Caps Changed - Crazy No Sound Problem

Hi guys,

here is my crazy story. I'm building a supergun with a MV-1FZ. Initially, the MV-1FZ had working audio with some problems:
- it was very low,
- it was impossible to turn the MV-1FZ volume up, because sound spikes would immediately shut down the sound completely (up to the next cold boot).

Reading on the forum, I decided to change Caps.
I bought the following:
9x 4.7µF100V 105C
4x 470µF25V 105C
4x 100µF63v 105C
(I hope, I didn't make a mistake here since I'm no expert in circuits).

I carefully, replaced all the caps by making good soldering on TOP and BOTTOM of the board for each capacitor. I also double checked the connections after the capacitors were installed.
(I can post detailed pictures of the board if required)

I cleaned the working sections with anti-flux. Everything looked shiny to me.

When I connected the MVS to the supergun, I did the following tests (in temporal order).
1) MVS sound test. Worked.
2) Started a game. No Sound.
3) MVS sound test. Worked.
4) Cleaned the cartridge and started the game. No sound.
5) MVS sound test. NOT Working anymore.

And now, I have completely no sound at all.

Guys, what the hell is going on? This stuff is making me crazy. Please help me.

Thanks.

Edit:
1) I changed all the caps with high quality Rubycons. The problem persists. I'm building a stereo mod to test the audio processor.
2) Built an MKL circuit. I don't get any sound from Ch1, Ch2 or Ch3 points on the board (see the StereoFix docs for more details), could be the audio chip

It isn't the caps. It's either the Ym2610 or a trace from the cart slot.

Thanks for the prompt reply Xian.

But why, before changing the caps, I could play with a very low volume (on the board) without losing the sound at all?
Also, is there a way for me to double check and confirm your idea?

Thanks!

Xian Xi said:

It isn't the caps. It's either the Ym2610 or a trace from the cart slot.

Click to expand...

XX pal... just give a more detailed explanation please man...

The n00b is breaking my balls... and hence, i'd PERSONALLY appreciate a solution to this...

Consider this a favour lads.... and I'll return it in the future....

xROTx

A cap or caps are just not sitting correctly(double triple check your + and - connections are not reversed). It is also not necessary to change out all the caps at once.You basically want to do one at a time until you can pinpoint and remedy the problem -IF- you don't have an accurate meter for caps...
My only solution for you would be to re-install your old caps one at a time and see what comes of it as you have to at least get back to where you had sound.
BB

Rot said:

XX pal... just give a more detailed explanation please man...

The n00b is breaking my balls... and hence, i'd PERSONALLY appreciate a solution to this...

Consider this a favour lads.... and I'll return it in the future....

xROTx

Click to expand...

BIG BEAR said:

A cap or caps are just not sitting correctly(double triple check your + and - connections are not reversed). It is also not necessary to change out all the caps at once.You basically want to do one at a time until you can pinpoint and remedy the problem -IF- you don't have an accurate meter for caps...
My only solution for you would be to re-install your old caps one at a time and see what comes of it as you have to at least get back to where you had sound.
BB

Click to expand...

Damn. I threw them away.
Didn't even think about reusing them

Should I buy another set completely identical to the ones on the board??

Cavia said:

Hi guys,

here is my crazy story. I'm building a supergun with a MV-1FZ. Initially, the MV-1FZ had working audio with some problems:
- it was very low,
- it was impossible to turn the MV-1FZ volume up, because sound spikes would immediately shut down the sound completely (up to the next cold boot).

Reading on the forum, I decided to change Caps.
I bought the following:
9x 4.7µF100V 105C
4x 470µF25V 105C
4x 100µF63v 105C
(I hope, I didn't make a mistake here since I'm no expert in circuits).

I carefully, replaced all the caps by making good soldering on TOP and BOTTOM of the board for each capacitor. I also double checked the connections after the capacitors were installed.
(I can post detailed pictures of the board if required)

I cleaned the working sections with anti-flux. Everything looked shiny to me.

When I connected the MVS to the supergun, I did the following tests (in temporal order).
1) MVS sound test. Worked.
2) Started a game. No Sound.
3) MVS sound test. Worked.
4) Cleaned the cartridge and started the game. No sound.
5) MVS sound test. NOT Working anymore.

And now, I have completely no sound at all.

Guys, what the hell is going on? This stuff is making me crazy. Please help me.

Thanks.

PS.: I have a 161 in 1 cartridge but it's dramatically hard to insert and remove from the
MV-1FZ. Anyone has a trick to make it easier to slide in the card slot?

Click to expand...

I know your 161 in 1 is the least of your problems right now but, take it apart and file a small amount off each end of the pcbs, then you will find it much easier to insert / remove from the MVS. (This is a well docmented fix)

mjsaville said:

I know your 161 in 1 is the least of your problems right now but, take it apart and file a small amount off each end of the pcbs, then you will find it much easier to insert / remove from the MVS. (This is a well docmented fix)

Click to expand...

Thanks a lot for your help man!
This is a starting point

Please test with an official MVS cart, not a multicart as they sometimes aren't reliable.

It's possible that the pot went bad as well. Check the resistance between pins 1 and 3 and then pins 1 and 2 while turning the knob and see if the resistance changes.

Xian Xi said:

Please test with an official MVS cart, not a multicart as they sometimes aren't reliable.

It's possible that the pot went bad as well. Check the resistance between pins 1 and 3 and then pins 1 and 2 while turning the knob and see if the resistance changes.

Click to expand...

Thanks Xian for the reply.

