White nationalists marching on UVa...

lithy said:

As for weapons on campus. Meh, that doesn't really garner any attention from me. Mass shootings are kinda passe, its all about bombing soft targets now.

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I disagree strongly on this - the weapons are definitely important. They clearly felt the need to bring them - why? They're not hunting or shooting targets. Certainly they knew that there would be a police presence - this isn't out in the woods somewhere. A rifle in a crowd surrounded by cops is emphatically not appropriate for self-defense. They've brought them either for murder, intimidation, or both. If there was any doubt: that's not okay.

(The campus location has nothing to do with it, assuming that campus doesn't prohibit them.)

lithy said:

You'll have to excuse me if I'm a little skeptical and painted it as 'just this past weekend'. The internet outrage kind of ebbs and flows. Just last week we were all going to die in a nuclear holocaust remember?

Serious question though, does support from the KKK/Stormfront/David Duke/etc. immediately invalidate a candidate for you? Or does it depend on how they react to the endorsement? I know Trump was pretty fucking terrible at distancing himself from those groups. I personally think Bannon and the other sidekicks to the POTUS are just power-fiends, I don't necessarily they believe any of that stuff only insofar as it helps they to consolidate a base.

As for weapons on campus. Meh, that doesn't really garner any attention from me. Mass shootings are kinda passe, its all about bombing soft targets now.

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Considering Gorka's euro nazi ties, it does not mollify my skepticism lf Trump's administration being something earnest.

SpamYouToDeath said:

I disagree strongly on this - the weapons are definitely important. They clearly felt the need to bring them - why? They're not hunting or shooting targets. Certainly they knew that there would be a police presence - this isn't out in the woods somewhere. A rifle in a crowd surrounded by cops is emphatically not appropriate for self-defense. They've brought them either for murder, intimidation, or both. If there was any doubt: that's not okay.

(The campus location has nothing to do with it, assuming that campus doesn't prohibit them.)

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Let's call a spade a spade here...none of those people heading to a rally of that nature are even remotely interested in peaceful protest. Here's a nice little rundown...are you going to a rally/protest? Are you taking the following:

Knife/gun
Mace
Bludgeoning tool
Face mask of any kind
Goggles
Shield
A container of shit/piss
Other objects for throwing


...I can go on and on but you get my point. Not a one of them showing up in semi riot gear and looking for expressing their voice only, they're looking for a fight.

I guess this is what gets me about the police in these situations. Why someone showing up with protection gear, weapons, bottles of piss/etc aren't turned away is beyond me.

...and for gods sake...keep these people away from each other. They had the smarts to keep those "God hates fags" nutjobs miles from a soldiers funeral...why can't the do the same with these people who are clearly up to no good?

The unmasking of these racist fuckwits is amazing. People photographed and identified a former klansman who went to jail for plotting bomb attacks. This wasn't an assembly. It was a CLE course in terror.

“I own a house in Charlottesville. Does anyone know I own a house in Charlottesville? Oh boy, it’s in Charlottesville, you’ll see,” Trump said. “It is the winery. I know a lot about Charlottesville. Charlottesville is a great place that’s been very badly hurt over the past couple of days. I own actually one of the largest wineries in the United States. It’s in Charlottesville.”

The winery is not actually one of the largest in the United States and is also not actually owned or operated by Trump, Mother Jones reports.

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lachlan said:

That nutjob ramming people.. the guy was only 20 and now his life is fucked. What a waste.

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Yeah, poor guy.

For real though what happened with that helicopter crash

I am about to tear a couple of you a new fuck hole tomorrow morning when I'm not drunk.

You know who you are.

Edit : no its just you smokehouse. The boys open carrying ar15s were on which side? I believe in open carry. I live in wyoming motherfucker. But WHICH SIDE WAS STRAIGHT OPEN CARRYING ASSAULT WEAPONS TO BEGIN WITH. You talk about riot gear, batons, bricks, whatever the fuck. You're deluded as FUCK. If any of you require more eloquent explanation I'll provide it tomorrow. Call me out, please. If I felt like it I could legitimately join the "sons of the confederacy " club or group or whatever they call themselves, on pedigree, faggots.

