SS3 is underrated
- Thread starter MarrymeMai
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SS2 is a god among video games. It shares it's rank with FFS as being one of the greatest games ever. I mean, who doesn't think Sieger's stage/music isn't badass? Or Galfords? Every person's stage and music in SS2 is unparalleled. I like SS2 the best, followed by SS4, SS3 and SS1, but I love 'em all. Some people spend too much time hatin' on games to actually sit down and play and have some damn fun.
And some people take the time to properly evaluate a game before they go off to proclaim it as being great or horrible.
Here's a few facts on SS4.
Fact #1: 99% of all jump-in combos are gone.
Fact #2: It is impossible to buffer moves out of block stun.
Fact #3: Many animation cuts were made.
Fact #4: Many specials were removed.
Fact #5: Fewer stages, less music.
Fact #6: An A slash will stuff anything stronger a good 85% of the time.
These are not random proclamations. These are indisputable facts. You can claim otherwise all you like, but it's like arguing that sunlight gives no warmth. The evidence is right there in front of you. You can choose to accept it or deny it as is your wont, but it doesn't change the fact.
But then, I guess I'm just "hatin'" and don't know how to have fun with my games. Twit.
-Deuce
Here's a few facts on SS4.
Fact #1: 99% of all jump-in combos are gone.
Fact #2: It is impossible to buffer moves out of block stun.
Fact #3: Many animation cuts were made.
Fact #4: Many specials were removed.
Fact #5: Fewer stages, less music.
Fact #6: An A slash will stuff anything stronger a good 85% of the time.
These are not random proclamations. These are indisputable facts. You can claim otherwise all you like, but it's like arguing that sunlight gives no warmth. The evidence is right there in front of you. You can choose to accept it or deny it as is your wont, but it doesn't change the fact.
But then, I guess I'm just "hatin'" and don't know how to have fun with my games. Twit.
-Deuce
If your talking to Chriz-77, don't bother. That guy shoots himself in the foot every 6 months. Last year it was with Ralph Karel's Metal Slug scam, then it was with Buster Broon, and now he's just talking smack about SSIV being good. Good yeah, it's good. I mean, better to play than say Double Dragon. But it's not better than III. The whole reason people shit on III was, IMO, that it didn't have endings. SSIII was just way ahead of its time. Now a game like MvC2, Tekken 3,TT,4, KoF 98, or KoF 2002 doesn't have endings and people don't complain at all. But back then it was different. SSIII was like the first to do it, and it pissed people off. Following that, people looked for other things to complain about - so they complained about the infinites. But Come on, infinites were all over the place in KoF 95, 97, and even in SSIV. So what made SSIV better than SSIII? It had less backgrounds, the sprites were bloated, the backgrounds were bloated (some looked seriously stretched, like they were meant to be 75% smaller, and you couldn't block into a counter attack. But it had endings. Oh yeah, and suicides. Gotta love suicides, because you can make a whole new game out of SSIV - "how fast can you suicide?"
I really didn't like what happened with some characters in SSIV though. Like Ukyo, just got raped. Look at his Musouzankouka and tell me with a straight face that it looks as good as it was in SSIII. You can't.
Even Amakusa - seriously - Amakusa looked and played more interesting in SSIII. In SSIII his normal moves sucked, but he was a skill character that you couldn't just win with by lucky. Then in SSIV they give him full screen attacks, the cheesiest fireball in videogames up to 1997, and to add insult to injury, they make him look fatter. Come on.
Well, I know I sound like I hate SSIV. I don't. I like playing as Kazuki. I enjoy Hanzo, even though in SSIV he's Fatzo. And Genjuro, despite his lack of cool combos has some good color combinations. I don't think that warrants enough for people to claim it better than SSIII, but then some people will never agree on which KoF is the best all around KoF. Even though that KoF is still 98.
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I'm guessing this was directed towards me (mainly because you emphasized 'hatin' right after my post), so I'll retaliate:
What makes me a twit? Because I refuse to sit around and make posts about why I don't like certain Neo games? I can sit around all day and make posts about why I think Fatal Fury 2 isn't as good as Fatal Fury Special. Or why I hate such and such game. In the end, it's pretty non-productive, no? Why not sit with a game and find a reason to like it and play it? When you go to play you'll have a much larger selection to enjoy.
This is why I now have new-found respect for EvilWasabi. He dislikes SS4, yet he can state reasons why he still likes to play it. That is a mark of a true gamer, and SS lover. I'm sorry, but after going through thousands of posts of "this kof sucks" or "all the art of fighting games suck" or "the only good Fatal Fury is MOTW", it makes me wonder how many people are real fans of this system.
