Why do people talk shit about the Nintendo 64?

joe8 said:

No, component and RGB are where it's at (for the N64 and other classic consoles). But I would agree that just about any video connection is better than composite. And you should play an N64 on a PVM, if possible.

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A friend had an RGB modded N64. Good quality cable on a 20 inch PVM. I was hard pressed to see a noticeable improvement on that console between S-Video and RGB.

I don't understand why the PlayStation gets so much love. There are some decent niche games, but the rest is few and far between.


People love to talk shit about Nintendo systems. But at my yard sale, it is the Nintendo systems and games that people want. Playstation/Xbox shit I can't move for shit.


Conversely, we target Nintendo systems when doing our picking. If a yard sale lists N64, we hit that early. There is a good chance that there will be some good games. If they list Playstation/Xbox, chances are it it is all crap shooters and sports games.

it's blurry no matter which video output you use.
It was the nature of the anti aliasing techniques used with N64 hardware.

It wasn't until Perfect Dark when they learned to tune it way down. That's why that game looks so much better than anything on the console.
There are also Game Shark hacks to turn it off now. It's looks tolerable.

I can kinda see where they were going with the N64 controller. Probably didn't want to shift too much focus towards one or the other between the d-pad and the analog stick. Would've been a lot better if the analog stick wasn't poorly designed to where they wore down so much.

Sony's Dualshock was even closer to that idea, but I'm still not a fan of the segmented d-pad.

Going back and playing the N64 is just... It kinda hurts. Playing Banjo Kazooie on there again after being used to the Xbox 360 version is painful. Framerate dips everywhere.

The N64 controller works great for games designed for the system.

But games that were ported from PC or other systems usually didn't take advantage of the controller features.

LoneSage said:

take me back to 2000 and slumber parties and 4-player mario kart 64 and mario party. yeah. good times back then. probably not now. or what do i know. maybe i'm just not a fun guy and they would still be fun if we still had slumber parties when we're 30 years old. or maybe when we're 30 they're not slumber parties anymore but orgies. at which point no one plays mario kart. so what do i know

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I'm no expert but I reckon the controller could be interesting, only one way to be a pioneer I guess.

I grew up with the N64 and sure it was fuckin grand at the time, goldeneye was the tits and yeah we loved the thing. But then I saw my friend who had the PS1 and went spent more time at his joint than our own. So in saying that I shouldn't lay shit on it right? wrong, it's a piece of crap that captivated me as a kid just like jingling keys did as a baby.

This reminds me I need to figure out how to use my GameShark to deactivate the AA in N64 games for improved clarity and fps. The wizards at ASSEMBLer figured it out a while back.

norton9478 said:

I don't understand why the PlayStation gets so much love...

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Dude, We're in a forum for a 2d Arcade Games. N64 can't do 2d for shit. Of course the peanut gallery is going to shit on it. PSX had some great 2d fighters and RPGs. The peanut gallery here will prefer it.

From a casual market Nintendo sells. Even the shittiest system had good 1st party games. I personally don't care to play the N64 and think the Rose Colored Glasses is the best analogy describing the players, but everybody started w/ something.

norton9478 said:

People love to talk shit about Nintendo systems. But at my yard sale, it is the Nintendo systems and games that people want. Playstation/Xbox shit I can't move for shit.

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What the hell are you talking about? People love talking shit about Nintendo Systems lol? Almost every other Nintendo System is praised. Nintendo Systems are the most popular systems. People only like to talk shit about the N64 because it's not that good.

And at Yard Sales people like buying Nintendo Stuff because it's more flippable. Nintendo Games, even if they suck, sell well.

Thierry Henry said:

A friend had an RGB modded N64. Good quality cable on a 20 inch PVM. I was hard pressed to see a noticeable improvement on that console between S-Video and RGB.

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Same Here. I purchased a RGB Modded N64 and was playing Via Scart on a PVM and although it did clean up the image a little it doesn't get rid of that filter. I hear the HDMI mod does a better job but why even bother.

Thierry Henry said:

A friend had an RGB modded N64. Good quality cable on a 20 inch PVM. I was hard pressed to see a noticeable improvement on that console between S-Video and RGB.

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Ideally, that's the case with any console outputting ~320 pixels per line. That's a dot-clock of around 6MHz, meaning you can only have patterns in the video signal of 3MHz. So, with the only limitation being the 3.58MHz real-valued chroma carrier, you're not losing anything fundamental in s-video.

(DVD video, for example, is 720 pixels wide, which is why they pushed for component output there.)

Now, of course, this assumes that you've got a good color video encoder in the console/converter and a good decoder in the TV/monitor.

In these pictures, I can see what people mean by the "vaseline" effect, but on a real N64 on a CRT over S-Video, I can't see it. It just looks crisp like anything else on a CRT.

I think it helps that I use a newer-made N64, a Japanese red funtastic system. Apparently those have less hardware-driven anti-aliasing.

HeavyMachineGun said:

In these pictures, I can see what people mean by the "vaseline" effect, but on a real N64 on a CRT over S-Video, I can't see it. It just looks crisp like anything else on a CRT.

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You got on those Rose Colored Glasses on bro. That AA shows up on a CRT via Svideo as well. I wouldn't subject my eyes to that mess on the screen, Might go blind.

Seeing N64 games in motion with the choppy frame rates doesn't help either.

