I'm proud of my home state.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/11....ap/index.html

Science and common sense: 1

People who feel schools should be churches: 0

Religion is fine and good when practiced on your own time. Religious theories don't belong in a public school curriculum.

Blair's support is waning, the White House has (former) staff members under indictment, Dubya's approval ratings are in the toilet, nobody gives a shit about "saving" Iraq anymore, and supporters of the invisible man in the sky are reminded that church is on Sunday and in a different building than the local school.

The liberal backlash begins :buttrock:

Yeah, this religious morality should stay out of law and school.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lord Wolfgang Krauser

religious morality

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Oxymoron.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

Oxymoron.

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lol ignorant.

lol america.

oh wait.

I was taught both theories in school. The difference being I was taught the theories .

Who knows for sure? It's a gamble either way. We don't even understand phenomenons like gravity/magnetism so who's to say?

I'm not up for much debate on this issue as I'm tired of discussing it, but I don't see any problem with teaching both theories. Either way, people will make up their own minds what to believe.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

I was taught both theories in school. The difference being I was taught the theories .

Who knows for sure? It's a gamble either way. We don't even understand phenomenons like gravity/magnetism so who's to say?

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But is a biology class a place for religious theory? The theory of evolution is based on science, whereas religious theory is based on belief and faith. A public school is a place for teaching science. Your home or church is better suited to exploring belief and faith.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

But is a biology class a place for religious theory? The theory of evolution is based on science, whereas religious theory is based on belief and faith. A public school is a place for teaching science. Your home or church is better suited to exploring belief and faith.

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lol. World Religions was the best class I ever took in High School.

Keep your shit together.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

But is a biology class a place for religious theory? The theory of evolution is based on science, whereas religious theory is based on belief and faith. A public school is a place for teaching science. Your home or church is better suited to exploring belief and faith.

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Theory is theory, no?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Theory is theory, no?

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Yes, I believe instead of gravity...Intelligent Falling should be taught in school.

give.me.a.break

Science is also a system of belief. I don't really see a big issue with teaching both.

I'm not an up-at-arms, we're all free to believe or disbelieve what we chose.

One can't prove evolution or creation. I fail to see why so many get bent about the issue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nesagwa

lol. World Religions was the best class I ever took in High School.

Keep your shit together.

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There's a difference between a class that teaches religion and a class that teaches about religions.

Fucking twit.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Theory is theory, no?

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No.

there's no point to teaching religious theory in public schools.

Especially since the US is leaning further from homogeneity with the influx of more Indians and Asians, who may not adhere to some fantastical judeo christian religion. That's why we support religious freedom - not relgious oppression.

midwesterners have to stop reinforcing the joke about how stupid they are.

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Originally Posted by wasabi

there's no point to teaching religious theory in public schools.

Especially since the US is leaning further from homogeneity with the influx of more Indians and Asians, who may not adhere to some fantastical judeo christian religion. That's why we support religious freedom - not relgious oppression.

midwesterners have to stop reinforcing the joke about how stupid they are.

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Christiantiy certainly isn't alone in creation?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

There's a difference between a class that teaches religion and a class that teaches about religions.

Fucking twit.

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How's the smogg up in Jersey? What about that rotten garbage smell at 6am when you walk out to the car for work?

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Originally Posted by DashK

How's the smogg up in Jersey? What about that rotten garbage smell at 6am when you walk out to the car for work?

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I live in Dover, not the NY Metro area.

I go to work at 9:00. I'm guessing Subway starts baking their fresh bread at 6 a.m., and that's your frame of reference?

And this topic isn't about Jersey. It's about Pennsylvania.

Dumbshit.



P.S. - The semen-soaked TP I tossed in the trash last night has more worth than all your posts combined.

DashK is a terrible member.

Everyone knows it.

Magna my boy, ID isn't science and shouldn't be masqueraded as such.

I sure believe in the big man up in the sky, but i dont like when Intelligient design is trying to be passed of as science. ID fails the test of being a science. The issue here shouldnt be about the credibility of evolution (as adaptation through natural selection is proven fact) it should be about the credibility of ID as a science.

You can't measure or observe the existance of a higher authority. Therefore any theory involving a higher power can't be scientific and thats really my main problem.

Loopz is dead on with his crack about "intelligient falling" - that is if we see something highly complex like gravity or astrophysics, we just can't pass them off as being divinely generated or what have you. We have to continue a pursuit of the truth, a pursuit of knowledge. And this pursuit is the basis of science.

