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Thread: Konami Lethal Enforcers JAMMA PCB

  1. #1
    Zero's Tailor

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    Konami Lethal Enforcers JAMMA PCB

    Hi All,
    I have a Konami Lethal Enforcers JAMMA PCB incoming, was wondering if you can help me out with 2 questions:
    1) does it require -5V?
    2) I would require two light guns - can anyone point me in the direction of guns which would be compatible with this PCB? Plug and play solutions allowing them to be directly plugged into the connectors on the board are preferred but anything that can be made to work with some simple rewiring at the connector end is also fine.

    Sound wise, from what I read up it gives mono off the JAMMA edge and stereo via a connector on the PCB so this should be fine, subject to whether it requires the -5V for it to work.

    If there is anything else I should know or any standard maintenance needed to be done on this board let me know.
    Last edited by MtothaJ; 10-04-2015 at 09:33 AM.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  2. #2
    The Chinese Kid Kid Panda's Avatar
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    Game does not require -5v for sound.

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    If the sound doesn't work it's not because of -5v, its from the konami hybrid sound IC's caps leaking

  4. #4
    Zero's Tailor

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    Quote Originally Posted by PunkicCyborg View Post
    If the sound doesn't work it's not because of -5v, its from the konami hybrid sound IC's caps leaking
    Thanks for your replies and info that there's no need for the -5V with this board. According to the seller sound works fine, still awaiting shipment of the board so can't verify at this moment, however I have read up that the Konami sound section on this is pretty unreliable. Apparently these are pretty difficult to fix up.
    Now I need some info on where the gats be at

    PS. Kind of on topic - found this movie about some guys slinging guns in da hood: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVlbx-2qPrU - at around 45 min they are playing Neo Geo AES - looks like 8 Man
    Last edited by MtothaJ; 10-04-2015 at 11:49 AM.
    Regards, MtothaJ

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    SouthTown StreetSweeper
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    I just picked up this board not to long ago in a lot and thought it would be fun to get a gun for it. If you find some guns update here please, I would love to see what kind of set up you use

  6. #6
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    here's a good one, watch out for the custom sound amp (big black ceramic IC in the corner of the board near the Jamma edge).

    ALL Konami PCB's with ANY version of the custom sound amp (X-men, Xexex had the same sound amp -- Lethal enforcers, metamorphic force, and others had similar amps but different from X-men). I repair more and more of these as the original capacitors used on ALL of them from the 90's ALL leak and erode away at the traces and solder pads on BOTH sides of the amp.

    So the best way to make sure it lasts a long time is (and I highly suggest going to the KLOV forum for info)...

    1) you must remove the sound amp (use nothing but chip quik SMD removal kit as it's the EASIEST way to remove it without damaging ANYTHING--- sorry for all the caps)

    2) then you must remove the capacitors (using two irons or chip quick).. then replace the op-amp (if it's a JRC4558, replace it with an LM358) , the DAC (digital to analog converter) (not sure what this one needs but I'm sure it's all over the place, esp KLOV forum).

    3) and lastly jump any of the 64 pins (with 30 awg KYNAR wire) that have lost connection between their corresponding points (or those that have an ohm reading higher than 1.0 Ohms (supposed to read between 0.5-0.8 ohms).

    4) Then use a nice rustoleum lacquer spray paint to make it look original.

    Sound is one of the most important things in any arcade game, especially the konami games.. so this will help you fix it should it ever go bad, and last a long long time

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTRetro87 View Post
    here's a good one, watch out for the custom sound amp (big black ceramic IC in the corner of the board near the Jamma edge).

    ALL Konami PCB's with ANY version of the custom sound amp (X-men, Xexex had the same sound amp -- Lethal enforcers, metamorphic force, and others had similar amps but different from X-men). I repair more and more of these as the original capacitors used on ALL of them from the 90's ALL leak and erode away at the traces and solder pads on BOTH sides of the amp.

    So the best way to make sure it lasts a long time is (and I highly suggest going to the KLOV forum for info)...

    1) you must remove the sound amp (use nothing but chip quik SMD removal kit as it's the EASIEST way to remove it without damaging ANYTHING--- sorry for all the caps)

    2) then you must remove the capacitors (using two irons or chip quick).. then replace the op-amp (if it's a JRC4558, replace it with an LM358) , the DAC (digital to analog converter) (not sure what this one needs but I'm sure it's all over the place, esp KLOV forum).

    3) and lastly jump any of the 64 pins (with 30 awg KYNAR wire) that have lost connection between their corresponding points (or those that have an ohm reading higher than 1.0 Ohms (supposed to read between 0.5-0.8 ohms).

