Carts vs CD/DVD

When the PSX was released (and now again with the PSP), one of Sony's main marketing points was the superiority of the CD storage system. CD=More storage space=better sound and graphics, etc. But the one area i never heard talked about was LOAD TIMES! I fucking hate waiting for a game to load, and that is probably the main reason why i love carts.

Now DVD's have cut down on load times, but they're still there. Plus CD/DVDs aren't nearly as durable.

Obviously carts have their disadvantages as well. Limited physical capabilities, bulky, expensive, etc. Which do you prefer?

I also have a technical question. Will it ever be possible to mass produce a cart with storage capabilites rivaling other mediums? Or do things like sheer cost and physical limitations prevent this from ever becoming a reality?

Personally, I like carts. You dont have to hold it all delicately and be afraid that you might accidently drop or scratch the bitch. I have physically abused many a cart my accident -- kicking, sitting on, spilling, etc and those mofos still work today. Besides, I like the action of inserting it with some force instead of the prissy disc insertion. REAL MEN LOVE CARTS, DAMMIT!

In order to make a cart compete with DVD/CD based games its gonna take alot memory, chips, and all that funkiness, and the prices will be chunky for 'em. Remember the prices of n64 games? Ouch. Werent they like $10-$15 more than a PS1 game?

I like CDs better. Better sounds, More Storage space, it's cheaper, and it's brings a case with it. I don't mind the loading time or buying a memory card. The only downside is easily damage.

"Obviously carts have their disadvantages as well. Limited physical capabilities, bulky, expensive, etc. Which do you prefer?"

At the moment, I'm still with discs, however the promise of gigabyte chips with DVD costs in the very near future is too tempting to say no to. Within years, it is not unlikely we will see Game Boy games with DVD production values.

anyone who says carts is just NOSTALGIC.

it is infeasable to do current games on carts. we are WAY past N64 level stuff... soundtracks ALONE could not be done, 5.1 DVD sound on a cart? please, let alone all the cinemas in todays games.

i remember some old psx ad, that said if final fantasy 7 was on cart it would cost 1,300 dollars a pop. surround sound and high definition will be THE STANDARD for 90% of games next generation, you cannot do this without DVD.

DashK said:

anyone who says carts is just NOSTALGIC.

Click to expand...

You know, I actually asked myself if I was simply being nostalgic before answering above -- then that all went down the crapper after taking a glance at my collection. Besides the MGS series, Fire Pro D, and Viewtiful Joe, I havent really cared much for anything post 32 bit era cept for the odd game here and odd game there. CDs have been beneficial, no doubt with the huge stoage capacity, but there's been too much much 3D wandering landscapes -- but the shooters kick!

You can grip that SOB. You can actually see it while playing. Has more of a material "feel." I dont need the FMV.....or the Dolby 65.42...or High Def.... as long as the gameplay, sound, and visuals are good, I'm good.

On a side note: does anyone know the approximate size of the average game these days?

Carts due to SYSTEM durability.

There is a greater chance that CD-based systems will cease to function, thus I have felt the need to buy three Saturns and three Dreamcasts in case they start to fail one day.

I like the carts, but I hate having to blow on them to get them to work!!!

I like compact disc based stuff at the moment although i wouldn't be surprised if we moved back to some sort of cart based system in the future with the price of new (non optical) media going down. The only thing i hate about cds/dvds is that they can can be scratched so easily.

I know it's ass backwards but I prefer my games on the "Cartridge" Format vs. Disc formats. Like a durable magazine for an assault rifle, I can drop a cart, step on one accidentally (why I wouldn't know, but you never know)... it can be put through all manner of tests and still play. *I once threw an AES cart right out the window glass and all, then kicked it like a soccer ball across the backyard. (I had to pay for the window of course) ***The game was Last Resort*** and guess what? After I'd calmed down from my rage at the damn "Chesse" factor in the game and having to start half a stage back (this was 1997) and the cart had been sitting in the blistering sun... THE GAME STILL WORKED!

Not only that but I have a soft spot for the format, seeing it's what I mostly played all the way up until SATURN and N64. Discs are cool but too damn flimsy and too easily scratchable. If Saurus and Yumekobo pulled off the stuff they did on an MVS Cart, and then Nintendo got what they got out of the N64, I know there's a future for carts that could do even better. The price should not be as high as it once was for making carts, I think the problem now would be getting the demographics back to buying them since everything is on Disc Format now.

