In regard to qube's topic.

I think i've clowned around enough today and need to take a little break(then back to clowning)

Take this how you want. I'm not trying to win any awards,respect/internet respect(who gives a fuck). I had to let it out so just take it how you want it.


As black and white americans WE ARE FUCKED. We will never get along. White people are racist, Black people are racist. The legacy of slavery is a never ending battle that will just go on and on and on and on. Shit like that does not and will not disappear.

Black people will continue to blame every single problem we face on White people, persicute whites who know nothing about the old times, live in a "slave mentality" illusion for life, give white people hell whenever we can. White people will continue to think we are stupid, ignorant and lesser, give us hell whenever they can and prevent us from moving to the highest point.

The thing is neither side wants to admit it. Who's more racist, whites or blacks? Everybody wants to point fingers but don't want to point at themselves. Its only human nature but its fuckin ugly.

neither side will say fuck it. Both sides promote it and pass it to the new generations fuckin up their minds for ever and ever. Its a vicious cycle.


I said "fuck it". I joined the military and have chosen to live abroad. I don't wanna see it anymore. I'll never be able to escape it. I don't think i'm a perfect person but i don't buy into the "white vs black battle" anymore why? Cuz i'm much bigger than this bullshit. There is a whole world out here and i'm gonna see it all, fuck the bullshit.

I just had to get it off my chest before I go back to spamming the living shit outta the war room.

+ 1's for everybody.

Can't we all just get along? :kekeke:

:kekeke: :shame: :kekeke: :shame:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

Can't we all just get along? :kekeke:

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Did you even read Spin's post you jackfoo'?! :mad: :envy: :very_ang: :oh_no:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by qube

Did you even read Spin's post you jackfoo'?! :mad: :envy: :very_ang: :oh_no:

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You racist! I bet you hate the French! :shame:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Magnaflux

You racist! I bet you hate the French! :shame:

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Doesn't everyone?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

I think i've clowned around enough today and need to take a little break(then back to clowning)

Take this how you want. I'm not trying to win any awards,respect/internet respect(who gives a fuck). I had to let it out so just take it how you want it.


As black and white americans WE ARE FUCKED. We will never get along. White people are racist, Black people are racist. The legacy of slavery is a never ending battle that will just go on and on and on and on. Shit like that does not and will not disappear.

Black people will continue to blame every single problem we face on White people, persicute whites who know nothing about the old times, live in a "slave mentality" illusion for life, give white people hell whenever we can. White people will continue to think we are stupid, ignorant and lesser, give us hell whenever they can and prevent us from moving to the highest point.

The thing is neither side wants to admit it. Who's more racist, whites or blacks? Everybody wants to point fingers but don't want to point at themselves. Its only human nature but its fuckin ugly.

neither side will say fuck it. Both sides promote it and pass it to the new generations fuckin up their minds for ever and ever. Its a vicious cycle.


I said "fuck it". I joined the military and have chosen to live abroad. I don't wanna see it anymore. I'll never be able to escape it. I don't think i'm a perfect person but i don't buy into the "white vs black battle" anymore why? Cuz i'm much bigger than this bullshit. There is a whole world out here and i'm gonna see it all, fuck the bullshit.

I just had to get it off my chest before I go back to spamming the living shit outta the war room.

+ 1's for everybody.

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I pretty much agree with you man.... I slide in and out of different circles of Blacks and whites on EVERY level of the socio-economic scale. I see how one side views the other. It's the shit you DON't See on TV that really scares me.... It's the subtleties that are prevalent.

The biggest different between Whites and Blacks is simple. Whites are almost never forced to be around blacks on a day to day basis. Blacks however are and know how to cope with it better.

Until whites are able to admit and confront thier own racist attitudes shit won't change. The political correctness movement has made shit even worse.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

I pretty much agree with you man.... I slide in and out of different circles of Blacks and whites on EVERY level of the socio-economic scale. I see how one side views the other. It's the shit you DON't See on TV that really scares me.... It's the subtleties that are prevalent.

The biggest different between Whites and Blacks is simple. Whites are almost never forced to be around blacks on a day to day basis. Blacks however are and know how to cope with it better.

Until whites are able to admit and confront thier own racist attitudes shit won't change. The political correctness movement has made shit even worse.

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We shall overcome the white devil™, we shall overcome. :very_ang:

You know, Spin, I live in a crappy neighborhood. I really hate it. It's not that everyone is black, but that they're all like thugs. Just the other night I had some black guy sneaking around the outside my house at midnight. With the gang stuff going on, two people got killed around the corner from my house (one shot, one on his motorcycle crushed into a parked car by a guy in an SUV). It's hard to feel safe around black people when so much shit like this happens and they're the one's propagating it.

I don't even like being around jockish white boys. And we have way too many of those too. What a bunch of gangbangers those fuckers are. I don't get it. Does playing sports mean you have to get girls drunk to get sex? Half the rapes on campus are perpetrated by jocks. Why do we allow people who are that stupid to get so beefed up and strong? It's as ridiculous as giving morons guns and calling them police officers.

