Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 77

Thread: AES to MVS (plays AES games on MVS)

  1. #1
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337

    AES to MVS (plays AES games on MVS)

    Hi,
    This is a project I've started ~7 years ago. I've never had the time to finish it. Yesterday cleaning some HDD I've found pictures about it.

    I've already built an homemade MVS to AES converter (to play MVS games on AES) which works fine :
    - PROG part is completely passive
    - CHA part contains only latches and MUX

    Then I tried to build an AES to MVS converter (to play AES game on MVS). Some may think that's a stupid idea since AES games are a lot more expensive than MVS.
    Anyway I love to play games on a cabinet (yes I know I could wire JAMMA on an AES but to me It's horrible to modify this great machine).

    So...
    I have already made some tries with a prototype converter which is completely passive :

    1) First try: EVEN, H, LOAD, DOTA, DOTB, GAD0~3 and GBD0~3 left unconnected.
    The game boots with sound but without graphics excepted simple texts or life bars (which is normal because there is no access to C ROM) as shown below :

    Start-up screen :
    Startup_1.JPG
    Main screen :
    Main_1.JPG
    Stage select screen :
    Stage_select_1.JPG
    In game screen :
    In_game_1.JPG

    2) Then I tried this: EVEN and H are grounded, LOAD is connected to PCK1B (I know it would be better to connect a 1 cycle delayed signal here), GAD0 to CR0, GAD1 to CR8, GAD2 to 16, GAD3 to CR24, GBD0 to CR1, GBD1 to CR9, GDB2 to CR17 and GDB3 to CR25 and obtained this:

    Start-up screen :
    Startup_4.JPG
    Main screen :
    Main_4.JPG
    Stage select screen :
    Stage_select_4.JPG
    In game screen :
    In_game_4.JPG

    The game is almost playable but is very ugly due to fact 1 out of 4 pixel is decoded and the other 3 are left black (0h0).

    3) In fact during each cycle 2 pixels are decoded and only 8 bits need to be well routed to PRO-CT0 chip. In total it needs 4 cycles to decode the 8 pixels from CR0~31:
    - first cycle reads CR0, CR8, CR12, CR24 for pixel A1 and CR1, CR9, CR17 and CR25 for pixel B1
    - second cycle reads CR2, CR10, CR18, CR26 for pixel A2 and CR3, CR11, CR19 and CR27 for pixel B2
    - third cycle reads CR4, CR12, CR20, CR28 for pixel A3 and CR5, CR13, CR21 and CR29 for pixel B3
    - fourth cycle reads CR6, CR14, CR22, CR30 for pixel A4 and CR7, CR15, CR23 and CR31 for pixel B4
    The system doesn't care of the other bits state during a cycle as It doesn't route them.
    So I wired like in 2) but GAD0 to CR0+CR2+CR4+CR6, GAD1 to CR8+CR10+CR12+CR14, GAD2 to CR16+CR18+CR20+CR22, GAD3 to CR24+CR26+CR28+CR30, GBD0 to CR1+CR3+CR5+CR7, GBD1 to CR9+CR11+CR13+CR15, GDB2 to CR17+CR19+CR21+CR23 and GDB3 to CR25+CR27+CR29+CR31 :

    Start-up screen :
    Startup_2.JPG
    Main screen :
    Main_2.JPG
    Stage select screen :
    Stage_select_2.JPG
    In game screen :
    In_game_2.JPG

    ...I forgot that PRO-CT0 latches C ROM data on the first of 4 cycle of decoding pixels. So, as you can see, pixels are the same 4 by 4.

    4)Now I think the solution to achieve a perfect decoding is to buffer the data (with four 8 bits latches) before the system reads CR0~31 bits. This would mean doing the 4 read cycles on one cycle of 12M, but will PRO-CT0 chip work fine at 48Mhz (48Mhz can be created simply out of 24M signal with XOR and RC)?

