Printable View
I know it's kind of taboo, especially among collectors, but how do you feel about emulations? I have quite a few on my computer, NES, SNES, Genesis, Turbo Grafx, and Neo Geo (don't hate me).
I justify this because I own all these systems, maybe not all the roms I have do I own in cart form. I'd still much rather have the physical game to play in the actual console, but some titles are just too hard to find or just too expensive.
You sir, are either incredibly brave or incredibly naive.
Either way - I salute you.
Good luck.
I never buy boots or play emulaters myself but saying that if someone offered me a copy of ss zero for 5 dollars right now i wouldnt say no to it :)
It's a great way to make money.
I got loads of emus and ROMs, of console and games I don't own.
I used to play them more, years ago, but now not much really...
Plus I just have one joypad on my comp, so if I have to play with someone, one of us has to use the keyboard. :rolleyes:
I spend more time on real consoles, like my NeoGeo I purchased recently. Or my NGPC.
At home, that is...
But actually... Emulators are useful at college. :D
I'm doing some computing courses... And we're in front of computers from time to time... That's where emulators come in handy to kill boredom. :D
best thing to ever happen to the neo!
Will it ever go away?? LMAO :tickled:
Don't you know TeH Ro0oOmZz R tEh rOxX0RzZ! :multi_co:
firewalls.....:D
mine are downloaded from a seperate "protected" source and burned to a cd. no physical roms on the hard drive, just the drivers for the emulators (which are 100% legal)
You do realize it's still not legal, wherever the ROMs are stored ?Quote:
Originally posted by bluedevil
firewalls.....:D
mine are downloaded from a seperate "protected" source and burned to a cd. no physical roms on the hard drive, just the drivers for the emulators (which are 100% legal)
legal, illegal.......:D
it's kind of like the mp3 thing, it's always been illegal but nobody was really enforcing the laws until now. I haven't actually downloaded any roms in quite a while, I basically got all the ones I wanted, so if and when they do decide that they want to prosecute, i'll just make sure I don't download anymore. You can't prosecute someone for downloading files before it was "illegal", that's why the riaa is only and can only go after people who persisted to download mp3's after the actual structure of the law was written. the only rule on record now is that you must delete the roms within 24 hours of downloading them, technically, they can't prove you didn't if they aren't physically on your hard drive.
i'm pretty sure that's very illegal.:DQuote:
Originally posted by SonGohan
It's a great way to make money.
And where did you see that "rule"? :rolleyes: On emulation websites? It's fucking bullshit.Quote:
Originally posted by bluedevil
the only rule on record now is that you must delete the roms within 24 hours of downloading them,
http://www.nintendo.com/corp/faqs/legal.html
"It's ok to have an illegal file for 24 hours" Yeah, does that really make sense to you?
Indeed, the 24 hours thing is pure bullshit.
Also, some companies like Nintendo consider it's illegal to have ROMs *EVEN IF YOU OWN THE ORIGINAL*...
By the way, ROMs have ALWAYS been illegal, so whenever you downloaded them doesn't make ANY difference.
no, it doesn't make sense, but like i said, nobody is enforcing these laws. i figured to start a thoughtful conversation on the subject, (as i'm sure many people here have now or have had emulators) not to discuss the legality of the subject. of course i know it's illegal, i'm sorry if i hurt anybody's feelings because i'm such a "criminal". the 24 hour thing is the rule for most rom sites, not an actual law, that is why i referred to it as a rule. if anyone has even tried to download any roms lately, you will find most rom sites have been shut down, or the links don't work anymore, so really, it's a moot point.
Well, once again.:lol:
You didn't hurt anyone's feelings, most of us are "criminals" anyway. But notice, this IS NOT an emulation website. These topics that spring up now and again are really fucking annoying.Quote:
Originally posted by bluedevil
no, it doesn't make sense, but like i said, nobody is enforcing these laws. i figured to start a thoughtful conversation on the subject, (as i'm sure many people here have now or have had emulators) not to discuss the legality of the subject. of course i know it's illegal, i'm sorry if i hurt anybody's feelings because i'm such a "criminal".
I'm going with naive.Quote:
Originally posted by Average Joe
You sir, are either incredibly brave or incredibly naive.
Either way - I salute you.
Good luck.
sorry to piss anyone off, i'm still new here. i didn't know it was such a touchy subject.
Like every controversial topic, there is a good and bad side to emulation (in general, or specifically, to Neo Geo).