It's a fucked up world dude. You know, in Maryland, I never felt afraid of anyone. If I saw a black guy in Maryland, I wouldn't blink. We all minded our own business there. Same for hispanics. In fact, hispanics are all chill down in MD/DC. Here in NY, we have the MS13, and because of them, my entire block was on shutdown last weekend.

I know it sounds kind of tora-ish, but it's pretty serious. Gangs are part of a problem that only fucks things up for everyone else. People get attracted to the criminal lifestyle, get killed, and help make it ok for people to generalize against an ethnicity.

It doesn't help that I live with a bunch of girls. It makes me a lot more paranoid and stressed out, thinking about what could happen to one of them if someone is waiting late at night. Last night there was a black guy waiting outside our house behind a tree wearing a backpack. Who the fuck needs a backpack on Sunday night? When I went outside he suddenly started walking away.

What makes people that's some kind of ok activity? It's fucked up. There's a lot of people here who should be killed, simply for being raised wrong. Agree or disagree - if you fuck up cooking a pancake, throw it in the trash. Don't try to live in harmony with it.

Well said Spin, well said. It all is truly fucked up when you look at it, white vs. black, brown vs. white, mexican vs. Rican....its all crazy. Tempers flare up even more in a segregated city such as Chicago and I think L.A as well.

Deep down(not so deep for most) people have racist views wheter they want to admit it or not. It sucks more when you lash out against our own people. Like black on black crime or two different factions of latinos(Rican vs. Mex) go at it all stupid. Just for whatever damn reason.

Since I'm here, I'm going to ask Spin a Q. I've been thinking of joining the military for a while now. I know you keep saying dont do it, but can I know why? Can you list all the bad shit that you have seen? I already went down to the marine recruitment center here an they already said I am ok to go, if I want. I got no meantal issues, am on no meds and am in great physical shape. Although I do have a record, but they said that they wont list it, they dont care.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wasabi

What makes people that's some kind of ok activity? It's fucked up. There's a lot of people here who should be killed, simply for being raised wrong. Agree or disagree - if you fuck up cooking a pancake, throw it in the trash. Don't try to live in harmony with it.

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That sentiment is going to upset a lot of people here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AztecNinja

I already went down to the marine recruitment center here an they already said I am ok to go, if I want. I got no meantal issues, am on no meds and am in great physical shape. Although I do have a record, but they said that they wont list it, they dont care.

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AztecNinja Don't Play! + MCRD/Parris Island staff = Quarterdeck fun!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AztekNinja

Well said Spin, well said. It all is truly fucked up when you look at it, white vs. black, brown vs. white, mexican vs. Rican....its all crazy. Tempers flare up even more in a segregated city such as Chicago and I think L.A as well.

Deep down(not so deep for most) people have racist views wheter they want to admit it or not. It sucks more when you lash out against our own people. Like black on black crime or two different factions of latinos(Rican vs. Mex) go at it all stupid. Just for whatever damn reason.

Since I'm here, I'm going to ask Spin a Q. I've been thinking of joining the military for a while now. I know you keep saying dont do it, but can I know why? Can you list all the bad shit that you have seen? I already went down to the marine recruitment center here an they already said I am ok to go, if I want. I got no meantal issues, am on no meds and am in great physical shape. Although I do have a record, but they said that they wont list it, they dont care.

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Spain did hatecrime you guys pretty hard back in the day.

In all seriousness, the Marine Corps is probably the worst branch to join if you want to maintain a normal family life (very high divorce rate), and there's a good chance that you'll be deployed. I had lunch with a number of college students who finished boot camp over the summer, and one of them was already told that they will be deploying to Iraq sometime next year.

Conversely, you probably know that joining the Corps is not about the GI Bill or benefits--it's about being a Marine. If you're looking for camaraderie, discipline, and the harshest physical and mental training you'll likely encounter in your entire life, it might be what you're looking for. I've been speaking to a good number of 0311s (Rifleman) who recently got out of the Corps who absolutely loved their time in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AztekNinja

Since I'm here, I'm going to ask Spin a Q. I've been thinking of joining the military for a while now. I know you keep saying dont do it, but can I know why? Can you list all the bad shit that you have seen? I already went down to the marine recruitment center here an they already said I am ok to go, if I want. I got no meantal issues, am on no meds and am in great physical shape. Although I do have a record, but they said that they wont list it, they dont care.

---

1. don't do the Marines. I'm not biased towards Air Force, i'm just biased against risky moves. Marines is rough, no way around it. Now is the worst possible time to join them.

2. If you have a problem with authority, then don't join. If you still wanna join i recommend the Air Force. Its so much more LAX. I joke around with higher ranking people and with many of them I am on a first name basis with them. Other branches aren't so lax with such things.