So, I've upload a couple of pics of my board (focusing on the audio section).
In this one you can see the bottom of the audio section. As Rot said I'm a n00b, so I numbered the pins of the volume knob (I hope you were referring to them)
Pic1: http://it.tinypic.com/r/hvckef/8
So, between 1 and 3, the resistance is always 1221 ± 2
When the knob is at its min, we have 1221 between 1 and 2, and 0 between 2 and 3.
Viceversa at its max, we have 0 between 1 and 2 and 1221 between 2 and 3.
By rotating the knob, I believe the sum of 1 and 2 + 2 and 3 is always 1221.

I also tried an original MVS cart. There is no sound, but pls note that even in the Sound Test of the board I can't get any sound at all.

I also noted the following. When I start the board, there is a clear buzzing on the audio channel (which increases or decreases by rotating the volume knob). As soon as I use the multimeter to measure the resistance, the buzz spikes in the speakers and everything goes quiet (like if the sound is compromised from now on).

The same behaviour holds when I lightly touch one the yellow capacitors on top (see next pic)
Pic2:http://it.tinypic.com/r/2hzir2v/8
Especially the 4.7 ones generate a spike in the buzzing as above.

The funny part is that, after soldering the new capacitors, the first 2 times I tried the sound test, it worked flawless. While no sound from the cart ever.

Are sure the new caps are right placed? I mean right polarity + and - are into correct position.

OldTony said:

Are sure the new caps are right placed? I mean right polarity + and - are into correct position.

Click to expand...

Ciao OldTony,

sure! You can even check the second picture I posted and see the polarity yourself

Chang caps are notoriously terrible quality.

SmokeMonster said:

Chang caps are notoriously terrible quality.

Click to expand...

Local store, son of a bitch.
I guess, I'll order online some Rubycons.

Thanks!

Cavia said:

Ciao OldTony,

sure! You can even check the second picture I posted and see the polarity yourself

Click to expand...

Ok so I think the best way to know if problem is the amplifier o the sound chip is to refer to stereo mod circuit (you can find it into forum explained) and use those points to test if audio signal is present before it cames into amplifier chip.
Are there some points on board where you can have the audio signal not amplified, so if you've a normal audio amplifier you can connect those point to amplifier and test if sound is present or not, if it isn't present the problem isn't into final circuit (amplifier) but into sound chip.
For stereo mod you can find it here: http://www.jamma-nation-x.com/jammax/tutorials.html
choose MVS and then MV1FZ Stereo mod from menu.

OldTony said:

Ok so I think the best way to know if problem is the amplifier o the sound chip is to refer to stereo mod circuit (you can find it into forum explained) and use those points to test if audio signal is present before it cames into amplifier chip.
Are there some points on board where you can have the audio signal not amplified, so if you've a normal audio amplifier you can connect those point to amplifier and test if sound is present or not, if it isn't present the problem isn't into final circuit (amplifier) but into sound chip.
For stereo mod you can find it here: http://www.jamma-nation-x.com/jammax/tutorials.html
choose MVS and then MV1FZ Stereo mod from menu.

Click to expand...

Thanks Tony,

first I changed all the caps with high quality Rubycon capacitors.
Unfortunately, the problem still persists.
Now I'm going to build the stereo mod as you suggested. Let's see what we'll get.

Well if it works you're sure problem is into amp sound and not into digital sound section. Let me know.

OldTony said:

Well if it works you're sure problem is into amp sound and not into digital sound section. Let me know.

Click to expand...

Una domanda semplice, OldTony.
I'm soldering the wires for the MKL's board on the MV1-FZS board. I know the locations of Ch1, Ch2 and Ch3; but what is the best place to get the ground and 5V (needed for the MKL board) from the bottom of the MV1-FZS board (possibly close to the Ch1,2,3 connection)?

Grazie.

I've connected 5v and GND directly from Jamma connector. Anyway you can check on CH1, CH2 and CH3 if audio signal is present, you need to connect one of this point to an amplifier.
Italiano: ho connesso i punti 5v e massa direttamente sul connettore Jamma. Per capire se il guasto sulla scheda è nell'amplificatore o nel chip sonoro digitale, puoi fare una semplice prova connettendo i punti Ch1 Ch2 e Ch3 (uno alla volta) ad un ingresso audio di un amplificatore audio, se l'audio lo senti allora il problema sulla scheda è solo nella parte dell'amplificazione, se non senti nulla allora il problema è il chip sonoro.

So,
I finished a MKL circuit and connected it to the Ch1, Ch2, Ch3, Gr and +5V on the board. Unfortunately, there is no sound coming out.
Both using the MKL circuit entirely, or just connecting (for example) Ch1 to the Left input of an amplifier, I only get some white noise but no sound.

What should I check next??
Note: I'm consolizing this MV1-FZS. I did the 5V mod and everything else works properly.

If you don't have sound while connecting Ch1. Ch2 or Ch3 to amp, this means just the sound chip is the problem....

and the sound chip is the YM2610. Do you know where I can buy a replace for this in EUROPE?
Thanks!

First... ALWAYS reset the backup RAM in the hardware test menu and power cycle the board if you have zero sound.

If that's not it then probe the YM2610's digital inputs with a logic probe that has audio capabilities. You WILL hear the digital information on the clocked pulses going into that 2610. If it's there then the digital part of the circuit is working. If it's not then you have a problem in the digital section.

When I get home from Japan this week I'll record a video and throw it up on YouTube to show you what I mean about checking the inputs to the YM2610 with a logic probe that has audio capabilities.

RJ

Make sure you didnt replace non polarized caps with polarized ones.