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Mike
08-13-2000, 02:37 AM
Does anyone know the means to a way of developing (from programing to insert) neo carts?

Gamemaster
08-13-2000, 02:41 PM
Nope sorry but it will be cool if someone can programm a real cool game, but thats dreaming only.

Mouse_Master
08-13-2000, 02:58 PM
I can not recall the website, but someone put together a simple demo that displays text and maybe a scroller on an Emulator. Source code for that is available. Its a start....

Keith

Mike
08-13-2000, 11:44 PM
I have been talking to some people in the developing community and I have found out some interesting things: You need a Neo Development Kit-pretty expensive but within grasp, and a good understanding of C+ and C++.

JMKurtz
08-14-2000, 07:15 AM
Mike,

Who have you been talking to? Getting an official Devlopers Kit would take something short of a miracle. I know someone that even went to Japan to try and get one from SNK and failed.

The second best thing is to look at the demos and tools that are already around from people that are hacking away at the Neo.

From this site, you can get a 68K compiler and a sample:
http://arcadedev.vintagegaming.com/

From here, you can get a Neo CD sample: http://www.illusion-city.com

[This message has been edited by JMKurtz (edited 08-14-2000).]

Mike
08-14-2000, 01:29 PM
Well, if this is the case I hope that someone can crack the code. Eventually it will happen and carts will be developed. I wonder- If carts did become produced, who would the royalties be paid to?

Mouse_Master
08-14-2000, 09:54 PM
What do you mean 'royalties?'

If any homebrew carts are produced, especially from tools people put into the 'Public Domain,' the cart should be free. And let me qualify free.....

The code for the game is posted on the Internet for everyone to download. Then, someone like Jeff could possibly put together a cart for you providing the proper sac cart, and some cash for materials and labor.

No more $500 'official' carts from a company that no longer exists in the US.... The carts would never be official.... Although, I am sure artwork might be created for the carts! http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/smile.gif

Keith

Mike
08-14-2000, 11:49 PM
Keith,

Do you think SNK or any parent company could take any legal action even though this company doesn't exist in the US anymore? What I meant by royalties is, a payment to sort of make the people that could take legal action against "Home Brew" carts look the other way. I may be way out in left field when asking, but I'm just curious.

Mouse_Master
08-15-2000, 03:55 PM
We had this discussion in the chat the other night.

Back in the 80s, Nintendo made EVERYONE deal with them to make games for the NES. Along comes Tengen, who reverse engineered the NES, and started producing games. Nintendo sued, and lost.

Basically, you can do whatever you want as long as you are not stealing code already produced, and you are not saying your product is 'official.'

Besides, for the Neo Geo, there is no one here to go after you, and even if SNK USA was still alive, I doubt they would care.

Keith

Mike
08-16-2000, 12:42 AM
Alrighty then. No friggin royalties to pay, nobody to answer to except the fans. Who wants to try and make this happen now??

chimpmeister
08-23-2000, 09:54 PM
Unfortunately, its not very realistic.

You'd need talented, experienced graphic artists, programmers, and musicians, and I mean people who are EXPERIENCED in creating game-related content for the Neo, or at least for a fairly powerful console in general.

Look at the insane number of frames of animation that go into the newest fighting games like Garou: MOTW or KOF 99. HUNDREDS of frames of animation for EACH CHARACTER, ALL "HAND DRAWN" by a graphic designer.

Or, skip the fighting game category (since they're pretty hard with so many animation frames) and look at something like Metal Slug 3. A number of artists to create extremely detailed backgrounds, then artists to create the many different, and animated, enemies with all the detail, then explosions with detailed debris flying everywhere, etc.

I'm afraid that the people who really know the Neo, the current (few remaining) Aruze employees or those that have jumped ship to other places (like maybe Capcom) are the ones that need to "pass on" their knowledge of Neo design/programming/development to others, and I'm afraid that will never happen. Its sad when a system such as this one, that was so beautifully designed for games (10 years down the road it still stands TALL!) will starve for lack of knowledge as to how to program and create for it. I mean, starve in the case of NEW games; we'll at least ALWAYS have the great older games that are done, at least in the small quantities produced . . . .

Oh, and the final nail in the coffin is undoubtedly the high cost of manufacturing Neo Geo cartridge games, which has always kept the system in niche market status.

Dion
08-24-2000, 12:42 PM
NGF will be doing these.
We will have a few new games that were contracted and created exclusively by NGF for market. NGF has a developers kit and will be releasing games in the near future.

