Retro Gamer magazine's terrible Metal Slug feature --reviewed!

qube said:

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WOAH!!

aegreatone said:

i'm 100% latino and i never tried to act black or white in my life. Thank you, I'm trying to become a Radiologist.

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I really don't give a rat's ass about flaming or hysterics or anything Internet-drama related anymore, but I am a big fan of truth and reality, and the reality of this situation is that aegreatone is a white kid.

For the newbies...

A few years back he posted some pics of himself with some semi-famous-at-the-time southern US rappers. He was claiming he was their producer or manager or roadie or something. The pics were real, and who knows, he may have actually been professionally involved with these people.

He was as white as ivory snow in those pics though, and he stood out like a sore thumb, which may actually support his claim of a professional relationship. Why else would a bunch of gangstas hang out with a gangly video-game playing cracker nerd.

He tried to deny that that was him in the pics a short while later, after everyone started ripping on him for being a wigger. Which makes me really believe it was him in the first place. If I were going to lie about hanging out with the gangstas, I'd claim I was one of the brothas, and not the honky.

Doesn't really matter anyway, cause it looks like the guy gotz banned yo. Ha ha ha. Tora-Kouhi-lite smack-posting mothafucka.

Holla.

tsukaesugi said:

He was as white as ivory snow in those pics though, and he stood out like a sore thumb, which may actually support his claim of a professional relationship. Why else would a bunch of gangstas hang out with a gangly video-game playing cracker nerd.

Holla.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icb_tRTnA4g

tsukaesugi said:

I really don't give a rat's ass about flaming or hysterics or anything Internet-drama related anymore, but I am a big fan of truth and reality, and the reality of this situation is that aegreatone is a white kid.

For the newbies...

A few years back he posted some pics of himself with some semi-famous-at-the-time southern US rappers. He was claiming he was their producer or manager or roadie or something. The pics were real, and who knows, he may have actually been professionally involved with these people.

He was as white as ivory snow in those pics though, and he stood out like a sore thumb, which may actually support his claim of a professional relationship. Why else would a bunch of gangstas hang out with a gangly video-game playing cracker nerd.

He tried to deny that that was him in the pics a short while later, after everyone started ripping on him for being a wigger. Which makes me really believe it was him in the first place. If I were going to lie about hanging out with the gangstas, I'd claim I was one of the brothas, and not the honky.

Doesn't really matter anyway, cause it looks like the guy gotz banned yo. Ha ha ha. Tora-Kouhi-lite smack-posting mothafucka.

Holla.

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Thanks for the heads up!

You know us newbs are AFRAID to use the search engine

Saves time to just get the cliff's notes.

It's threads like this which make me thankful I'm only a very minor geek.

Also, Metal Slug is overrated and Retro Gamer is awesome.

aegreatone said:

i'm 100% latino and i never tried to act black or white in my life. Thank you, I'm trying to become a Radiologist.

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you would never score high enough on the MCAT to get into medical school. Your poor English skills alone bar you from any professional job.

Spectre said:

It's threads like this which make me thankful I'm only a very minor geek.

Also, Metal Slug is overrated and Retro Gamer is awesome.

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Apoligize and we are still okay,don't apologize and

F'n Awesome

Deuce said:

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HAHAHAHA

So I finally found a BN that had the mag in it (had to drive all the way to fucking Roseville) and read the "article"...what a fucking crock of shit. Bobak was too kind.

I'm not going to regurgitate what he posted, but HOLY FUCK Stewie didn't research a goddamn thing other than hitting up Wikipedia/GameFAQs and playing Anthology. I love how his writeup of MS5 is less than 5 sentances long; his concluding sentance goes something like "other than that, it's business as usual, so let's move along shall we?" Classic bullshit way to get out of writing something you failed to research in time. I was in high school, and I remember pulling that shit out when the paper was due and I didn't have the energy to finish my last bullet point.

Also, I love how he rags on MS3's difficulty, then chides people for doing the same thing to MS Advance.

