PC Engine pad hack - DB15 + original pad still working (pics)

Wasn't really planning on this but got around to doing a PC Engine pad hack today to use it with a DB15 modded Madcatz fightstick (same joystick I am using for Neo Geo and Sega Mega Drive as well as PS3 via the orginal USB cable). While padhacks aren't terribly exciting IMHO the cool thing about this one is that it keeps the original controller 100% functional and gives you an option to hook up / daisy chain in the DB15 fightstick:



I only slightly enlarged the cord hole with a soldering iron since getting rammed by two big fat black cords was just too much to take for the poor PC Engine pad



Quite happy with how this one turned out since nothing got trashed in the proces meaning I still have the original Core Grafx pad matching the system. As for the actual pad hack this is pretty straightforward (or rather it would be if I didn't get constantly interupted and kept loosing concentration / dicking stuff up ). The dpad and run and select buton solder points for the DB15 wires are pretty straightforward to find as is GND and +5V. The I and II buttons are a bit more tricky however since there is the autofire component of the the pad and various resistors meaning it becomes harder to follow the traces. In the end I just got a piece of wire, put one end to GND, switched on a game and kept tapping different points on the pad with the other end of the wire until i found the correct points. Since keeping the pad operational was a priority, the main thing was to obviously pick points far away from where the buttons would be depressed so as not to get in the way.

I also thoroughly cleaned the pad and adjusted the autofire switches - if they are too loose / do not work it is woth bending the metal contacts up to ensure that they make good contact with the pad surface - this usually fixes any problems and firms up the movement action of theswitches so they become less flimsy to operate. In fact a dodgy autofire on one of the switches was actually the reason I opened the pad up in the first place - and then kind of got sucked in

PS. just tried a Neo Geo CD pad and this works great also.

Damn that pretty nice !

congrats man! looks good

MtothaJ,
Glad you are still posting stuff like this. As a fellow Madcatz TE stick guy, I've been wanting to do a padhack for a TG16 pad for some time but I couldn't find any definitive solder points detailed with pics online.

I'm not sure if the CG pad is the same on the inside as the TG16 pad but if you could post your solder points and what they correspond to on the DB15 that would be awesome.

Thanks!

ballzdeepx said:

MtothaJ,
Glad you are still posting stuff like this. As a fellow Madcatz TE stick guy, I've been wanting to do a padhack for a TG16 pad for some time but I couldn't find any definitive solder points detailed with pics online.

I'm not sure if the CG pad is the same on the inside as the TG16 pad but if you could post your solder points and what they correspond to on the DB15 that would be awesome.

Thanks!

Click to expand...

Hi Ballzdeepx - not sure whether TG16 pad is same as PCE (the end connectors are definitely wired differently though) but for TG16 I found the below info, with all point located on the IC:


http://www.gamesx.com/controldata/turbocont.htm

To match with a Neo Geo pin out:


Use the 'Credit' for Select, 'Start' for Run; also one thing which I did and would recommend is that because of the way the buttons are laid out on the PCE / TG16 pad i.e. 'II' then 'I' you wire them so:
II -> Neo Geo Button 1 (13 on male DB15)
I -> Neo Geo Button 2 (5 on male DB15)
Kind of counterintuitive but definitely makes sense to keep the original layout

Hey man this is fantastic thank you!
So you just soldered right to the legs of the IC then or did you trace them all out?
If this works for the TG16 pad I have a nice little project for next week.

Thanks for taking the time, I really appreciate it.

You should go for a cosmetic mod too. All the SFxT art is awful.

ballzdeepx said:

Hey man this is fantastic thank you!
So you just soldered right to the legs of the IC then or did you trace them all out?
If this works for the TG16 pad I have a nice little project for next week.

Thanks for taking the time, I really appreciate it.

Click to expand...