    4) Then use a nice rustoleum lacquer spray paint to make it look original.

    Sound is one of the most important things in any arcade game, especially the konami games.. so this will help you fix it should it ever go bad, and last a long long time
    If you repair them all the time how come you're not sure on the DAC?

  8. #8
    Captain Dick
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    Probably not sure on the exact DAC on this specific ceramic module, there are some variants of these around.

    "(X-men, Xexex had the same sound amp -- Lethal enforcers, metamorphic force, and others had similar amps but different from X-men)."

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    You dont have to replace the chips on the bottom if they aren't damaged. The last one I did was from a cab and stored upright and the cap juice never made it to the bottom and was fully functional after changing just the caps. I've only had to change op-amp on the bottom

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    Quote Originally Posted by Asure View Post
    Probably not sure on the exact DAC on this specific ceramic module, there are some variants of these around.

    "(X-men, Xexex had the same sound amp -- Lethal enforcers, metamorphic force, and others had similar amps but different from X-men)."

    Fair enough. It's just I've never heard of a need to replace the DAC.

  11. #11
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bar81 View Post
    Fair enough. It's just I've never heard of a need to replace the DAC.

    Well now you have lol. Look, these things honestly don't all last. I've repaired plenty of *X-men* (and personally own 7 boards, 2 are parts board - one 4-player and one 6-player but use their sound module as backups), and all needed DAC's replaced.

    Why? Cause after replacing the caps and jumping corroded traces On top AND underneath that no longer made contact to the module's pins.. And then replaced the op-amp with the sound being restored BUT distorted and cutting in and out, jumped the pins of the op-amp AND the pins of the DAC as well - still no dice. Replaced the DAC, sound restored 100%, 2-hour intro test at default volume and full game played at full... No problems, and no heatsink on the MB3722 getting hot either like they usually do when the sound module (amp/chip whatever you want to call it) isn't working properly because either the traces are gone or IC's are faulty

    The only one that has no issues so far (knock on wood) are the custom ASIC's. Hopefully they don't end up like CPS1 C board custom chips...

    So there you have it folks. If the DAC's were to have been believed to never go bad... Then people would most likely trash their game, like it or not
    Last edited by GTRetro87; 10-10-2015 at 02:31 PM.

  12. #12
    Zero's Tailor

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    Guys, thanks for your helpful responses. I received the PCB today - it boots fine with no errors. Without the guns there is only so much one can test as I am restricted to viewing attract / demo mode. P1 sound effects sound excellent, really clear and loud, P2 sound slightly quieter / more distant in comparison. Did not note much in the way of music but this is consistent with launching the game in MAME - attract mode does not feature music, save for a quick theme thing on the title screen.
    Would anybody have a link to a step by step guide on how to revitalise the sound amp? I am fairly confident I can do the work, but so far have not found any guide on the exact steps in the process. The KLOV forums require some kind of OTT registration process.
    EDIT: have found this schematic:

    KONAMI_054986A.png

    Seems pretty self explanatory what needs to be done - maybe a stupid question but where is the op amp and dac you are referring to?

    Lastly, any leads on where the gats be at? From what I noted, the connecters I have on my board are 4 pin ones.
    Last edited by MtothaJ; 10-12-2015 at 02:06 PM.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  13. #13
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    check out this site: http://www.jammarcade.net/konami-hyb...dules-undress/


    Looks to me that both X-men and Xexex's sound amp #054544, and Lethal Enforcers' (and other konami games') sound amp #054986A - op-amp and DAC are exactly the same. The layout of the traces are a little different compared to X-men's 054544, but not by much.

    The custom ASIC's are different between the two and are interchangeable, but at least the op-amp (JRC4558 or LM358 which is the replacement) and AD1868 DAC are. Check out pictures #5 through 8 on this site and you'll see how the sound amp is "undressed" and rebuilt - especially your style that Lethal Enforcers use. Don't forget to replace the tiny regulators!

  14. #14
    Zero's Tailor

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTRetro87 View Post
    check out this site: http://www.jammarcade.net/konami-hyb...dules-undress/


    Looks to me that both X-men and Xexex's sound amp #054544, and Lethal Enforcers' (and other konami games') sound amp #054986A - op-amp and DAC are exactly the same. The layout of the traces are a little different compared to X-men's 054544, but not by much.