Poppy said:

I am about to tear a couple of you a new fuck hole tomorrow morning when I'm not drunk.

You know who you are.

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i like lithy but he's posting some retarded shit uitb

lithy i still wanna drink with u one day

LoneSage said:

i like lithy but he's posting some retarded shit uitb

lithy i still wanna drink with u one day

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Pfft... tell me about it...

I have no beef in this episode... I just troll as carefully as I can when it concerns stuff like this...

You guys can tell me to stop interfering anytime ya' like tbh... I'm old, ugly and wise enough to know when to shut up...

xROTx

Poppy said:

I am about to tear a couple of you a new fuck hole tomorrow morning when I'm not drunk.

You know who you are.

Edit : no its just you smokehouse. The boys open carrying ar15s were on which side? I believe in open carry. I live in wyoming motherfucker. But WHICH SIDE WAS STRAIGHT OPEN CARRYING ASSAULT WEAPONS TO BEGIN WITH. You talk about riot gear, batons, bricks, whatever the fuck. You're deluded as FUCK. If any of you require more eloquent explanation I'll provide it tomorrow. Call me out, please. If I felt like it I could legitimately join the "sons of the confederacy " club or group or whatever they call themselves, on pedigree, faggots.

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*yawn*

Oh look, yet another time you're calling me out, color me surprised.

I'm not pointing out one specific group, and I'm not pointing out one specific incident.

...and what's this?



Whoops...looks like the far right isn't the only ones showing up with firearms to some of these peaceful "gatherings". (and why you chose to bring open carry into this is beyond me...you know my stance on firearm rights.) With that said, there's a time and a place. A powder keg riot at any second event is not exactly the brightest place to exercise your 2A rights. I'm pointing out people, on any side, that are showing up looking to start a riot...which is wrong no matter how you look at it.


With that said...tear into me, I'm sure you'll find some way to once again bitch about whatever I have to say, you always do.

fakeXsound said:

Yeah, poor guy.

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smokehouse said:

*yawn*

Oh look, yet another time you're calling me out, color me surprised.

I'm not pointing out one specific group, and I'm not pointing out one specific incident.

...and what's this?

Whoops...looks like the far right isn't the only ones showing up with firearms to some of these peaceful "gatherings". (and why you chose to bring open carry into this is beyond me...you know my stance on firearm rights.) With that said, there's a time and a place. A powder keg riot at any second event is not exactly the brightest place to exercise your 2A rights. I'm pointing out people, on any side, that are showing up looking to start a riot...which is wrong no matter how you look at it.


With that said...tear into me, I'm sure you'll find some way to once again bitch about whatever I have to say, you always do.

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Did you get that off infowars?

https://www.google.com/search?tbs=s...j7zNgcZ6OXKXcxLN9Lvqyp5njnULZqKT1_1mTzg&hl=en

The picture you posted was from an anti-ICE protest in Arizona back in February.

http://bigleaguepolitics.com/snowfl...litia-release-hilarious-training-day-footage/

using the 2nd to protect their friends from improper deportation procedures is probably the best use of the 2nd in recent memory.

Jonathan - you're better than this. Don't go to alex jones to form your opinions. When you see an image or meme, google research it.

SpamYouToDeath said:

I disagree strongly on this - the weapons are definitely important. They clearly felt the need to bring them - why? They're not hunting or shooting targets. Certainly they knew that there would be a police presence - this isn't out in the woods somewhere. A rifle in a crowd surrounded by cops is emphatically not appropriate for self-defense. They've brought them either for murder, intimidation, or both. If there was any doubt: that's not okay.

(The campus location has nothing to do with it, assuming that campus doesn't prohibit them.)

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I guess it is just because I know there is a lot of overlap between those groups and far-right militia/2A groups. Unless they showed up saying, we are here to shoot blacks and jews I just don't see simply carrying a weapon as actionable threat. I didn't see anything in the news, were there any reports of gunshots? All I saw was fights and mob scuffles.