DashK said:

anyone who says carts is just NOSTALGIC.

it is infeasable to do current games on carts. we are WAY past N64 level stuff... soundtracks ALONE could not be done, 5.1 DVD sound on a cart? please, let alone all the cinemas in todays games.

i remember some old psx ad, that said if final fantasy 7 was on cart it would cost 1,300 dollars a pop. surround sound and high definition will be THE STANDARD for 90% of games next generation, you cannot do this without DVD.

Click to expand...

Technically if someone could figure a way to super compress the sound files onto the ROMS in a manner similar to that of MP3s, you could have CD Quality playback. The game would access basically an MP3 file at say maybe "Radio" Quality or even "Telephone Quality" supped up, and at "Telephone" it would still be a tad bit more clear & with voices over the best MVS Cart music. It would just access whatever song it needed instantaneously along with it's regular game codec. *It's just that no one has devoted a part of their life to R&D on something of this sort.

MERCENARY X99

Carts > optical media, we all know why.

And if it were possible to put CD content on a cart, all the better.
Atomiswave and Naomi are both cart-based right?

Besides, I've never had a cart die or have read errors on me. Yea I've seen the typical ASCII garbage on the screen from a dirty cart but you can clean it good as new. optical... forget it, its FUBAR.

Carts...it's a sense of pride to me...THE NEW WAYS MAKE CM85' MAD!!

Seriously, I felt carts just dont die...the CD/DVD, sure you got good sound coming out...yet "Now Loading" is the worst words in the english language...


It's a tough break..I am nostaglic and damn proud of it..sure we have those who have stated about blowing into the cart for the NES, yet SNES/Genesis/AES days we didnt have that...which reminds me...SMS never had that problem...(at least I think it didn't)

Just depends on those certain games I think

Mercenary X99 said:

*I once threw an AES cart right out the window glass and all, then kicked it like a soccer ball across the backyard. (I had to pay for the window of course) ***The game was Last Resort*** and guess what? After I'd calmed down from my rage at the damn "Chesse" factor in the game and having to start half a stage back (this was 1997) and the cart had been sitting in the blistering sun... THE GAME STILL WORKED!

Click to expand...

lol

Back in the day my friend's mother ran over a Super Pitfall NES cart with her station wagon. Well, she didn't so much run it over as we put it under her tires and waited...

The cart was cracked to hell, but when we tried it out...THE GAME STILL WORKED! Unfortunately, it didn't make the game suck any less, so we proceeded to smash it with a balpeen hammer. Good times!

i don't understand this argument for carts based on durability. just take care of your shit. the only advantage a cart has over a disc medium is lack of load times. other than that, they're expensive to produce and are relatively limited in what they can do.

Well, if you're talking about today's games then it's DVDs. They are cheap and have massive storage space.

Although the PS2 has certainly horrified me with some long load times, but it's mostly bad programming.

Carts are too expensive to be feasible without some major technological breakthrough of some kind. They'd have to be super-cheap to compete with DVD technology too though. So it seems unlikely.

Most of my personal favorite games of all time are on carts. I wouldn't want my Neo games ANY other way though.

But if everything cost the same? I'd prefer a system that takes CDs/DVDs AND carts

Carts all the way IMO. I am a collector as well as a gamer, and I love the distinctive look of different styles of boxes. With CDs, every system blurs into every other. I like definition of system software. Plus, the game contained within each cart is to me more impressive than it would have been on a CD/DVD, simply because the developers are forced to make maximum use of the more limited space. I also hate 3D games, so there yah go.

CD.

Better music
Cheaper
Can make backups
More stuff on them
Smaller
etc etc

That being said, I still like carts too.

"Technically if someone could figure a way to super compress the sound files onto the ROMS in a manner similar to that of MP3s, you could have CD Quality playback. The game would access basically an MP3 file at say maybe "Radio" Quality or even "Telephone Quality" supped up, and at "Telephone" it would still be a tad bit more clear & with voices over the best MVS Cart music. It would just access whatever song it needed instantaneously along with it's regular game codec. *It's just that no one has devoted a part of their life to R&D on something of this sort. "

N64 RE2 anyone?

Carts dont break or get scratched when you put them on your table without a case.

Carts are just more durable.

They can make great carts now, imagine write-locked SD card (up to 1GigaByte each now) instead of PROMS... you could get a cart as big as a snes cartidge with the "megcount" of a DVD.

the only problem now with this is price... but it drops verry fast