using a person's color as a physical description

this kind of stems from neo1087's topic.

now, neo's a whitey. in his story he described someone as "black."

most people jumped on him as being racist.

though observation ive noticed that most people will, when describing someone, leave out that persons race/skin color if its the same as their own. but they will commonly include it if it is different.

ive also noticed a double standard. its 100% ok for every other race to call us crackers white, but if a whitey calls a black person black it tends to not always fly over so well.

thoughts?

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Originally Posted by not sonic

this kind of stems from neo1087's topic.

now, neo's a whitey. in his story he described someone as "black."

most people jumped on him as being racist.

though observation ive noticed that most people will, when describing someone, leave out that persons race/skin color if its the same as their own. but they will commonly include it if it is different.

ive also noticed a double standard. its 100% ok for every other race to call us crackers white, but if a whitey calls a black person black it tends to not always fly over so well.

thoughts?

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Why does there need to be 2 Country music channels?

Just about everyone I know does this.
I usually look at them & ask "why does it matter that hes black?".
People are people, Some cool, Some stupid.
That's just life I reckon.

I thought most people were joking around in neo's thread.

I know I was...

But I'll leave SPIN to post that pic of the little black kid saying "That's racist!"

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Originally Posted by not sonic

though observation ive noticed that most people will, when describing someone, leave out that persons race/skin color if its the same as their own.

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In my oppion, that is not entirely true.

http://home.houston.rr.com/samrussell/bsmf.JPG

http://www.beadesigngroup.com/blog/a...WheatiesAd.jpg

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Originally Posted by norton9478

In my oppion, that is not entirely true.

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well i didnt post it as conclusive evidence its just what ive seen.

personally i think that using someones race is ok to describe someone as long as youre not implying anything derogatory. (i suppose when people leave out their own can kind of skew it to being derogatory when they do throw in a race/color.)

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Originally Posted by Average Joe

http://www.beadesigngroup.com/blog/a...WheatiesAd.jpg

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FTW

Whenever I describe people, I almost never mention their race. I'll usually say, "some old guy" or "a random bum" or "I met the coolest guy/girl ever!" Their race is unimportant to me.

I had breakfast with 3 whiteys this morning, and my whitey wife just took my brown dog for a walk.

i'll call someone by their race when describing them. i could care less if someone says otherwise. my girlfriend has a problem with it, and says "that's kinda racist." and i say "how is that racist at all? it's describing someone and if i just say a tall guy with glasses people wont know who the fuck i'm talking about. but if i say the tall black dude with glasses it helps to narrow things down at least a bit." so she got even more on me saying that i'm mean and so i said to her:

"i'm hispanic, if someone describes me as such i wouldn't have a problem with it, hispanic, latino, chicano, whatever they wanna call me in that context is fine. i'm not being called a beaner, or wetback, or spic, so i'm not offended. i don't describe a black person as a nigger or spook so why would they be offended if i describe them as black, black is perfectly fine, they know they're black and they prolly know i can see it too. it's not racist if it's a fact."

she promptly said okay, and then asked "well what if someone calls me white?" and i said "well you are white, it's unavoidable that someone would call you that. and i don't think being white offends you as you've been fine with it all your life so i think you're cool with being white, just like most black people are cool with being black and hispanics are cool with being hispanic, and so forth and so on. it's not racist to describe someone by their race, hell we're all categorized into it by the state of texas anyways. not much to be done about it other than live with it." and that kinda ended the conversation on that. though she's still iffy on calling black people black when talking about them or whatever.

I think using crayola names would lessen the racism factor quite a bit. Black people could be called Walnut Mahogany, white people could be called Manilla Vanilla, and the asians would be Mango Mellow Yellow.

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Originally Posted by Domino-chan

Whenever I describe people, I almost never mention their race. I'll usually say, "some old guy" or "a random bum" or "I met the coolest guy/girl ever!" Their race is unimportant to me.

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You sound like one of the random little critters from Animal Crossing.

The real question here is, who are you describing?

If there are 2 random people on the street, and I want to point out one of them to you ( let's say, you're looking for someon, but don't know what he looks like ).