Plus, the fucker didn't even include all of the ports, as MS3 XBLA is missing, as are all of the WiiWare Metal Slugs (all of which were available when he wrote the article). All of the info for the original arcade versions of the games are just ripped from a wiki so he has more time to elaborate on the Playstation versions.

It's also funny how heavily they relied on formatting: each page had about two paragraphs of info tops, and had the other 80% of the page filled out with random sprites and screenshots. There was maybe, MAYBE a page's worth of words in the entire spread, which might actually be a good thing considering Stewie's horrible writing style.

I also love how the fucker got out of reviewing the mobile versions by whining "there's too many" and "teh keypad is bad for shooters!!1!".

In summary: by reading the actual article and judging for myself, I think it's actually worse than what people have been pointing out here. It's apparent that Stewie just got a couple of Playstation ports, the handheld versions and Anthology for his "research", and spent so much time fucking around with useless extras that he forgot to write about the actual fucking games.

And yes, he does state that Metal Slug has only 5 levels. FACTUAL ERROR #1 CONFIRMED

aegreatone tried to fuck with the Neo Pope. That'll learn him, mayne.

All that time he was pretending to be a black music producer or roadie or whatever... when I saw the photos of the lilly white kid I seriously lol'd.

Ah...finally after 48 pages and 1187 posts, I've read it all, seen it all and am totally proud to be a member of the Neo Community. My major fault this time was not catching on to this thread when it first started so I missed out on some fresh drama. Here's another vote for 'Best of...' and as I always say: IT'S OFFICIAL!!!

Ans since I've been known to do this in the ever-loving Wrestling Thread, without further ado:

Total Posts: 1,188

User Name - Posts

RevStu 100
lithy 68
Sam Madeupname 54
Jedah Doma 39
TonK 37
AncientFlounder 36
Praise the Lard 36
Deuce 36
Takumaji 32
Steve 31
KanYozakura 30
wasabi 29
kernow 28
strider 23
Rade 17
qube 17
Abasuto 17
RocketLawnChair 17
Neogeofan12 16
OrochiEddie 15
Mike Bevan 15
Mai-bukkake 14
OMF2097 13
Late 13
SIXPACK 13
Professor Denim 12
Edge Of Heaven (aka RevStu) 12
kspiff 12
genjiglove 11
norton9478 11
Neo Alec 11
Lovergoat 11
djdelly 10
Twinkle Star 10
ki_atsushi 9
HeartlessNinny 9
Kiselgof 9
NeoTheranthrope 9
GunstarHero 9
Sp0o/\/?! 8
Frankly 8
synbiosfan 8
Bobak 8
mmsadda 7
GhostLop 7
Koopa64 7
LoneSage 7
Ghost-Dog 7
zer0hue 6
aegreatone 6
Domino-chan 6
Nesagwa 6
Decepticreep 6
Mercenary X99 6
Spike Spiegel 6
StickmanLoser 6
Lagduf 6
Jibbajaba 5
DUTCH ANDY 5
striderpunk 5
ironish 5
Michael Yagami 5
YuckMud 5
finngamer 5
Lastblade 4
Rot 4
Mayhem 4
rarehero 4
tony starks 4
kitkit.com 4
Geddon_jt 4
joeaverage 4
aMithos 4
Mike 3
slerch666 3
astrodan88 3
wizkid007 3
Tarma 3
Snuh 3
ForeverSublime 3
butta 3
payment_due 3
kazuo 3
Reality Check 3
Duddyroar 2
Will Graham 2
OrochiSaffron 2
Kiel 2
jro 2
fenikso 2
BigTinz 2
Aypok 2
cools 2
RAINBOW PONY 2
Rain 2
Vectorman0 2
Lloyd Mangram 2
Dampfwalze 1
nam1972 1
pza 1
ORPHEUS 1
Gameoz 1
AirRaid 1
buster_broon 1
Neco_Coneco 1
FairlanePhantom 1
Spectre 1
Aaron D 1
ninjaboyjohn 1
O. Yashiro 1
chrisr 1
DecepticonZero 1
Wes 1
hermosaguy 1
Bskull 1
Average Joe 1
Coryoon 1
hanafuda 1
riskVSreward 1
massimiliano 1
Pentarou 1
frazer99 1
ilazul 1
twalden 1
Lets Gekiga In 1
Darklighterx 1
DEL 1
Baseley09 1
ookitarepanda 1
tsukaesugi 1
Ruell 1
xiao_haozi 1
insaneben 1
Zenimus 1
caleb1883 1
sliceypete 1
Chainclaw 1
MeTaLCzAr 1
Bibliophile 1
Hentai Sama 1
Arcademan 1
Tyrannosatan 1
skot 1