    The custom ASIC's are different between the two and are interchangeable, but at least the op-amp (JRC4558 or LM358 which is the replacement) and AD1868 DAC are. Check out pictures #5 through 8 on this site and you'll see how the sound amp is "undressed" and rebuilt - especially your style that Lethal Enforcers use. Don't forget to replace the tiny regulators!
    Excellent, thanks so much! Since it seems the sound on my board is in reasonably good shape I will initially just replace the caps on top of the amp and see where that gets me.
    As for the pistols, these seem to be the ones: https://na.suzohapp.com/products/accessories/96-2300-12
    Regards, MtothaJ

  15. #15
    Zero's Tailor

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    Ordered the caps today (ELNA and Nichicon caps supposedly dedicated for audio) however in the meantime I am having a real hard time removing that black lacquer crap the module is coated in. So far tried alcohol and white spirit rubbing with both a q-tip and a toothbrush but the stuff will not budge. I know the linked article mentioned some Romanian paint stripper - unlikely that I will find the exact same type.
    I am wondering to what extent removing the lacquer is a must to make a start on desoldering the old caps- would it be possible to remove the caps with two irons thus exposing the solder pads with the black crap still in place?
    Last edited by MtothaJ; 10-13-2015 at 02:33 PM.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  16. #16
    Bub & Bob's Bubble Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtothaJ View Post
    Ordered the caps today (ELNA and Nichicon caps supposedly dedicated for audio) however in the meantime I am having a real hard time removing that black lacquer crap the module is coated in. So far tried alcohol and white spirit rubbing with both a q-tip and a toothbrush but the stuff will not budge. I know the linked article mentioned some Romanian paint stripper - unlikely that I will find the exact same type.
    I am wondering to what extent removing the lacquer is a must to make a start on desoldering the old caps- would it be possible to remove the caps with two irons thus exposing the solder pads with the black crap still in place?
    When I get one of these chips, I take some needle pliers and twist the caps off gently. The caps are so shitty that they fly right off. Sometimes it leaves the cap leg on it, but I just use a soldering iron and put new flux/solder on it and the leg flys off. Works like a treat. I haven't lifted a solder pad yet.





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  17. #17
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    You can definitely use two irons - set each to around 550 degrees, 575 maximum. I wouldn't suggest using the plier method cause I've damaged one once before that way without even tugging.. Then again, the electrolyte damaged the HELL out of it and I'm still currently repairing everything on that chip - you have no idea how badly eaten away this chip was when ininitially got it

    Don't worry about the black paint, print out the schematic you found and the pictures from the site I sent you of the chip that resembles yours. Use the pics as a guide to help you diagnose each pad and corresponding pin with your multimeter to see what each reads - should be no more than 1.0 ohm; sometimes I've read 1.4 ohms but that was for capacitors - I still jumped them to get a reading of 0.6-0.8 ohms

  18. #18
    Zero's Tailor

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    Thanks again guys for your support, I proceeded with removing the old caps using 2 irons. Went pretty smoothly, no pads were lifted so happy with that:

    PCB.jpg

    Crappy caps bagged up and ready to be sent back to Konami

    caps.jpg

    Will probably be a few days before my replacement caps arrive, so plenty of time to thoroughly check the reading on those connections with a multimeter and jump any connections which might need that. I think I will leave the regulator on as is for the time being. IMHO for anybody about to do this replacement I would skip trying to get the paint off the chip. You really gain nothing, risk damaging the chip if you use too much pressure when brushing / scraping and e.g. in my case this has resulted in loosing the Konami logo on the chip. But no real harm done - when I add those through hole capacitors the thing isn't exactly going to be pretty anyway
    Regards, MtothaJ

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    If you don't remove more of the black paint you will have a hard time soldering in the new caps. Some of the paint close to the pads will contaminate your solder. I just use an old tooth brush and some rubbing alcohol when I do mine

  20. #20
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    When you spray on simple green and scrub with a toothbrush, you end up scraping off all the ruined (by electrolyte) paint and a majority will probably come off anyway. Besides it'll all be squeaky clean

    Also make sure that when you remove the chip - BUY CHIP QUIK SMD REMOVAL KIT with **lead**.. it'll help a BUNCH lol.

    A desoldering gun would work but there is very stubborn solder in some via's which the pins won't let go of.. These hybrids come off like regular logic IC, they're like stuck to the board until you pry them off.. but because they're ceramic, they'll break so you don't want that at all. Chip quik will loosen up all the solder and will help you pry off the module with no damage as you run the iron back and forth (at 575-600 degrees at this point) so that the solder stays soft and helps loosen the module off the PCB.

