Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Honest Question about Controllers

  1. #1
    Crazed MVS Addict
    Capitalistix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Florida

    Posts
    147

    Honest Question about Controllers

    Why is it that noone has applied a nintendo-wavebird like bluetooth/dongle solution for retro consoles? Theres such an enormous retro market nowadays I cant imagine that I'm the first person to think of this? Think of it, wireless Sega Saturn controllers. Wireless original Xbox controllers, wireless PS2/Genesis/SNES non-IR controllers... Or do these readily exist and Ive just been blind? I feel like MAYBE Ive seen some cheap chinese trash over the years for PS1 that maybe used bluetooth, but certainly not in spades at that, and obviously of hideous quality. If someone were able to make these, I feel with outlets like Stone Age Gamer and other sites, they would become a staple product.

  2. #2
    Cholecystectomy Required.
    ggallegos1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Milford, CT

    Posts
    2,992
    8bitdo SNES30 Wireless Bluetooth Controller Dual Classic Joystick for IOS / Android Gamepad - PC Mac Linux https://www.amazon.com/dp/B014QP2H1E..._eJqmAbKJJYDET
    "I am the master of my fate. I am the captain of my soul."
    Switch FC 0965 2531 6217

    Quote Originally Posted by ObeyMyEgo View Post
    ggallegos1 Is a cock sucking faggot. That is all.

  3. #3
    drunk downunder!
    aka. Muff Diver.
    lachlan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    A Hard Earned Thirst

    Posts
    10,925
    They exist for iOS, Android, Windows, MacOS and of course things like the raspberry pi all via bluetooth. Retro consoles? who plays those?



    !!

  4. #4
    Crazed MVS Addict
    Capitalistix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Florida

    Posts
    147
    Quote Originally Posted by ggallegos1 View Post
    8bitdo SNES30 Wireless Bluetooth Controller Dual Classic Joystick for IOS / Android Gamepad - PC Mac Linux https://www.amazon.com/dp/B014QP2H1E..._eJqmAbKJJYDET
    I think you maybe misunderstood me, I know bluetooth controllers exist for computers and cellphones, Im talking about a dedicated dongle and controller solution for a given older console that mimicks what the wavebird did. i.e. put the dongle into the sega saturn (for example) controller port. Select desired channel number on dongle. Turn on wireless controller that works with said dongle, and set to same channel. Enjoy saturn games without having to be no more 5 feet away from the console itself, especially helpful if you have a projector setup like me or like countless people who have enclosed entertainment centers that otherwise would have to be all opened up to allow a controller cord through.

  5. #5
    Cholecystectomy Required.
    ggallegos1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Milford, CT

    Posts
    2,992
    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalistix View Post
    I think you maybe misunderstood me, I know bluetooth controllers exist for computers and cellphones, Im talking about a dedicated dongle and controller solution for a given older console that mimicks what the wavebird did. i.e. put the dongle into the sega saturn (for example) controller port. Select desired channel number on dongle. Turn on wireless controller that works with said dongle, and set to same channel. Enjoy saturn games without having to be no more 5 feet away from the console itself, especially helpful if you have a projector setup like me or like countless people who have enclosed entertainment centers that otherwise would have to be all opened up to allow a controller cord through.
    The controller I linked has optional console adapters. There are also a plethora of controller adapters for other systems as well.
    "I am the master of my fate. I am the captain of my soul."
    Switch FC 0965 2531 6217

    Quote Originally Posted by ObeyMyEgo View Post
    ggallegos1 Is a cock sucking faggot. That is all.

  6. #6
    Somewhere in Europe.

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Neo Geo World

    Posts
    625
    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalistix View Post
    Im talking about a dedicated dongle and controller solution for a given older console that mimicks what the wavebird did. i.e. put the dongle into the sega saturn (for example) controller port. Select desired channel number on dongle. Turn on wireless controller
    8Bitdo sell exactly that for the genuine NES and SNES, as well as for Nintendo's new "Classic" versions of both [they use the nunchuck port for controllers]. Here:

    Retro Receiver NES
    Retro Receiver SNES
    Retro Receiver Classic

    I'm sure if the demand was high enough, they would make these for other platforms. I haven't heard anything about wireless options for Saturn, but I know PlayStation had some 3rd party controllers with IR dongles back in the day.