To reiterate, i've no problem with ID or anyone who believes in god/literal acceptance of Adam and Eve, but i do have a problem with ID pretending to be science.

If we start to say evolution is only one credible theory, then what next?

Should the same apply to all other scientific theories?

Geocentrism?
Spontaneous Generation?

Oh shit man what's up? Everytime I see you post I think of when you sold me my neo way back in the day. Okay yeah enough of that.

I agree, seperate church and state. Practicing religion on one's own time is cool but it doesn't belong in government.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Science is also a system of belief. I don't really see a big issue with teaching both.

I'm not an up-at-arms, we're all free to believe or disbelieve what we chose.

One can't prove evolution or creation. I fail to see why so many get bent about the issue.

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you can't be serious. you're bringing in the most trivial ideas from philosophy into this discussion.

let me ask you this - do you think it would be ok if leftfield theories about extraterrestials and the paranormal where taught as explaining things?
what in your criteria validates a system of belief? the majority? if so, why?

I'd hate to be a scientist from Kansas right now... I can only imagine the jibes they're getting from colleagues.

Religion and Science should have nothing to do with each other, they're seperate subjects. Funny, when I went to Catholic HS school, those courses were seperate. Because we were a college-prep school, we were taught biology the way the rest of the civilized world learns it.

I guess Kansas has decided it's done with that affiliation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bobak

The middle of America somehow managed to make itself more irrelevent.

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:chimp:

I said it in another thread but Popular Science said that the third worst job in any science field was teaching biology in the state of Kansas.

Edit: Uh oh Bobak took out his slam on the midwest :kekeke: :kekeke:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lagduf

Edit: Uh oh Bobak took out his slam on the midwest :kekeke: :kekeke:

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I decided to aim it square at Kansas. I'll deal with Nebraska when it comes time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bobak

I decided to aim it square at Kansas. I'll deal with Nebraska when it comes time.

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Heh, whats up with their Unicameral State Legislature anyway?

Don't worry - we've got some looneys in MO too.

PS: Jedah Doma lives in Kansas

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

There's a difference between a class that teaches religion and a class that teaches about religions.

Fucking twit.

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Not this one for the most part.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

One can't prove evolution or creation. I fail to see why so many get bent about the issue.

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Same here: http://www.venganza.org/

How would you feel about that being taught in public schools? :chimp:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Orochi Iori Y

Same here: http://www.venganza.org/

How would you feel about that being taught in public schools? :chimp:

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Oh man, that would be awesome.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Science is also a system of belief. I don't really see a big issue with teaching both.

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It's a science class.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Orochi Iori Y

Same here: http://www.venganza.org/

How would you feel about that being taught in public schools? :chimp:

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That's the best website I've seen in a while, thank you :D

(the word of FSM shall be spread to my friends, remember WWFSMD!)

http://www.neo-geo.com/forums/images...pirate_125.gif, indeed!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Theory is theory, no?

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I came pretty close to teaching high school...

Would you want me to teach all of my theories to your kids?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Science is also a system of belief. I don't really see a big issue with teaching both.

I'm not an up-at-arms, we're all free to believe or disbelieve what we chose.

One can't prove evolution or creation. I fail to see why so many get bent about the issue.

---

Personally, I don't want my tax dollars paying for kids to learn about 5 gazillion different religions, and having these children be of absolutely no more value after graduating from advanced Baptist studies.

Basically, the difference is that you can't build a bridge using religion, because it isn't based on facts and sound principles.

I think that Scientology should be taught in Psycology class.

Mostly beacuse I think that crazy fucker hubbard has a point.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by galfordo

Basically, the difference is that you can't build a bridge using religion, because it isn't based on facts and sound principles.

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most religious individuals maintain that their beliefs are based on sound principles and facts

Teaching about The major Religons such as Islam, Hinduism, Xianity, Eastern Pagainsm (Shintoism, confuscism and the like) is pretty damn important.

We got a bunch of retards in the country that don't know shit about them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

Teaching about The major Religons such as Islam, Hinduism, Xianity, Eastern Pagainsm (Shintoism, confuscism and the like) is pretty damn important.

We got a bunch of retards in the country that don't know shit about them.

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True, but many would also benefit from a better understanding of philosophy in general.

While we're teaching theories, why can't this man get into more classrooms?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...s/larouche.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by melchia

True, but many would also benefit from a better understanding of philosophy in general.

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True that...

But understanding relgions is VERY important to understand world events....

Ignorance clearly plays a role in the modern bias agains followers of Islam.

Such ignorance was most clear on the Eve of the Iraqi war when 60-70% of the US population belived that Sadam Had a clear role in the 9/11/01 attack.

Anyone that knows anything about Al Queda/Taliban/Mushadeen and the Bath Party knows that this is VERY improbable.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bobak

While we're teaching theories, why can't this man get into more classrooms?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...s/larouche.jpg

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My old man voted for him like 3 times.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

True that...

But understanding relgions is VERY important to understand world events....

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many religions have underlying philosophies, which is what i was getting at. of course, there are also philosophies that aren't religiously based also, and an education, which touches on some of them, would make individuals more well rounded in their understanding of the world at large. i'm not saying people should be taught to believe any of the theories, only that they should be made aware of them and what they really say/represent.

A course that teaches the history of world religions is quite acceptable and very valuable for understanding both world history and world cultures.

It's the presence of religious doctrine in science classes that's unacceptable, and that's what the ID uproar is all about.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by melchia

most religious individuals maintain that their beliefs are based on sound principles and facts

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ahaha
and that's why we call them morons.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

One can't prove evolution or creation. I fail to see why so many get bent about the issue.

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And right there kids is the biggest bang of them all. Anyone who uses the words "fact" and "science" when talking about evolution hasn't studied it at any real length. You could seat the top minds in evolutionary theory in one room and none of them could prove any aspect of evolution. They will tell you that Lucy is the "mother of us all" but if you ask them if it is possible that Lucy is some part of an extinct undiscovered animal species they can't say "no" because in truth they don't know what Lucy is. Most of the so called evidence related to evolution was shoehorned to fit the theory yet doesn't hold up to any real scrutiny. If you believe in evolution you believe in something you can't prove. Welcome to the ranks of the faithful. Church dismissed.

Jeff

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SoloFenris

And right there kids is the biggest bang of them all. Anyone who uses the words "fact" and "science" when talking about evolution hasn't studied it at any real length. You could seat the top minds in evolutionary theory in one room and none of them could prove any aspect of evolution. They will tell you that Lucy is the "mother of us all" but if you ask them if it is possible that Lucy is some part of an extinct undiscovered animal species they can't say "no" because in truth they don't know what Lucy is. Most of the so called evidence related to evolution was shoehorned to fit the theory yet doesn't hold up to any real scrutiny. If you believe in evolution you believe in something you can't prove. Welcome to the ranks of the faithful. Church dismissed.

Jeff

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lolz

I'm pretty certain adaptation through natural selection has been proven a fact.

Thats evolution bud.

There is way more to it then man evolving from "monkeys."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SoloFenris

And right there kids is the biggest bang of them all. Anyone who uses the words "fact" and "science" when talking about evolution hasn't studied it at any real length. You could seat the top minds in evolutionary theory in one room and none of them could prove any aspect of evolution. They will tell you that Lucy is the "mother of us all" but if you ask them if it is possible that Lucy is some part of an extinct undiscovered animal species they can't say "no" because in truth they don't know what Lucy is. Most of the so called evidence related to evolution was shoehorned to fit the theory yet doesn't hold up to any real scrutiny. If you believe in evolution you believe in something you can't prove. Welcome to the ranks of the faithful. Church dismissed.

Jeff

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sorry, kiddo, but this issue was beaten to death last spring, and the case for evolution has been scientifically proven on a microscopic level. There is way too much actual scientific evidence backing evolution now. I'm too lazy to find the thread, but it's in unrelated. Run a search if you feel like feeling smarter.

edit: lazy, like people who give up looking for the truth and fall back on "god" as an answer. haha.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

But is a biology class a place for religious theory? The theory of evolution is based on science, whereas religious theory is based on belief and faith. A public school is a place for teaching science. Your home or church is better suited to exploring belief and faith.

---

If evolution gets it's share of time in the lesson plan I do not see why religious beliefs on the subject should not be offered as well. Nobody has proven the theory of evolution to be %100 true. Evolution is an aethiests belief on creation. Why is it so wrong to teach both views of the subject? Educating students about somthing isn't forcing them to believe anything. I don't believe half the things I read in some of my college textbooks. Not everyone is aethiest and not everyone is religious so it is not fair to only teach and cater to one single view. Students need to learn about both sides and then make an decision on what they want to believe. I lean more towards the religious side of the spectrum when it comes to creation but I made sure to learn about evolution as well because it is important to educate yourself and know about these things. The problem with most people today is that they go around making assumptions and choosing beliefs when they do not know anything about what they have chosen not to believe in. How could anyone possibly make an educated and fair decision about anything if they have not learned about all of the possibilities out there? Take a look at the many people who were born into a religion and accuse all other beliefs other than their own to be false when they know next to nothing about them. I was born in a Christian family but my religion was decided by me as a personal choice; not my parents. I would never follow a religion/belief blindly, I would make sure to learn all of the different sides first. It is important that students learn all theories/beliefs with these types of things because otherwise they will just grow to be uneducated and narrowminded like most of society is today.

Sure religion is based largely on faith but that is what religion is all about; faith. Evolution/Natural Selection is based on facts but not all of those facts have been proven. Both sides have have faith that their belief is the correct one. Why does it really matter who is right anyways? Just let people believe what they believe in and respect their views as you do your own. If everyone did this then there would be no debate on issues such as this. Having an open mind goes a long way.

HAHA, I was wondering when the FSM would make his first appearance here.

May we all bask in the light of his noodley appendage.


Norton: Larouche is fucking crazy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wasabi

ahaha
and that's why we call them morons.

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no argument here, but it makes them a pain in the ass to have to reason with (especially when they help vote morons like them into office)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thirdkind

A course that teaches the history of world religions is quite acceptable and very valuable for understanding both world history and world cultures.

It's the presence of religious doctrine in science classes that's unacceptable, and that's what the ID uproar is all about.

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I had no idea :rolleyes:

What's so Scientific about id/creationism?

It's a fucking joke.

P.S. Leave the Science to Science class and the Mythology to Mythology Class.

I think the world was formed on the back of a giant turtle.

AND guess what?

There are many many many christians who belive that ID/Creationsim does not confilict with Evolution.

The problem is that there are a handfull of sects whose whole religous doctrine is cemented in taking every event in the bible literaly.... And that all falls down when it comes to creation theory. That's why they fight so hard against such an Inoocuous idea. Because it makes them look stupid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neo Maikeru

If evolution gets it's share of time in the lesson plan I do not see why religious beliefs on the subject should not be offered as well. Nobody has proven the theory of evolution to be %100 true. Evolution is an aethiests belief on creation. Why is it so wrong to teach both views of the subject? Educating students about somthing isn't forcing them to believe anything. I don't believe half the things I read in some of my college textbooks. Not everyone is aethiest and not everyone is religious so it is not fair to only teach and cater to one single view. Students need to learn about both sides and then make an decision on what they want to believe. I lean more towards the religious side of the spectrum when it comes to creation but I made sure to learn about evolution as well because it is important to educate yourself and know about these things. The problem with most people today is that they go around making assumptions and choosing beliefs when they do not know anything about what they have chosen not to believe in. How could anyone possibly make an educated and fair decision about anything if they have not learned about all of the possibilities out there? Take a look at the many people who were born into a religion and accuse all other beliefs other than their own to be false when they know next to nothing about them. I was born in a Christian family but my religion was decided by me as a personal choice; not my parents. I would never follow a religion/belief blindly, I would make sure to learn all of the different sides first. It is important that students learn all theories/beliefs with these types of things because otherwise they will just grow to be uneducated and narrowminded like most of society is today.

Sure religion is based largely on faith but that is what religion is all about; faith. Evolution/Natural Selection is based on facts but not all of those facts have been proven. Both sides have have faith that their belief is the correct one. Why does it really matter who is right anyways? Just let people believe what they believe in and respect their views as you do your own. If everyone did this then there would be no debate on issues such as this. Having an open mind goes a long way.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neo Maikeru

If evolution gets it's share of time in the lesson plan I do not see why religious beliefs on the subject should not be offered as well.

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Because public schools are secular institutions. A biology class is a place to discuss the possible origins of life based on scientific theories that can be proven or debunked through evidence. Religion cannot be proven; it is an entirely faith-based belief system. Therefore, it is not science and has no place in a scientific curriculum.

For those of us who are non-religious, the stories presented in assorted religious texts are no less absurd than Xenu, dead alien souls, and intergalactic B-52's. If you want to fill your kid's head with that stuff, go right ahead. Just keep it out of school.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by melchia

I had no idea :rolleyes:

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I was only trying to support your argument.