How do you feel about looking up strategies/watching videos etc.

ebinsugewa · Jun 30, 2014

Personally I don't particularly have anything against looking stuff up/using savestates/whatever, in fact it's what I usually do. I can appreciate the fun and challenge of doing it on your own, though. Many of my favorite games are ones I had to start from scratch on, but others I don't have the drive to figure out on my own. The game that raised this question for me is NES Ghosts 'n' Goblins. I played it a few times as a kid, but never had much luck with it. I've started playing it again and something is driving me to beat it old school, I'm not sure what.

SNKorSWM · Jun 30, 2014

Game Genie?

Karou · Jun 30, 2014

If you want help try pming me? I could look it up based on what you ask then give you garbled up hints! like the assistants on gamecenter cx or something=fun!

Good Luck.

I used to play games then I got bad at them and impatient and started to have to cheat more. I'd never have found all the materia without the gudebook for instance?, always had hints from nintendo power and going to back to visit moms for internet when I would get stuck later though. never was that HARDCORE! of a gamer ever really I guess?

lolifoxgirl · Jun 30, 2014

I have been seeking help with fighter games lately, but thats just because I haven't played them at all. If you need help get enough to get yourself going.

GutsDozer · Jun 30, 2014

Yeah with fighting games sometimes the only way to learn new things is to watch combo vids and stuff.

NeoGeoNinja · Jun 30, 2014

Quite simply, I have no issue looking stuff up if I become infuriatingly stuck at a point in a game - whether it be a boss, puzzle/maze etc.

But otherwise, if I can avoid doing so, I won't ever bother.

pulstar · Jun 30, 2014

I pretty much go with the try/fail approach for as long as my patience holds out then I go and have a look at a guide. For things like shmups/fighters I try everything first and if I can't seem to find a decent strategy I watch strategy videos. So much easier to copy strategies for these kinds of games from videos of people actually doing it.

xsq · Jun 30, 2014

yeah, I try on my own as long as I feel it's resonable. Some games I have the will to figure out all of the stuff by myself, but well, sometimes I won't. Time is also a factor... and I ain't all too bright going by some games standards - there I said it.

xb74 · Jun 30, 2014

I will look up achievement guides for some direction when mopping up after finishing a game. I will struggle through a game story though on my own despite the time it takes.

Retro gaming - nothing against looking at guides, but give it a red hot go first, multiple times. Coming back for more pain is part of the thrill and this should be preserved mostly

andsuchisdeath · Jun 30, 2014

I'm very much ok with it.
Sometimes watching a video/seeing someone else play the game is only thing that will provide a perspective shift for me.

There are some games where I can "look at the picture" 100 times, and never see the "vase." After seeing a demonstration from elsewhere, I will finally see the "vase".

I hope after playing the game enough I can find a way to smash the vase over the faces. Because watching a video/demonstration or adhering to a strategy you could never quite fathom in you're own mind, shouldn't mean that creativity and innovation must be sacrificed. Game depending, you can have it all.

MCF 76 · Jun 30, 2014

I think its fine, I do it a lot on newer games. I do try to figure it out on my own until I get pretty aggravated.

ggallegos1 · Jun 30, 2014

Its OK in my book. I usually avoid guides/YouTube for as long as I can until I have no idea how to get past a certain part or boss. I don't have much time anymore to try and try and try for an hour, so as long as I can progress and enjoy the game I'm good

GutsDozer · Jun 30, 2014

While watching Summer Games Done Quick I learned a lot of new techniques on various speed runs. One of them being the Two guys doing LOZ:OOT twin speed runs. It was crazy they skipped the ENTIRE game! it was nuts. I would never have the time to sit and figure that shit out. So the only way I would ever see that is by watching a video. To be frank I did not know it was even possible.

ebinsugewa · Jun 30, 2014

andsuchisdeath said:
There are some games where I can "look at the picture" 100 times, and never see the "vase." After seeing a demonstration from elsewhere, I will finally see the "vase".

I hope after playing the game enough I can find a way to smash the vase over the faces. Because watching a video/demonstration or adhering to a strategy you could never quite fathom in you're own mind, shouldn't mean that creativity and innovation must be sacrificed. Game depending, you can have it all.

I feel the same way. Well put.

I guess with GnG I feel like it's mainly a pattern game anyway, and I'm not one for games like Pac-man etc. that are pure pattern, so I'm trying to enjoy the figuring out bit the same way you might route through a shmup say.

Kid Panda · Jun 30, 2014

I usually stay away from videos for games that I might play in the future. Pretty much all shmups that I play I have never watched a superplay/let's play ever. If i beat a shootie on my accord I get alot more satisfaction, in saying this, there are some that I have played for over 2 years and haven't beat. I guess it really depends on how much patience you have I guess.

andsuchisdeath · Jun 30, 2014

@ebinsugewa. Thanks. I feel you with post #14.

@kidpanda. I'm with you on not watching videos if it will spoil an otherwise virgin-esque experience. Similarly, I'll avoid watching a video if I'm experiencing a difficult situation that I know will be remedied solely with experimentation and practice.

I'm very cognizant of my limitations though, so usually within X amount of time, I can determine whether or not I'm too stupid to figure out the best course of action/approach to a game. This is when I'll be open to watching videos.

Still, there are instances of watching a video following the circumstances illustrated above, where afterwards I'll say "shit I get the big picture now. And I think I can come up with a more effective approach than this one".

Overall I like videos I guess. As a person in general, I'm a rather poor problem solver.

