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i did a search and didn't see a thread for this
kind of surprising
anyway, this game is good, really good
it's like a darker and grittier Uncharted (i hold Uncharted in the highest of regards so the comparison is huge compliment)
it's also brutal as hell
i don't mean gameplay-wise, i mean situation-wise
Laura's death scenes/animations are hardcore violent
i also feel because of the added violence, it makes for a much more tense, although not any less awesome, experience than Uncharted
Damn, that's good.
And here all this time I just though she was hot. :D
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/i...LWvxcIuhJwv_cG
I am consistently horny while playing this game.
This game is fucking boss. BOSS.
Top notch in every way.
One thing I want to point out is that CD has really done a good job streamlining the controls without it feeling dumbed down. Makes me wonder why other companies are still in hold X, Z, ^%&* while pressing L4 to look around while covering mode.
Who will play Lara in the movie reboot based off of this game? That's the real question.
I've played the game for about 3 hours so far. Intend to do more this weekend.
Feels like Lost + Uncharted + young, cute, vulnerable Lara Croft.
I think the game is very well put together but it's not gripping just yet.
i haven't used anything but the bow yetQuote:
Originally Posted by terry.330
80% of my kills are headshots too
love that thing
i've been playing this all morning
i'm trying to get all the collectibles as i go but there's some you need to backtrack for
my only real gripe is that it's too easy
i'm playing it on Hard and i haven't come across any situation that proved to be challenging
i haven't even died that much during firefights either
the majority of my deaths are testing out jumps and dying on purpose to see the various death animations (again, they're all quite brutal)
This is not a criticism of the game, just an observation.
The game's ease is because CD and S-E aren't trying to create a challenging game.
They're trying to resuscitate an IP for mass consumption.
Every challenge and task in this game is meticulously crafted to cater to the widest audience possible. Most of which will be only average or low level gamers.
The best way to do that is to get the audience emotionally invested in the characters and the narrative.
This way, the audience will be ready to buy 'Lara's next great adventure' in a few years.
This is why I say emotional context is so important in in the marketing of games. It's a deeply entrenched element of the whole dev process, and the theory is meant to capture casual gamer dollars.
Give the audience characters they love and they'll follow them through hell. This is true of any storytelling medium.
This true and I have zero problem with it. It's all just so well put together and polished.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
I played it for about 6 hours straight yesterday, something I haven't done with a new game in a very long time.
As Joe said the game so far has been fairly easy. Which has actually made the game more enjoyable to me. I've died a few times messing up jumps or missing timing on the QTEs. But that has kept me more invested in the progression of the game and story.
I also enjoy that they are showing Lara in a new light, not just a British Indiana Jones with big tits. A strong young female lead stuggling. Games need more characters like this, less space marines, indestructable digital porn vixens and faggy RPG boys.
And there is absolutely nothing wrong with an easy game so long as the ease is deliberate, tested and, as you said, polishedQuote:
Originally Posted by terry.330
It's just not for people that want to be challenged.
In looking at what this game is about, it's clear that emotional context is at the core of the experience.
Young, innocent, vulnerable Lara in a desperate situation, the jagged chisel of reality chipping away at her bit bit. Every death is horrible to watch, violent and visceral.
And yet, the reason I am bothered by it and want to avoid it is because she's so young and on a deeper psychological level, my instincts are thinking about all the life that will not be lived by this person if she dies because I let her down. She's not real, but my base survival instinct is kicking in anyway.
It's a clever way to trigger an emotional connection between Lara and the players.
I am not trying to start shit with you because I'm not about that, but I don't completely agree with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by terry.330
I like your sentiment, but the problem isn't in the existence of space marines, indestructible porn vixens and faggy RPG boys.
Tomb Raider's experience isn't about twitch gaming. It's about emotional and narrative context.
Likewise, we've seen characters of the types you cite as being contextually viable characters:
Space Marine-Marcus Fenix
Indestructible porn vixen-Bayonetta
'faggy' RPG boy-Cloud Strife
All three are alphas of their trope, and are characters worth investing time in.
Do not take this to mean that the games Marcus, Bayonetta or Cloud inhabit are perfect games. They may or may not be. But those characters are all 'ultimate' expressions of their type that represent the best that can be done with them.
It's all about context, my friend.
Batman: The Dark Knight Returns is a great comic book. But too many people taken the wrong example away from it. Same is true for many video game archetypes.
Yeah I agree with all those examples, they are all good charcters in great games but they're also the exception. I just wish developers would be a little more original with their characters nowadays when games are as cinematic and grand in scope as they've become.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
I think it is just a little more striking and as you said emotionally investing when we have a unique and interesting character to play as and more importantly care about. Companies seem to be quite content to just use some generic template and throw in a gimmick and dump millions of dollars into a sure fire seller.
Memorable charaters matter and CD have taken Lara from one of the pillars of video game cliches and actually sat down and figured out how to make her a real person that we care about. That's not something a lot of companies are willing to do and it makes for an interesting discussion.
I think it's one of the key elements that is holding modern gaming back from being more than just disposable entertainment.
When it comes especially to survival based games, games with desperate struggles, pitched battles and so forth, it's important to highlight the vulnerability of the character.
Escape From New York is a great example of this. Snake is not a superhero in that movie. He's an efficient mercenary with an ability to survive. He gets his weapons taken away from him. He's tortured. He's forced to fight a slow fat man with spiked clubs in a crappy boxing ring. He limps, literally, all the way to the finish line without any weapons. All of this takes place in a dystopian environment where there is no hope, no authority to assist him, no safe haven for him to retreat to. It's why you root for him. The narrative is very serious about it's desperate circumstances, and wants the audience to believe in it.
In a game like Gears, which is more about stop and pop cover based shooting, the element of survival is a bit more meta. Rather than cutscenes showing the desperation, which are so much military dramatic hokum anymore, the gameplay itself suggests the tension: the death's head HUD growing more gradually red as he takes damage, or his 'Bleeding Out' status when he can only crawl around on the ground until someone comes for him or, in single player games, until you mas the button enough for him to get up.
Tomb Raider does it by showing this young, desperate girl who is intelligent but lacks the hardness of the world dying in grisly fashion. It's a really deviously subversive technique, almost (but not quite) on par with the narrative of Spec Ops: The Line, which is perhaps the ultimate game for showing how a gaming cliche can be used to highilght all the potential that lies therein.
Tomb Raider is, by far, the more polished game. Spec Ops is just an example of how cliched characters and situations can still be powerful narrative tools to connect the player to the game and create a truly memorable experience.
this is way too much serious talk about videogames for me man
These are the design elements that devs think about when they want the players to have a memorable experience that they are willing to come back to again and again, both in replaying the game and in buying the sequels.
It's in the DNA of many Japanese developers. When we talk about 'theme' in gaming, this is an important part of what goes into their ultimate design.
What is the theme of Raiden in MGR: R, for example? I won't dissect that actual component, but you can bet your ass Platinum Games and Kojima Studios forced the issue at every possible point.
People don't need to think about this stuff to enjoy a game. But looking at game dev theory is something I find fascinating because it's all about a studio finding ways to get their hooks sunk deep into the players' minds on a subconscious level.
that's why i always read your postsQuote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
you're very analytical and passionate about this stuff
i like people like that
i was just ribbing playfully because i'm the antithesis of you when it comes to critiquing games
my analysis of a game begins and ends with the question of whether i'm having fun or not
i never delve beyond a thinking process any more complex than that
on-topic: i'm at about 48% complete with this
my initial comment about the difficulty stands
it is very easy, but thoroughly engaging
enjoying it immensely
Stiiiiiiiiiiill horny!
So I was playing last night and unlocked the ability to fast travel between camps and suddenly the game transformed into something I really, really like.
HERESY!Quote:
Originally Posted by terry.330
Do not spout your blasphemy. The God Emperor dwells upon the Golden Throne to protect us all from the enemies of mankind.
I haven't played a Tomb Raider game since the original, which I played on the Saturn sometime in the last century.
May have to check this out when there is a price drop.
does lara get raped in this or what
i keep reading this on other forums, that she gets really beaten up or something
I'm laughing out loud at this.Quote:
Originally Posted by LoneSage
You win this time commie.
I might check it when it's on steam sale, otherwise low priority. I think Anniversary was the last TR game I played.
Wasn't there supposed to be implied rape or some shit like that in this game?
Loving the game, can anyone tell me how many levels/chapters there are in this game as I seem to be burning through it quite rapidly?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzNha...920E98FD7AB3A6Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Shroom
it's been hard for me not to buy this. i really really want it, since i was a huge tomb raider fan back in the 90's....when i was a horny teenager...lol
it's great it's so successful. :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drnPaBAoG7w http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drnPaBAoG7w
This game immediately reminded me of Uncharted... except that the gameplay is actually mostly better! The controls feel somehow more responsive and while there seems to be a cover mechanism, it isnīt quite as Gears of War. Even the quicktime events are bearable though I always seem to miss button Y press on my first try :) No, I donīt really like the quicktime events but I have to suffer through them if I want to see all those cinematic shots that come with them.
Uncharted definitely has a better story though. I canīt make myself to care about the story in this one. Itīs okay but it could have been better.
Still... Definitely the best game in the Tomb Raider franchise, finally a worthy reboot in a series that has failed on its previous tries to be rebooted so many times.
I like the gunfights, I like the climbing, I even think the puzzles are done just right. They bring pacing and I have to think them for half a minute while running around but then I realize what I have to do well before I have to resort to any guide or such. I hope they become a little more advanced gradually as I progress though. So far so good.
I really liked Crysis 3 which also had a bow and some stealth gameplay elements but I like this game more. It just captures to the flow of the game with just enough of a story and above all well paced gameplay elements with enough variance and surprises. Also it looks awesome at 2560x1600 and with everything else set to max except I put AA, tressfx and tesselation off because otherwise it crashes.
Almost done with this game and now that I've rally gotten into it, I can't put it down.
Capcom, sit the fuck up and take notice.
If you want to raise the stakes on your long running franchise of note, PLAY THIS GAME, PAY ATTENTION TO HOW THEY RAMP UP THE TENSION AND LEARN A FEW THINGS.
If Resident Evil 6 would have had the pacing and tempo of this game, it would have been fine.
I love the modifications to the existing gameplay.
The narrative is relentless, desperate and intense.
This is a survival horror game, plain and simple.
I don't even mind the QTEs.
I don't know how they'll follow this up, but this is a really great game.
Much more to my liking than Uncharted ever was.
Im having withdrawals. Against my better judgement I started it Thursday night and was immediately immersed. The problem is that I knew it was my weekend to work (as a nurse im required to work one weekend a month) and I haven't been able to touch it in a couple of days. Im ready to get back into it. I completed the first few areas I visited and once I earned the ability to travel between camps I realized there will be items I cant get until later, which has me looking forward to what the game will bring. Needless to say, this title thus far has been an amazing experience.
O.
I said before I was 'almost done' playing this.
How wrong I was.
This game is a lot longer than I was expecting, and with the collections can take a good long time to finish.
Good stuff. But I feel they've missed one important opportunity for a character defining moment, one that seemed to be screaming it was time
Spoiler:
Just finished it. My god, what a game. Taiso, I look forward to your thoughts upon completion. I wont spoil anything though.
O.
I was such a non-believer of this games generation. After finishing God of War Ascension, Metal Gear Rising, Resident Evil 6... I was feeling.. well that's it.. PS3 is dead for me..
but I started to read how good this game was.. so I got it and played it last night for 5 hours straight!
Holy shit! This is a great game!!
No arrows pointing where you should go, like if you were retarded. No follow me dot!
It's awesome, like good old days challenge.. except for near save state that current gen has but.. it's awesome!
I managed to finish the game up earlier this week.Quote:
Originally Posted by O. Yashiro
In terms of intrinsic gameplay (I.E. 'is the game fun to PLAY'), I would have to say that the combat is smooth, the platforming is engaging, the controls are generally responsive and the treasure hunts and tomb puzzles are not only challenging but rewarding to complete, both in terms of satisfying a player's need to succeed and at the in game rewards of loot revealing maps and big XP rewards.
The aesthetics are spot on, from the voice acting to the graphics and textures to the BEAUTIFUL environments and the soundtrack. The sense of vertigo I experienced when I was in the harbor in the later stages of the game, navigating all those gigantic shipwrecks, really generated a feelilng of 'scale' within me. I realized just how big this island and its mystry was, and small and insignificant I was against it. How will one battered teenage girl overcome an island acting as home to a power that can beach battleships? These immersive elements are part and parcel of any video game experience that is fixed on narrative. It's not just about advancing the story to the next chapter, but feeling the current chapter. This is not an easy thing for game developers to establish, and it needs to be recognized when they do it.
In terms of the extrinsic gameplay (I.E. 'playing to achieve a particular in-game state/status' such as seeing the story unfold, leveling up, etc), I enjoyed modifying the weapons and gathering the resources to improve them. I also liked how stylish you actually become with Lara as the game goes on. As she gets stronger and more confident, so do you.
The game gets easier as you go along, and I believe this is a good thing for this type of game. Purists may argue that the gameplay 'isn't hard enough' but my personal view is that this is in willful ignorance of what this game actually is.
If you look at what this game is, there is a clear attempt on the part of the devs to revitalize an IP whose resonance is about 75% in the public consciousness and only about 2%5 in the quality of the games themselves. There really aren't that many 'great' Tomb Raider games. In fact, I think it's fair to argue that after the first game, none of them really justify the character's position in the industry if you look at it from a sheer 'game quality' standpoint. Lara's been a one trick pony for a long time now.
But still, Lara persists. She is an icon, undeniably one of the most recognizable female protagonists from video games of all time. You could argue that, given her pop culture exposure, she's the MOST recognizable, certainly moreso than Zelda, Samus or Chun Li to the lay person. And it can't be denied that she is one of the most significant characters, male or female, because of how she's been used in pop culture since her introduction. The first live action film remains the highest grossing movie based on a video game ever, and that kind of mass market penetration means something. If you call something 'Tomb Raider', people are going to know who it's about and what it is.
So it's clear that the mission with this new game was to focus on the character's growth through the course of the game from an ability/maturity standpoint, which necessarily creates an emotional bond with the player, and this is something that goes beyond the observation of Tomb Raider as a 'game'. If you look at the focus on cinematic storytelling and the harsh circumstances she's forced to endure, CD is definitely trying to get you to care about this character and to want to get her thorugh these trials.
This is why, in my opinion, the death scenes for failed QTEs are so violent. Whenever Lara gets impaled or choked to death or crushed,, and it's all right there in front of me, I feel really bad. Instincitively, because of my own human nature, I am thinking 'she's so young and she'll never live all that life and have all those adventures.' It's more frustrating to me than when, say, Nathan Drake or Kratos dies. Those people have had their day in the sun and if it's their time, the only tragedy is that 'evil prevails.' This will obviously not affect all players. Some people will just be mashing buttons as fast as possible to give it a second, third or fourth try. But for me, observing the game as a narrative experience and not purely as an exercise in hand-eye coordination, I take all of these elements into consideration and feel all the more rewarded for enjoying the game on all the levels it has to offer. I am, at the very least, getting far more bang for my buck than the impatient twitch based gamers who only care about 'gameplay' and 'challenge.' This game is not for them-it's for the rest of us.
But with Lara, there is an extra desire to help see her through it because I want to help her get off that island, stop the bad guys, save her friends and go on to do great things. The character has no cynicism in her at the start of the game, and despite all the marketing of this dark, gritty heroine that emerges from hell transformed, she remains hopeful, optimistic and vulnerable. I've read one review that criticized the cinematic portrayal of the character in stark contrast with the violent methods of eliminiating enemies at the player's fingertips, but I feel this odd juxtaposition of gameplay versus presentation is perfectly fine. Audiences will generally remember Lara for the person she is supposed to be, not the violent killer some of us have made her through our own actions. This type of selective ownership is something players can generally sort out for themselves with little concern.
To further illustrate that Lara is Lara and we are just shepherds on her adventure, at the end of the game, the 'meta' element of going back to complete the island at 100% is that 'she's not going back' when the others are relieved to finally be going home. But even there, her internal motiviation is not like that of Martin Sheen's psyche blasted soul from Apocalypse Now. She hasn't grown harder, as Sheen did. It can be argued that Sheen became weaker as a human being at the end of AN, whereas Lara's grown stronger for staying pure, and that island still has secrets to discover. And you want to help her discover those secrets. Just as Lara, this virtual identity, wants to unearth the secrets because of her archaeological roots and to see all truths laid bare, you also want to revisit the island and uncover everything because at your heart, you too are a completist. If you weren't, you wouldn't be playing 'New Game+' mode.
And it is significant, and important, for Lara to retain her own identity, rather than let the audience shape her. This is what creates the narrative attachment that so many of today's gamers need to return to a series that features beloved characters. This is not to discredit games like Fallout 3 or Elder Scrolls, but those games don't rely on a signature character to exist. Tomb Raider, on the other hand, exists because of Lara's enduring popularity, not the other way around. Because of that, player ownership needs to be provided in other areas of the game and not necessarily in plotting her life course.
This type of psychological connection between the game and the player is a very difficult tightrope to walk. It's an element of 'theme' that is being pushed in order to create a compulsory connection to the game and the character. This makes you want to play the next game, have the next adventure.
I've seen this trend fairly often in games this year: games that are eminently fun with engaging, if easy, gameplay, compelling characters and narrative and amazing aesthetics. DmC, Castlevania: Lords of Shadow Mirror of Fate and now Tomb Raider all are a part of this trend, as is Fire Emblem: Awakening if you count the casual mode gameplay. They've also been four of the most fun games I've played this year. None of them (except FE: A) has the replayability or polish of Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance, but I take them a whole lot more seriously as entries respective to their IPs because they are creating a greater sense of attachment to EVERYTHING about them. With MGR: R, the gameplay is the only thing I care about and with all that wonderful aesthetic polish (graphics, music, immersion, etc.) being so completely forgettable, it's such a tragic waste.
As an accomplishment, I give this new TR 4.5 out of five. I think CD hit every mark they were aiming for. If players don't like it, it's because this game just isn't for them and is not a mark against the game itself at all. My only quibble is that there is no way in game to reveal the locations of the 'treasure hunt' item locations. I don't want those locations HANDED to me, but another map, a harder to find map, or at least a marker showing the ones I've found as I check the map, would have been appreciated.
thank you sir, and I will likely be sharing your thoughts via quotes and such on other forums. im telling you, you should get paid for this or do columns.
O.
Thanks. I appreciate the praise:)
As for 'columns', stuff's in the works but I will always make time for my peeps at NG.com to post things like this.
it's always a delight to read taiso's posts and i don't even care about video games anymore
Patched!
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/1005/59497480.jpg
This game just got even better :)
Nude Raider flashback :lolz:
you can't do that for real can you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendel
I will have to purchase this game.
They didn't try to tack on some bullshit multiplayer did they?
Yes, there is multi player but fuck that noise. My experiences were solely on the single player campaign and it's really all you need. Fuck multi player Tomb Raider.
so are there like mythical creatures in this or not? trying to avoid watching videos to be sure because I want them to be surprises but I want to know for sure there are some. You know like rock beasts or living statues and stuffs. boss fights with mystical stuffthings?
how much do you have to fight 'normal' guys?
Yeah the MP is just tacked on prerequisite BS. Single player is where it's at, and by at I mean fucking awesome.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
I just want to say I agree with you wholeheartedly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
Fuck multiplayer Tomb Raider.
I haven't played a Tomb Raider game since Tomb Raider. Ok, that's not true - I played Tomb Raider 2 on the PSX but did not enjoy it at all.
Does this new Tomb Raider delve in to any magical/occult type elements? If you recall in the first Tomb Raider game you fought demons...But then again you also fought Dinosaurs and bears.
The original Tomb Raider is great.
EDIT: Ha, didn't see Karous post above about mythical creatures. I <3 Karou.
You spend most of the game fighting normal enemies, but there's a mystical force behind the power on the island and there are some supernatural enemies in the third act.
There's a particularly tense sequence when you're navigating an area to avoid being detected by them. Extremely well done. A rare occasion of a set piece in a video game I actually like.
Is Tomb Raider back at it's best? Or does the Uncharted series still take first place?
As I am wondering if I should buy it or not.
Here is where I can't really give an opinion on Tomb Raider v. Uncharted because I've always felt Uncharted was terribly overrated and not really all that great to begin with.
I am curious to see what the Uncharted fans think of this, though.
Uncharted is way more fun but more childish than Tomb Raider.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
I've beaten all 3 uncharted games and I really enjoyed it.
The soundtrack of Uncharted 3 is a masterpiece, compared to an almost non-existed Tomb Raider soundtrack.
The complain I have for Tomb Raider so far, at 60% of the game is that.. it's really long and gets boring.
Uncharted has a more fluid game play more straight forward that I enjoy more.
I would compare the style of game play of uncharted to a NES Ninja Gaiden, you just run and go forward. This can be a blessing for some and a boring side of the game.
The Tomb Raider game play has moments of going back and forward, revisiting places and so on.
I believe this is the main difference from both games, besides the sound track.
The graphics are both amazing, so there's not much to talk about here. Since both use almost the same gameplay engine that is absolute the same:
- How health works, no health bar, no health kits
- Climbing is the same, including same buttons
- Quick time events based on a single button, no button combination
- The aiming is the same
- The weapons are almost the same
- Enemies take almost the same amount of bullets
- Same enemies, the guy with iron helmet, the guy with a shield, they are present on both games
One thing that I feel that is the same is the over beaten the main character gets. Drake passes the point of death a lot, the same goes to Lara.
To me, Tomb Raider could be called "Uncharted - A spin off game" and it would fit.
Except for the soundtrack.
Being a huge Uncharted fan, it was the game that sold me on PS3, I have to say that I dont think the two games should really be compared. Even though I knew that just through premise and what the characters "do" it would happen, there is an obvious parallel that could be drawn, but there shouldnt be. The reason I say this is because once you get past that initial similarity (although huge), the games are really VERY different. Whereas Tomb Raider is all about building the emotional connection between you as the player to Lara as the character, using themes of solitude, desperation, and most of all survival. Uncharted is more about using its amazing set pieces to wow you as the player into driving Drake the character forward. Even though with it being a game that you knew would have an inevitable conclusion, there were moments in Tomb Raider where you are made to truly feel like "how much more can this girl take"? In Uncharted this feeling is never invoked because Drake is the quintessential plucky action hero, you know hes going to make it, its all about seeing HOW he does it. The experiences are VASTLY different in each game, thus even though they both might clamber up walls with impeccable climbing skills, and they both hunt treasure....the two characters and the two games are NOTHING alike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiso
O.
Awesome observation of theme, O.
I think what you point out is why I just can't get into Uncharted.
It relies on its set pieces to create emotional momentum and I am not a fan of set pieces in video games, with a few exceptions. I think a lot of it has to do with my general dislike of QTEs, although TR's and now the new Castlevania's for 3DS are two examples where the QTEs actually add to the experience rather than detract from it.