Poppy said:

I am about to tear a couple of you a new fuck hole tomorrow morning when I'm not drunk.

You know who you are.

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Damn, I thought I was going to get included, but I guess it's just smoke. I was so ready.

LoneSage said:

i like lithy but he's posting some retarded shit uitb

lithy i still wanna drink with u one day

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Meet up in DPRK?

lithy said:

Serious question though, does support from the KKK/Stormfront/David Duke/etc. immediately invalidate a candidate for you? Or does it depend on how they react to the endorsement? I know Trump was pretty fucking terrible at distancing himself from those groups. I personally think Bannon and the other sidekicks to the POTUS are just power-fiends, I don't necessarily they believe any of that stuff only insofar as it helps they to consolidate a base..

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I hate to mention this, but there is a historical precedent of people just dismissing all of that crazy rhetoric and cow towing is just part of a power grab. Only to be shocked later.

Evil Wasabi said:

Did you get that off infowars?

https://www.google.com/search?tbs=s...j7zNgcZ6OXKXcxLN9Lvqyp5njnULZqKT1_1mTzg&hl=en

The picture you posted was from an anti-ICE protest in Arizona back in February.

http://bigleaguepolitics.com/snowfl...litia-release-hilarious-training-day-footage/

using the 2nd to protect their friends from improper deportation procedures is probably the best use of the 2nd in recent memory.

Jonathan - you're better than this. Don't go to alex jones to form your opinions. When you see an image or meme, google research it.

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I need to keep a cooler head here...sorry.

The only point that I'm trying to make is that regardless of "side", people are showing up to these events looking for trouble. It really does not matter what the John Brown fellas were looking to do, I'm saying they're poking the skunk, and they aren't "alt-right". I was trying to point out that this is going on regardless of their stance, it isn't a right-wing exclusive.

I cannot say it enough, I'm all for protesting and letting your voice be heard. Intentionally showing up looking for a fight is something different.

smokehouse said:

...and what's this?

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Wow, is that Abu Obi Wan in the middle ?
The force is strong with this group !

It seems like a lot of people chastising these folks for confronting Nazis are the same folks that justify gun ownership with "If only the people of Germany had stood up to the Nazis".

lithy said:

I guess it is just because I know there is a lot of overlap between those groups and far-right militia/2A groups. Unless they showed up saying, we are here to shoot blacks and jews I just don't see simply carrying a weapon as actionable threat. I didn't see anything in the news, were there any reports of gunshots? All I saw was fights and mob scuffles.

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There are a couple of considerations that you're conveniently leaving out.

Bringing a firearm to a fight will not end well if that gun goes off. If the shooter invokes SYG, they will have the burden of proving that to a jury of their peers.

The racists knew that their protest was going to be a fight. If they protested unarmed, they would have been more effective.

We have seen foreign policy use the technique of the slipknot to coax an enemy into the first attack. Fighting words is a murky "i know it when I hear it" exception of the first amendment, and that's probably what the racists were banking on in Va.

Tom Garrett Jr, Va congressman for the Charlottesville district, refused to meet the constituents in his district about the ACA repeal, but smiled for the camera when taking a picture with the white supremacists.

Evil Wasabi said:

It means you're what is known as a snowflake.

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I looked it up on UrbanDictionary and it is either Wild Zoo Animals or some reference to a Gary Busey movie.

Tripredacus said:

What does WZA mean?

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Poppy said:

That you dont immediately know means you are a noob first of all. But the word itself means a member who is unbelievably full of shit, a verbose and intellectually "highbrow" uncontrollable spewing shit fountain.

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That's weird, we just call em poppy

Evil Wasabi said:

There are a couple of considerations that you're conveniently leaving out.

Bringing a firearm to a fight will not end well if that gun goes off. If the shooter invokes SYG, they will have the burden of proving that to a jury of their peers.