Or I'm just one of those people who doesn't readily notice blurriness, or I don't let it bother me.

I'm gonna try out the Smash 64 GS code for blur removal anyway. My funtastic N64 will still have its reduced hardware filter though. Maybe it improves the image, maybe not.

Then you have examples like this where the end result is essentially a Nintendo DS game. It makes the game look different, but I don't know if it's actually better. I never could stand the jagged edges and massive pixels in PSX games.

HeavyMachineGun said:

Or I'm just one of those people who doesn't readily notice blurriness, or I don't let it bother me.

I'm gonna try out the Smash 64 GS code for blur removal anyway. My funtastic N64 will still have its reduced hardware filter though. Maybe it improves the image, maybe not.

Then you have examples like this where the end result is essentially a Nintendo DS game. It makes the game look different, but I don't know if it's actually better. I never could stand the jagged edges and massive pixels in PSX games.

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I can't see the video. Yea, I prefer unfiltered pixels over filtered any day. Games like 3rd Strike for example that had a Filter option, I always turn off. I don't mind the jagged edges. I in fact embrace them.

But 3rd Strike is a 2D game, unfiltered makes sense. 3D has jagged edges and in the case of PSX/Saturn, very low res textures that have to get stretched to insane sizes resulting in essentially 3D NES games. Those games tend to look better with at least some level of smoothing, not much. When the 3dfx Voodoo graphics card was launched, it was a massive leap in technology and it featured some anti-aliasing.

HeavyMachineGun said:

But 3rd Strike is a 2D game, unfiltered makes sense. 3D has jagged edges and in the case of PSX/Saturn, very low res textures that have to get stretched to insane sizes resulting in essentially 3D NES games. Those games tend to look better with at least some level of smoothing, not much. When the 3dfx Voodoo graphics card was launched, it was a massive leap in technology and it featured some anti-aliasing.

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But Even Games Like Resident Evil or Tekken 3, I prefer the Jagged Pixels over the Smooth Blurry 3d one's on N64 Games.

I can't imagine playing an N64 game like Ocarina of Time with 100% unfiltered wall textures. It would look like a bad PC game hack.

Be careful doing those GS cheats, I was in the middle of doing mine and accidentally semi bricked it. The last revision is generally considered the best but you probably know all this.

I Digress though, need to get around to doing it my self too again :P

They don't have any spine text on the carts. Mistake #1

norton9478 said:

I don't understand why the PlayStation gets so much love. There are some decent niche games, but the rest is few and far between.


People love to talk shit about Nintendo systems. But at my yard sale, it is the Nintendo systems and games that people want. Playstation/Xbox shit I can't move for shit.


Conversely, we target Nintendo systems when doing our picking. If a yard sale lists N64, we hit that early. There is a good chance that there will be some good games. If they list Playstation/Xbox, chances are it it is all crap shooters and sports games.

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Let's face it...much of that generation (N64, PS1, Saturn) has not aged well...at all.

To me it's no different than early 2D systems, like the 2600. They're just not playable. There's a vast difference between 2600 Pitfall and Super Mario World. The same goes for early 3D...so much of it is now total shit.

With that said, during the mid/late 1990's, there was no better choice for a primary gaming system than the PS1. Pushing aside the very few amazing multi-player games the N64 had (Mario Kart, Party, Golf, Tennis, or Goldeneye), the PS1 offered everything the N64 had...and then so much more. You wanted 2D game platformers, Role Playing, Sim, Sport, Arcade ports, FPS, racing sims, puzzle.....I could go on and on, but they were all largely represented on the PS1. All joking aside, the PS1 was the most diverse and useful gaming system made before the PS2 came along and did it again...but better. I can't comprehend how anyone would ever refer to the system as being overrated.



...as for the N64, it's simple, you either love it or you don't. Me, I saw the NES as a god-like console when it was current, then the SNES came out it was everything the NES was...but better. It blew me away in terms of how high quality it was. Armed with those expectations, I had beyond high hopes for the N64 and it let me (and many others) down in a monumental way. I could have lived with the awkward controller, the blurry over use of anti-aliasing, and even the WAY over priced cart format had the system actually offered a diverse library of games, but it did not. When 99% of the pro N64 comments include the same 4-5 games...that's sad.

Geekman1222 said:

Be careful doing those GS cheats, I was in the middle of doing mine and accidentally semi bricked it. The last revision is generally considered the best but you probably know all this.

I Digress though, need to get around to doing it my self too again :P

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If my Gameshark bricks, I can just stack it on top of a working Gameshark Pro (sparkly v3.2) and reflash them using a parallel cable and the old Gameshark PC software.

IIRC, N64 Everdrives also support games that have AA-removal patches, as well as GS codes. I'll have to give it a try later on and look at the results myself.

As much as I'd love to get the UltraHDMI board installed, I just can't justify spending that much on a Nintendo 64.

Here are those Everdrive patches.

http://n64.poregon.com/shared/

HeavyMachineGun said:

Here are those Everdrive patches.

http://n64.poregon.com/shared/

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Awesome. Thanks!

On a sidenote, just discovered that Viletim's N64RGB boards support AA-removal. Now I'm kinda torn between getting my NS1 modded with the simpler RGB mod, or my NS2 with the N64RGB board.

Since my N64 kiosk (the big steel one) doesn't have the original TV, I plan to RGB mod it and upscale it to a VGA monitor. Should I still disable the AA?