I think the Neo Geo is a unique case b/c there are emulators out there that can duplicate the NG to a very high degree of accuracy (something you don't see for most current generation of hardware b/c it takes several generations of computational power to be able to emulate correctly). But there are still new games being made/published on this aged hardware.
Thus, what we have is almost perfect emulation of new games. This is bad for Neo Geo/SNK. This is bad for fans who want to see the continued survival of NG and its games.
OTOH, it is good for people to try out older titles like Magician Lord or whatever and get interested in the history of NG and perhaps get into the scene (we have read many stories about that on this board).
But most rabid Neogeo fans (like me) view the emulation as a bad thing b/c we know the Neo Geo is at the twilight of its stellar life and we don't want anything to accelerate its demise.
To add something new to the 1285628957638th thread about this subject, I have a question?
Can I have the rom of MSX for example if I have the PS one version or do I need to possess the AES/MVS version? The same question can be asked to a lot of neo games.
i agree, like i said in the first post, i'd much rather have the physical game. i'm not trying to take anything away from the companies who are currently producing software for their hardware, and as such i only use emulators for older dead systems (the neo being the exception, yet i still am searcing for as many games for the physical system i can find).
Nope. You can't have the Rom even if you have the Neo version. You downloaded an illegal file, its status will not change regardless of what you own.Quote:
Originally posted by Robert
Can I have the rom of MSX for example if I have the PS one version or do I need to possess the AES/MVS version?
That Nintendo FAG is bullshit as well.
Roms are not 100% illegal, if it was then Capcom is violating it's on copyright by distributing roms.
Emulators themselves are legal thanks to the Sony v. bleem LLC court ruling.
That's a different situation. Capcom has the right to do whatever they want with their own IPs.Quote:
Originally posted by Decepticon
That Nintendo FAG is bullshit as well.
Roms are not 100% illegal, if it was then Capcom is violating it's on copyright by distributing roms.
But Nintendo will have you believe all roms are illegal.Quote:
Originally posted by SamuraiShodownSensei
That's a different situation. Capcom has the right to do whatever they want with their own IPs.
If you backup your cart yourself it is legal, just because you have the cart doesn't mean you can get the rom and it's ok.
I have thousands of roms of games that I can't play anymore because of the aging systems have been broken.
If Nintendo, Sega, ect want me to stop playing old NES and Master System roms then re-replease the hardware so I can go back to playing them on the respective system. Until then I will contiue playing the roms of said system.
As far as the Neo goes I wouldn't have mine today if not for roms so to say it does the developer no good is an understatement.
Not everyone will download a rom and then buy the game but I know quite a few who do.
Emulation is sexy.
When are people going to realise that because something is convient does mean it is right?
It is a wonderful thing that has let me play and find out about games i wouldnt of otherwise had the opportunity to.
I have no qualms with it whatsoever.
I already have teh rom.
Nintendo will have you believe all romz that you download or obtain in other matters are illegal. And they are quite right.Quote:
Originally posted by Decepticon
But Nintendo will have you believe all roms are illegal.
If Nintendo wanted to put a buncha roms on a Cd with an emulator and sell it as a Nintendo greatest hits package, they can. Its their intellectual property and they are giving you a license to play them.
and i would buy them.
It's not a matter of it is illegal or not, the police is not gonna come to check.Quote:
Originally posted by SamuraiShodownSensei
Nope. You can't have the Rom even if you have the Neo version. You downloaded an illegal file, its status will not change regardless of what you own.
In my opinion is a matter of everybody's own ethics. For me, having the roms of an old game is not a problem, and a good way to recover games that would have been lost in the past forever. The problem is when brand new games get dumped and distributed within a month of its release.
GIVE ME CONVENIENCE OR GIVE ME DEATH.Quote:
Originally posted by BlackSpy
When are people going to realise that because something is convient does mean it is right?
yes i will,,,,watcha gonna do when i come for you...LOL
yeah right I can affirm there aint no rom emulation police.,.,.