    Use enough of the tacky flux the kit provides so the solder flows well (no need for too much, just enough) and it'll come right off with *little* force. You can get the kit cheap from http://gokimco.com/, or ebay. Usually I buy a few from Kimko so that I reach their minimum ($20 I think), but if you want one kit just get from ebay.

  21. #21
    Zero's Tailor

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    Success!

    Yesterday I have checked the connections with a multimeter and these appear to be fine (all in the 0.8 range), today I received the caps and soldered these in:

    2015-10-15 19.42.59.jpg

    Just to confirm that these are the correct caps - the 4.7uF is slightly larger when comparing ot the rest because its rated for 25V and not 16V like the other 2 types.

    Initially, I got the same results as before (Player two sound effects (shots fired, enemy deaths) being more quieter / distant than those for Player 1) but then I had another look at the documentation regarding dip switches. Dip swich 1 is for selecting between mono and stereo audio and i had it on stereo even though I was using mono via the JAMMA edge (doh!). Flipped Dip 1 to on and sound now works perfectly Really happy how this has turned out, thanks again for all your input and help
    Last edited by MtothaJ; 10-16-2015 at 12:29 PM.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  22. #22
    Cheng's Errand Boy

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    Excellent news!!! Good for you I'm glad it worked out well! Takes some patience but it works out well in the end

    One thing I should mention, I honestly don't know if the 4.7uf caps being rated for 25v will make a big difference since idk what the capacitors needs -- but just for the sake of the science, a capacitor rated at 4.7uf at 16v and a cap at 4.7uf but at 25v work a bit different from each other besides voltage ratings

    For instance, another way of looking at the two is.. Both are the same micro farad (4.7uf) rating, but each *produce* 4.7uf at either 16v or 25v, which means they range differently.

    If you can find a capacitor of the same series at 16v then it would be suggested to add those instead. But then again, it's possible that there will be no harm done.

    As long as nothing is getting HOT then all should be ok.


    Enough science for now lol, again good for you!
    Last edited by GTRetro87; 10-19-2015 at 12:26 AM.

  23. #23
    Zero's Tailor

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    Quote Originally Posted by GTRetro87 View Post
    Excellent news!!! Good for you I'm glad it worked out well! Takes some patience but it works out well in the end

    One thing I should mention, I honestly don't know if the 4.7uf caps being rated for 25v will make a big difference since idk what the capacitors needs -- but just for the sake of the science, a capacitor rated at 4.7uf at 16v and a cap at 4.7uf but at 25v work a bit different from each other besides voltage ratings

    For instance, another way of looking at the two is.. Both are the same micro farad (4.7uf) rating, but each *produce* 4.7uf at either 16v or 25v, which means they range differently.

    If you can find a capacitor of the same series at 16v then it would be suggested to add those instead. But then again, it's possible that there will be no harm done.

    As long as nothing is getting HOT then all should be ok.


    Enough science for now lol, again good for you!
    My understanding is that with capacitors its the value of the capacitance that counts. For voltage you want one which is equal or exceeds the rating of your particular application (much like the wattage of a resistor). Having a higher voltage rating doesnt change the way the capacitor functions in the circuit. The real argument for not going over the specified v is i) cost ii) larger physical size of the cap.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  24. #24
    Zero's Tailor

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    Guys, just one more thing - I am thinking of hooking up the stereo sound. I have a female connector plug which fits the CN6 male connector on the PCB, the question is what would be a neat way of hooking this up? I am using a supergun.
    At the crudest level, I guess one could cut the traces on the board just before the JAMMA edge and divert the CN6 L and R signals to the appropriate JAMMA pins, also making sure to lower the volume to the lowest level in the test menu (I assume the CN6 output is amplified and we are looking to as close as line level possible) but messing with the original board is something I would rather avoid.
    One solution which comes to mind from my side is to get a finger board, cut the sound connections going from the JAMMA edge on the fingerboard and wire in those from the CN6 connector.
    My supergun has additional screw terminals inputs for all connections so I could simply connect the L and R wires from the PCB, however as I have mentioned in this thread, even with the dip switch set to stereo, the board still outputs mono-esque sound via the JAMMA edge which could be a problem.
    Regards, MtothaJ

  25. #25
    Morden's Lackey
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    I'm having GTRetro87 recap and replace the chips on my X-Men board. He comes highly recommended at KLOV and his prices are excellent. While I could recap it myself, it's much lower of a risk to let someone with experience do it (in case problems arise), and getting the op-amp and DAC swapped at the same time for a little extra is perfect.

    Definitely look him up if you need Konami sound work done.

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