Amano Jacu
Charles Barkley
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Why don't you just use TEH ROMZ in the Xbox with the hi-def pack so you get component with progressive scan ? 
Component Video Modification for the AES! *UPDATED w/SCREENSHOTS*
- Thread starter Kpj
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or buy a rgb compatible monitor that can also be used with other systems ...Amano Jacu said:Why don't you just use TEH ROMZ in the Xbox with the hi-def pack so you get component with progressive scan ?
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metallizer said:
Off topic:
You're an idiot. When will members outside the USA and Canada realize that this is simply not an option. I swear the next time a Euro member praises their scart connections i'll vomit. We already know you connect your games through rgb, get over it.
On topic:
Its hard for me to tell the difference between those two images, though perhaps my eyes aren't "trained." Either way i'd like to see the picture of the mod inside the homecart system.
Amano Jacu
Charles Barkley
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omnedon said:I have done side by side comparisons, THE ROMZ vs the real thing.
Those of you using the roms are getting exactly what you pay for.
bUT TEH r34l thing doesn't haF PROGRESIVE SCAN!!!!1111!!!111
Seriously, d00d, this thread is all about the big assed +50'' tvs and their component stuff and their magic abilities.
Back on topic, does anyone want me to do another pic like that in my scart TV through RGB of my MVS board in action? Of course I don't have a 6 megapixels digicam, I think mine is 3.2 only, sorry for that
Amano Jacu
Charles Barkley
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supergoose79 said:
My guess is that (American) people that have spent some thousands of $ in a big TV with component inputs, progressive scan and what not, that they use with their modern consoles and dvd players, prefer to use that one and have the best possible picture for the AES, than spending more money in another monitor that should be placed somewhere else.
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You're an idiot. When will members inside the USA and Canada realize that rgb is an option. I swear the next time an American member praises their component connections i'll vomit. We already know you like to spend thousands to have your systems butchered, get over it.Lagduf said:
the neo was meant to be hooked up to a rgb monitor and it's not that those modded systems would be much more affordable than a standard neo plus one of those broadcast monitors. just ask Roger, he often said that he didn't have (m)any problems with getting his monitors.Amano Jacu said:
IF i'd have to use component, then i'd get an external box that i could also use with my other systems.
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lol what a worthless mod, those pics look almost exactly the same.
the neo geo is pixely 2D games, what the fuck is the point?
also the romz look just fine off my xbox.
the neo geo is pixely 2D games, what the fuck is the point?
also the romz look just fine off my xbox.
300wins
Conan The Librarian,
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You know, it's not that hard to find a RGB monitor people. For the price of the mod, why not just buy a RGB monitor? They aren't as hard to find as everyone in the USA makes it out to be. Sony PVM-2530 are plentiful and cheap. So are Sony GVM-2020. Hell, old Commodore monitors would do, abiet a tad bit small. Maybe 25 inches isn't big enough for some people, but realistically, do you need to see your game with characters that's 3 feet tall or something?
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/legends-02.jpg <-- RGB at it's finest.
And before anyone thinks this is running off the PC that's sitting next to it, you're wrong. Look at the 1 slot next to the PC, or ask anyone who's seen this thing in action like: xtoo_short, BIGPsyche, kyosuke75, jindo to name a few.
Component mod... blah. Give me RGB over it any day.
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/legends-02.jpg <-- RGB at it's finest.
And before anyone thinks this is running off the PC that's sitting next to it, you're wrong. Look at the 1 slot next to the PC, or ask anyone who's seen this thing in action like: xtoo_short, BIGPsyche, kyosuke75, jindo to name a few.
Component mod... blah. Give me RGB over it any day.
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omnedon said:Despite your best attempts at sarcasm, you've managed to say something useful in here.
And a good quality consumer TV ain't gonna do it for you.
Nice thing about Kenny's mod, and JMKurtz's project, is that it can grow with you. You can use composite, S-Video, or component.
Just don't expect magic from component if your TV isn't an excellent HDTV.
I should have thought before I spoke I hope I didnt offened anyone .
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300wins said:You know, it's not that hard to find a RGB monitor people. For the price of the mod, why not just buy a RGB monitor? They aren't as hard to find as everyone in the USA makes it out to be. Sony PVM-2530 are plentiful and cheap. So are Sony GVM-2020. Hell, old Commodore monitors would do, abiet a tad bit small. Maybe 25 inches isn't big enough for some people, but realistically, do you need to see your game with characters that's 3 feet tall or something?
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/legends-02.jpg <-- RGB at it's finest.