    Does anyone out there have an opinion of the best way to follow?
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  2. #2
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Bump
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  3. #3
    Lazy SNK Employee
    SouthAmericaNeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Santiago Chile

    Posts
    58
    this is an amazing attempt to accomplish. Why is it so hard and not a reverse of the !ARCADE! unit?
    ALL OTHER TROPICAL STORMS BOW BEFORE EL NIŃO!

  4. #4
    JammaNationX
    Xian Xi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Waipahu, Hawaii

    Posts
    27,472
    Quote Originally Posted by SouthAmericaNeo View Post
    this is an amazing attempt to accomplish. Why is it so hard and not a reverse of the !ARCADE! unit?
    Because the ZMC2 is in the AES cart and not on the mobo like MVS.

  5. #5
    Gai's Trainer
    city41's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    San Jose area

    Posts
    1,348
    I like this idea. I could see how some people would say this is unnecessary. But after years of collecting AES and now owning a cab, I would definitely buy one of these if available.
    Slug 2 > Slug X

  6. #6
    Angel's Love Slave
    GadgetUK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    UK

    Posts
    1,058
    I would think your best bet here is to use a CPLD. Very impressive progress! I would buy one of these as well!
    My YouTube channel contains some MVS repairs and stuff:-
    http://www.youtube.com/user/GadgetUK164

  7. #7
    Mayor of Southtown

    RabbitTroop's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    2,668 miles from birth

    Posts
    13,912
    Nice. It's almost there. I too think it would be nice to have a device like this, if for no reason other than giving people more options on how they want to use their games, and on what consoles. There are also the rare home carts that are actually cheaper than their MVS counterparts, not to mention a lot of folks that probably do have both MVS and a home system. So... Yeah... I've wanted something like this for a while, and I hope to see this develop more!

  8. #8
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    For the moment I'm stuck as I don't own any AES game anymore either the prototype boards.
    Will work on it (any member willing to sell a cheap but working AES game for tests purpose?).
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  9. #9
    JammaNationX
    Xian Xi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Waipahu, Hawaii

    Posts
    27,472
    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    For the moment I'm stuck as I don't own any AES game anymore either the prototype boards.
    Will work on it (any member willing to sell a cheap but working AES game for tests purpose?).
    I might have a copy of World Heroes/2 or something lying around that I can send you.

  10. #10
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Quote Originally Posted by Xian Xi View Post
    I might have a copy of World Heroes/2 or something lying around that I can send you.
    PM sent.
    I've ordered some parts in order to build a second prototype. It might take several weeks for delivery (int'l economy shipping).
    And next month I'll be away from home for 5 weeks (business trip), then the Xmas period, etc. Not sure I'll be able to work on it until early next year.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  11. #11
    Thou Shalt Not
    Question Rot.
    xsq's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Muenster, Germany

    Posts
    7,412
    nice project. It would be cool if this did work.

  12. #12
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    I should be able to build a second prototype soon.
    I'm looking for a not working MVS game I would use to reroute cartridge port and use as a shell. If anyone can help.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  13. #13
    AH
    A
    COLUMBIAN!
    aha2940's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Colombia

    Posts
    2,409
    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    I should be able to build a second prototype soon.
    I'm looking for a not working MVS game I would use to reroute cartridge port and use as a shell. If anyone can help.
    If all you need is the shell, then a bootleg cart may be what you need. If so, I have a broken ko2001 boot (boards are not original), and can give it to you for shipping price.

    Regards.

  14. #14
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Quote Originally Posted by aha2940 View Post
    If all you need is the shell, then a bootleg cart may be what you need. If so, I have a broken ko2001 boot (boards are not original), and can give it to you for shipping price.