3. You can hang loose but don't hang too lose. If you fuck up enough times or even do 1 thing thats considered too bad then they will ruin your life until you get out or even after you get out. THE MILITARY CAN AND WILL FUCK YOU HARD IF THEY FEEL THE NEED TO.

4. I don't know if you live alone or not but even if you do being away from your family will have effects on you even if you aren't that close to them. Its even worse when they send you halfway across the fuckin planet. I love Europe to death, i'm having non-stop fun however i'm a million miles away from my best friends and family. Hurricane Katrina fuckin destroyed my whole area and I'm too far away to help. Shit like that can have effects on you.

5. Even if you choose a job they can always change it and make you do something completely different than what you asked for while you are in basic training. I'm a fucking grunt-mechanic , i chose a grunt job cuz i'm a dumbass, however some of the people i work with are fuckin geniuses however because of demand they are working crazy long hours out in the blistering cold along side me. The Air force has many cush office jobs but the Brunt of our force is Flighline Mechanics like my slave worker dog ass. This can make you have a total hate for the military and dissent will always be in your heart so then you are liable to snap all the time at people.

6. If you go overseas, keep your dick in your pants or wear a condom. The darker skinned guys tend to be very popular overseas. These bitches will bend over backwards for you and they will try to get a baby out of you and if they do then YOU = FUCKED beyond help. They will try to marry you to get American Citizenship and then divorce you and try to find a richer man and live the American Dream from your benefits and child support payments. Shit like this happens on the regular. The military will make you pay for it 10 fold.

In a nutshell the military will fuck you if need be. It doesn't happen in its worst form that often but it can. I havent gotten fucked really but i've seen a couple who have and it ain't pretty. Oh yeah and don't drink and drive cuz if you do then you will be sorry you ever were born, they will hang it over your head and make you want to kill people.

About the branch to join, if you want the most freetime, the most choices of places to go and less likely ending up in a hole with Bin Laden then go to the Air Force.

p.s. I can't stand the Air Force however its the easist to put up with and its the closest branch that relates to civillian life, just with more benefits(medical/education)

Spin, I read this and approach it with some mixed feelings; that is, feelings that aren't really ready to be organized. But I couldn't help re-reading the paragraph while replacing white/black with other dichotomies:

Rich/Poor
Renter/Home Owner
Armenian/Turkish
Arab Christian/Arab Muslim
Japanese/Chinese
Orthodox Jew/Reform Jew
Ashkenazi Jew (descent from Europe)/Mizrahi-Sephardic Jew (Africa/Mid East)
and the list goes on...

Granted they function only on different levels and don't all concern race and don't have slavery as a precursor, but I get a pessimistic inturpretation on all fronts: they all read the same. You can replace 'slavery' with 'opression' or 'disenfranchisement' or any other like-defined term, and the result is the same.

What I guess I'm getting at is that that sort of bi-directional hate ain't unique, and you'll find some kind of thing like it wherever you go. I'll leave it to the sociologists and psychologists to debate if 'human nature' is the root of it. In the meantime, some can only speculate on causes while the better ones work towards solutions.

Impoverished blacks have shifted from forced dependency government to voluntary dependency.

The slavery thing doesn't affect me... maybe it would if my ancestors were in this country when it went down. That isn't the case... in fact I'm new enough to be 3rd generation on one side so I feel no "guilt" regardless of the color of my face. The vast majority of those in this country have a bloodline that was "discriminated" against at some point - of course not as extreme as servitude but I digress. To use it to excuse today's failings is a cop out.

The image blacks have in pop media and attempt to emulate is absurd. "Thug life." Give me a break... many aren't educating/bettering themselves because they simply don't value education/progress. It's not that they can't... it's that they choose not to. They'd rather sink into the shit around them.

I know it's cliched but the whole "niggas/blacks" thing rings true. I have no problem with blacks... no more problem than I have with any other law abiding, decent citizen. How much media coverage do they get? Fucking none, they're not "sellable" I guess. It's the niggas.... they're just as bad as every other form of scum whether that be white trash, spics, etc. They want to bring everyone else down with them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SPINMASTER X

1. don't do the Marines. I'm not biased towards Air Force, i'm just biased against risky moves. Marines is rough, no way around it. Now is the worst possible time to join them.

2. If you have a problem with authority, then don't join. If you still wanna join i recommend the Air Force. Its so much more LAX. I joke around with higher ranking people and with many of them I am on a first name basis with them. Other branches aren't so lax with such things.

3. You can hang loose but don't hang too lose. If you fuck up enough times or even do 1 thing thats considered too bad then they will ruin your life until you get out or even after you get out. THE MILITARY CAN AND WILL FUCK YOU HARD IF THEY FEEL THE NEED TO.

4. I don't know if you live alone or not but even if you do being away from your family will have effects on you even if you aren't that close to them. Its even worse when they send you halfway across the fuckin planet. I love Europe to death, i'm having non-stop fun however i'm a million miles away from my best friends and family. Hurricane Katrina fuckin destroyed my whole area and I'm too far away to help. Shit like that can have effects on you.