All my points are on the IC except for the I and II buttons which I got from elsewere on the pad, however I will probably be opening up the pad sometime in the future to try out these IC points becuase I realised that when I connect a DB15 controller the turbo settings which are set on the PCE pad do not affect the DB15 controller. Would be cool if whatever you got set on the pad is also reflected on the DB15 controller and I don't really see why this shouldn't be possible.
I will have another look at this and report back some time - but not now since I just cleaned the place and can't be fcuked to get the soldering iron and all the other bits and pieces out again

This is awesome, I didn't know you could solder directly to the IC. I've got some extra DB15 cables thanks to Yodd, I'ma have to try this.

MtothaJ said:

All my points are on the IC except for the I and II buttons which I got from elsewere on the pad, however I will probably be opening up the pad sometime in the future to try out these IC points becuase I realised that when I connect a DB15 controller the turbo settings which are set on the PCE pad do not affect the DB15 controller. Would be cool if whatever you got set on the pad is also reflected on the DB15 controller and I don't really see why this shouldn't be possible.
I will have another look at this and report back some time - but not now since I just cleaned the place and can't be fcuked to get the soldering iron and all the other bits and pieces out again

Click to expand...

Couldn't you also just solder I & II direct from the IC and rely on the Madcatz turbo feature or will that not work?
Just a thought.

ballzdeepx said:

Couldn't you also just solder I & II direct from the IC and rely on the Madcatz turbo feature or will that not work?
Just a thought.

Click to expand...

At least in the case of my Madcatz stick the turbo feature only works when connected via USB. That said the only situation I had it come on when connected via DB15 was when playing a Blue Elf Jamma board connected to a supergun and this was rather eratic and more of a hinderance than a help. Maybe its worth looking more closely at the turbo pcb inside the stick - perhaps somebody more knowledgeable could confirm or otherwise comment in this regard.

MtothaJ said:

All my points are on the IC except for the I and II buttons which I got from elsewere on the pad, however I will probably be opening up the pad sometime in the future to try out these IC points becuase I realised that when I connect a DB15 controller the turbo settings which are set on the PCE pad do not affect the DB15 controller. Would be cool if whatever you got set on the pad is also reflected on the DB15 controller and I don't really see why this shouldn't be possible.
I will have another look at this and report back some time - but not now since I just cleaned the place and can't be fcuked to get the soldering iron and all the other bits and pieces out again

Click to expand...

It depends on where you pull the contact points on the pad. Driectly from the place the buttons are, yes. turbo will work. after the switches, nope.

MtothaJ said:

At least in the case of my Madcatz stick the turbo feature only works when connected via USB. That said the only situation I had it come on when connected via DB15 was when playing a Blue Elf Jamma board connected to a supergun and this was rather eratic and more of a hinderance than a help. Maybe its worth looking more closely at the turbo pcb inside the stick - perhaps somebody more knowledgeable could confirm or otherwise comment in this regard.

Click to expand...

Gotta be honest. I've modded TE sticks all the live long day, and when asked about maintaining turbo after a dual mod, I tell people tough luck. I'm not even going to touch it.

They actually still make the encoder chip used in TG16/PCE controllers. So you can very easily make your own Neo -> PCE adapter without having to fuck with a controller.

Linky. 35 cents.

^ That is pretty cool, now I need to find a cable and the male DIN to make it complete.

Lemony Vengeance said:

It depends on where you pull the contact points on the pad. Driectly from the place the buttons are, yes. turbo will work. after the switches, nope.

Click to expand...

Found the below PCB pic on Slagcoin - posting here for reference so we have everything in one place:



I think it should be possible to get the turbos spinning and at the same time have working buttons by exposing some copper trace in close proximity to the buttons and soldering to that.

Impressive work!

MtothaJ said:

Found the below PCB pic on Slagcoin - posting here for reference so we have everything in one place:

I think it should be possible to get the turbos spinning and at the same time have working buttons by exposing some copper trace in close proximity to the buttons and soldering to that.

Click to expand...

be careful. the contact points are very fine.