And before anyone thinks this is running off the PC that's sitting next to it, you're wrong. Look at the 1 slot next to the PC, or ask anyone who's seen this thing in action like: xtoo_short, BIGPsyche, kyosuke75, jindo to name a few.
Component mod... blah. Give me RGB over it any day.
I got a 2530 for under $150 shipped .
Now I just need to make cables for it
syringe
Banned
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Interlaced SD component *might* be worth the upgrade over S-Video or not depending on your TV.
One of the reasons nobody here can agree on the difference in quality between S-Video and Component on a regular TV is because the difference is either relatively huge or nothing at all depending on the TV set and how it processes the component signal.
Most people don't realize this but some manufacturers are guilty of having the YPbPr downgraded to a Chroma/Luna signal (S-Video Quality Signal) after entering the TV set before it goes to the RGB guns as a cost saving measure during production. If you have one of these sets there will be absolutely no edge over using S-Video and consider yourself screwed by the manufacturers, if theres a largely noticable *read* decent upgrade in image quality between S-Video and Component on your SD TV the color seperation is being maintained and the signal is being processed as advertized. This cuts across a large portion of the manufacturers and it's generally a dirty little industry secret they don't want you to know.
There's a similar situation with European TV's as well. To save on production costs alot of the new TV's in europe will now transcode the RGB signals they recieve to Component or even S-Video converting the image back to pure RGB in the GUNS instead of bypassing everything and delivering straight it to the RGB guns like it should be doing. Some manufacturers have even taken advantage of this and even used it to offer a new "feature" such as those LG tv's that can accept either RGB or Component through a modified scart block.
This cuts along most major tv manufacturers even the ones you percieve as good ones and there's no way to know if your particular TV does it and othe SD models by the same manufacturer don't it's a crap shoot. But you can reasonably suspect hat if you don't see a difference between Component and S-Video or S-video and RGB (for Europeans) this half-assed down conversion is happening on your set.
The two other things to note is that it's safe to assume that all cheap chinese TV brands like Apex and those "fake" Jensens do this and for all the reputable manufacturers like panasonic, toshiba, samsung, zenith, rca etc. it's a total crapshoot (some models do, some don't) unless you get into their EDTV/HDTV range where cutting costs in this regard becomes an impossibility because they have to support 480P/720P/1080i through those same jacks.
----
This would be a bigger issue if interlaced YPbPr wasn't virtually identical in quality to RGB. You'd need a professional monitor before you could see any difference in signal quality and even if you did you'd really have to look for it. Effectively making the quality of the Television you buy far more important in terms of the resulting image quality read (How it handles RGB if you live in Europe or Component if you live in the United States) than the nature of either of those signals.
It's estimated that about 50% of the current TV models being sold in Europe cut corners and transcode to YPbPr or S-Video instead of doing what they technically should (the majority are doing the YPbPr covnersion and maybe 15% are guilty of the S-Video down conversion).
The number of units downgrading Component into S-Video internally within the United States is unknown but it's sizable as well.
It just breaks down to manufacuters wanting to save money in a competitive market which means producing the least amount of region specific parts as possible and unifying the parts used in production for all regions wherever possible. Having a TV downgrade YPbPr and processing the resulting S-Video signal is simply cheaper than properly processing the component signal as well. I.E. grabbing green from the weighted Y signal then dumping all the color together and using a now unweighted Y for the second part of the signal.
It sucks but that's life.
One of the reasons nobody here can agree on the difference in quality between S-Video and Component on a regular TV is because the difference is either relatively huge or nothing at all depending on the TV set and how it processes the component signal.
Most people don't realize this but some manufacturers are guilty of having the YPbPr downgraded to a Chroma/Luna signal (S-Video Quality Signal) after entering the TV set before it goes to the RGB guns as a cost saving measure during production. If you have one of these sets there will be absolutely no edge over using S-Video and consider yourself screwed by the manufacturers, if theres a largely noticable *read* decent upgrade in image quality between S-Video and Component on your SD TV the color seperation is being maintained and the signal is being processed as advertized. This cuts across a large portion of the manufacturers and it's generally a dirty little industry secret they don't want you to know.
There's a similar situation with European TV's as well. To save on production costs alot of the new TV's in europe will now transcode the RGB signals they recieve to Component or even S-Video converting the image back to pure RGB in the GUNS instead of bypassing everything and delivering straight it to the RGB guns like it should be doing. Some manufacturers have even taken advantage of this and even used it to offer a new "feature" such as those LG tv's that can accept either RGB or Component through a modified scart block.