    Regards.
    I need both the shell and the boards. I will reroute edges. No need for an original game.
    Anyway thanks for the offer, PM sent.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  15. #15
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Unfortunately shipping cost are too high so I didn't make the deal with aha2940 (thanks to him anyway).
    Anyone else with a non working MVS cart who could ship it for ~$10 to NZ?
    Last option is to buy a working game (~$20 shipped).
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  16. #16

  17. #17
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Xian Xi View Post
    I'll send you an MVS with the AES.
    Wow thank you very much.
    You my project's patron!
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  18. #18
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Small update: gathering the tools and parts

    DSCN4248.JPG

    DSCN4267.JPG
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  19. #19

  20. #20
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337

    Thumbs up

    Thank you so much!
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  21. #21
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Hey! I'm back.
    While working on this project I was thinking, why people who make CMVS in an AES case just doesn't modify the MVS board to be directly compatible with AES game and so that externally it looks like a normal AES?
    To me you have to :
    - replace the 2*120 pins edge connectors by 2*100 pins connectors
    - reroute signals
    - reroute LOAD/EVEN/H/DOTA/DOTB/GAD0/etc. signals directly to the chips on the MVS board
    It seems a lot of soldering but isn't very complicated (doesn't involve ICs or other electronic parts).
    It could be useful if you have a fried AES board as it's probably cheaper and easier to find a MVS board for replacement.
    Last edited by Apocalypse; 01-12-2016 at 04:58 PM.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  22. #22
    JammaNationX
    Xian Xi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Waipahu, Hawaii

    Posts
    27,472
    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Hey! I'm back.
    While working on this project I was thinking, why people who make CMVS in an AES case just doesn't modify the MVS board to be directly compatible with AES game and so that externally it looks like a normal AES?
    To me you have to :
    - replace the 2*120 pins edge connectors by 2*100 pins connectors
    - reroute signals
    - reroute LOAD/EVEN/H/DOTA/DOTB/GAD0/etc. signals directly to the chips on the MVS board
    It seems a lot of soldering but isn't very complicated (doesn't involve ICs or other electronic parts).
    It could be useful if you have a fried AES board as it's probably cheaper and easier to find a MVS board for replacement.
    It probably would be way easier with a prefabbed PCB with everything already done.

  23. #23
    Vice's Love Slave
    shadowkn55's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    SoCal

    Posts
    2,171
    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Hey! I'm back.
    While working on this project I was thinking, why people who make CMVS in an AES case just doesn't modify the MVS board to be directly compatible with AES game and so that externally it looks like a normal AES?
    To me you have to :
    - replace the 2*120 pins edge connectors by 2*100 pins connectors
    - reroute signals
    - reroute LOAD/EVEN/H/DOTA/DOTB/GAD0/etc. signals directly to the chips on the MVS board
    It seems a lot of soldering but isn't very complicated (doesn't involve ICs or other electronic parts).
    It could be useful if you have a fried AES board as it's probably cheaper and easier to find a MVS board for replacement.
    I'll take it that you have never tried to remove the card edge connectors before have you? Removing and replacing card edge connectors has got to be the biggest thorn in my side when it comes to any mvs repair.

  24. #24
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    Quote Originally Posted by Xian Xi View Post
    It probably would be way easier with a prefabbed PCB with everything already done.
    Good idea, except for the specific signals that have to be reroute directly to an IC. Still it's far less effort. But I should do a prototype first.
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowkn55 View Post
    I'll take it that you have never tried to remove the card edge connectors before have you? Removing and replacing card edge connectors has got to be the biggest thorn in my side when it comes to any mvs repair.
    Edge connectors are mounted on an intermediate board for horizontal slots. So you can simply remove than board and make a homemade board with AES connectors.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


  25. #25
    Edo Express Delivery Guy
    Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    New-Zealand

    Posts
    337
    I've managed to gather all the electronic parts needed (including the AES cartridge connectors).
    Still looking for a working AES game to be the test game and a non-working MVS game to use the edge connectors.
    Current SNK projects:
    - Samurai Spirits (Shodown) RPG English version for the NGCD:
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...nch-to-English)
    - AES to MVS converter (plays AES games on MVS):
    http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showth...-games-on-MVS)


Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •