Metal Gear discussion topic

My previous topic about the new trailer informed me that a lot more people than I thought are looking forward to MGS3. I realize that the third MGS game isn't nearly as hyped as the second was, as some people were dissapointed with the game. I personally wasn't. I loved the game, and after reading some things that Southtown Kid wrote about the storyline, I appreciated it even more. In fact, if you are reading this STK, I'd like to hear some more of your insights about it.

But anyway, I just wanted to make a topic about the Metal Gear games. Have theories about the story? Think the only game worth playing is Snake's Revenge? Want to let the world know how bastardized the MSX version of MG was when it was ported to the NES? Tell us all about it.

I would actually like to know how rare the MSX Metal Gear games are. I was thinking about buying them for my collection, but I don't really want to spend a fortune. Also, anyone know where I could possibly get the limited edition box sets of MGS and MGS2? New, if possible.

The Metal Gear franchise overall has been used up too much since Kojima released his 1997 masterpieces of MGS. Before that it had been a decade long hiatus of anyone playing as Solid Snake, thus there was a certain amount of charm to it all, and it didn't hurt matters any that the game actually ended up being a SOLID game.

As far as the best of the series, well from the looks of it, MGS III: Snake Eater may very well end up being just that as all the event take place before the MSX/NES original title and the Outer Heaven events. I say this primarily because Kojima is finally able to pull off something that he's obviously had in the back of his mind for a long, long, long time. Up until now, despite how cool David Hayter's voice is as snake and the fact MGS was in 3-D, I'd have to say the best of the series was indeed Metal Gear II: Solid Snake for the MSX2 Computer system, emulated and hacked/translated into english. *All of the elements we see now were implemented into the game back then. In all honesty MGS and even Ghost Babel for the GBC were all just re-tweaked re-tellings of his 1991 MSX-2 masterpiece. ---Snake's Revenge shouldn't even be mentioned at all, it was cool before I knew better but it's a sad excuse to say it was a great game, and I mean come on.... "Freckin' football players you need to lob mulitple grenades at!???"

With Snake Eater upon us a lot is riding on the franchise, though I hope he ends it here {I'm aware of the PSP MGS "Acid" game} because it's getting beyond diluted in it's execution. I did enjoy Sons Of Liberty and where it went, but it still doesn't change the fact the game dragged out a bit longer than needed. I love how Kojima took facts about the DOD's Dog Teams of Covert Ops who did things for the less politically correct regime of the Cold War and turned them into the whole "La Le Lieu Le Lo" {THE PATRIOTS}... into a future setting, and now going back to the origins should be telling indeed. But Kojima IMO, takes too many freckin' creative liberties with the hardware being used. The U-2 Spyplane was the primary recon plane of it's day, no SR-71s were in operational use in 1964, as were there no Russian Mi-24 HIND Gunships, nor hover craft of an operational use. His attention to firearms of the era is spot on however. I just hope he doesn't make the whole series in the end but a strand of "Digital Tape" within some V.R. Construct, that would truly suck. I've been a fan since the begining and will play them all, but at this point I personally am going to play SNAKE EATER more so for the Jungle infiltration and "Cold War" feeling rather than actually caring about the convoluted script that just goes all over the place and has hardware in operational use that makes no sense.

MERCENARY X99

you know what pisses me off the most? when people say things like "why play MGS? watch a movie instead." Fucking hate it. can't they fucking see the other things in the game? the control, the interactive environment, the AI, the atmosphere ..... etc.

as for MGS2, I can understand all the hate, but come on. it's really not that bad, but 1) the idea of changing the lead character worked. and it was to give Snake a better personality. think about future games. 2) if you think Raiden was gay, then play the Jap version and reconsider. 3) sure, the cutting edge technology crap ruined the story (along with Rose), but still, there were some interesting elements in it. 4) the media hype, the official trailers, and the Demo that was released with ZOE really hurt and affected the game. without all these, the game (and the story) would have been much much more enjoyable. it's like if all the Amazing stuff was already revealed before releasing the game.

also, the GB version of MGS is great. it was way much better than I expected. the gameplay was enjoyable. no joke.

and if anyone is interested in the MG1 and MG2 roms, send me a PM. (MG2 is translated into English)

k'_127 said:

and if anyone is interested in the MG1 and MG2 roms, send me a PM. (MG2 is translated into English)

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Very interested,will it work on the Xbox?

BIG-

BUMP!

*Come on guys we can't be the only three in here who has somethin' to say about the METAL GEAR franchise, or stabs in the dark to where we think things are gong to go.

MERCENARY X99

Some info on Metal Gear Acid (Ac!d?): http://psp.ign.com/articles/541/541291p1.html?fromint=1

genjiglove said:

Some info on Metal Gear Acid (Ac!d?): http://psp.ign.com/articles/541/541291p1.html?fromint=1

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I personally can't stand "Card Games" and the fact the METAL GEAR franchise would go that route is all the more reason I hope Snake Eater is the final installment in the regular series, and does it with class. But thats' just me.