5. Even if you choose a job they can always change it and make you do something completely different than what you asked for while you are in basic training. I'm a fucking grunt-mechanic , i chose a grunt job cuz i'm a dumbass, however some of the people i work with are fuckin geniuses however because of demand they are working crazy long hours out in the blistering cold along side me. The Air force has many cush office jobs but the Brunt of our force is Flighline Mechanics like my slave worker dog ass. This can make you have a total hate for the military and dissent will always be in your heart so then you are liable to snap all the time at people.

6. If you go overseas, keep your dick in your pants or wear a condom. The darker skinned guys tend to be very popular overseas. These bitches will bend over backwards for you and they will try to get a baby out of you and if they do then YOU = FUCKED beyond help. They will try to marry you to get American Citizenship and then divorce you and try to find a richer man and live the American Dream from your benefits and child support payments. Shit like this happens on the regular. The military will make you pay for it 10 fold.

In a nutshell the military will fuck you if need be. It doesn't happen in its worst form that often but it can. I havent gotten fucked really but i've seen a couple who have and it ain't pretty. Oh yeah and don't drink and drive cuz if you do then you will be sorry you ever were born, they will hang it over your head and make you want to kill people.

About the branch to join, if you want the most freetime, the most choices of places to go and less likely ending up in a hole with Bin Laden then go to the Air Force.

p.s. I can't stand the Air Force however its the easist to put up with and its the closest branch that relates to civillian life, just with more benefits(medical/education)

---

Having lived at Camp LeJeune (home of the Marine Corp's Eastern fleet) for three years +, I can assure you Spin speaks the truth.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wasabi

You know, Spin, I live in a crappy neighborhood. I really hate it. It's not that everyone is black, but that they're all like thugs. Just the other night I had some black guy sneaking around the outside my house at midnight. With the gang stuff going on, two people got killed around the corner from my house (one shot, one on his motorcycle crushed into a parked car by a guy in an SUV). It's hard to feel safe around black people when so much shit like this happens and they're the one's propagating it.

I don't even like being around jockish white boys. And we have way too many of those too. What a bunch of gangbangers those fuckers are. I don't get it. Does playing sports mean you have to get girls drunk to get sex? Half the rapes on campus are perpetrated by jocks. Why do we allow people who are that stupid to get so beefed up and strong? It's as ridiculous as giving morons guns and calling them police officers.

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shit like this is why I live in Europe. Although i live on a base with people like this(i mean come on i'm in the US Air Force) I can always drive out of the entrance gate into a whole new world(metros who drive golfs). Europe isn't any better cuz it has its own problems however i'm not as familiar with them so its like a break for me.

Truthfully Its almost scary how easy it is to go back and forth between "my 2 worlds". The Military dorms are just like a college dorm. Most Military men are Jocks or Thugs and they all are out for the booze and the pussy. I live in the dorms now and its exactly like a college dorm in every single way. Dudes fight, get drunk, rape bitches(and even other guys) etc. Its nuts. I can't fuckin wait to move out into a village a few miles away.

From my balcony I literally can look left and see jocks and thugs fighting in the parking lot with the police with rap and rock music blaring from people's opened doors and American cars driving fast all over the place making noise and then i can look right just over the fence and see the German countryside villages with little German farmhouses, and German cars driving around. Its literally awe-inspiring. Its literally like walking through a portal that lets you travel to another country instantly.

I'm much bigger than all of this shit. Wasabi I can totally understand and feel your pain, i really can

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Impoverished blacks have shifted from forced dependency government to voluntary dependency.

The slavery thing doesn't affect me... maybe it would if my ancestors were in this country when it went down. That isn't the case... in fact I'm new enough to be 3rd generation on one side so I feel no "guilt" regardless of the color of my face. The vast majority of those in this country have a bloodline that was "discriminated" against at some point - of course not as extreme as servitude but I digress. To use it to excuse today's failings is a cop out.

The image blacks have in pop media and attempt to emulate is absurd. "Thug life." Give me a break... many aren't educating/bettering themselves because they simply don't value education/progress. It's not that they can't... it's that they choose not to. They'd rather sink into the shit around them.

I know it's cliched but the whole "niggas/blacks" thing rings true. I have no problem with blacks... no more problem than I have with any other law abiding, decent citizen. How much media coverage do they get? Fucking none, they're not "sellable" I guess. It's the niggas.... they're just as bad as every other form of scum whether that be white trash, spics, etc. They want to bring everyone else down with them.

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I know many people with similar views... I used to think that this was a perfectly legit view.

But in my experiance, this the people who purport this view often act in a slightly different manner.

That's just my experiance.

Besides that, the flaws of this view are:

1. It puts blacks into one of two categories. I think that is rather narrow.
2. It is ethnocentric.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CrackerMessiah

Granted they function only on different levels and don't all concern race and don't have slavery as a precursor, but I get a pessimistic inturpretation on all fronts: they all read the same. You can replace 'slavery' with 'opression' or 'disenfranchisement' or any other like-defined term, and the result is the same.