This cuts along most major tv manufacturers even the ones you percieve as good ones and there's no way to know if your particular TV does it and othe SD models by the same manufacturer don't it's a crap shoot. But you can reasonably suspect hat if you don't see a difference between Component and S-Video or S-video and RGB (for Europeans) this half-assed down conversion is happening on your set.
The two other things to note is that it's safe to assume that all cheap chinese TV brands like Apex and those "fake" Jensens do this and for all the reputable manufacturers like panasonic, toshiba, samsung, zenith, rca etc. it's a total crapshoot (some models do, some don't) unless you get into their EDTV/HDTV range where cutting costs in this regard becomes an impossibility because they have to support 480P/720P/1080i through those same jacks.
----
This would be a bigger issue if interlaced YPbPr wasn't virtually identical in quality to RGB. You'd need a professional monitor before you could see any difference in signal quality and even if you did you'd really have to look for it. Effectively making the quality of the Television you buy far more important in terms of the resulting image quality read (How it handles RGB if you live in Europe or Component if you live in the United States) than the nature of either of those signals.
It's estimated that about 50% of the current TV models being sold in Europe cut corners and transcode to YPbPr or S-Video instead of doing what they technically should (the majority are doing the YPbPr covnersion and maybe 15% are guilty of the S-Video down conversion).
The number of units downgrading Component into S-Video internally within the United States is unknown but it's sizable as well.
It just breaks down to manufacuters wanting to save money in a competitive market which means producing the least amount of region specific parts as possible and unifying the parts used in production for all regions wherever possible. Having a TV downgrade YPbPr and processing the resulting S-Video signal is simply cheaper than properly processing the component signal as well. I.E. grabbing green from the weighted Y signal then dumping all the color together and using a now unweighted Y for the second part of the signal.
It sucks but that's life.
Last edited:
gamejunkie
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Scanline your right about how you can get screwed with the tvs. My dad bought a big screen a few years ago and they said it was "high def ready", well to say the least that means jacksquat. Its just 480i component jacks, the same exact resolution as svideo.
As for the two screen shots at the first of the post, the reason that no one can tell the difference is because in reality there is no difference on a normal set. But when you got both componet and svideo running at the same resolution on a slightly higher end set you will see a difference! I personally can see the difference even in the two pics above.
Seeing as how this system only delivers 2d graphics and what year it was developed I doubt there is much need for the component connectors. Don't get me wrong I'm a total geek and I would love to have that system!
Props to Kenny Boy for this feat!
P.S. Component signal is better than a Scart signal
As for the two screen shots at the first of the post, the reason that no one can tell the difference is because in reality there is no difference on a normal set. But when you got both componet and svideo running at the same resolution on a slightly higher end set you will see a difference! I personally can see the difference even in the two pics above.
Seeing as how this system only delivers 2d graphics and what year it was developed I doubt there is much need for the component connectors. Don't get me wrong I'm a total geek and I would love to have that system!
Props to Kenny Boy for this feat!
P.S. Component signal is better than a Scart signal
300wins said:You know, it's not that hard to find a RGB monitor people. For the price of the mod, why not just buy a RGB monitor? They aren't as hard to find as everyone in the USA makes it out to be. Sony PVM-2530 are plentiful and cheap. So are Sony GVM-2020. Hell, old Commodore monitors would do, abiet a tad bit small. Maybe 25 inches isn't big enough for some people, but realistically, do you need to see your game with characters that's 3 feet tall or something?
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/legends-02.jpg <-- RGB at it's finest.
And before anyone thinks this is running off the PC that's sitting next to it, you're wrong. Look at the 1 slot next to the PC, or ask anyone who's seen this thing in action like: xtoo_short, BIGPsyche, kyosuke75, jindo to name a few.
Component mod... blah. Give me RGB over it any day.
Whats the model number off of that sony montior?
300wins said:Sony PGM-200R1U in case you want to buy one of your own.
1) What kind of RGB male plug does it use?
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/RGB-2.jpg
2) Does it ues one like this?
http://www.japangamesnow.com/produc...d=807&osCsid=20a72abe8d5c62db2fec1dea9893c242
3) Also have you ever seen a DVD running on it?
4) What inch is that montior?
Thanks!
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300wins
Conan The Librarian,
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- 1,631
neo_X7 said:1) What kind of RGB male plug does it use?
http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/RGB-2.jpg
2) Does it ues one like this?
http://www.japangamesnow.com/produc...d=807&osCsid=20a72abe8d5c62db2fec1dea9893c242
3) Also have you ever seen a DVD running on it?
4) What inch is that montior?
Thanks!