NGF is the NeoGeoFuture.

Dion
www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com)

Robi15
08-24-2000, 02:29 PM
Dion, could you please explain the cost, step by step, why NGF's carts are so expensive? Where does these 100's of dollars go?

Robi15

chimpmeister
08-24-2000, 09:51 PM
Uh, Dion, you're getting a developer's kit? That's really great, except you guys have no artistic, programming, or musical talent, or experience. That may make it kinda hard to make any games, except maybe some tetris clones . . . http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/biggrin.gif http://www.neo-geo.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

Dion
08-24-2000, 10:30 PM
Cost of why NGF unreleased carts is very simple. It is just the price of all parts, shipping, conversion labor, and art pack.

Here's an example:

$300 MVS cart +$10 shipping of the MVS cart
$50 to $100 - cost of sac cart + $10 shipping of sac cart

so far just in the parts you have $370 to $420 in parts and shipping to YOUR door.

Now, it will cost $100 for the conversion.

Total now is $520.
Add return shipping and your total is $530 total.

Add in art pack - ranges frm $50 to $300.

Also, protected games require a KoF99 ($250) plus another $50 sac cart) so that adds to the price, bring it from $520 total to about $700 on average.

Now remember.....these are prices NOW on older games. The longer you wait on certain MVS games, the cheaper they become to convert.

Right now if you wanted a KoF 2000 - the MVS alone is $1100.00. Plus you need to have it shipped to you, you would need a KoF99 ($250) for a sac cart, pay $5 for shipping the sac cart, pay to have the parts shippd to me - another $6, pay $100 for conversion, and your total over $1400.00 - and still no art.

ART is where the cost lies.
Some might say "no way," but look at the last few released AES carts that sold on eBay with no art. They got about 40% of their worth.

Look at the last Neo Turfmasters to be sold on eBay. That game is worth about $500.
But the one on eBay didn't have the insert or manual and only got $140.

So, the art on that game was worth $360.

Collectors and even gamers value the art.
And NGF has the official art to make all the games look complete and match the rest of all your carts.

Go look at any of the NGF games.
Go to www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com) and look at that Slug 3.


I've always said it's the art pack that make the game. Anyone can have a dumb and ugly "black cart."

Go look at all my carts up close at my persona Neo page at:
http://members.aol.com/dkd4/dionsneo.html

There you will see a lot of Neo items.


Dion
www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com)

Dion
08-24-2000, 10:36 PM
As for NGF programming the games. who said "Dion" would program all these games?
NGF is more than "Dion."

We have partners and we are talking with programmers that already have games developed and 100% complete. Once all this goes through, payments are paid, and licenses are signed and approved, we will code them for the NeoGeo.

As we said, NGF is the NeoGeo Future.
We will have our own games available soon for all Neo fans and Neo Freaks to enjoy.

NGF all the way!!!!

Keep checking www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com) for news on these latest games.


Dion
www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com)

[This message has been edited by Dion (edited August 24, 2000).]

charles
08-24-2000, 11:13 PM
Why not subcontract someone to make the conversion parts for you. Then you would be truly "official". Hacking up a KOF 99 makes me cringe... how many will you be able to sac before the community runs out of them?

Just curious.

Dion
08-25-2000, 12:26 AM
For our own NGF made games, we do have all the parts being made for us. That is why we can offer all new NGF games for only $350.

But, they are not protected boards.
We are buying older MVS and AES style boards stock from Aruze for these new games that we will market.

The only problem is that we have to buy the cases and boxes. All that adds in cost.

Sometimes it's just as easy to get older sac carts.

Dion
www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com)

Mike
08-25-2000, 10:09 AM
Dion, how did you guys manage to get a dev kit?

Dion
08-25-2000, 12:32 PM
I just answered that same question for someone else on one of these forums.

We got the kit during the SNK sell-out from Aruze.
We have only one game completely finished right now, but not coded. Chris and a few other NGF members like the game but I am not to "into" it.

It's good game with many different stages and challenges. This MAY come out, and it may not.

There is also another "Shooting" game under development. And that one is all the way Neo.
There will be lots of other suprises coming soon for the Neo AES and Neo MVS. I'll hint more on those when they are closer to completion.


Dion
www.neogeofreak.com (http://www.neogeofreak.com)

[This message has been edited by Dion (edited August 25, 2000).]