The racists knew that their protest was going to be a fight. If they protested unarmed, they would have been more effective.

We have seen foreign policy use the technique of the slipknot to coax an enemy into the first attack. Fighting words is a murky "i know it when I hear it" exception of the first amendment, and that's probably what the racists were banking on in Va.

Tom Garrett Jr, Va congressman for the Charlottesville district, refused to meet the constituents in his district about the ACA repeal, but smiled for the camera when taking a picture with the white supremacists.

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Isn't that exactly why the principle of non-violence for moral causes works though? Proving stand your ground if both sides were fighting becomes a lot easier. If you show up to counter protest a trolling, in your face, repugnant group and get in a fight with them, don't they basically win? They were the ones preaching hate and intolerance and you show up to shut down something you don't agree with by what amounts to force.

It is similar to why I feel like Black Lives Matter can't get the traction they want, because the victims often have previous criminal records or were in the commission of a crime at the time. I know there are many reasons for this, many of which I agree are causing a disproportionate effect of policing in black neighborhoods, but until they get a truly unimpeachable victim, there can always be that question in people's minds.

Same for this. If the left (for lack of a better term?) show up to counter protest a hate group and then cause a fight/riot/whatever, that message is not going to get through to a lot of people sitting at home on their couch. They lose their message to a headline of 'Groups Clash in Charlottesville'.

I'm not sure if I'm even disagreeing with anything you said above, except for Garrett, I don't know anything about that to comment on it. All I know is that we have seen this trick before with Westboro, these groups want this reaction, so in giving it to them, they're controlling the message more than if everyone literally sat home and said 'whatevs' from their couch as a few hundred half-braindead skinheads spent an hour or two of their Saturday afternoon milling around a college campus.

Condemning BLM because their members or victims had priors falls directly into the InfoWars narrative that ignores the fact that we have people like Jeff Sessions in place specifically to direct law enforcement to focus on the black districts that the GOP needs to disenfranchise.

That may be true, but it doesn't mean a group (as cited Black Lives Matter as an example) then can ignore that "common" circumstance entirely. I don't think the majority thinks that Black Lives Matter can't get what they want because, in the past, they have propped up criminals as heroes or martyrs. When that argument is brought up, it is faced with backlash, rather than a response such as "yeah we are trying to work on that and here are some other things we are doing." However, even this isn't (seen as being) true and it is the fault of media reporting. People in that movement (at least in this area) do have those discussions and are not so quick to react to such statements, nor shift away and then go blame something else. The real leaders of these groups are well aware of the crime issue, the education issue, and whatever else because they are living in those communities and do try to make things work out.

And those leaders are not the ones who get the retweets, post articles on Buzzfeed and "The Root" or end up on the TV news shows.

A lot of the stress people seem to be having over these issues is due to blowhards on the internet.

Tripredacus said:

That may be true, but it doesn't mean a group (as cited Black Lives Matter as an example) then can ignore that "common" circumstance entirely. I don't think the majority thinks that Black Lives Matter can't get what they want because, in the past, they have propped up criminals as heroes or martyrs. When that argument is brought up, it is faced with backlash, rather than a response such as "yeah we are trying to work on that and here are some other things we are doing." However, even this isn't (seen as being) true and it is the fault of media reporting. People in that movement (at least in this area) do have those discussions and are not so quick to react to such statements, nor shift away and then go blame something else. The real leaders of these groups are well aware of the crime issue, the education issue, and whatever else because they are living in those communities and do try to make things work out.

And those leaders are not the ones who get the retweets, post articles on Buzzfeed and "The Root" or end up on the TV news shows.

A lot of the stress people seem to be having over these issues is due to blowhards on the internet.

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I blame a vast majority of that on the media, and social media.

The people out there that really are working for the good of others that are gaining ground against negative social issues do not make for good headlines or video clips. The social masses do not see these people, they often see the violent, radical problem causers out...well...causing problems. Sadly, these people do not make up the majority of most positive social change groups, not by a long shot.

We're in a real social mess at the moment.