    Edit: Apparently, there are official Saturn IR controllers.
    Last edited by Morden; 12-13-2017 at 07:18 AM.

  7. #7
    Schlonginator II: Judgment Dong
    GohanX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Next to your mom

    Posts
    9,613
    Yes, I love the 8bitdo SNES controllers and I have all the dongles Morden listed. I've also bought/made SNES to whatever adapters, so between the bluetooth connectivity and the adapters I can use them on damn near anything I want.

  8. #8
    Crossed Swords Squire

    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Levittown, PA

    Posts
    191
    Quote Originally Posted by ggallegos1 View Post
    There are also a plethora of controller adapters for other systems as well.
    There's still no QUALITY wireless solutions for Sega Master System, Sega Genesis, Playstation 1 - just to mention a few (there are MANY other systems as well) I haven't been able to find a decent solution for those which is good enough quality to actually play with for extended periods of time, and pretty closely mimics the look of the original controller(s) -- looking near-identical is very important as this is all about nostalgia for me (and playing the system on the controller it was designed for).

    Even the original Xbox has no good wireless solution... The 'best' choice for that is the Logitech ones which I've bought 6x of those off eBay in the past year - which don't look like the original controller exactly FYI - and it took me 6x tries to find ONE which wasn't all jacked up and had decently working buttons - and that 6th one had to be bought brand new in sealed box and was expensive (thankfully it worked much better than the other 5).

    I've discounted any of the original IR solutions as those literally need a funky ~3x6" brick plugged into the front of the console, and need unobstructed line-of sight to work (and commonly don't work very well in my experience back in the day even when they were brand new).

    I've even reached out to the couple custom PCB (DIY kits) solutions I've found and all of those seem to be limited runs which are out of production (or at least I have been unable to reach the guys who designed them over PM, Website, or Email), and were usually around $150 per controller all said and done (which I would think about paying...but no pre-built solutions either). I started a topic all about wireless controller options for some of these systems on Shmups and it seems like there's nothing that would fit my requirements which is sad.

  9. #9
    Schlonginator II: Judgment Dong
    GohanX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Next to your mom

    Posts
    9,613
    If 8bitdo would make a Saturn clone pad I would give them all the money.

  10. #10
    Trust the French? cdamm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Chicago

    Posts
    10,733
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    There's still no QUALITY wireless solutions for Sega Master System, Sega Genesis, Playstation 1 - just to mention a few (there are MANY other systems as well) I haven't been able to find a decent solution for those which is good enough quality to actually play with for extended periods of time, and pretty closely mimics the look of the original controller(s) -- looking near-identical is very important as this is all about nostalgia for me (and playing the system on the controller it was designed for).

    Even the original Xbox has no good wireless solution... The 'best' choice for that is the Logitech ones which I've bought 6x of those off eBay in the past year - which don't look like the original controller exactly FYI - and it took me 6x tries to find ONE which wasn't all jacked up and had decently working buttons - and that 6th one had to be bought brand new in sealed box and was expensive (thankfully it worked much better than the other 5).

    I've discounted any of the original IR solutions as those literally need a funky ~3x6" brick plugged into the front of the console, and need unobstructed line-of sight to work (and commonly don't work very well in my experience back in the day even when they were brand new).

    I've even reached out to the couple custom PCB (DIY kits) solutions I've found and all of those seem to be limited runs which are out of production (or at least I have been unable to reach the guys who designed them over PM, Website, or Email), and were usually around $150 per controller all said and done (which I would think about paying...but no pre-built solutions either). I started a topic all about wireless controller options for some of these systems on Shmups and it seems like there's nothing that would fit my requirements which is sad.
    the easy answer is that there isnt a ton of money to be made by larger companies for niche things.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kpj View Post
    Sometimes, the customer doesn't always KNOW what's right.



  11. #11
    Crossed Swords Squire

    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Levittown, PA

    Posts
    191
    Quote Originally Posted by cdamm View Post
    the easy answer is that there isnt a ton of money to be made by larger companies for niche things.
    8BitDo I'm assuming isn't loosing money - I wonder how many NES/SNES controllers they sell compared to the ones made for the NES/SNES Classic. I don't know how large of a company they are but I know stores like BestBuy and WalMart were selling their products at least...