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The thing is, the black/white divide in America is much harsher than, your examples of Renter/Home Owner, Armenian/Turkish, or Orthodox Jew/Reform Jew. Most of those things won't get you racially profiled, and I'm sure we've all seen cases where an authority figure automatically assumes the worst about an individual because they're black or hispanic (it doesn't apply to all ethnicities, as Asians and Indians have a much easier time of it).

That said, most disenfranchised minorities are stuck in a self-fulfilling prophecy. While I'll concede that the environment one grows up in has some effect on what opportunities they have, you always hear excuses like 'my parents never encouraged me to be good at math' or 'I had to learn how to grow up in a gang to survive on the streets' or 'my teachers weren't any good' as to why you have these 18 year olds who can't communicate without sounding like aegreatone. Willpower and discipline goes a long way, and I often don't see it in people who continually blame government and society for their short-comings.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

But in my experiance, this the people who purport this view often act in a slightly different manner.

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Ahahaha, how?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CrackerMessiah

Spin, I read this and approach it with some mixed feelings; that is, feelings that aren't really ready to be organized. But I couldn't help re-reading the paragraph while replacing white/black with other dichotomies:

Rich/Poor
Renter/Home Owner
Armenian/Turkish
Arab Christian/Arab Muslim
Japanese/Chinese
Orthodox Jew/Reform Jew
Ashkenazi Jew (descent from Europe)/Mizrahi-Sephardic Jew (Africa/Mid East)
and the list goes on...

Granted they function only on different levels and don't all concern race and don't have slavery as a precursor, but I get a pessimistic inturpretation on all fronts: they all read the same. You can replace 'slavery' with 'opression' or 'disenfranchisement' or any other like-defined term, and the result is the same.

What I guess I'm getting at is that that sort of bi-directional hate ain't unique, and you'll find some kind of thing like it wherever you go. I'll leave it to the sociologists and psychologists to debate if 'human nature' is the root of it. In the meantime, some can only speculate on causes while the better ones work towards solutions.

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You are 100% right. It totally mirrors many of the conflicts around the world. And what have we learned about it? It will go on and on and on and on infinite. Nonstop. Like I said, I'm bigger than this shit and i've seen various forms of it traveling abroad (Europe and the Middle east).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

2. It is ethnocentric.

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Isn't everything about the many different subcultures that make up our country ethnocentric though?

When asked what you "are", how many people here answer American? *raises hand*

Hell, I'm first generation in this country on my mothers side of the family, but overall I consider myself to be a lucky citizen of a great nation, and an American above all.

That's the problem though, everyone it to hung up on black, white, Mexican, Asian bullshit to make any real progress.

I agree with what Spin had to say in his inital post, and I can't wait to see what this thread turns into...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Ahahaha, how?

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It's all personal experiance....

This is probably the most prevalent view where I come from. But these very same people give me odd looks when I'm with a person of color. Or Lock the car doors when they see a black person on the street. Or refer to one of my friends a Oreo because he doesn't act the hip-hop way.....

Or refer to me as a nigger lover because I don't hang out with them on my lunch break and talk about Shotguns, Wrestling and ATV's.*

*This one is 100% true.

I'm seeing some finger pointing in this thread :smirk:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

It's all personal experiance....

This is probably the most prevalent view where I come from. But these very same people give me odd looks when I'm with a person of color. Or Lock the car doors when they see a black person on the street. Or refer to one of my friends a Oreo because he doesn't act the hip-hop way.....

Or refer to me as a nigger lover because I don't hang out with them on my lunch break and talk about Shotguns, Wrestling and ATV's.*

*This one is 100% true.

---

Wahahaha. Well that isn't me.


Calling someone I know a "Nigger lover." Wahahahahahahahahahaha.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ely13

The thing is, the black/white divide in America is much harsher than, your examples of Renter/Home Owner, Armenian/Turkish, or Orthodox Jew/Reform Jew. Most of those things won't get you racially profiled, and I'm sure we've all seen cases where an authority figure automatically assumes the worst about an individual because they're black or hispanic (it doesn't apply to all ethnicities, as Asians and Indians have a much easier time of it).

That said, most disenfranchised minorities are stuck in a self-fulfilling prophecy. While I'll concede that the environment one grows up in has some effect on what opportunities they have, you always hear excuses like 'my parents never encouraged me to be good at math' or 'I had to learn how to grow up in a gang to survive on the streets' or 'my teachers weren't any good' as to why you have these 18 year olds who can't communicate without sounding like aegreatone. Willpower and discipline goes a long way, and I often don't see it in people who continually blame government and society for their short-comings.

---

While I wouldn't say that the black/white divide, when discussing the US, is the most harsh, I'd say that you're right, given the list. When I think of things like this I try to not just focus on one particular nation/country, but rather make an attempt to find situations that resemble the example and try to draw conclusions from that. Analogy or what have ya. While the others bear little or no weight on popular American life, they do elsewhere. And it's in those 'elsewheres' where American problems likewise become petty.

But on this note, I'd be tempted to say that it's more rich/poor, with a strong parallel -something almost synnonomous- with white/black, repsectively. Given we've had nearly 150+ years where slavery has been illegal, it's easier to look at it like that in a contemporary context. But since slavery in the US was race-based, it really complicates things. Chicken, egg, history... all damn complicated variables.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by qube

Isn't everything about the many different subcultures that make up our country ethnocentric though?

When asked what you "are", how many people here answer American? *raises hand*

Hell, I'm first generation in this country on my mothers side of the family, but overall I consider myself to be a lucky citizen of a great nation, and an American above all.

That's the problem though, everyone it to hung up on black, white, Mexican, Asian bullshit to make any real progress.

I agree with what Spin had to say in his inital post, and I can't wait to see what this thread turns into...

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There is a difference between ethnocentricsm and nationalism.

Ethnocentrisim is essentialy failing to recognize the possitives of another culture due to the conditioning of your own culture.

As for being Hung up on race. It's a thing that the majority has created. If you grow up black, asian or hispanic, you will always be reminded of it. If you are black and do a good job, People will be like "wow, look at that hard working black kid".

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Wahahaha. Well that isn't me.


Calling someone I know a "Nigger lover." Wahahahahahahahahahaha.

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exactly..... But I just wanted to let you know why I'm suspicous of people with that view....

but the honkeys didn't know me at the time...

The fact that I knew 2 of the 3 black guys before I started working there didn't seem to be a good reason to eat lunch with them.....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

If you grow up black, asian or hispanic, you will always be reminded of it.

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How did you become such an expert on everyone? I'm Asian, and that doesn't describe me at all. Race it simply what you make of it. My biases and views have been formed from experience, not from the majority telling me what I should and should not think. My opinion of myself is thusly formed the same way, not from being reminded of specific character traits I do or do not possess.

I don't think I ever noticed how cocky you are before this thread :spock:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by qube

How did you become such an expert on everyone? I'm Asian, and that doesn't describe me at all. Race it simply what you make of it. My biases and views have been formed from experience, not from the majority telling me what I should and should not think. My opinion of myself is thusly formed the same way, not from being reminded of specific character traits I do or do not possess.

I don't think I ever noticed how cocky you are before this thread :spock:

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I just repeat what peple tell me.... Then I see if it sticks... I actualy got that line from a ASAM Mailing list that I somehow got put onto...... \

They were complaining about the glass celing that ASAM's face in the coroporate world.Damn near called Elaine Chao A house slave..

I thought that it was a good line... I'm always testing things out... But I do know many blacks who feel like they are always being reminded of thier skin color.

I don't know the history of this thread and just read spinmaster's post but racism is a touchy subject. Everyone to some degree is a little racist and if they deny it they are just fooling themselves it's just a matter of how much and if you act upon it. I'd like to think of myself as a pretty friendly guy whether you're black white whatever but it just pisses me off when i see people who act differently towards people of other race. Maybe they're not aware that they're doing it. Pretty much where ever you go you're not going to escape the problem because people are pretty much the same to some degree. Like shunning the unknown. If a black man went to japan I would be willing to bet anything he'd be treated differently. Or if a japanese person went to live in Africa. I think it would be cool if we kept our race hidden from fellow ng.com members and say 10 years later all met up and discovered who was who maybe that would break a few barriers. Maybe i'm just fooling myself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lycan645

I don't know the history of this thread and just read spinmaster's post but racism is a touchy subject. Everyone to some degree is a little racist and if they deny it they are just fooling themselves it's just a matter of how much and if you act upon it. I'd like to think of myself as a pretty friendly guy whether you're black white whatever but it just pisses me off when i see people who act differently towards people of other race. Maybe they're not aware that they're doing it. Pretty much where ever you go you're not going to escape the problem because people are pretty much the same to some degree.

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That's pretty much how it is... 30 years of political correctness has only exacerbated the issue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by qube

How did you become such an expert on everyone? I'm Asian, and that doesn't describe me at all. Race it simply what you make of it. My biases and views have been formed from experience, not from the majority telling me what I should and should not think. My opinion of myself is thusly formed the same way, not from being reminded of specific character traits I do or do not possess.

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Best post in thread.

Quote:

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I don't think I ever noticed how cocky you are before this thread :spock:

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norton likes to argue more than Wizkid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Abasuto

Best post in thread.



norton likes to argue more than Wizkid.

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Or he's just bored....

There's a whole metric ton of truth to what Spin said, but I think it's for different reasons.

It's not white vs. black IMO. It's middleclass vs poor.