MERCENARY X99

Mercenary X99 said:

I personally can't stand "Card Games" and the fact the METAL GEAR franchise would go that route is all the more reason I hope Snake Eater is the final installment in the regular series, and does it with class. But thats' just me.

MERCENARY X99

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Yeah, I'm still on the fence towards Acid too. And like you, I am not a fan of card games at all. But if any series could sway me, it's Metal Gear. I will wait to judge this one until I see more.

genjiglove said:

Yeah, I'm still on the fence towards Acid too. And like you, I am not a fan of card games at all. But if any series could sway me, it's Metal Gear. I will wait to judge this one until I see more.

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Yeah I hear you. Don't think I'll budge on this note though. I've seen enough card based stuff {Yu-Gi-Oh, Magic The Gathering, etc.} to last me a lifetime and all the cornball tom foolery that goes with it. What needs to be made is a METAL GEAR motion picture with an entirely different twist, and find the appropriate actor to play Snake but who's voice is dubbed and lip synched with David Hayter. *I'm guessing we're the only NG.Com personnel who actually have disscussion over the MG franchise it seems.

MERCENARY X99

Mercenary X99 said:

Yeah I hear you. Don't think I'll budge on this note though. I've seen enough card based stuff {Yu-Gi-Oh, Magic The Gathering, etc.} to last me a lifetime and all the cornball tom foolery that goes with it. What needs to be made is a METAL GEAR motion picture with an entirely different twist, and find the appropriate actor to play Snake but who's voice is dubbed and lip synched with David Hayter. *I'm guessing we're the only NG.Com personnel who actually have disscussion over the MG franchise it seems.

MERCENARY X99

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I have one question for you Merc. Do you actually own the MSX versions of the Metal Gear games? If so, how much did they cost you?

genjiglove said:

I have one question for you Merc. Do you actually own the MSX versions of the Metal Gear games? If so, how much did they cost you?

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No I have the emulated versions for an older computer {Windows 98} that used MSX Launch Pad. Sorry, but I wish I owned the originals just to own them. Sucks that there was never any "Official" English versions of either game as the "Solid Snake" emu/ROM was a hacked/translation done in the U.K.

MERCENARY X99

Mercenary X99 said:

No I have the emulated versions for an older computer {Windows 98} that used MSX Launch Pad. Sorry, but I wish I owned the originals just to own them. Sucks that there was never any "Official" English versions of either game as the "Solid Snake" emu/ROM was a hacked/translation done in the U.K.

MERCENARY X99

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Yeah, I would love to own those too. I hear they fetch a pretty high price on Ebay though.

I don't know if this MGS is less hyped than SOL, I think its sudden change of setting is putting some people off from going completely overboard batshit crazy about the title. Most people were left wondering who/what/where with the Patriots and the La Li Lu Le Lo (which is mentioned in the newest trailer, so perhaps we'll get the answers we want after all) at the end of MGS2.

Also remember we saw a LOT of supposed gameplay of Snake on the Tanker for SOL, but over half of the actual game was spent as Raiden. I wouldn't be surprised if MGS3 takes place over several scenarios over a period of several years. The whole "ReLive" thing to me smacks of cloning (Les Enfants Terribles) and given the fact we see Snake/Big Boss/Your Mom whoever it REALLY is, seemingly beaten to death by "The Colonel", who says we don't start off the game as Big Boss, but finish off as Snake, or another clone?

There's also the mention of "Jack" in the newest trailer, Raiden a clone too? That'd be getting a bit excessive and redundant.

In all honesty, I can't say that I played anything pre MGS on PSX. Never really thought they could be that good. I might as well go ahead and play some of those classics, as I enjoyed both metal gears after that.

Mercenary X99 said:

No I have the emulated versions for an older computer {Windows 98} that used MSX Launch Pad. Sorry, but I wish I owned the originals just to own them. Sucks that there was never any "Official" English versions of either game as the "Solid Snake" emu/ROM was a hacked/translation done in the U.K.

MERCENARY X99

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I'll have to try those emulated one day. The MSX version of MG&MG:SolidSnake still it bothers me. That Konami refuse, to put those on any kind of collection. If they don't think there gonna sell well. On the current console, market how about the GBA. What you think about that?

genjiglove said:

I have one question for you Merc. Do you actually own the MSX versions of the Metal Gear games? If so, how much did they cost you?

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Excuse my ignorance, but what is the MSX? And if an emulator is available, can someone PM me so I can try it out?

Buro Destruct said:

I don't know if this MGS is less hyped than SOL, I think its sudden change of setting is putting some people off from going completely overboard batshit crazy about the title. Most people were left wondering who/what/where with the Patriots and the La Li Lu Le Lo (which is mentioned in the newest trailer, so perhaps we'll get the answers we want after all) at the end of MGS2.

Also remember we saw a LOT of supposed gameplay of Snake on the Tanker for SOL, but over half of the actual game was spent as Raiden. I wouldn't be surprised if MGS3 takes place over several scenarios over a period of several years. The whole "ReLive" thing to me smacks of cloning (Les Enfants Terribles) and given the fact we see Snake/Big Boss/Your Mom whoever it REALLY is, seemingly beaten to death by "The Colonel", who says we don't start off the game as Big Boss, but finish off as Snake, or another clone?