SNKorSWM · Jul 1, 2014

GutsDozer said:
While watching Summer Games Done Quick I learned a lot of new techniques on various speed runs. One of them being the Two guys doing LOZ:OOT twin speed runs. It was crazy they skipped the ENTIRE game! it was nuts. I would never have the time to sit and figure that shit out. So the only way I would ever see that is by watching a video. To be frank I did not know it was even possible.

Those tool assisted runs made with tens of thousands of savestates aren't exactly something that normal people could hope to do within the limits of their reflexes.

Archdesigner03 · Jul 2, 2014

The only time I use videos / faqs etc etc is when I get stuck in 16bit era RPGs...sometimes those games are so ambiguous on what to do next.

Archdesigner03 · Jul 2, 2014

GutsDozer said:
While watching Summer Games Done Quick I learned a lot of new techniques on various speed runs. One of them being the Two guys doing LOZ:OOT twin speed runs. It was crazy they skipped the ENTIRE game! it was nuts. I would never have the time to sit and figure that shit out. So the only way I would ever see that is by watching a video. To be frank I did not know it was even possible.

I watched their LOZ:OOT speed run too, it's pretty damn amazing how they figure it out and actually know the technical reason behind each glitch.

Wachenroder · Jul 12, 2014

It just depends on the game. Sometimes, game designers are way too vague with direction. I've gotten pretty good fishing out what stuff I can figure out on my and what stuff is stupid game design.

The first Crash Bandicoot and the first gem is a perfect example of this.

flashbackx · Jul 15, 2014

Funny, I've been thinking a lot about this lately. I don't see any difference between watching a video strategy and reading a Nintendo Power strat as a kid. You still need the skill to pull it off. Save states on the other hand... I think that's a bit of a gray area. I've been revisiting a few of the games I never beat as a kid on the Retron 5; and I was thinking about what really constitutes "beating" a game clean. Save states are great for adult life and the minimal free time that entails... but I think they are acceptable as long as they are used within the rules of the game.

Batman NES for example has unlimited continues; but you have to start a level over completely when you use all your lives; so I think it's acceptable to Save state the beginning of a level if you want to take a break (otherwise I'd be leaving the console on all day and overnight sometimes like I did as a kid... and that's just wasteful!) However, saving before a boss and continually reloading in order to beat him would not count as truly beating the game in my opinion.... same with continually reloading a certain level in a game where there is not unlimited continues, if the real game makes you start from the beginning than you need to restart for your run to count. I know a lot of people don't see it that way and think any use of save states completely invalidates a play though... but I feel as long as they are used to save a checkpoint in a game it's all good.

andsuchisdeath · Jul 15, 2014

flashbackx said:
Funny, I've been thinking a lot about this lately. I don't see any difference between watching a video strategy and reading a Nintendo Power strat as a kid. You still need the skill to pull it off. Save states on the other hand... I think that's a bit of a gray area. I've been revisiting a few of the games I never beat as a kid on the Retron 5; and I was thinking about what really constitutes "beating" a game clean. Save states are great for adult life and the minimal free time that entails... but I think they are acceptable as long as they are used within the rules of the game.

Batman NES for example has unlimited continues; but you have to start a level over completely when you use all your lives; so I think it's acceptable to Save state the beginning of a level if you want to take a break (otherwise I'd be leaving the console on all day and overnight sometimes like I did as a kid... and that's just wasteful!) However, saving before a boss and continually reloading in order to beat him would not count as truly beating the game in my opinion.... same with continually reloading a certain level in a game where there is not unlimited continues, if the real game makes you start from the beginning than you need to restart for your run to count. I know a lot of people don't see it that way and think any use of save states completely invalidates a play though... but I feel as long as they are used to save a checkpoint in a game it's all good.

Using savestates to beat a game you're already using more than one credit on is really moot. At that point it's all the same.

I'd say the controversial facet to savestates is their involvement with players' practicing regiments.

Many skilled players use savestates to practice the more difficult parts of certain games. I don't understand the controversy with this, although I've never used save states before (I don't know how to).

Ghudda · Jul 16, 2014

I recently have been playing through Metroid Prime for the Gamecube and have realized that I have a hard time with the back tracking that typically ensues in Nintendo action/adventure games. I have a hard time dealing with backtracking caused by little guidance or clarity on where i'm supposed to go. I understand the games promote exploration but there's only so much I can take. Therefor, i've been following a guide fairly consistently just to stay aware of exactly where I need to go next. I havn't always had this problem with games and used to love getting lost back when I was a kid. But now I suppose I have this lack of patience and have a hard time remaining content in those kinds of situations.

Tripredacus · Jul 16, 2014

I've said before (elsewhere) that unless you are playing a game for competitive means, how you go about playing it doesn't matter. Games are for your personal enjoyment. If that means you want to use cheats, glitches, look up videos or walkthroughs, fine. If you are playing in multiplayer or trying to beat a speed record, a high score or some other form of competition, then those things are a problem.

andsuchisdeath · Jul 16, 2014

Tripredacus said:
I've said before (elsewhere) that unless you are playing a game for competitive means, how you go about playing it doesn't matter. Games are for your personal enjoyment. If that means you want to use cheats, glitches, look up videos or walkthroughs, fine. If you are playing in multiplayer or trying to beat a speed record, a high score or some other form of competition, then those things are a problem.

While I agree with you on the first part (games being for personal enjoyment), I think one must discriminate on what becomes a "problem" regarding high scores/competition.

Obviously cheats are out of the equation. But if you're going for a speed or high score record, you better know exactly how "the best" are handling a game if you want to best them. Videos/walkthroughs are crucial to this IMO.

How do you feel about looking up strategies/watching videos etc.

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