Damn but that's a mass of humanity

Arcademan said:

Damn but that's a mass of humanity

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It's a mass of something all right.

DUTCH ANDY said:

Apoligize and we are still okay,don't apologize and

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Tbh I'm just talking out of my ass, I only own the original so am in no position to comment

Spectre said:

Tbh I'm just talking out of my ass, I only own the original so am in no position to comment

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So am i,just having some fun with my new e-persona(username)

KanYozakura said:

So I finally found a BN that had the mag in it (had to drive all the way to fucking Roseville) and read the "article"...what a fucking crock of shit. Bobak was too kind.

I'm not going to regurgitate what he posted, but HOLY FUCK Stewie didn't research a goddamn thing other than hitting up Wikipedia/GameFAQs and playing Anthology. I love how his writeup of MS5 is less than 5 sentances long; his concluding sentance goes something like "other than that, it's business as usual, so let's move along shall we?" Classic bullshit way to get out of writing something you failed to research in time. I was in high school, and I remember pulling that shit out when the paper was due and I didn't have the energy to finish my last bullet point.

Also, I love how he rags on MS3's difficulty, then chides people for doing the same thing to MS Advance.

Plus, the fucker didn't even include all of the ports, as MS3 XBLA is missing, as are all of the WiiWare Metal Slugs (all of which were available when he wrote the article). All of the info for the original arcade versions of the games are just ripped from a wiki so he has more time to elaborate on the Playstation versions.

It's also funny how heavily they relied on formatting: each page had about two paragraphs of info tops, and had the other 80% of the page filled out with random sprites and screenshots. There was maybe, MAYBE a page's worth of words in the entire spread, which might actually be a good thing considering Stewie's horrible writing style.

I also love how the fucker got out of reviewing the mobile versions by whining "there's too many" and "teh keypad is bad for shooters!!1!".

In summary: by reading the actual article and judging for myself, I think it's actually worse than what people have been pointing out here. It's apparent that Stewie just got a couple of Playstation ports, the handheld versions and Anthology for his "research", and spent so much time fucking around with useless extras that he forgot to write about the actual fucking games.

And yes, he does state that Metal Slug has only 5 levels. FACTUAL ERROR #1 CONFIRMED

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Wow is this still going?
And again you've still missed the point of what the definitive is about It's to mark significant additions and changes to the gameplay, not to simply list every port that's ever been released. Still good try though.

strider said:

Wow is this still going?
And again you've still missed the point of what the definitive is about It's to mark significant additions and changes to the gameplay, not to simply list every port that's ever been released. Still good try though.

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He's retarded, don't worry about it.

Ignore him and he'll probably go away...

strider said:

Wow is this still going?
And again you've still missed the point of what the definitive is about It's to mark significant additions and changes to the gameplay, not to simply list every port that's ever been released. Still good try though.

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That's funny...the only "gameplay" he really talked about was in the Metal Slug Advanced section, and maybe that half-asses SNES comparison in the intro. Like I said above, his "analysis" of MS5 was a couple of sentences long and lacking any substance whatsoever. The main focus of the article was on the additions to the Playstation ports. You can spin it all you want, and I really don't care what the intention of the article was. The finished product is terribly written and padded with formatting.

strider said:

Wow is this still going?
And again you've still missed the point of what the definitive is about It's to mark significant additions and changes to the gameplay, not to simply list every port that's ever been released. Still good try though.

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Actually, you know what sounds retarded...

