everything about KOF but I wanted to make sure my friend isn't wrong...had a hard time believing this.
I prefer hand-drawn backgrounds to rendered. The Shock Troopers graphics are better than Shock Troopers 2, because less of it is rendered. Rendered graphics date more quickly than hand-drawn, as rendered relies more on how advanced the system hardware is. The graphics on the Neo Geo Metal Slug's are still great, even though they are on outdated hardware, because they are hand-drawn with skill. The artist has more control over what they are creating. Sometimes, artists can create better work, if they choose to limit the tools they can work with, as it forces them to make better use of the tools that they do have.
 
Last edited:

Late

Reichsf?rer-Finnland,
20 Year Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2001
Posts
8,348
I prefer hand-drawn backgrounds to rendered. The Shock Troopers graphics are better than Shock Troopers 2, because less of it is rendered. Rendered graphics date more quickly than hand-drawn, as rendered relies more on how advanced the system hardware is. The graphics on the Neo Geo Metal Slug's are still great, even though they are on outdated hardware, because they are hand-drawn with skill. The artist has more control over what they are creating. Sometimes, artists can create better work, if they choose to limit the tools they can work with, as it forces them to make better use of the tools that they do have.



6*Westinghouse "Event Horizon" Gravitic Enhanced Fusion Reactors.
6*Lockheed-General Electric I-79LGE12 Gravitic Enhanced Plasma Engines.
1*Lockheed-Mitchell "Waverider 2 - W" Gravitic Drive.
2*Lockheed-Mitchell M51e6 Jump engines.
 

GohanX

Horrible Goose
20 Year Member
Joined
Sep 28, 2001
Posts
12,490
They don't look so good on component, on a regular CRT TV.

If you're not seeing scanlines on a SD CRT through component you need to turn down the contrast or get a set that's not blurry as shit.
 

Heinz

Parteizeit
15 Year Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2005
Posts
22,334
6*Westinghouse "Event Horizon" Gravitic Enhanced Fusion Reactors.
6*Lockheed-General Electric I-79LGE12 Gravitic Enhanced Plasma Engines.
1*Lockheed-Mitchell "Waverider 2 - W" Gravitic Drive.
2*Lockheed-Mitchell M51e6 Jump engines.

:keke:
 
Top