There are just more poor black people so they're much easier to stereotype into this group. But there are "white trash" people who are in the same conditions who act exactly the same way, except they don't have the cool "urban" thing that black people have as part of their pop culture. Some white trash people try to emulate that too (see: Eminem) though, but they have their own stereotypes, cept we call them "rednecks" instead of "thugs" or "niggas".

Wasabi hit on it kind of too.

In my area there are black people in the groups I work with; asians, people of middle eastern decent, everything. Same thing goes with my friends or people I knew when I was in college. You don't feel different or anything around these people even though they may speak with different stereotypical accents or dress a certain way. I don't at all.

But if I go to a party or something in an area that has some poor people that are like dressed "thug" and talk like that, you get suspicious and act carefully.

So yeah, my point is that I don't think it's black vs white, but middle class vs poor class.

The only time race comes into play with this IMO is when you see that so many black people are disproportunately stuck in the poor class as opposed to white people. That right there is indicative of some kind of problem that is more than likely the fault of both black and white people. I can't even begin to explain exactly what those problems are though. All I know is that there is a problem and if we do want this crap to end we have to find a way to fix the problem reguardless of who is at fault.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JHendrix

The only time race comes into play with this IMO is when you see that so many black people are disproportunately stuck in the poor class as opposed to white people. That right there is indicative of some kind of problem that is more than likely the fault of both black and white people. I can't even begin to explain exactly what those problems are though. All I know is that there is a problem and if we do want this crap to end we have to find a way to fix the problem reguardless of who is at fault.

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That's a perfect summary...

But to sumaraize the summary of teh summary:

People are a problem

You can't "fix" a culture, and I think the "black culture" is a huge driving factor for why things are they way they are today.

They have to fix it themselves.

Here in L.A.,everyone wants to be ghetto.

About 80% of Blacks I know,or have come in contact with,claim to have ties with gangs/dealers..with more than half coming from middle/upper-middle class background,I shit you not.

It's fucking ridiculous.

B-

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

You can't "fix" a culture, and I think the "black culture" is a huge driving factor for why things are they way they are today.

They have to fix it themselves.

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I don't think that's the whole problem.

That's part of it sure, but it's not the whole thing.

There's a culture on the other side of the middle class that kind of has this indifference towards helping them. Sure they get some programs that get thought up by some rich white folk who generally do care and want to help, the problem is that when these programs get implamented in say the poor black neighborhood school, the people there are already too broken to really care enough to put it to work properly.

Or the money doesn't get there in the amounts it should, a lot getting eaten up through the Bureaucracy or corruption or both.

The two problems feed off each other. And these are simple summaries of part of the problem that exists.

When you have such huge social-economic problems like this there are no simple answers that can explain why they exist. There is no simple summary.

Holy crap am I being so sympathetic because I just drank a Black and Tan?

The world will never know Dinkins, the world will never know. :spock:

For the record,

I'm a racist person.

Being racist is like being an alcholic...

YOu have to admit you have a problem before you can address it.

everyone else is just in denial.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JHendrix

I don't think that's the whole problem.

That's part of it sure, but it's not the whole thing.

There's a culture on the other side of the middle class that kind of has this indifference towards helping them. Sure they get some programs that get thought up by some rich white folk who generally do care and want to help, the problem is that when these programs get implamented in say the poor black neighborhood school, the people there are already too broken to really care enough to put it to work properly.

Or the money doesn't get there in the amounts it should, a lot getting eaten up through the Bureaucracy or corruption or both.

The two problems feed off each other. And these are simple summaries of part of the problem that exists.

When you have such huge social-economic problems like this there are no simple answers that can explain why they exist. There is no simple summary.

Holy crap am I being so sympathetic because I just drank a Black and Tan?

The world will never know Dinkins, the world will never know. :spock:

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Culture is an enormous part of the problem, and it goes largely unaddressed. People like Bill Cosby open their mouths and suddenly they're Uncle Toms because people don't want to hear it. They think some mystical government interventionist program could make it go POOF! and disappear. No matter how balanced the legislation it's not going to do jack shit without a drastic cultural overhaul... People simply can not be "Helped" until they dedicate their minds to helping themselves. The cycle of dependency created by socialist government programs is clearly doing nothing to alleviate the serious cultural problems... and in turn the economic problems continue to worsen.

Education is no longer "In."

PS: I'll fucking drink you up

I like what Dave Chapell said about Bill Cosby....... He's still that kid who grew up in the streets of Phillia. Every once in a while he's still gonna be real about shit.

The key to helping the underclass is Mixed income neighborhoods.......

Too bad FEMA is going the isolated Trailer park route. They are replacing one Ghetto with another.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Culture is an enormous part of the problem, and it goes largely unaddressed. People like Bill Cosby open their mouths and suddenly they're Uncle Toms because people don't want to hear it. They think some mystical government interventionist program could make it go POOF! and disappear. No matter how balanced the legislation it's not going to do jack shit without a drastic cultural overhaul... People simply can not be "Helped" until they dedicate their minds to helping themselves. The cycle of dependency created by socialist government programs is clearly doing nothing to alleviate the serious cultural problems... and in turn the economic problems continue to worsen.