Darran, in his own words

Okay, I put off responding to an earlier comment by Darran since I assumed Rot had ended everything. But since Darran is apparently still scanning this thread, I thought I'd reply to this unresolved comment to me:

strider said:

Plus I never said what you've stated, but you're free to interpret my silence here any way you choose.

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So what did I say he said?

Bobak said:

-- In a moment where I assume he didn't actually read the original post, Darran (lead editor of RG) starts repeating Stuart Campbell's argument that a lack of errors removes any accusations of poor writing, omissions, etc... (which has no logical basis). He then basically expresses: "Oh, what can I do? Its not my problem. So I won't do anything." I'm sure I'm not the only one who's studied leadership and management in school; and one aspect of a good leader is the willingness take whatever responsibility --real or perceived-- they can muster to control damage to their organization; not dismissing it on a technicality.

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All right, let's take a look at what Darran said in this thread, and see if it matches:

Your original post in this thread, dismissive as it was, addressed the poor writing in the article by noting:

strider said:

Stuart is meticulous in his research and I trust him 110% with whatever he writes. He's been writing these articles now for a very long time, and no one has ever been able to recall a game he's missed or pointed out something that's factually incorrect about what he's missing.

If I didn't think his article was up to scratch then I wouldn't include it in the magazine. It's that simple.

You're getting Stuart's opinions and thoughts about the series confused with him actually stating them as facts, which he isn't.

If you can't point out things that are factually incorrect then great, you've got a solid argument, but at this moment in time in does very much come across like "this article is rubbish because it doesn't agree with what are generally accepted opinions" which is totally different. On the other hand, you're obviously entitled to your opinion and it's good to know that there are gamers out there who still have a hell of a lot of passion for their favourite games.

Peace Out. I'm off to play Metal Gear Ocelot.

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Where did I say that I assumed this was meant as a dry, pure-fact/no-opinion article? Answer: nowhere --only Stuart, in his unprofessional hysterics, said something like that because he misinterpreted by accusations that he put out terrible work product with the conclusion that I meant that only a serious, dry article would work. Considering I've regularly complimented RG on this site, I'm obviously aware of the light hearted, humorous tone that's present throughout (and occasional errors in each issue). The problem with the Metal Slug piece is it was terrible by the standards of what we came to appreciate in RG.

I said it was poorly written, and you mention several times above that, unless anyone can point out errors, then this is just a good article otherwise you would have never published it.

So you obviously didn't pay much attention to my actual criticism, it seems you came in only to defend your own decision for printing the article.

Now you do come to some comment on Mr. Campbell's actions:

strider said:

I can only apologise for any bad language he has used.

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But you never actually do it --and your comment isn't entirely accurate as a manager can obviously be much more politically astute and note that "the actions and comments of Stuart Campbell on this forum do not reflect the opinion of the editors and staff of Retro Gamer." Nope, you just say you could apologize for bad language.

But let's go to the point where you repeat your misinterpretation of my comments (something you deny above):

strider said:

I can't believe that this thread is now ten pages long and STILL no one has pointed out the many factual accuracies that Bobak has claimed in his original post. Can someone who has actually read the article and is not blindly responding to a fellow, long established forum member please list them for me, as I'd love to know what they are.

After all this time, the original poster still seems to have confused an opinion seen within the magazine as stated fact.

Show me the money as Jerry Maguire would say. Better than that, show me actual factual errors, because at the moment this is still reading like "I will slander someone because they don't agree that Metal Slug 3 is the best game in the series."

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So, Darran, tell me how you can write the above then disagree with my comment that you started "repeating Stuart Campbell's argument that a lack of errors removes any accusations of poor writing, omissions, etc... (which has no logical basis)." You can't.

Also, please Darran: don't misuse legal words like "slander". I can state all of my comments on the poorly written hack job by Mr. Campbell without any fear of "slander", because they are true. Besides, as a written review, the issue would've been "libel", not "slander" if I had somehow committed some form of defamation.