And I'm actually making some of these circuits this weekend for 300wins

I'll probably skip out on using turbo like Lem said, not worth the hassle.
MtothaJ, one last thing with this being a TE stick, did you need to use the +5V? If I recall that's not needed with the NEO DB15 layout unless its a NGCD pad.

Lemony Vengeance said:

be careful. the contact points are very fine.

And I'm actually making some of these circuits this weekend for 300wins

Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up - to be honest I had a change of mind and am going to leave it as it is.
Just played for about 45min on different PCE titles using the Madcatz Fightstick, Neo Geo CD pad and original controller.
My view is that the Neo Geo CD controller is pretty much the perfect match for the system - really comforable in the hand, seems very well suited for the genres best represented on the system (shooters, driving games etc.). The fightstick also plays fine, its really a matter of personal preference, some games play better on the fightstick others on the CD pad. Lastly, with regard to the original controller - feels pretty cheap and unsatisfing and also not that comfortable to hold - ultimately its a NES pad with turbos. What is cool about having them daisy chained is that you can use either one at any moment without having to unplug cables. It also extends the Neo Geo CD pad's cord, which is at present my go to pad for PC Engine. Also, I have an new old stock Avenue 6 pad incoming - I ordered it before I did this mod and having known how this would has turned out I would have probably not bothered pulling the trigger, since I save for the additional buttons for SF2 the existing controller options are more than enough.

PS. composhit is a real eyestrain, can't wait for the RGB gear to arrive. Still, things could have been worse - apparantly some of the TG16 systems have RF only (!!) with some add on needed for composite (someone must have had a mental seizure when they thought that one up )

ballzdeepx said:

I'll probably skip out on using turbo like Lem said, not worth the hassle.
MtothaJ, one last thing with this being a TE stick, did you need to use the +5V? If I recall that's not needed with the NEO DB15 layout unless its a NGCD pad.

Click to expand...

I have +5V connected on mine, so not sure whether the PCE / TG16 padhack would function without it. I guess you could try it without connecting the +5V. If it works then great, if not then you can either connect the +5V line on the fightstick (this is what I did: http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/showt...ck-Pro-TE-DB15-Neo-Geo-mod-wth-pictures/page2) or maybe as was suggested in that thread just plug the USB in for the power.
Even though in theory you do not need the +5V for a standard DB15 layout, in practise I found that because we don't have a bare DB15 stick, but one with PCB's etc. not having the power connected sometimes causes things to behave eratically - Neo Geo was always fine, but run into problems with Mega Drive and Blue Elf when the power line was not connected.

ballzdeepx said:

I'll probably skip out on using turbo like Lem said, not worth the hassle.
MtothaJ, one last thing with this being a TE stick, did you need to use the +5V? If I recall that's not needed with the NEO DB15 layout unless its a NGCD pad.

Click to expand...

In my somewhat limited pad hacking/modding experience, you need to wire the 5V if you have any PCBs in the mix. Although they are not used, they need to be powered or the Neo does some crazy shit when you try to use it.

To give you an update I refined this somewhat by linking the SELECT and RUN respectively also to DB15 line for Button 3 and Button 4. So when using e.g. a Neo Geo CD pad you now have Avenue Pad 3 style functionality since if the SELECT and RUN buttons are actual action buttons in the game they are within easy reach e.g. Nitro boost on Chase HQ or special attack on SHinobi.
Avenue 3 pad offers the option of selecting whether buton III becomes SELECT or RUN, in this case you have SELECT assigned to C and RUN assigned to D.




I think this is a good layout since in the vast majority of cases it is SELECT which is the action buton and going along the bottom curve of the pad you have III II I layout as you would do on a Avenue 3 pad, with RUN most usually just being the pause buton in game. Obviously, the standard SELECT and RUN buttons keep their functionality.

MtothaJ - Would you mind taking a picture of the PCB? I'd love to know how you were able to make this work and keep the functionality. I actually followed your other thread for the genesis 3 button and it went great.