    If you compare the sales of the Xbox 360 at 84 million, and PS3 at 84 million, PS4 at 71, etc. ...the PS2 outsold all of those at 155 million (PS1 was 102mil)...even accounting for not as many people using those older PS2/PS1's as it's an older system...there's still a HUGE market for a good quality PS1/2 wireless controller (hell, even a dongle to have the PS3/PS4 controller work on a PS1/PS2 would be AMAZING!). The best PS2 wireless controller I've been able to find (tried MANY brands) is a cheap no-name ("Dunop"?) brand from China for ~$15 which is less than ideal (and when used on my PS1, it disables the memory card in slot 1 somehow! ...plus it's only in black color and PS1 were always gray). I settled on that because it's half-way decent...but I know a lot of people will settle for nothing less than near-perfect so I still think there's a HUGE market for something like this.

    Sega Genesis, yeah, at barely 31 million might not be cost effective...Sega Master System...probably not. BUT, us retro gamers are some rabid beasts and I can see $100 being no sweat for a GOOD quality wireless controller for some systems like these. I would certainly pay that much (even to have my existing 6-button Sega Genesis retrofitted with a bluetooth receiver and plug-in dongle - even in a DIY kit with some simple soldering - I would jump on that as would a lot of people I know).

  12. #12
    Crazed MVS Addict
    Capitalistix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Florida

    Posts
    147
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    There's still no QUALITY wireless solutions for Sega Master System, Sega Genesis, Playstation 1 - just to mention a few (there are MANY other systems as well) I haven't been able to find a decent solution for those which is good enough quality to actually play with for extended periods of time, and pretty closely mimics the look of the original controller(s) -- looking near-identical is very important as this is all about nostalgia for me (and playing the system on the controller it was designed for).

    Even the original Xbox has no good wireless solution... The 'best' choice for that is the Logitech ones which I've bought 6x of those off eBay in the past year - which don't look like the original controller exactly FYI - and it took me 6x tries to find ONE which wasn't all jacked up and had decently working buttons - and that 6th one had to be bought brand new in sealed box and was expensive (thankfully it worked much better than the other 5).

    I've discounted any of the original IR solutions as those literally need a funky ~3x6" brick plugged into the front of the console, and need unobstructed line-of sight to work (and commonly don't work very well in my experience back in the day even when they were brand new).

    I've even reached out to the couple custom PCB (DIY kits) solutions I've found and all of those seem to be limited runs which are out of production (or at least I have been unable to reach the guys who designed them over PM, Website, or Email), and were usually around $150 per controller all said and done (which I would think about paying...but no pre-built solutions either). I started a topic all about wireless controller options for some of these systems on Shmups and it seems like there's nothing that would fit my requirements which is sad.
    You seem to get me, although I can't vouch for the 8bitdo controller someone mentioned earlier that I didnt know had adpaters, I will say that for Genesis at least, you may want to give Sega's official wireless IR "Arcade" pad a try. Yeah it has a large IR dongle, but in my experience it doesnt have to be pointed exactly at the console, I can comfortably sit like normal and it still gets connection so after a while I dont even notice it's there. Now in case I move or whatever it may break line of sight temporarily so I do make it a point to only use it for non exacting games (i.e. no fighters, tough platformers, only RPGs etc.) but still, I feel the same way you do about many things and this controller's benefit to me over the years has far outweighed its cost

  13. #13
    Crazed MVS Addict
    Capitalistix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Florida

    Posts
    147
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    8BitDo I'm assuming isn't loosing money - I wonder how many NES/SNES controllers they sell compared to the ones made for the NES/SNES Classic. I don't know how large of a company they are but I know stores like BestBuy and WalMart were selling their products at least...

    If you compare the sales of the Xbox 360 at 84 million, and PS3 at 84 million, PS4 at 71, etc. ...the PS2 outsold all of those at 155 million (PS1 was 102mil)...even accounting for not as many people using those older PS2/PS1's as it's an older system...there's still a HUGE market for a good quality PS1/2 wireless controller (hell, even a dongle to have the PS3/PS4 controller work on a PS1/PS2 would be AMAZING!). The best PS2 wireless controller I've been able to find (tried MANY brands) is a cheap no-name ("Dunop"?) brand from China for ~$15 which is less than ideal (and when used on my PS1, it disables the memory card in slot 1 somehow! ...plus it's only in black color and PS1 were always gray). I settled on that because it's half-way decent...but I know a lot of people will settle for nothing less than near-perfect so I still think there's a HUGE market for something like this.