But, tick-tock, you didn't stop:

strider said:

So we're getting to the end of yet another page and STILL no one has produced any proof of any factual errors within the article in question.

Why is everyone bashing Retro Gamer's integretity for poorly written articles when they've not read the article in question and are instead basing their opinions on a lengthy post that STILL doesn't make any mention of a single factual mistake that's been made within the article he's clearly so upset about.

Why are you all blindly following someone who, thanks to his first post, clearly doesn't know what he's talking about? (and by that I don't mean the metal slug franchise, but What Retro Gamer's Definitive Series is). It just doesn't make any sense.

As for posting scans I'd imagine that Imagine Publishing would demand they're taking down before you can say "but they're mummies, not zombies."

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I added the emphasis to point out this is the exact same argument your previous post, based on the idea first put forth by Mr. Campbell, that "a lack of errors removes any accusations of poor writing". You assert you never said such a thing. Well, there you are again.

strider said:

lithy said:

I'd like you to clearly state what you think about calling the enemies in Metal Slug 2 zombies.

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Why is that so important to you? Surely we should be discussing the factual errors within the article? After all that's how this all started up.

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If you read my first comment, you'd actually notice that I said the whole zombie/mummy things was "a forgivable error" and dropped it. Then you go into the "factual errors" that I supposedly started this with --only the thing is, my point was it was a poorly written article that stood out against the normal work in RG.

strider said:

The point is everything in the article he insists is factually incorrect, is not actually factually incorrect, but because he's a respected member of this forum, you'll happily believe him anyway.

He's confused the writer's opinions on the series as being a factual representation of Metal Slug's history and because he doesn't agree with the writer's opinion's he has gotten angry - something I knew would happen as soon as I fell off my chair laughing about the Metal Slug 3 entry when I first read it - which of course is completely missing the point.

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How many things did I say were factually incorrect, Darran? Why did I use the words "mess", "rushed", "unpolished", "rush job", etc. The only thing I apparently didn't understand perfectly was the poorly used [-Ed] joke (a convention I am familiar with) --and the reason it didn't quite work was because the joke was poorly done. The rest of my comments were all about how poor article quality. But no, you state that "everything in the article he insists is factually incorrect, is not actually factually incorrect". As I said in the comment you deny: "In a moment where I assume he didn't actually read the original post, Darran starts repeating Stuart Campbell's argument that a lack of errors removes any accusations of poor writing, omissions, etc..."

strider said:

A factual error is this game has 12 levels when it has 6. A factual error is Marco made his debut in Metal Slug 5.

Deciding whether a creature that exhibits the traits of several types of different undead as exhibited in a whole selection of cinematic, fantasy books and mythology (I play D&D so technically I don't consider them either to be fully zombies or mummies) is something different entirely. Still that's not going to stop someone from having the opinion that it is a factual error, which sort of brings up back around to the beginning of this whole thread.

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Good lord, the irony of this post is others even pointed out such a level mistake in the article. But the second paragraph is more of the same: you throw this mummy/zombie debate back to the first post, which is actually about poor writing. Y'know, I'd like to take this second to comment that a good writer might have put something about mummies in the write-up for 2, then allowed for a comment like "3 just took the lame mummies from 2 and swapped them with zombies." I think that basically carries the same idea that Mr. Campbell had about the "problems" with 2/X/3, but is --I dunno-- written more clearly and, frankly, better than this piece in toto.

Later, you come back to Mr. Campbell:

strider said:

Steve said:

Despite whoever may be more "right" or "wrong" (or both), as editor of Retro Gamer magazine, Darran, I'm just curious what your thoughts are to the way Stuart has conducted himself here? Some have called his behavior here unprofessional, Stu claims otherwise. He said he doesn't represent the magazine here, while some (myself included) believe there's still a code of professional honor you should uphold. Quite frankly, his behavior has been amazing, and I don't mean "amazing" in a positive light, either. Since you're the editor of the magazine, I'm wondering what your thoughts are on this general subject.

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Oh I didn't miss it.