Here's a picture of the RGB that it uses. There is 2 type: One is a 5 BNC, the other is a 15 pin male HD (the one computer VGA uses) as seen here: http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/RGB-2.jpg
And yes, I watch DVD on it all the time. I have a picture of a DVD running on it here: http://www.arcade4home.com/legends/legends-03.jpg
(the DVD in the picture is the All About SNK r2 DVD).
The monitor is a 29 inch monitor with 27 inch viewable.
SeaWolf69
Haomaru's Blade Shiner
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- Jun 8, 2003
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- 688
Yes,
That was alot of great info there Scanline! I don't know if my Sony KP-61HS30 cuts corners like you said? I do know that I have both monster video 2 S-video cables and monster video 3 Component cables for my progressive scan DVD player, PS2, Xbox (GameCube only has it's own crappy Componet Cables
). It is a very noticeable difference between the two cables for me. I prefer the Component cables, the images it produces looks far better than S-video. As for playing my AES on there, it doesn't look that good due to my 61" adding scan lines 
( is there any way to fix this?). I usually keep it hooked up to a old 27" Sony Trinitron that I have w/ regular composite cable and it looks just fine to me. Although I'm interested know in upgrading to S-video or Component outputs, Stereo output & Raz's new Uni Bios chip that fixes SSVS!! Can any of you tell me if the Uni Bios is better than the debug bios chip that I currently have? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks...
SeaWolf69
off topic:
Hah,
As for hooking up to bigger TV's to play games, I think that is just a wicked luxury that most people enjoy, looks awesome!! I remember when I was down in LA a couple yrs ago, I walked into a Electronics store and they had a screen that took up the whole wall and were showing a football game and the players were as big as me! Hah, now that would be awesome to hook up a Neo to that
That was alot of great info there Scanline! I don't know if my Sony KP-61HS30 cuts corners like you said? I do know that I have both monster video 2 S-video cables and monster video 3 Component cables for my progressive scan DVD player, PS2, Xbox (GameCube only has it's own crappy Componet Cables
). It is a very noticeable difference between the two cables for me. I prefer the Component cables, the images it produces looks far better than S-video. As for playing my AES on there, it doesn't look that good due to my 61" adding scan lines ( is there any way to fix this?). I usually keep it hooked up to a old 27" Sony Trinitron that I have w/ regular composite cable and it looks just fine to me. Although I'm interested know in upgrading to S-video or Component outputs, Stereo output & Raz's new Uni Bios chip that fixes SSVS!! Can any of you tell me if the Uni Bios is better than the debug bios chip that I currently have? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks...SeaWolf69
off topic:
Hah,
As for hooking up to bigger TV's to play games, I think that is just a wicked luxury that most people enjoy, looks awesome!! I remember when I was down in LA a couple yrs ago, I walked into a Electronics store and they had a screen that took up the whole wall and were showing a football game and the players were as big as me! Hah, now that would be awesome to hook up a Neo to that
omnedon said:I have done side by side comparisons, THE ROMZ vs the real thing.
Those of you using the roms are getting exactly what you pay for.
Well, considering Teh Romz output an identical image...I don't see the problem. And yes, I've compared my real MVS to my PC outputting to my TV.
omnedon
Astra Superstar
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- 654
Well, maybe it's the xbox emulators I use, but my low serailled AES's S-Video is way way WAY sharper, with richer colour, than my modded Xbox, hooked to the same TV thru component. That plus emulators sound seems muddy, and slightly off mix, when compared to the real thing (that's using the same speakers too).
This is a literal side by side (hitting the switch on the powered system switcher I use) back and forth comparison, using the same TV and speakers.
Emulation is good, but not the same. Perhaps tweaking my emu's would help.
Is your MVS hooked to the same monitor when comparing?
This is off topic anyway. I'm a collector too, so I'm always biased to the real thing. But no kidding, my AES looks and sounds a lot better IMO.
This is a literal side by side (hitting the switch on the powered system switcher I use) back and forth comparison, using the same TV and speakers.
Emulation is good, but not the same. Perhaps tweaking my emu's would help.
Is your MVS hooked to the same monitor when comparing?
This is off topic anyway. I'm a collector too, so I'm always biased to the real thing. But no kidding, my AES looks and sounds a lot better IMO.
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RiotoftheBlood
Chin's Drinking Partner
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- Jan 10, 2001
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- 2,779
ORPHEUS said:
How can you say "only truly worthwhile" when this is all a matter of opinion? There is a difference between component and S-video, with or without progressive scan. How large that difference is and how important that is to the user varies.