There's also the mention of "Jack" in the newest trailer, Raiden a clone too? That'd be getting a bit excessive and redundant.

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I thought I had read an interview with Kojima where he said there would be no character changes in the game, but I guess you have to take that with a grain of salt. Kojima seems to purposely mislead at times.

Someone send me a CD with the dreamcast MSX emu and the two MG games on it.

Yes.

Nesagwa said:

Someone send me a CD with the dreamcast MSX emu and the two MG games on it.

Yes.

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I wasn't aware such a thing existed.

genjiglove said:

I wasn't aware such a thing existed.

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http://www.dcemulation.com/dcemu-dreamMSX.htm

http://www.dcemulation.com/dcemu-fmsx.htm

Whichevers better.

Nesagwa said:

http://www.dcemulation.com/dcemu-dreamMSX.htm

http://www.dcemulation.com/dcemu-fmsx.htm

Whichevers better.

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I don't know if it would be worth burning that to a disc since Metal Gear 1&2 are the only MSX games I have ever heard of.

genjiglove said:

I don't know if it would be worth burning that to a disc since Metal Gear 1&2 are the only MSX games I have ever heard of.

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Shit I didn't know about that one either {MERC is giddly like a kid stealing candy at the store}, and Genji... dood the MSX was a neat little computer system that had some interesting games on it. The two METAL GEAR games {especially #2} is the primary reason to emulate, but here are some of teh interesting games out there for it.

GAL FORCE {Shooter}
SDF Macross {Shooter}
MS GUNDAM {Odd Shooter}
Green Beret {Original version of Rush N' Attack}
The Goonies {The original version played on the Play Choice 10}
Vampire Killer {Original Castlevania}


theres tons more. *Check out this website for more on the MSX http://darkwatcher.psxfanatics.com/console/zemmix.htm

LATERZ

MERCENARY X99

i was lucky my uncle bought mg 1 for the nes when it was released and i played the shit out of it. unfortunately i was too young to understand most of it and the game basically ended when i was confronted with that giant ass tank that blocked the way. i couldnt for the life of me get past that sumbitch so basically i beat the game every time i got to that part. some shit that sticks out in my mind:

dying to those fucking scorpions
dying to that censored floor if you didnt have the bomb suit
the maze! oh god the maze sometimes it took 2 minutes sometimes it took 2 hours.

never did play part 2 but after messing around with the rom here and there it is easy to understand how groundbreaking this game was. here we are ten years later and the new games are still borrowing much of what was introduced with that game. as soon the msx hacks were mentioned in this thread i searched and downloaded both the MSX emulator and english version of both 1 and 2. took like less than 2 minutes to fins all the stuff.

no 16 bit metal gears is prolly the biggest travesty. could have been so awesome considering 16 bit is the best era ever. mgs was an excellent game and an amazing accomplishment for the time. mgs 2 was also an excellent game marred by a sloppy script that should have taken a ride through the edit room about a dozen more times. im sure it looked good in his head but its an all too common problem of just writing and writing and writing and writing and before you realize it you have one huge ass mess on your hands. usually you just scrap it and start over but im sure there were time constraints and whatnot. the scary part is i listened to every sentence the first time around. prolly the biggest waste of game life ive ever gone through. you can litterally skip about 20 hours worth of the spoken dialogue by holding down the X button and walk away from the game with the same amount of satisfaction as the guy that carefully listened to every word.

mgs 3 looks interesting. i kind of like sneaking through a fortress, crawling through ventilation shafts and camping out in toilet stalls so im not sure if this new one will rank with the likes of mgs. the graphics look amazing though and the new take on the stealth genre with camouflage could prove to be very fun indeed, not to mention another trend setter.

anyway i doubt the original mgs is going to be topped any time soon. it is one of the few 32 bit sequels that left an impact much like the classic original did. it survived the leap into 3D in my view and that is not a compliment i hand our freely seeing as how i hate 3d with a passion (btw NO fighter has survived it and none ever will).

FeelGood said:

no 16 bit metal gears is prolly the biggest travesty. could have been so awesome considering 16 bit is the best era ever. mgs was an excellent game and an amazing accomplishment for the time

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try MGS on game boy color

FeelGood said:

(btw NO fighter has survived it and none ever will)

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why? wild ambition was excellent. just needed little improvements, like better BGs, more characters, and some gameplay complex.

I think KOF:MI couldn't have been done any better. from animations, to the detailed (creative) backgrounds, to the excellent gameplay. all this surpassed all my expectations.

EDIT: that's unless you mean they (3D fighters) can't "replace" the original 2D ones. that would be another story, and yes, I would agree.

Ghost Babel was pretty good. I played it for a good while on the DC GB emulator.
The only problem though is that the screen is really small on the GBC and the radar is almost useless because you cant see where you or enemies are (not to mention where they can see).

Edit: If they redid MG 1 and 2 on say, PS2 (probably would have gone over better on PSX), in a 16 or 32 bit style, added voice and better sound overall, it would be awesome. Or if they just included it with MG3 or something. Seriously.