If a company wants to push something they can go through the long process of getting records ,,then proof and evidence then usually only then they must have a written or recorded statement from someone who is a reliable source that the police used several times that has been proven to be reliable,,then maybe the court would issue a search warrant to take the romz or computer but....will that happen probably when a cow shoots out my ass...
come on people if companies( older roms i am not saying newr ones wouldnt be enforce...Cmpanies that still produce software for the system thats being emulated or whatever) neogeo,nintendo gamecube,,xbox microsoft)they could be anal about copies and do more but for the old systems that is not being made and no software being made for them,,,Who really gives a fuck,,Not me not any other police agency in the usa..
just be careful if you fool with new systems the big one to watch..
is probably SNK,,,a business thta has left came back et etc,,,They would be against it more than anyone,,,Microsoft 2nd,,They got the money to do what they want,,,nintendo, then sony..
only my openion though...Roms/ emulators yes they are good, why because if i want to play a game on a system maybe a atari 2600, or a colecovision who the hell am i hurting atari yeah right..
I say if your a gamer and you still buy games and systems ...Enjoy...
;)Quote:
Originally posted by Amano Jacu
It's not a matter of it is illegal or not, the police is not gonna come to check.
In my opinion is a matter of everybody's own ethics. For me, having the roms of an old game is not a problem, and a good way to recover games that would have been lost in the past forever. The problem is when brand new games get dumped and distributed within a month of its release.
thank you for getting back to the original question posed. :)
I really don't care about emulation as I always prefer owning the real thing. ROMs never play as well as the real deal.
Emulation is not the end of the world that many people would have you believe, but I would have to agree that this is not an emulation site, and therefore not the proper place to discuss it.
i used to have mame and i would always play commando on my comp, but i dont usually do romz.
btw, would ppl in the gp32 community be considered rom whores?
never played a rom in me life as i can't be arsed to search for them! I hear they're fairly crappy anyway, plus which, a decent pad for a pc aint easy to come by, let alone two! Gimme the real deal (or a good port) any day, in the long run it's waaaaaay more convenient :)
if my local arcade dont get the game and i got to travel like an hour and a half to boston to play the game
i will dl it just so i know how to play the game when i get there
and thats only if the games been out for a while
i cant stand to get owned by young kids cause i have no idea how to play
and that only happened once with rival schools\project justice
i got owned by a 10 year old it will never happen again
According to the law, you're allowed to have one legal backup of any software you purchase, regardless of what media its stored on.
For a good amount of people, downloading roms off the internet is the only way to get that backup (though hosting the rom and distrubuting it to any that also don't own the actual game is illegal), because rom dumping software is not only expensive and hard to use, but various encryption methods prevent anyone but master dumpers from getting a decent playable copy.
Regardless of its legality, emulation did a lot more to help SNK than hurt it, at least back in '98 and '99 when Neo emulation was really starting to get good. By then most people (including myself) had totally forgotten about the Neo, and it did wonders to reintroduce it to everyone who had forgotten, and those who had never even heard of it in the first place. The problem is that today the Neo doesn't really need that much advertisment as far as that method goes, because SNKP is working towards putting themselves back on the public map outside of just the hardcore fanbase. Also, bootlegs weren't NEARLY as rampant back then as they are now due to huge advances in dumper technology and knowledge.
The only real excuse for emulating the Neo now is if you want to try out a game before you buy it, because as we all know the carts are ridiculously expensive, and not everyone has a decent arcade to preview/play it. Its especially true after games like ROTD and Metal Slug 4, where they aren't universally lauded for their quality.
Exactly!Quote:
Originally posted by Fygee
The only real excuse for emulating the Neo now is if you want to try out a game before you buy it, because as we all know the carts are ridiculously expensive, and not everyone has a decent arcade to preview/play it. Its especially true after games like ROTD and Metal Slug 4, where they aren't universally lauded for their quality.
The only roms I play now are of games I find for sale, I will load the rom, play it for a while and if I like it I will buy it.
Other than that I will play most of my Neo games on my MAME cabinet if someone else is using the TV.
Ture from time to time I will load up games I dont own but is Taito hurting because I played Double Dragon? Or Konami because I played TMNT or The Simpsons with 3 friends?
As far as console games go, my NES and Master System died a long time ago and until I can get one new in the box reissued I will continue to play my old school games on my PC.
Not always true. Using Emulators is an excellent way to create guides using screenshots, and being creative with the actual art/music inside the game.Quote:
Originally posted by Fygee
The only real excuse for emulating the Neo now is if you want to try out a game before you buy it
I second that.
I use romz strictly as a "preview" for my future purchases.
Nothing beats the real deal.
Do you really think emulation can be really a reason for people not buying the original thing? I mean, even on brand new games as in the neo?