Education is no longer "In."

PS: I'll fucking drink you up

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Yes culture is part of the problem in a large part.

But there is way more to it than culture than when you have so many people of the same ethnicity who are disproportunately stuck in the poor class.

I tend to agree with you that the problem is more on their culture than anything else, especially because the people who do go to school and get jobs and become "middle class" don't act like that most of the time and obviously are different, and as such get labeled as Uncle Tom's since they live with and are like other middle class white people.

Not because they're acting "white" since they'll still have a black accent or dress a certain way, but because they're middle class and have those kinds of values and behavior/voting patterns.

It's a lot like how hugely successful conservative black people get labeled Uncle Tom's.

Still it really makes me laugh when people say that George Bush is racist or doesn't care about black people or whatever.

His two Secretaries of State, the highest ranking member of his cabinet have both been black, one of them being a black woman. It's one of the most powerful positions he can appoint someone to aside from the Supreme Court. Yet somehow he's racist. :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Culture is an enormous part of the problem, and it goes largely unaddressed. People like Bill Cosby open their mouths and suddenly they're Uncle Toms because people don't want to hear it. They think some mystical government interventionist program could make it go POOF! and disappear. No matter how balanced the legislation it's not going to do jack shit without a drastic cultural overhaul... People simply can not be "Helped" until they dedicate their minds to helping themselves. The cycle of dependency created by socialist government programs is clearly doing nothing to alleviate the serious cultural problems... and in turn the economic problems continue to worsen.

Education is no longer "In."

PS: I'll fucking drink you up

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Look at the shit that Chuck D gets in the Hiphop Community.......

All of those fucks owe him thier carreer and the hip hopers tell him to shut up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

Look at the shit that Chuck D gets in the Hiphop Community.......

All of those fucks owe him thier carreer and the hip hopers tell him to shut up.

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Haven't heard anything about that. What did he say?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JHendrix

Yes culture is part of the problem in a large part.

But there is way more to it than culture than when you have so many people of the same ethnicity who are disproportunately stuck in the poor class.

I tend to agree with you that the problem is more on their culture than anything else, especially because the people who do go to school and get jobs and become "middle class" don't act like that most of the time and obviously are different, and as such get labeled as Uncle Tom's since they live with and are like other middle class white people.

Not because they're acting "white" since they'll still have a black accent or dress a certain way, but because they're middle class and have those kinds of values and behavior/voting patterns.

It's a lot like how hugely successful conservative black people get labeled Uncle Tom's.

Still it really makes me laugh when people say that George Bush is racist or doesn't care about black people or whatever.

His two Secretaries of State, the highest ranking member of his cabinet have both been black, one of them being a black woman. It's one of the most powerful positions he can appoint someone to aside from the Supreme Court. Yet somehow he's racist. :lol:

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I'm not saying it lies entirely on the shoulders of their culture - that's silly. I'm saying without a cultural change there will be no change whatsoever - economic or otherwise.

That being said I believe welfare does little to improve their status. As it is it's a broken system and it continues to erode their culture - it has been for decades. When a culture goes down the shitter the society it's attached to follows suit.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JHendrix

His two Secretaries of State, the highest ranking member of his cabinet have both been black, one of them being a black woman. It's one of the most powerful positions he can appoint someone to aside from the Supreme Court. Yet somehow he's racist. :lol:

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He's not racist, he just doesn't know black people. He's never been around them. Same goes for Poor people.

He refuses to speak at the NBA errr NAACP annual. That doesn't look good. Fuck it, I'd Speak at the Christian Collation/Moral Majority annual if they invited me. even if they called me some crazy shit.

That's why I always wanted Bill Bradly to run for president. He has showered with more blacks than Most politicians have shook hands with.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stinky-Dinkins

Haven't heard anything about that. What did he say?

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Chuck D is always criticising the Hip Hoppers for being to complacent and for not standing up....

He's basicly calling them House slaves.

Basically, he goes through everything that's wrong with rap. Rap is all thug shit. Remember Enemy? IT was a completly different vibe.

It's sad that finally, Blacks have the ear of the american youth. But they ain't sayin shit.

The more Chuck D says, the more he gets ignored.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

It's sad that finally, Blacks have the ear of the american youth. But they ain't sayin shit.

The more Chuck D says, the more he gets ignored.

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They're saying plenty - it's reflected in the culture.

They're saying exactly what they want to hear - not what they should hear. Shit sells.

50 Cent and the like are heros to so many urban youths.

Why? Because they're hard. They're tough. They're rich. They're "real." And they were shot NINE FUCKING TIMES!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by norton9478

For the record,

I'm a racist person.

Being racist is like being an alcholic...

YOu have to admit you have a problem before you can address it.

everyone else is just in denial.

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That's what the Great Jew Conspiracy (tm) wants you to think.