What is more apparent?

If I say, the guy with the glasses? Or the black/white/etc. guy?

( BTW, I go with " the guy in the such and such shirt" ;) )

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Originally Posted by not sonic

this kind of stems from neo1087's topic.

now, neo's a whitey. in his story he described someone as "black."

most people jumped on him as being racist.

though observation ive noticed that most people will, when describing someone, leave out that persons race/skin color if its the same as their own. but they will commonly include it if it is different.

ive also noticed a double standard. its 100% ok for every other race to call us crackers white, but if a whitey calls a black person black it tends to not always fly over so well.

thoughts?

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This thread is going places.....

anyway this is what the deal is. It goes 2 ways but it also all depends on the situation. Some people just have to use somebody's race as a description when they aren't the same race as that person because thats all they know. Other people think anytime somebody uses race its always bad. There are plenty of times when you have to.

In America I think we can all agree that the "default" American is white. Look at movie and video game main characters. Everything else is kind of secondary. A guy I knew told me about how he got "tested". He said a man pointed out some people and asked them what they were. He pointed at a lady and said "what is that" and the guy goes "its a lady" and he pointed at a black guy and the guy said "its a black guy". He said at that moment he realized what the deal was and what the guy was trying to get ouf of him. Even non white people will do the same and call out their own race but not whites, depending on where they grew up.

Even here in Europe dealing with my fellow Americans they say the craziest things. if i say "there was a fight last week at the club" they'll say "was it a white guy or a German guy?":spock: by white guy they mean "American guy". That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and is downright ignorant and funny at the same time.

Another example similar to the one above but from the European side is how Europeans treat "Americans". We all know that Americans and the French hate each other and time after time I'm sure you've heard people say "i went on vacation in France and I hated it", well all i have to say is, I've been to France 7 million times and only 1 time did i have a problem and it was because of a misunderstanding and why? Cuz I'm black. In France they see the "typical American" as a white guy and i hate to say it but they won't hesitate to give them trouble while the American minorities slip through the cracks of french bad treatment. Also when I hear Europeans talk bad about Americans they are always referencing white people but without actually saying "white people". I think its ridiculous and not cool at all.

Now for the other side.

There are times when you need to use race as a description. But many times people can't handle it and wanna go overboard and get all "PC" about it. Also being that I've been living overseas dealing with other languages i realized that the sounds of words can make a person who doesn't understand a word think it has a different meaning. If a word sounds rough then that word must be a bad word.

When I'm travelling around to other countries and tell people where I live they say "ew you live in Germany, their language sounds rough and ugly". Now ugly is not a description of what I'd have for the German language but "rough" i can agree with. Even the nicest words sound rough like "Schatz" which is like saying "Dear" or "Ruhig" means "Calm". Alot of their words have a "ck" sound at the end or some other part of the word and that denotes a "rough sound".

More often than not people will refer to us as "Black" and not "African American". Now say the words out loud "black" and "African American" and "white". What sounds rougher? I think most of you would say the word "black" sounds rough while "African American" has a softer sound and probably carries a slightly different meaning as well and "white" just sounds like any old word. Say the phrase "you black bastard" and then say "you african american bastard" and then "you white bastard". I'm sure the 2 latter sound alot less offensive than the first and "african american bastard" sounds downright awkward and silly.

So when some people hear the word "Black" in reference to them they don't like it, its cuz it doesn't sound nice to their ears. It also works well in cuss word phrases. "You black motherfucker", "that black bitch". The way a word sounds has an impact on what people like to be called.

It ends up being an overboard PC example of "don't call me that cuz it doesn't sound nice" when In actuality there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. I'm black, and thats that. The "black vs african american" thing is a whole nother topic so i won't go too far into that.

Basically we should just see a person as a person instead of "that (insert race) person". But this world isn't perfect now is it?

The biggest thing that pisses me off is America's youth conforming to a media stereotype for their given background.

IE: Black kids salavating over the new Game cd and dressing in accordance with MTVs high standards of ghetto style clothing. White kids wearing tight jeans with studded belts and spiking their hair to a peacock mohawk. With fingerless gloves and listening to panic at the disco. etc..

The only thing I'm tempted to ask these kids are "you gonna be dressing like that in ten years?" and then walk away and let them ponder the question.

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

A lot of stuff.

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http://members.cox.net/geesehoward/ssx2.jpg

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Originally Posted by SamuraiShodownSensei

The biggest thing that pisses me off is America's youth conforming to a media stereotype for their given background.

IE: Black kids salavating over the new Game cd and dressing in accordance with MTVs high standards of ghetto style clothing. White kids wearing tight jeans with studded belts and spiking their hair to a peacock mohawk. With fingerless gloves and listening to panic at the disco. etc..

The only thing I'm tempted to ask these kids are "you gonna be dressing like that in ten years?" and then walk away and let them ponder the question.

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Thats something that can't be stopped. Its not just youth, its just human nature in general to conform regardless of age.

Look at old white people, then look at old black people, and look at old hispanic people. Of course the gap in differences is much smaller than teenagers and such but there are differences.

I find using color as a way of properly detailing the event.

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Originally Posted by Buro Destruct

http://members.cox.net/geesehoward/ssx2.jpg

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I can't believe you guys still have this edited picture of me. I must say I chuckled when I saw it.

The relevance of this practice probably reaches its highest level of legitimacy when the matter of identification is of primary importance. Any missing persons descriptions or descriptions of persons wanted for criminal activity would have lessened effectiveness were this information omitted simply due to political concerns.

All I know is this...

If a crime is allegedly commited by a black person, his face is more likely to make the 6'0clock.

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Originally Posted by DolphinLord

The relevance of this practice probably reaches its highest level of legitimacy when the matter of identification is of primary importance. Any missing persons descriptions or descriptions of persons wanted for criminal activity would have lessened effectiveness were this information omitted simply due to political concerns.

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exactly. i figure when describing someone you tell the other person, how the person looked. whether they're ugly, fat, white, hispanic, black, asian, had glasses, facial hair, big boobs, any of this stuff. and yeah big boobs, fat, race, and ugly are all politically incorrect, but so what. you're trying to give someone details not leave them in the dark.

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Originally Posted by DolphinLord

The relevance of this practice probably reaches its highest level of legitimacy when the matter of identification is of primary importance. Any missing persons descriptions or descriptions of persons wanted for criminal activity would have lessened effectiveness were this information omitted simply due to political concerns.

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Wow I had to read that 2 times before I got it... :D

My father was an expert for race religions - being a teacher in a multi-racial area, he was sent on many courses about how to deal with and combat racism. In school whites were the minority to non-whites, but if you evenned up by race there was probably and equal mix between white, black, chinese, asian, indian and a few europeans. He became passionate about fighting racism for future generations, and wanted us to grow into a generation of people where it wouldn't be an issue. Once there are no racist parents, there shall be no racist children, and it can be left in the past. We traveled around the country to seminars and worked with the British sections of the children's television workshop to try and help with equality.

As an adult I've been in the music industry for many years and helped many dissadvantaged areas get out of drugs and into making music, dancing and acting - often producing and getting signed hip-hop records for poor teens, which has lead me to work in the states in similar communities also. Last year I was asked to write a book about the effects of racism in the music industry, and I am currently about 3/4 of the way through writing, having researched the matter even more fully and gaining more of an understanding of racism specifically in America and how it affected popular culture before, during and after the Jim-crow era.

I hate racism of all kinds - it literally makes me sick to my stomach, I've just been raised that way. However I also hate people claiming certain things are racist which aren't - for example an employer feeling he has to employ the minority candidate even when another candidate was better qualified, for fear of being called racist. A shop owner banning a minority from his shop for shoplifting can often be toughted as racist, when he would have done exactly the same no matter what the colour of the thief's skin.