    Sega Genesis, yeah, at barely 31 million might not be cost effective...Sega Master System...probably not. BUT, us retro gamers are some rabid beasts and I can see $100 being no sweat for a GOOD quality wireless controller for some systems like these. I would certainly pay that much (even to have my existing 6-button Sega Genesis retrofitted with a bluetooth receiver and plug-in dongle - even in a DIY kit with some simple soldering - I would jump on that as would a lot of people I know).
    Yes, this.

  14. #14
    Crazed MVS Addict
    CZroe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Newnan, GA, USA

    Posts
    149
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    8BitDo I'm assuming isn't loosing money - I wonder how many NES/SNES controllers they sell compared to the ones made for the NES/SNES Classic. I don't know how large of a company they are but I know stores like BestBuy and WalMart were selling their products at least...

    If you compare the sales of the Xbox 360 at 84 million, and PS3 at 84 million, PS4 at 71, etc. ...the PS2 outsold all of those at 155 million (PS1 was 102mil)...even accounting for not as many people using those older PS2/PS1's as it's an older system...there's still a HUGE market for a good quality PS1/2 wireless controller (hell, even a dongle to have the PS3/PS4 controller work on a PS1/PS2 would be AMAZING!). The best PS2 wireless controller I've been able to find (tried MANY brands) is a cheap no-name ("Dunop"?) brand from China for ~$15 which is less than ideal (and when used on my PS1, it disables the memory card in slot 1 somehow! ...plus it's only in black color and PS1 were always gray). I settled on that because it's half-way decent...but I know a lot of people will settle for nothing less than near-perfect so I still think there's a HUGE market for something like this.

    Sega Genesis, yeah, at barely 31 million might not be cost effective...Sega Master System...probably not. BUT, us retro gamers are some rabid beasts and I can see $100 being no sweat for a GOOD quality wireless controller for some systems like these. I would certainly pay that much (even to have my existing 6-button Sega Genesis retrofitted with a bluetooth receiver and plug-in dongle - even in a DIY kit with some simple soldering - I would jump on that as would a lot of people I know).
    I think they sell a lot more Classic Edition dongles than you might realize. First, the Classic Edition consoles all use the same Wii Remote accessory port so it works with both. Second, their original controllers are super-short. Third, they also work with the Wii, which has something like 150 million sales and the controllers are used all over the place. The potential user base vastly eclipses the Sega Saturn.

    I’d love to see one for Sega Saturn too but it probably ain’t happenin’. I have all of their Retro Receivers and several of their controllers and they are surprisingly well made. Love ‘em!
    -El Duderino (not into the whole "brevity" thing)

  15. #15
    Crossed Swords Squire

    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Levittown, PA

    Posts
    191
    Quote Originally Posted by CZroe View Post
    I’d love to see one for Sega Saturn too but it probably ain’t happenin’. I have all of their Retro Receivers and several of their controllers and they are surprisingly well made. Love ‘em!
    In case anybody missed it: Genesis, Saturn, and Dreamcast wireless controllers are being released they say:

    http://segabits.com/blog/2018/01/10/...ries-revealed/


    Forum post discussing them here:

    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...rn-controllers

  16. #16
    Crazed MVS Addict
    CZroe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Newnan, GA, USA

    Posts
    149
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    In case anybody missed it: Genesis, Saturn, and Dreamcast wireless controllers are being released they say:

    http://segabits.com/blog/2018/01/10/...ries-revealed/


    Forum post discussing them here:

    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...rn-controllers
    Thanks! Definitely going to check this out. Over the years I’ve ended up with about 6 Saturns and I don’t even have 5 regular controllers. Felt really weird bringing another back from Japan last June but I couldn’t turn down a white Saturn for $7!