Get the example of SvC. If the ROM isn't released, that's no problem for the people who want to play it ilegally for free: the'll just make a copy of the PS2 port when it comes out. Moreover, I guess there would be many more people with a copied PS2 SvC than with the rom, if it was released.
I find emulation most interesing for research, developers and, of course, to play games you could never play in other way. Still, I think that doesn't keep real gamers from buying their games. The only thing I hate emulators for is 'cuz when the Neo emulation started, the homecart's prices rised dramatically in the second hand market.
Anyway, as said before, I think this topic has been started many time before and has little to do with this forums.
[OCEAN]
If homecart prices raised when neo geo emulation started then i think emulation should be a good thing for you all guys, seem you seem to have some kind of obsession with high pricing and marketing and all the stuff that you have created in this site.
Of course emulation is a good thing as a method for preserving the games from sinking into oblition, there´s no doubt about it. The problems with TEH ROMZ (svc, matrimelee etc) is just another affair caused by silly kids who want fighters for free. And of course a LOT of people has enterede the "neo-scene" after playing with emulator like HELL, you can count on me there, as i´m building a medium home cart collection (no mvs here now) of games that i´ve played on both arcades and emus but i like them so much that i want to actually OWN em. Thats all about it. If i want to play kizuna encounter of course I will use kawa-x better than spending 700 euro on that medium fighter, but i think emulation has brought here a LOT of people. Flame on me if ya want
Emulation is kewl ... Ive said it before...
But a question for you ... In the review section of this forum showing the screenshots.. Where did they come from...
Huh
not photos... no loss quality...
Surely they cant be snapshots taken from the Mame emulator...
Which is one of the best ways to get screenshots...
Just shows this website may even be constucted via an emulators help..
Something to think about
Well but then it's not a backup of your copy any more.Quote:
Originally posted by Fygee
According to the law, you're allowed to have one legal backup of any software you purchase, regardless of what media its stored on.
*cut*
*cut*Quote:
but various encryption methods prevent anyone but master dumpers from getting a decent playable copy.
If you remove the encryption your altering the code and it therefore not a backup copy anymore either which probably breaks some other licence agreements to boot.
Can't blame anyone for using roms and emulators though.... except those bastards making money of them.
Its been my experience that people rarely get the rom and then decide not to buy it just because they can play it for free. Most of the time its because they figure the game isn't good enough to shell out the odd $325. And those who are planning on buying it will buy it regardless of whether or not they can play it for free with roms, since some say it looses a lot of its charm when played on an emu instead of on the real thing.Quote:
Do you really think emulation can be really a reason for people not buying the original thing? I mean, even on brand new games as in the neo?
Get the example of SvC. If the ROM isn't released, that's no problem for the people who want to play it ilegally for free: the'll just make a copy of the PS2 port when it comes out. Moreover, I guess there would be many more people with a copied PS2 SvC than with the rom, if it was released.
Overall, the only thing about ROMs that really, truly hurts sales of games is bootlegs.
Well, unless you altered the data somehow, your backup should be identical to any other backup of an altered cart. So even if you weren't the one who dumped it, there's no real difference even if you had.Quote:
Well but then it's not a backup of your copy any more.
This is true, though one could argue that they would have to do so in order to get a backup, which they are legally entitled to. Don't take my word for it in a court of law though. ;)Quote:
If you remove the encryption your altering the code and it therefore not a backup copy anymore either which probably breaks some other licence agreements to boot.
Well, let's say SNES roms were not illegal and Nintendo didn't care about the roms of their games.. the GBA would be screwed
I enjoy emualtion. I have played from Atari 2600 to N64 emulators. I don't have any guilt playing a neo geo ROM because if I never did I wouldn't have my 29 inch sit down arcade.
First, just about everyone here has bought a Neo Geo cart or cd, so we all supported SNK. Second, we all would rather have a nice looking collection of carts on the shelf than names of rom files in a folder. Third, I love what emulation can give you that the legal carts can't, things like cheats and perfect graphics. I love the way the neo games look in vga. I also love to use invincibilty in some games to see all the endings. I love emulation. I had to sell my entire collection and missed it for years until the neo was emulated. For those of you who can afford to buy all the carts in your collection or are able to drive to play the arcade versions, you are very lucky or you worked hard for it. I'm happy I have this forum to keep the Neo alive, we didn't have much of SNK in the early '90s as far as info and fans, you guys are great!