Are your political views considered left or right?

Left

In politics, the term left-wing (or political left or simply on the left) refers to the segment of the political spectrum associated either with any of several strains of socialism, social democracy, or liberalism, (in the United States sense of the word), or with opposition to right-wing politics.

Right

In politics, the term right-wing (or political right or simply on the right) refers to the segment of the political spectrum associated either with any of several strains of conservatism, or with opposition to left-wing politics.

Well?

Please reply with an explanation if you can (i.e. in the days before we had polls)

I'm for...

smaller government
balanced budgets
strong military with good benefits

I'm against...

nation building
censorship
big spending
needless governmental spending increases
needless restriction of rights

In other words, in 1998 I would have been considered right-wing. I'm apparently left though because...

I oppose unplanned wars with ill-considered consequences
I think GW Bush is a moron.
I support the Geneva convention.
I believe in a balanced budget.
I believe in a strong military with good benefits.
I support smaller government.
I'm against getting us into nation-building situations since our army isn't equipped for it.

I think the Patriot Act is a crock of shit, and if you read into, you'll find that we just gave our right to privacy up. We're are living in a modern day form of facism but people are scared to believe it.

the roker said:

I think the Patriot Act is a crock of shit, and if you read into, you'll find that we just gave our right to privacy up. We're are living in a modern day form of facism but people are scared to believe it.

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????

I just don't see how my rights are any different than they were 10 years ago. Just tell me how my daily life is/will be affected.

galfordo said:

????

I just don't see how my rights are any different than they were 10 years ago. Just tell me how my daily life is/will be affected.

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typical bullshit

if it hasn't happened to you

then it doesn't happen to anyone does it?

the roker said:

I think the Patriot Act is a crock of shit, and if you read into, you'll find that we just gave our right to privacy up. We're are living in a modern day form of facism but people are scared to believe it.

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Did I miss something? Was this Act voted a YES by the people of this country with the guidelines completely understood or was this a decision made by the people elected to office LEFt & RIGHT??
-BB

the roker said:

typical bullshit

if it hasn't happened to you

then it doesn't happen to anyone does it?

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who has it happened to? do you know anyone who has been "violated" by the patriot act?

I'm a registered Republican, but I'm really moderate. The only reason I'm registered Republican is the rule in Florida about participating in the primaries. I plan on voting for Ralph Nader, I really like his platform about cracking down on corporate crime, ending the war on drugs, and can be trusted with treating the environment properly (with respect!).

BIG BEAR said:

Did I miss something? Was this Act voted a YES by the people of this country with the guidelines completely understood or was this a decision made by the people elected to office LEFt & RIGHT??
-BB

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It's how it was voted, but the law is more of a right-wing policy (hence Galfordo's blind adoration) giving the government more control on invasions on our personal rights, in other words, our right to privacy can go right out the window if the government suspects any activity.

Galfordo said:

who has it happened to? do you know anyone who has been "violated" by the patriot act?

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once again, your brightness amazes me, you don't find anything wrong with the government having the authority to run tabs on anyone at anytime they feel like?

Have you read about it?

Do you know exactly what rights we've unvoluntarily (as BB pointed out) we've been stripped of?

It's ok though, as long as it's something released under the guise of terrorism, then its ok in your book.

good day sir

Yup, this thread's going to be free from any arguments -that's for sure

Patriot Act is f--ded up. I had to read a packet of about 300 pages, a year ago, on what crap that act has caused and I'm thoroughly against it. The whole thing comes of as reactionary totalitarianism. Its even more creepy in light of things like torture and prisoner abuse.

Purposefully ignorant

Intentionally unaware or uninformed.

If you don't want to know what rights have been taken away, you won't.

Definition b: galfordo.

the roker said:

Please reply with an explanation if you can (i.e. in the days before we had polls)

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I'm as about far left, as your gonna find. Not only am I an admitted liberal, but I'm *gasp* not ashamed of it! I'm tired of weak Democrats letting the Conservatives turn it in to a dirty word. I see the average Republican TV spot always with a "..he's far too liberal..". Then how do they respond back? With a commercial or an interview, showing why they're not. He called them a liberal. Who freaking cares!? They give them the power by bowing down when that word is thrown about. Instead of saying, "Yes, I am a liberal and I am proud of it! I stand for the good of and the welfare of, the people! I do not put the interests of big business and those who fill my coffers over that of the basic rights of the patients and the customers; over the lives of human beings! Or that of our environment, which we leave behind for our children and grandchildren."

I do respect the fact that now a days it seems Democrats have become more aggressive in getting their ideas across (still no where near as much as the Republicans, but better, none the less) but it seems to come at a cost. As more and more the party goes closer to moderate then actual left. In reality, neither of the two parties is anything close to a voice for me (at least not until Al Franken finally throws his hat in. Franken for Prez 2012!) It's more of a lesser of two evils... and you can't find a more sinister axis of evil, then the Bush Administration, so there ya go.

I voted conservative in the last UK general election (it was more a vote against Blair than anything else). I consider myself fairly right wing, but like Jethrek said, it appears I may be considered left wing for supporting a decrease in government interference in all walks of life (censorship, tax, reams and reams of red tape for businesses, needless government spending, randomly starting wars which the majority of people oppose, obsession with procedure and political correctness).

jethrek said:

Purposefully ignorant

Intentionally unaware or uninformed.

If you don't want to know what rights have been taken away, you won't.

Definition b: galfordo.