    EDIT: Uh-oh. They’re from RetroBit? I’m a bit more suspicious. After ignoring their QA inspection/warranty sticker on my RetroBit NES dogbone controller I found inside that they had the nerve to copy Nintendo’s controller cord winding posts... and then not even use them. The cord was sliding in and out of the controller and putting stress directly on the soldered connections. Ridiculous! It would also freeze my consoles when hot-plugging and the wires were ridiculously thin. The resulting cable was so thin that the rounded hole on the controller (supposed to serve as strain relief) was much too big. I then fixed a broken RetroBit Retro Trio for a fleamarket vendor and found both SNES controllers had the same exact flaw (thin, incorrectly-routed wires) AND they neglected to mold half of the controller correctly for holding the L & R button pivots. I found another boxed RetroBit dogbone controller for pennies at a fleamarket and it didn’t have the same problem with the cord, so it seems that they finally fixed it. They have since worked with 8bitdo on the N64-style Bluetooth controller, which I haven’t tried. That, along with their dogbone improvements, has me cautiously optimistic.
    Last edited by CZroe; 01-30-2018 at 09:22 AM.
    -El Duderino (not into the whole "brevity" thing)

  17. #17
    Whilst Drunk.
    I Found God.
    Booze = Bad.
    pixeljunkie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    in a glass of Orval

    Posts
    5,437
    I do wish there was an 8bitdo adapter for PC Engine - but at least the wireless controllers released for those back when are actually still pretty decent, even with the whole "line-of-sight" thing.

    m7-s1Dx4bNS0DMd3NEy4Stw.jpg
    Last edited by pixeljunkie; 01-30-2018 at 10:07 AM.

  18. #18
    Crossed Swords Squire

    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Levittown, PA

    Posts
    191
    Quote Originally Posted by CZroe View Post
    They have since worked with 8bitdo on the N64-style Bluetooth controller, which I haven’t tried. That, along with their dogbone improvements, has me cautiously optimistic.
    I really haven't been following this, but wasn't the N64 controller cancelled or discontinued or something? Think it might have had some problems...which if RetroBit's other products have been crappy maybe that had something to do with it? (totally guessing here)

    I'm also skeptical. I love the 8BitDo products for example (besides hating Bluetooth connectivity issues), but nearly every other non-official brand controller I've ever used has had some major drawbacks...so I'll hold my breath until the reviews start coming in, then I'll pick these up if they're good. Otherwise having to use a cord isn't the end of the world.

  19. #19
    Crazed MVS Addict
    CZroe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Newnan, GA, USA

    Posts
    149
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochartaigh View Post
    I really haven't been following this, but wasn't the N64 controller cancelled or discontinued or something? Think it might have had some problems...which if RetroBit's other products have been crappy maybe that had something to do with it? (totally guessing here)

    I'm also skeptical. I love the 8BitDo products for example (besides hating Bluetooth connectivity issues), but nearly every other non-official brand controller I've ever used has had some major drawbacks...so I'll hold my breath until the reviews start coming in, then I'll pick these up if they're good. Otherwise having to use a cord isn't the end of the world.
    A lot of their controllers have been discontinued and replaced with newer versions that don’t look as close to Nintendo’s originals. They were also renamed, despite being discontinued. “NES30” became “N30,” for example. It seems that they are suddenly concerned about trademarks and infringing designs.

    I was at Microcenter yesterday and they still had the 8bitdo NES30 Arcade Stick and 8bitdo + RetroBit N64 BT controller.

    The quality of their NES30 is better than Nintendo’s own NES Classic Edition where Nintendo made the nub beneath the D-pad too small, allowing constant unintended diagonals (particularly frustrating example that keeps happening: Kirby floats when I’m trying to double-tap to run). That said, 8bitdo made a similar error on the recent 2.4GHz non-BT and the BT versions made to match the Super Nt. Swapping the SNES D-pad in definitely helps. Raising a bit more with tape helps more. Some people cover the inner contact on each direction with tape (enough contacts remain to function) in order to solve it without an original part. The replica part does look nearly identical but the slight size difference on the pivot nub really hurts it.

    Here’s my video demonstrating the D-pad swap with my brother playing Tetris Attack/Panel de Pon:
    https://youtu.be/gO9w1uzgZvI

    All that said, I still heartily recommend them. Most people are not particular enough to ever notice and the utility of BT adds enough to make the extra effort worth it, IMO. This is coming from someone who has 11 essentially unused/original SNES pads and knows what they should feel like (1 SFC, 10 SNES).

    I think it’s fair to say that we are really picky about our D-pads too, same as you. Even the officially licensed SNES AsciiPad was garbage for Tetris Attack despite seeming to us original parts!
    -El Duderino (not into the whole "brevity" thing)

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •