NeoVGA: Lagless, pixel-perfect line doubler for Neo-Geo MVS and AES

Xian Xi · Apr 7, 2016

For what it does I don't see a problem at all at $160. I was thinking it would be about $150-160ish with all the time to assemble.

GTRetro87 · Apr 7, 2016

For $160 I don't see it being a problem for an assembled piece.

For instance, the JROK encoder outputs component, s-video and composite - standard resolution. Great, but not sufficient for all applications because not ALL of us are using CRT's - or have non-CRT's that even accept the MVS sync signal at standard resolution (thankfully my Panasonic Viera Plasma does). JROK is what, $80 + shipping basically and it doesn't take much to assemble one.

However, your approach has taken the MVS (and now CPS2) MUCH much further in allowing us to output the *correct* Sync AND 480p output for Modern LED's/LCD's, etc.. This specific breakthrough is worth EVERY penny of $160 assembled and programmed.

Hopefully down the road, we'll have a lagless RGB to VGA converter with options to adjust Sync - compared to the "meh" Gonbes converter! When that time comes, I'm willing to put down double this. All it takes is somebody, with the know-how, to put in the effort for a project like this - and that's exactly where the value comes from - effort

Yodd · Apr 7, 2016

Have you checked into how much it would cost for a build house to assemble these for you?

Cause at 1 hour per board, I dunno...that could make it hard to meet demand.

Or perhaps getting some stencils created.

pixeljunkie · Apr 7, 2016

Xian Xi said:
For what it does I don't see a problem at all at $160. I was thinking it would be about $150-160ish with all the time to assemble.

this :thumbsup:

mikejmoffitt · Apr 7, 2016

Yodd said:
Have you checked into how much it would cost for a build house to assemble these for you?

Cause at 1 hour per board, I dunno...that could make it hard to meet demand.

Or perhaps getting some stencils created.

That's actually precisely where this price comes from. I've found a good manufacturing house, recommended for low-volume. That's why $100 isn't going to cut it - it's not my labor making up the cost, it is theirs!

After working a little more on the bill of materials I have it down to where I think $140 - $150 will cut it. Hey, it's a little bit better!

Niko · Apr 7, 2016

$150 ~ $160 is very fair price.

People where already paying ~$300 for an xrgb which isnt as nice as this. So half the price for a better product? Sign me the fuck up.

Granted this is specific for the neo, but still. I think the price is fair.

mikejmoffitt · Apr 7, 2016

Niko49 said:
$150 ~ $160 is very fair price.

People where already paying ~$300 for an xrgb which isnt as nice as this. So half the price for a better product? Sign me the fuck up.

Granted this is specific for the neo, but still. I think the price is fair.

Actually, as a minor point of consolation, this can in theory support just about every '80s - early '90s arcade game (that has an exposed DAC). On some weekend I'll probably add support for WMS games (Joust, Robotron, etc) alongside Pac-Man, because I have access to those games. If I remember correctly Bubble Bobble has a particularly tricky custom DAC IC; this might be a decent replacement to give it some extra options. Of course, I haven't got Bubble Bobble.

tl;dr let me borrow your arcade PCBs and I will see about adding support

fenikso · Apr 7, 2016

A buck fiddy is reasonable. Is it as low as we'd all like? No, but we all live in the real world, and if that's the price it takes to make it worth your while then we're all happy to pay it.

PS - If you put a list of possible compatible boards up, some of the members on here might be able to lend you them for testing. I have a Jaleco Mega System32, I could lend you if you think it's compatible. (though I have no interest in consolizing it, it would be for the benifit of others)

lions3 · Apr 7, 2016

yeah, $150 sounds like what I was expecting. Since I only need one for my CMVS I don't see this price as a huge problem. Well and maybe one for CPS2 later on.

fluxcore · Apr 7, 2016

Niko49 said:
$150 ~ $160 is very fair price.

People where already paying ~$300 for an xrgb which isnt as nice as this. So half the price for a better product? Sign me the fuck up.

Granted this is specific for the neo, but still. I think the price is fair.

The main differentiator (aside from direct digital conversion etc) between this and the xrgb is that the xrgb can be used on just about any input source, whenever you like. At the moment at least, the NeoVGA is limited to just one device (but potentially can be firmware flashed to others) and is hard-installed into it. If I'm throwing down ~$200 I'm really more interested in something which can be used across different boards etc - even if that means wiring up a specific socket for a (potential) external NeoVGA board.

buaku · Apr 7, 2016

I'd pay the $160. Still seems like a fair enough price.

mikejmoffitt · Apr 9, 2016

I have my finger on the trigger for ordering the first manufactured PCB.

I made a few tiny changes to improve usability for hooking up the outputs, some more capacitors, and...

Xian Xi · Apr 9, 2016

Nice.

mikejmoffitt · Apr 9, 2016

Alright, the manufactured board has been ordered. Should be about twelve days.

DaytimeDreamer · Apr 10, 2016

mikejmoffitt said:
Alright, the manufactured board has been ordered. Should be about twelve days.

Very nice. How many boards have you ordered as a first run batch?

mikejmoffitt · Apr 10, 2016

I ordered one board to ensure it's built correctly and I haven't made any egregious errors. Once that's good then the first ten boards will be made.

McColbo · Apr 10, 2016

Haha where and how long is the waiting list for the first 10

lions3 · Apr 10, 2016

Once you get that one back and if it works as expected, you should take pre-orders for that first batch. I would bet there's going to be far more interest than 10. I know you don't want to probably front the cash for more than 10, so I would suggest getting the forum to preorder the boards... so less out of pocket $$ to you.

Or am I misunderstand. Would these first 10 basically be V1.0 releases that would allow you to make sure the board works in the wild. Well before doing a much bigger order of boards?

mikejmoffitt · Apr 10, 2016

The first ten are pre-order units for one member. After that is done, and those boards work well and there aren't changes for me to make, then I can open up to doing public batches. I still have to write documentation for these too.

Tyranix95 · Apr 10, 2016

This is rad. Excited to see the results.

---

If this is a smash, which I'm sure it will be, then perhaps someone--hint, hint--can come up with a better type of "GBS-8220" Low-Med-Hi Res scalier.

DaytimeDreamer · Apr 11, 2016

mikejmoffitt said:
The first ten are pre-order units for one member. After that is done, and those boards work well and there aren't changes for me to make, then I can open up to doing public batches. I still have to write documentation for these too.

Well thought approach. After those first 10 units I'm guessing you'll have more than a 100 boards as a first run in total. Most members that are interested (including myself) I'm sure will purchase more than one board.

GTRetro87 · Apr 11, 2016

just tell me where to sign my name and send payment cause I'm dying for this

mikejmoffitt · Apr 12, 2016

Soon, soon! I'm waiting on my first manufactured one to arrive. Today the status changed to 'Processing' so fingers crossed.

DrHuxtable · Apr 13, 2016

Sorry if it's been answered already but how far out would CPS2 be after a successful Neo launch? It would be cool to have a website/thread where we can view status of upcoming game support and pre-order. I'm sure Arcade Projects would love to add a section for you

Overall, I think you'll sell boat loads of these over time as you add more games. This is where collecting is heading as CRTs continue to disappear.

mikejmoffitt · Apr 13, 2016

CPS2 is fully working right now. The wiring is a little less intuitive, as the labels on the PCB don't match the signal names, but with a wiring diagram it's easy. Nintendo 64 support remains unsupported/at your own risk, but I have that bitstream too.

This weekend I might mess with the Joust hardware finally.

NeoVGA: Lagless, pixel-perfect line doubler for Neo-Geo MVS and AES

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