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This reply applies to both you and the roker, since you both seem to have the exact same modus operandi when it comes to this - namely, disagree with me and I'll call you stupid.

Very clever - obviously you're scared to engage in any sort of substantive argument, so you choose your normal escape route of calling the person who questions your beliefs ignorant. I guess coming up with examples of how the Patriot Act has affected your life is just a little too mentally taxing? All I hear are extremely vague generalities so far ....

the roker said:

I think the Patriot Act is a crock of shit, and if you read into, you'll find that we just gave our right to privacy up. We're are living in a modern day form of facism but people are scared to believe it.

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ditto
kudos to the roker
It's something I've always thought but never spoken about since is a very american thing and somebody would get pissed if any foreigner enter in this subject


anyway
I believe this thread will bring a lot of confusion
many,many people (especially in the US) associate the idea of left with communism, bringing examples like old USSR and so
let's start saying this is fucking RETARDED
communism NEVER existed and never will
communism implies the ABSENCE of a central state, go read some works from Marx
so what we've had in eastern Europe were NOT communist states, but just socialist dictatorships


about me
I'm used to be a ferocious socialist, now I'm a wise moderate
IMO Bush administration is exactly the OPPOSITE of what a state should have
I go far and saying what you're experiencing nowaday in the US ain't so much different from a typical southamerican militar dictatorship
not that things in Italy are going better
at least Bush got the ballZ and ACT
our prime minister is a whining faggot acting like a badass

I believe in a moderate socialist parliament
in NOT wasting money with military
in a strong healthcare, an affordable(economically speaking) scholastic system
in spending huge amount of money in scientific research

well....you get the idea

1. I believe that any form of government constitutes in itself a necessary evil, and as such should be as small as possible.

2. I believe the rights of the individual must always come before the needs of the State.

3. I believe in the principle of self defense, and the right of a person to defend his property and his loved ones, with force if need be.

4. I believe in free enterprise. Governments should not interfere with, unduly protect, or impose heavy taxes on, private enterprise.

5. I believe one has to prove his worth to society, instead of living like a parasite, abusing the welfare system.

6. I believe in a punitive legal system, based on the principle of retribution, as opposed to "reintegration".

7. I believe terrorism must be considered a military threat. Hence governments such as the Spanish should act accordingly, and employ the army in suppressing it. Military law should be summarily applied to all convicted terrorists, retroactively if necessary.


I suppose I could go on and on, but you get the picture.

@ Lovecraft

I basically agree with most you've said
just couple of things

point 6:
It scares the shit out of me
ever heard about "circumstances"?

point 4:
dont agree. There have to be rules
a completely free market brings to megacorporations and imperialism

kaos said:

@ Lovecraft

I basically agree with most you've said
just couple of things

point 6:
It scares the shit out of me
ever heard about "circumstances"?

point 4:
dont agree. There have to be rules
a completely free market brings to megacorporations and imperialism

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Regarding (6): meh, I am fucking tired of the Spanish legal system. It's a fucking joke.

Regarding (4): yeah, well, there must be some rules and regulations in place, but...

Bear in mind that in countries like ours, the State is a humongous, corrupt entity, which controls most aspects of everyday life, particularly economy. All in the name of the welfare system, of course. But the problem is, most European democracies have become a sort of deviant mutation of what they were once supposed to be. Scandinavian countries are quite good in this respect, but France, Spain, and a handful of others are becoming a cesspool, I think. I just think Europeans should take a step back and stop believing every social democrat's lies. Europe could really be a grand place if there was a definite change from the current situation.

kaos said:

@ Lovecraft
point 4:
dont agree. There have to be rules
a completely free market brings to megacorporations and imperialism

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A "free market" is an economic theory. There has never been and probably never will be a "true" free market economy, and so therefore you can't say that it leads to mega corporations and imperialism.

The market system we have at the moment is leading to mega corporations (import tariffs, subsidies, tax breaks, etc etc). As much as politicians preach about "free trade" they are all talking out of their proverbial asses. Free trade doesn't exist.

Todays interpretation of the left - right, is quite different to when the term was first used in the first French Assembly.
The political sense of "right" owes its origin to the "right hand," rather than the "correct," sense of "right." Delegates to the French National Assemble of 1789 sorted themselves out by political affiliation, the conservatives deciding to sit on the right side of the chamber and the radicals on the left. Perhaps because the words "right" and "left" are two very short ways of summing up fundamental political disagreements, the terms have been used in this sense for more than 200 years.

Double post... oops

Being from Europe I am considered a rightist over there, however the same views here are seen as being leftist.

Differences in cultures I guess, and a good propaganda by E.J. Hoover who managed to make the word socialism blend with communism in the US.


(it is also funny to think that the term "liberal" does have a very different meaning in the US and France.
In France a liberal is someone who is strongly for non interventionist state and pure capitalism... the opposite of a liberal in the US.

Howdoin said:

(it is also funny to think that the term "liberal" does have a very different meaning in the US and France.
In Europe a liberal is someone who is strongly for non interventionist state and pure capitalism... the opposite of a liberal in the US.

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yeah...I forgot to mention it before, good point to discuss
that's why I usually avoid that word

actually you've been even soft
a liberal over here, is a convinced rightwing conservative person
usually, at least, and especially among young people

There´s some depising in the US about the term "socialism".Just would like to remind that the country with the highest quality of life in the world is Sweden, which has been ruled by socialist for about 50 years

Left for me, only i think some idea of the both side are interesting !!!