Bush administration stages conversation with troops

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

On the news tonight they are saying that the administration deceived the public on a discussion between the president and a group of soldiers. Scott McClellan said that the discussion would be open and that the soldiers would be able to say whatever they wanted. But as it turns out, the news stations got a feed of a white house staffer coaching the soldiers on what Bush was going to say and how they should answer the question.

So basically, they can't sell the war to people by telling the truth, so they make shit up. One guy on the news was saying that this is overwhelmingly blatant.

Feel free to reply even if you don't like what I say.

JHendrix · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
On the news tonight they are saying that the administration deceived the public on a discussion between the president and a group of soldiers. Scott McClellan said that the discussion would be open and that the soldiers would be able to say whatever they wanted. But as it turns out, the news stations got a feed of a white house staffer coaching the soldiers on what Bush was going to say and how they should answer the question.

So basically, they can't sell the war to people by telling the truth, so they make shit up. One guy on the news was saying that this is overwhelmingly blatant.

Feel free to reply even if you don't like what I say.

Not that I don't believe you, but link please?

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

The soldiers were briefed on the general questions the President would ask but did not use prepared responses.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/nation/president/2004-10-03-bush-troops_x.htm

Troops in survey back Bush 4-to-1 over Kerry

By Dave Moniz, USA TODAY

An unscientific survey of U.S. military personnel shows they support President Bush for re-election by a 4-to-1 ratio. Two-thirds of those responding said John Kerry's anti-war activities after he returned from Vietnam make them less likely to vote for him.

In the survey of more than 4,000 full-time and part-time troops, 73% said they would vote for Bush if the election were held today; 18% said they would vote for Kerry. Of the respondents, 59% identified themselves as Republicans, 20% as independents and 13% as Democrats.

The survey was conducted Sept. 15-28 by the Army Times Publishing Co., which distributes the weekly newspapers Army Times, Navy Times, Air Force Times and Marine Corps Times. (Army Times Publishing is owned by Gannett, which also publishes USA TODAY.)

Army Times Publishing sent e-mails to more than 31,000 subscribers and received 4,165 responses on a secure Web site. The publisher cautioned that the results are not a scientific poll. Its readers are older, higher in rank and more career-oriented than the military as a whole.

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

Not true. They showed a guy answering the question in rehearsal on NBC nightly news tonight. Unfortunately I don't have a link since it was on TV.

Tacitus · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
On the news tonight they are saying that the administration deceived the public on a discussion between the president and a group of soldiers. Scott McClellan said that the discussion would be open and that the soldiers would be able to say whatever they wanted. But as it turns out, the news stations got a feed of a white house staffer coaching the soldiers on what Bush was going to say and how they should answer the question.

So basically, they can't sell the war to people by telling the truth, so they make shit up. One guy on the news was saying that this is overwhelmingly blatant.

Feel free to reply even if you don't like what I say.

WOW! What a discovery!

It's not like I've been to speaking engagements or formal events like this (one with Clinton, in fact) where EXACTLY the same thing happened (3 democratic, one republican)

Ho hum.. tempest in a teacup here.

melchia · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
Not true. They showed a guy answering the question in rehearsal on NBC nightly news tonight. Unfortunately I don't have a link since it was on TV.

Can you not look the tv station's website up and find one?

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

Ely13 said:
The soldiers were briefed on the general questions the President would ask but did not use prepared responses.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/nation/president/2004-10-03-bush-troops_x.htm

Troops in survey back Bush 4-to-1 over Kerry

By Dave Moniz, USA TODAY

An unscientific survey of U.S. military personnel shows they support President Bush for re-election by a 4-to-1 ratio. Two-thirds of those responding said John Kerry's anti-war activities after he returned from Vietnam make them less likely to vote for him.

In the survey of more than 4,000 full-time and part-time troops, 73% said they would vote for Bush if the election were held today; 18% said they would vote for Kerry. Of the respondents, 59% identified themselves as Republicans, 20% as independents and 13% as Democrats.

The survey was conducted Sept. 15-28 by the Army Times Publishing Co., which distributes the weekly newspapers Army Times, Navy Times, Air Force Times and Marine Corps Times. (Army Times Publishing is owned by Gannett, which also publishes USA TODAY.)

Army Times Publishing sent e-mails to more than 31,000 subscribers and received 4,165 responses on a secure Web site. The publisher cautioned that the results are not a scientific poll. Its readers are older, higher in rank and more career-oriented than the military as a whole.

I also like that you included a link to an article from over a year ago. Thanks for the irrelevance.

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

They had a 15 minute presentation to put before the American public, and you're surprised that they wanted a direct, clean presentation?

They had three Captains, a First Lieutenant, and a Master Sergeant speak. These are people who are well experienced at giving presentations and summarizing what their companies/platoons are doing for their field-grade Officers.

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
I also like that you included a link to an article from over a year ago. Thanks for the irrelevance.

IMTheWalrus said:
So basically, they can't sell the war to people by telling the truth, so they make shit up. One guy on the news was saying that this is overwhelmingly blatant.

Don't talk shit about soldiers doing something far more relevant than anything you've ever done.

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

Ely13 said:
Don't talk shit about soldiers doing something far more relevant than anything you've ever done.

I'm not talking shit about the soldiers, I'm talking shit about our war criminal president.

Tacitus · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
I'm not talking shit about the soldiers, I'm talking shit about our war criminal president.

Once again.. how does this qualify as news, interesting or even relevant?

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

melchia said:
Can you not look the tv station's website up and find one?

Unfortunately, I can't find a link on the NBC website yet, but that's probably because it just aired. You'll probably see one on msnbc.com shortly.

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

VanillaThunder said:
Once again.. how does this qualify as news, interesting or even relevant?

You're reading it :cool:

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
I'm not talking shit about the soldiers, I'm talking shit about our war criminal president.

So you honestly think the White House is going to use its limited press time getting soldiers to adlib 8 minutes of total speaking time to summarize how preparations for the election on the Iraqi Constitution differ from the January 2005 elections? The White House nor the US Army would have wanted to present anything nearly so slipshod, especially in the face of the American people.

If Scott McClellan said explicitly that this would be an unscripted, open discussion, then he was wrong, but from watching the 15 minute clip on Fox News Video, I was under the impression that the President was going to ask questions about the election and the soldiers would answer. I thought it was a clean, neat opportunity, and I wish both the Iraqi people and our servicemembers the best of luck for a smooth election.

Tacitus · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
You're reading it

Face it, it's a nothing story being trumped up to pile another stupid accusation on Bush.

I'm all about exposing the incongruences, errata and general chicanery of this administration at this point, but dude.... bring something of substance up. This is an incredibly common practice. How is this any different than getting handed the questions before a debate? (another common practice)

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

VanillaThunder said:
This is an incredibly common practice. How is this any different than getting handed the questions before a debate? (another common practice)

Yup.

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

Ely13 said:
So you honestly think the White House is going to use its limited press time getting soldiers to adlib 8 minutes of total speaking time to summarize how preparations for the election on the Iraqi Constitution differ from the January 2005 elections? The White House nor the US Army would have wanted to present anything nearly so slipshod, especially in the face of the American people.

If Scott McClellan said explicitly that this would be an unscripted, open discussion, then he was wrong, but from watching the 15 minute clip on Fox News Video, I was under the impression that the President was going to ask questions about the election and the soldiers would answer. I thought it was a clean, neat opportunity, and I wish both the Iraqi people and our servicemembers the best of luck for a smooth election.

I believe that this administration is trying to spin the war like it spins everything else because support for the war and this president is fading. They are trying to do whatever they can to make americans believe in the government after the series of lies that has led up to the unnecessary death we hear about every day on the news.

I'm sure you thought it was a nice conference, but it wasn't presented as rehearsed to the people who were watching it. It's a political tactic.

I really don't think this is a nothing story. I'm not interested in what Clinton was making up about stupid shit like affairs or general policy. I'm more interested when people lie about something and then 2000 soldiers and 25000 Iraqis die. Besides the fact that Bush is president, not Clinton.

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
I believe that this administration is trying to spin the war like it spins everything else because support for the war and this president is fading. They are trying to do whatever they can to make americans believe in the government after the series of lies that has led up to the unnecessary death we hear about every day on the news.

I'm sure you thought it was a nice conference, but it wasn't presented as rehearsed to the people who were watching it. It's a political tactic.

I really don't think this is a nothing story. I'm not interested in what Clinton was making up about stupid shit like affairs or general policy. I'm more interested when people lie about something and then 2000 soldiers and 25000 Iraqis die. Besides the fact that Bush is president, not Clinton.

http://www.blackfive.net/main/2005/01/aiding_and_abbe.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"...I (we) don't see all the news coverage that you in the states see. I do see some Fox News and CNN...CNN is the voice of the anti-war movement. I wonder that if CNN had been around in 1942 we might all be speaking German and Japanese. I can tell you this: everything I have heard on CNN is so biased, negative and out-of-touch that I will never watch CNN for the rest of my life."
Chaplain Steven P. Unger
LCDR, CHC, USN
Multi National Corps-Iraq

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't believe for one second that these people do not want us there. I have met many, many people from Iraq that want us there, and in a bad way. They say they will never see the freedoms we talk about but they hope their children will. We are doing a good job in Iraq, and I challenge anyone, anywhere to dispute me on these facts."
Ray Reynolds, SFC
Iowa Army National Guard
234th Signal Battalion

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"...what we found is what we always find: a majority of people being intimidated, terrorized and oppressed by a radical, fanatical and clinically INSANE few. We found people who want us to finish this fight, no matter how long it takes, and who were genuinely appreciative of our efforts...a little different than what you hear out of NY and Washington News Rooms."
LtCol Mark A. Smith
Mayhem 6 CO
Task Force 2/24
Mahmudiyah, IZ
2nd Bn, 24th Marines
H&S Co, Bn Cmdr

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

Ely13 said:
http://www.blackfive.net/main/2005/01/aiding_and_abbe.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"...I (we) don't see all the news coverage that you in the states see. I do see some Fox News and CNN...CNN is the voice of the anti-war movement. I wonder that if CNN had been around in 1942 we might all be speaking German and Japanese. I can tell you this: everything I have heard on CNN is so biased, negative and out-of-touch that I will never watch CNN for the rest of my life."
Chaplain Steven P. Unger
LCDR, CHC, USN
Multi National Corps-Iraq

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Don't believe for one second that these people do not want us there. I have met many, many people from Iraq that want us there, and in a bad way. They say they will never see the freedoms we talk about but they hope their children will. We are doing a good job in Iraq, and I challenge anyone, anywhere to dispute me on these facts."
Ray Reynolds, SFC
Iowa Army National Guard
234th Signal Battalion

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"...what we found is what we always find: a majority of people being intimidated, terrorized and oppressed by a radical, fanatical and clinically INSANE few. We found people who want us to finish this fight, no matter how long it takes, and who were genuinely appreciative of our efforts...a little different than what you hear out of NY and Washington News Rooms."
LtCol Mark A. Smith
Mayhem 6 CO
Task Force 2/24
Mahmudiyah, IZ
2nd Bn, 24th Marines
H&S Co, Bn Cmdr

It seems like you like this war a lot. I suggest you go enlist and serve. Put your money where your mouth is.

Tacitus · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
It's a political tactic.

I really don't think this is a nothing story. I'm not interested in what Clinton was making up about stupid shit like affairs or general policy. I'm more interested when people lie about something and then 2000 soldiers and 25000 Iraqis die. Besides the fact that Bush is president, not Clinton.

Interesting juxtaposition right there, folks.

P.S. You can ask Clinton how he spun that whole Somalia travesty... and what happened at the posthumous medal ceremony...

Ely13 · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
It seems like you like this war a lot. I suggest you go enlist and serve. Put your money where your mouth is.

zer0hue · Oct 13, 2005

IMTheWalrus said:
It seems like you like this war a lot. I suggest you go enlist and serve. Put your money where your mouth is.

I think, by that line of logic, that you would have to march into the White House and put Bush under citizen’s arrest for “war crimes.” That, or just assassinate him, but (and I’m taking a big stab in the dark here) I’m willing to bet you don’t much care for guns. See how stupid this kind of reasoning makes you sound?

IMTheWalrus · Oct 13, 2005

zer0hue said:
I think, by that line of logic, that you would have to march into the White House and put Bush under citizen’s arrest for “war crimes.” That, or just assassinate him, but (and I’m taking a big stab in the dark here) I’m willing to bet you don’t much care for guns. See how stupid this kind of reasoning makes you sound?

Uh, unfortunately that's not possible. Your logic is poor and leaping. I don't think that saying people who believe in the war should go fight it is a wrong thing to say. I'm sure there are people in Iraq who don't particularly believe in being there and would rather be with their families, so the people who believe in this war can take their place.

Not only that, but last I checked we were having a hard time recruiting soldiers to join the military, so if everybody believes so much in this war, they should go fight it. It's really easy to say that you are for the Iraq war when you don't have to sacrifice anything besides your tax dollars.

iamyagami22 · Oct 13, 2005

ENOUGH ABOUT BUSH. goddamn it thats all everyone fucking talks about, shut the hell up already, it's not like he's killing babies and eating them(this woud be news), until it serves a point don't make a big deal about it.

DangerousK · Oct 13, 2005

Walrus-

Congratulations on finding that out.

Welcome to America.

-DK

Bush administration stages conversation with troops

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