One thing, that in my mind at least is not racist, is describing somebody as "black" or "white" - its a common term for describing the colour of somebody's skin. One of the major factors when describing somebody's appearance IS the colour of their skin, and its foolish to claim otherwise - for example "tall, black, guy wearing jeans" is not as racist description, neither is fat, "white, girl with the pink shirt". The only time is when the colour is used is an emphasized or derogatory way, especially when that person is in the minority - for example in a room of white people, a single black person may not be comfortable being described as "the black one" - especially if not in front of their face, after being introduced by name, and with vocal emphasis on the word. Of course thats an extreme example, but my point is that black people are black, and should be proud of their heritage, the same can be said for caucasian, chinese, indian etc. Describing someone as such is only offensive when purposely used to ignore their other features, and simply characterize them by race, and race alone.

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Originally Posted by Thiessen

My father was an expert for race religions - being a teacher in a multi-racial area, he was sent on many courses about how to deal with and combat racism. In school whites were the minority to non-whites, but if you evenned up by race there was probably and equal mix between white, black, chinese, asian, indian and a few europeans. He became passionate about fighting racism for future generations, and wanted us to grow into a generation of people where it wouldn't be an issue. Once there are no racist parents, there shall be no racist children, and it can be left in the past. We traveled around the country to seminars and worked with the British sections of the children's television workshop to try and help with equality.

As an adult I've been in the music industry for many years and helped many dissadvantaged areas get out of drugs and into making music, dancing and acting - often producing and getting signed hip-hop records for poor teens, which has lead me to work in the states in similar communities also. Last year I was asked to write a book about the effects of racism in the music industry, and I am currently about 3/4 of the way through writing, having researched the matter even more fully and gaining more of an understanding of racism specifically in America and how it affected popular culture before, during and after the Jim-crow era.

I hate racism of all kinds - it literally makes me sick to my stomach, I've just been raised that way. However I also hate people claiming certain things are racist which aren't - for example an employer feeling he has to employ the minority candidate even when another candidate was better qualified, for fear of being called racist. A shop owner banning a minority from his shop for shoplifting can often be toughted as racist, when he would have done exactly the same no matter what the colour of the thief's skin.

One thing, that in my mind at least is not racist, is describing somebody as "black" or "white" - its a common term for describing the colour of somebody's skin. One of the major factors when describing somebody's appearance IS the colour of their skin, and its foolish to claim otherwise - for example "tall, black, guy wearing jeans" is not as racist description, neither is fat, "white, girl with the pink shirt". The only time is when the colour is used is an emphasized or derogatory way, especially when that person is in the minority - for example in a room of white people, a single black person may not be comfortable being described as "the black one" - especially if not in front of their face, after being introduced by name, and with vocal emphasis on the word. Of course thats an extreme example, but my point is that black people are black, and should be proud of their heritage, the same can be said for caucasian, chinese, indian etc. Describing someone as such is only offensive when purposely used to ignore their other features, and simply characterize them by race, and race alone.

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http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/icons/icon35.gif Respect

No point to even take issue with such harmless words.

In my white trash town, I'll describe somebody as that "black dude" if it can help the other guy figure out who Im talking about.

And if I'm in the city at like...Viva nightclub where it's 95% black, I'd be like: "hey check out that white dude breaking over there...."

Isolating a minority is the quickest way to describe a person. It's a reflex more than anything.


What the fuck else am I gonna call'em if I don't know their names?

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Originally Posted by Sp0o/\/?!

What the fuck else am I gonna call'em if I don't know their names?

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"dude"

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Originally Posted by not sonic

this kind of stems from neo1087's topic.

now, neo's a whitey. in his story he described someone as "black."

most people jumped on him as being racist.

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I figured when most people called him racist, they were just being jokingly facetious. At least I hope they were!

I think anybody would get slightly alarmed if they were being followed closely by a stranger, regardless of that person's race. But if a certain group (in this case, young black males typically dressed a certain way) has a reputation for being more inclined towards crime, are you a racist for becoming more apprehensive upon seeing such a person coming near you? I think not! That's known as "street smarts", not racism.

I am white, but if I go to Britain and see a group of chavs approaching, am I a racist against white people for thinking there's a chance they might pull a knife on me?

soon we won't be able to call people anything

black people will only be called people

fat people will only be called people

stupid people will only be called people

and no one will know what the fuck anyone is talking about.

A PC tower of Babel.

freedom of expression may expose hate, but it's a price I'll gladly pay.

How can anyone say that they wouldn't ever describe someone by their race? If you were trying to point someone out in a crowd, let's make this simple and say it's a group of businessmen in black suits, if there was only one guy in that group was asian, you'd be stupid not to describe him as "the asian one" if you were trying to point him out. And if you wouldn't think of that as a viable way to point someone out, you're probably just way too sensitive about race. People use race to point someone out when race is a good way to distinguish them from other people. If it was a group of white guys, you'd probably say the color or someone's hat or jacket. When you're pointing people out you don't know, you'd OBLIGATED to do so through aesthetic characteristics, there's just no other way to do it.

On the other hand, if you *always* use race to describe people, something's fishy, but using it sometimes should be no problem...

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Originally Posted by wasabi

soon we won't be able to call people anything

black people will only be called people

fat people will only be called people

stupid people will only be called people

and no one will know what the fuck anyone is talking about.

A PC tower of Babel.

freedom of expression may expose hate, but it's a price I'll gladly pay.

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It's not just people, either. I remember listening to a George Carlin standup where he talks about people "pussy-fying" words to great degrees over the years. Let's all just face it - we're turning into a world full of insecurity.

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

Thats something that can't be stopped. Its not just youth, its just human nature in general to conform regardless of age.

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I defy human nature.

PS ~ your post before this was the thread winner.

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Originally Posted by Abasuto

I defy human nature.

PS ~ your post before this was the thread winner.

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I defy human natures as wel.

LOL, after I posted that, I felt like I was wizkid for some reason:lolz:

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

"dude"

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Describing =/= Profiling

When you refer to them as "white women" is that racist? Common now....


It's not like I'm fucking Wizkid telling you about "YOUR PEOPLE" and how they need to "get their shit together" like MY PEOPLE have...

Now THAT was some ignorant shit.

me personally, it depends. If I'm telling a story to someone, I usually throw in the person's race just because I like to retell the story as authentic as I possibly can.

However, if it's just a small thing, I don't even think about race. I also agree with whoever said they have no qualms about it, just so long as it is not used in a negative fashion.

LOL, I once had this guy jump on my back because I was re-telling a flea market score and used the words "Mexican vendor" and he threw the racist card at me :oh_no:

Some people bitch about it because they're fucking pussies.

Others bitch about it because they love bitching.

Still others bitch about it because it makes them feel like they're more compassionate.

It's ok though - I actually prefer the term "darkies" anyway. :lolz:

This is the stupidest fucking thread in the world.

There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with referring to someone by their race if they aren't present. It's a matter of communication.

Some people might prefer African-American to black, or Latino/Hispanic to "spanish", but if you are trying to describe someone to someone else the hierarchy goes 1) Gender 2) Race or ethnicity 3) Size or build.

Are we all a bunch of Stephen Colberts, completely unable to see color?

"People tell me I'm white and I believe them."

What's even MORE annoying are the people who complain about this sort of thing, like whatever loser started this thread. Who cares if someone says "That's racist!"

Guess what, it's not, so get over it. When people go on and on about how this sort of thing is an "affront to white people now I've been called racist"...well, doesn't that make you just as stupid and petty as the jackass who started the whole thing?

/rant

bro chill the fuck out.

i made no opinion in my original post and feel that this thread was fleshed out pretty well and we got some great responses, and it proves this clearly is something that comes up.

i would in no way call this "the stupidest fucking thread in the world" nor do i feel it necessary to call me a loser.

so seriously chill the fuck out.

Around blacks who don't know me, I'm referred to as "big dog" or "big man" (Like I already don't know about my size to begin with. Gee, thanks. :rolleyes: ) Otherwise, I usu. get "that big, black guy over there" or some phrase that may describe me less by what my skin is and more of what I'm wearing or doing at the moment....my guess is being too sensitive and not calling a spade a spade.

Well I'm a Mutt, comprised of BLACK, Creole, Cherokee, Seminole, German, Mexican, Apache, Mongolian, Spanish and let me tell you. I have no problem with ppl using the color of someone else's skin to describe them or even me for that matter. I can't remember the number of times I've been simply called "That Mexican guy" or "that High yellow black dude" or teh funnier ones when I don't shave for a week... "that Habib looking motherfucker".

WHATEVER!

It's just words ppl. Why the fuck do ppl not just get specs of sand in the vagina but literally the whole damn beach up their cunt? I mean I'm comprised of a large number of ethniticities from both sides of the family and from both side's mother/father lineage, and from time to time I'll be like: That fucking Honky cut me off!" or "Gawd damn Nip son of a bitch!" Etc, etc.

Does this mean I really feel that way? NOPE. Am I a racists? NOPE! Don't really give a flying fuck about it all, it's just words. And I don't care who the person is or what their background, if you get offended over that shit you're a fucking faggot, and not in the homosexual way either, just a limp wristed PC minded Nancy Boy. Hell I've seen queers who indeed are homosexual have more backbone and don't get pissed about being referred to as a homo. But then you'll have straight folks get all upset over someone referring to them by their skin color? Yeah, well ppl will stop using that as a description of someone when Census stops making a BIG deal over it as well.

Like I said... "WHATEVER".
:annoyed:

This multi ethnic asshole is going to moonwalk his ass across the lawn and the white lady who owns the duplex can complain to her loud black neighbor to her right and cuss out the spic who lives above her.
:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

"dude"

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Amen.

And I hate Animal Crossing.

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/icons/icon35.gif Respect

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Wow thanks a lot man :)

Glad what I typed didn't offend anyone. Of course - that could have been because I typed so much that very few people bothered to read it ;) :lolz:

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Originally Posted by DolphinLord

The relevance of this practice probably reaches its highest level of legitimacy when the matter of identification is of primary importance. Any missing persons descriptions or descriptions of persons wanted for criminal activity would have lessened effectiveness were this information omitted simply due to political concerns.

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Exactly. http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/icons/icon14.gif

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Originally Posted by Sp0o/\/?!

Describing =/= Profiling

When you refer to them as "white women" is that racist? Common now....


It's not like I'm fucking Wizkid telling you about "YOUR PEOPLE" and how they need to "get their shit together" like MY PEOPLE have...

Now THAT was some ignorant shit.

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Naaah its not profiling its just in certain situations it can be seen that way. Like in my example before when the guy referred to people of his race as what they were without the race but when the other guy pointed to the black guy and he says "black guy", then people will look at that and say "so what, that means he's not a regular guy?".

Otherwise there is nothing wrong with using race as a description.

p.s. this country is getting pussyfied.

i dont hate races..
i hate people....

including blackies and whities

get the fuck over it... People get oppressed. Just be glad your being oppressed for race, and not for being retarded...

I use black/white/latino/asian usually.

Normally I use black because I only know one African American (USA/Kenya).

White is the sort-all of most people, even if they're not white.

i'll put it like this. the day a black guy isn't proud to be called black, the day a hispanic guy isn't glad to be called hispanic, the day an asian isn't proud to be asian. the day these names become insults and hurt people's feelings is the day that people have truly lost it. i'm hispanic, when someone refers to me as such i am fucking proud of it. i don't take it as an insult. i feel like "damn right! i am hispanic, my parents did come over here from cuba, and i do know spanish, and i am of a different culture than you and i'm damn proud of that heritage" the day someone of a different race or culture becomes ashamed of being referred to as such is the day that society as a whole has become far too sensitive. if i refer to a black guy as black guy i'd expect him to be proud of his heritage and be like "yeah i'm black, i'm proud, and i'm something you'll never be." not to be hurt or offended by that. if he was offended i can guarantee i'd lose a lot of respect for someone in that case. because that just makes the person out to be a super sensitive wuss.

Black people aren't black.
White people aren't white.
Asian people aren't yellow.

Its a description, get over it. White people have as much reason to be up in arms at being called 'White" as Black people have to be angry over being called "Black". Neither word is any more or less accurate than the other.

I'm friends with a black guy, and we constantly quip jokes back and forth about our respective race and at the end of the day we're still friends and we're having a good laugh.