You can throw anybody "indisputable facts", but in the end the case is still up to a person's "indisputable opinion" to make the judge for themself, and I don't think I need anybody trying to tell me what I should like/dislike.
Oh, don't get me wrong. I don't hate SS4... I just regard it as the least of the series, a rather grandiose disappointment. Certainly undeserving of all the adulation it receives, as it's not even half the game SS2 or SS3 are... particularly in light of what it could have been.
Bearing all that in mind, I'll still take it over any SF2/SFA iteration. I liked the Kazama brothers (though I could've done without the SS2 returners). But I don't regard it as anything even remotely close to the top tier of the Neo catalog.
By the way, Wasabi, Hanzo wasn't redrawn in SS4, as I recall. The only SS3 alumni who got actual redraws were Nakoruru and Gaira, with Amakusa, Shizumaru and Rimururu getting touchups for their actual attacks. None of them are "fatter." The sprites are the same as they were in SS3, just not as many and with ugly palettes. Same goes for the backgrounds. They had stuff added, and reduced color depth, but they weren't "stretched." Sprite rips can show you that in any case.
No one's as much of an SS fan(atic) as Wasabi, at least on this side of the pond. There's no disputing that in my mind. At any rate, I tend to think ill of those who make the blanket statement that those who dislike a particular game are just no good at it, haven't played it enough, or are looking for excuses not to like it. Believe me, I wanted to like SS4. Hell, I wrote the damn FAQ for it. When I got it, I was all fired up to believe it'd be the best thing since sliced bread. Indeed, I made many excuses for its shortcomings back in the day on the mailing list... to EX Andy, of all people, someone with whom one does not debate lightly. But the more I played, the less I wanted to. I played some pretty heavy-duty versus games, and plenty of vs. CPU time, and the game simply isn't particularly fun to me. Does that make me somehow less of a Neo fan? Sure, right, you win, whatever.
Considering that I'm one of the seemingly miniscule number who actually finds Warrior's Rage 2 enjoyable, I don't think anyone can (rightly) accuse me of not being able to find positive things about any given game. I don't make snap judgements. That's very much not in my character. I evaluate things from every angle before I form an opinion. And as most people who know me can attest, there's no swaying me once it's formed unless you can conclusively prove to me that my opinion is based on false information. And in SS4's case, it's not. My dislike for the game is quite quantifiable, and utterly justified. If that makes you somehow respect me less, well, I can't say I'll lose sleep over it. This is getting seriously rambly, so I think I'll wrap up. Agree if you want, or don't. I'm not overly concerned about it.
-Deuce
Bearing all that in mind, I'll still take it over any SF2/SFA iteration. I liked the Kazama brothers (though I could've done without the SS2 returners). But I don't regard it as anything even remotely close to the top tier of the Neo catalog.
By the way, Wasabi, Hanzo wasn't redrawn in SS4, as I recall. The only SS3 alumni who got actual redraws were Nakoruru and Gaira, with Amakusa, Shizumaru and Rimururu getting touchups for their actual attacks. None of them are "fatter." The sprites are the same as they were in SS3, just not as many and with ugly palettes. Same goes for the backgrounds. They had stuff added, and reduced color depth, but they weren't "stretched." Sprite rips can show you that in any case.
No one's as much of an SS fan(atic) as Wasabi, at least on this side of the pond. There's no disputing that in my mind. At any rate, I tend to think ill of those who make the blanket statement that those who dislike a particular game are just no good at it, haven't played it enough, or are looking for excuses not to like it. Believe me, I wanted to like SS4. Hell, I wrote the damn FAQ for it. When I got it, I was all fired up to believe it'd be the best thing since sliced bread. Indeed, I made many excuses for its shortcomings back in the day on the mailing list... to EX Andy, of all people, someone with whom one does not debate lightly. But the more I played, the less I wanted to. I played some pretty heavy-duty versus games, and plenty of vs. CPU time, and the game simply isn't particularly fun to me. Does that make me somehow less of a Neo fan? Sure, right, you win, whatever.
Considering that I'm one of the seemingly miniscule number who actually finds Warrior's Rage 2 enjoyable, I don't think anyone can (rightly) accuse me of not being able to find positive things about any given game. I don't make snap judgements. That's very much not in my character. I evaluate things from every angle before I form an opinion. And as most people who know me can attest, there's no swaying me once it's formed unless you can conclusively prove to me that my opinion is based on false information. And in SS4's case, it's not. My dislike for the game is quite quantifiable, and utterly justified. If that makes you somehow respect me less, well, I can't say I'll lose sleep over it. This is getting seriously rambly, so I think I'll wrap up. Agree if you want, or don't. I'm not overly concerned about it.