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To go back to how I characterized your reaction, taking into account your above two comments: "He then basically expresses: "Oh, what can I do? Its not my problem. So I won't do anything." I'm sure I'm not the only one who's studied leadership and management in school; and one aspect of a good leader is the willingness take whatever responsibility --real or perceived-- they can muster to control damage to their organization; not dismissing it on a technicality."

strider said:

So how is me answering questions that are being asked hurting the magazine's reputation? Anyway I'm off to play Demon's Souls.

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Gee, I wonder:

strider said:

As for a financial stake. Do you really think upsetting 4 (I think it four, it might be more, but I could be wrong) people on a forum is going to crush world wide sales of Retro Gamer?

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This was in reply to lithy's comment "We also don't have a financial stake in anything we post as well." The funny thing is, you soon go on to backpedal:

strider said:

Um you've not read my post have you?

Of course I don't want to lose readers. Hell I hate to even lose one reader. I love my readers, they secure the future of the magazine and in these ridiculously uncertain times that's a critical thing as you've already pointed out. It's a pity if certain readers are going to stop buying the magazine because they don't like the way Stuart has conducted himself, but that's totally out of my control. I can't force you to buy the magazine.

As someone has already pointed out, regardless of how they feel about the author of an article and how they conduct themselves that isn't going to stop them from reading the mag.

I asked Lithy "Do you really think upsetting 4 (I think it four, it might be more, but I could be wrong) people on a forum is going to crush world wide sales of Retro Gamer?"

And yet somehow you're attributing a question I asked him to my own personal opinion about how I feel.

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I'm going to be honest, I don't think anyone would interpret your words in any other way than how they sounded --and the need to write several paragraphs to defend it only shows how well-conveyed the first message was.

strider said:

Well I know that I don't like the way Amy Winehouse conducts herself in public, but that won't stop me from listening to Back to Black. That's me though.

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And yet the studio who publishes Winehouse's music would be quick to state that her words and actions do not reflect them --the logical parallel to your relationship to Mr. Campbell.

Let's bring out the next few comments:

strider said:

So let me get this straight, you want me to publically tell Stuart off for his behaviour on a public forum is that right? Is that how people you know are usually told off then?

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To repeat: "He then basically expresses: "Oh, what can I do? Its not my problem. So I won't do anything." I'm sure I'm not the only one who's studied leadership and management in school; and one aspect of a good leader is the willingness take whatever responsibility --real or perceived-- they can muster to control damage to their organization; not dismissing it on a technicality."

Your next post asks for a little more parsing:

strider said:

Didn't I always say that I'm not going to address Stuart's behaviour on a public forum? That's just not professional is it.

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Actually it is. Companies find themselves having to do it all the time. Its called PR.

strider said:

Also, I'm pretty sure I made a public apology about his language very early on in the thread (page two I think), but it was conveniently ignored.

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Really? Where? All you said was "I can only apologise for any bad language he has used." --and you never did.

strider said:

Oh and as for the readership thing I never said I couldn't care about losing readers, but as you've already made your mind up about me (despite all the coverage I've given this site in the past) I guess it doesn't really matter now does it.*

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As I said in my first post, I had nothing but goodwill towards the magazine. While Mr. Campbell had a hissy-fit because he's unprofessional... You backed yourself into that corner.

strider said:

To save me trawling through the last 13 odd pages can I still have that list of PROPER factual errors please and not anything relating to what the individual in question felt should have been in the article?

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Yet again, you state only the presence of factual errors equals poor writing.
Something you deny you said in your very next post (the one at the top of this thread), which asked for this more thorough response.

I look forward to hearing back, if you're still interested. How did I misinterpret what you said again?

I thought it was cool that they just had a big feature about metal slug. But what do I know, I'm a casual MS fan.

Where is Stinky when you need him?

I've never been a fan of Stuart Campbell (much too self-important for my tastes), but his behaviour in this thread has been appalling. Sure, he may feel that the TC was being rude and was wrong, but that doesn't give him an excuse to launch into the tirade he replied with.

I mean, come on Stu, you've been getting so much abuse on the internet over the years surely it's water off a duck's back now?