-Deuce
I'll be the first to admit I like 4 over 3. BTW Deuce may remember who I am- an old-time SSML person who you did tech support for once.
Every SS game except the original has something to drive me nuts.
SS2 annoyed me with it's screwy hit detection. I do feel it was the best balanced of the SS games- without resorting to XvSF balance. Ukyo had problems with a couple characters if I remember right- so he wasn't any worse then SSF Sagat.
SS3 Really Really annoyed me. My main reasons
1) A sucky Amakusa who's main trick was the 50% low kicks of death, and
2) The easiest infinates of any Neo game I've played. Few people remember Samurai 3 as infinte heaven. Slash/Bust annoys me in both 3 and 4.
SS4 has a number of minor things that annoy me. Overpowered EX moves for some characters, some things left out, Wan-Fu left out and Tam Tam put in.
The new characters in 3 and 4 were a mixes bag also- Rimururu and Shizumaru are K'=vel bad designs. Basara and Gaira were pretty neat, and Amakusa, I'd have liked a hybrid SS3/4 Amakusa- but they never got him right. Kazuki and Sogetsu were very generic.
Overall though, SS4 is annoying but not bad. 2 is best of series. 3 is crap. 1 is basic but classic.
Every SS game except the original has something to drive me nuts.
SS2 annoyed me with it's screwy hit detection. I do feel it was the best balanced of the SS games- without resorting to XvSF balance. Ukyo had problems with a couple characters if I remember right- so he wasn't any worse then SSF Sagat.
SS3 Really Really annoyed me. My main reasons
1) A sucky Amakusa who's main trick was the 50% low kicks of death, and
2) The easiest infinates of any Neo game I've played. Few people remember Samurai 3 as infinte heaven. Slash/Bust annoys me in both 3 and 4.
SS4 has a number of minor things that annoy me. Overpowered EX moves for some characters, some things left out, Wan-Fu left out and Tam Tam put in.
The new characters in 3 and 4 were a mixes bag also- Rimururu and Shizumaru are K'=vel bad designs. Basara and Gaira were pretty neat, and Amakusa, I'd have liked a hybrid SS3/4 Amakusa- but they never got him right. Kazuki and Sogetsu were very generic.
Overall though, SS4 is annoying but not bad. 2 is best of series. 3 is crap. 1 is basic but classic.
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I only have ss1,ss2 (ngh + mvs), and the recent ss3 ngh.
.. and for some reason I'm having a ball playing ss3, its refreshing. I dig the high damage, shit if I got hit with a standing C from a sharp katana I would expect more than half my life to dissapear also.
Its so dark compared to the "cartoony" ss2 and 1, I still havent spent enough time on 3 to make a decision on it (only had it 3days), but I was upset to find out it had no real endings. frown
.. and for some reason I'm having a ball playing ss3, its refreshing. I dig the high damage, shit if I got hit with a standing C from a sharp katana I would expect more than half my life to dissapear also.
Its so dark compared to the "cartoony" ss2 and 1, I still havent spent enough time on 3 to make a decision on it (only had it 3days), but I was upset to find out it had no real endings. frown
daybona
Juz,
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I've played one and two for quite some time and when I put in three, I was quite taken aback. It is very different. Gone is the slow choppy (albeit classic) gameplay of the first two. It has been replaced by faster, more strategic gameplay and much smoother animation. I am also a huge fan of the dark "NinjaScrollesque" atmosphere. I love all samurai showdowns, but three is definitely worth owning and enjoying especially compared to the bloated price tag of four...
You don't need the 4th part. If you've Samsho 5! That's a fact, so it´s not underrated imo! It still contains some nice characters and endings, but take a look at the washed graphics, lack of dedicated bgs/BGMs, insane imbalance, gameplay physics :No more Comment! 
ShikiMikoto
Mature's Make-up Artist
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wow...bumped almost a year later...time goes by quick...I remember it as if not long ago...
SS3 is a totally different experience from 4...I hate it, but I've decided it's not necessary to compare it to SS4 anymore...so forget it.
SS3 is a totally different experience from 4...I hate it, but I've decided it's not necessary to compare it to SS4 anymore...so forget it.
ShikiMikoto said:
That's cool. I didn't see the anti-SSIII sentiment until 1998. Before that people all seemed to like SSIII and SSIV. But time passes and our tastes for things becomes more defined.
Sadly, a game like SSV or the recent KoFs will not get that honor, because there isn't an arcade scene to compliment them.
kafuin_gaira
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i like sam3, but i'm horrible at it compared to 2 or 4. maybe one of these days i'll pick it back up and give it another shot.
kafuin_gaira
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i agree EW, i only wish he would have retained his moves from 3 in either 4 or 0/V 