Semi-serious discussion: Heavy thoughts about God.

Been doing a shitload of thinking lately, since I'm staying quite far from my workplace after breaking up with my girl. Lots of drivetime.

I think for too long I have confused the idea of having a personal relationship with God/spiritual outlook with my own negative views on organized religion. I still view organized religion to largely be a divisive tool ripe for abuse by those who seek to impose their own limited beliefs on the rest of humanity. However, I do know plenty of people who who simply use it as a guiding force in their lives, providing comfort and a certain level of discipline without any kind of need to shove their practices on other folk. I still find it really amazing how similar many belief systems are, yet the gulf of hatred that exists between many of these sects is really mind-blowing.

I, for the first time in my life, feel the need to cultivate some form of personal faith. Relying solely on cold, hard humanity and scientific fact simply isn't enough. Anyone else ever taken or feel like taking a really long, intense look at the forces that drive you and what your overall place in the world should be?

You know there's a part of your brain that's hardwired to have a religious experience when stimulated.

Subjects in a test had that particular part either chemically or electrically (I can't remember which) stimulated without being told why... and a majority of them reported having a religious vision.

I don't mean to come across as being callous, but maybe that part of your brain is just getting overactive lately.

In such cases only what you think matters, nothing else. If you want to follow a form of faith, go ahead. If you like what you are experiencing then you can continue but if you don't you can stop almost instantly (afterall its just a thought at the end of the day).

Loopz said:

Anyone else ever taken or feel like taking a really long, intense look at the forces that drive you

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Alcohol and poontang.

Loopz said:

and what your overall place in the world should be?

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Custodial Artist.

Having some faith in a higher power doesn't mean you have to be some bible thumper. I think just understanding that there is something to answer to at the end of your life can and does positively affect the choices and the path you take throughout your life.

just my 2 cents.

As corny as it may sound, this may just be the good ol' H.S. doing it's job to pull a sheep back into the fold.

Yes organized religion can be a bad thing at times, it's all about finding a good church run by true God fearing pastors and decons. Just remember organized religion can be corrupted, but the message of God is always pure.

Why do you need god?

If life that hard that you want to stop thinking and start walking around blindfolded?

I mean, that's much easier than the life of logic.

My thoughts on God:

He looks like Santa Clause, and has no problems whatsoever kicking you out of heaven for fighting with a sword-weilding girl in a bikini.

Following an organized religion does not preclude the use of logic. Belonging to one religion and having studied and attended several others, a lot of the precepts and fundamental beliefs revolve around the fact that it is your responsibility to make choices in your life. The teachings are there to present you with someones interpretation of what that religions deity or deities teachings were, how they think they were intended and possible consequences of actions that do not align with those teachings/beliefs. But, ultimately most of them do a great deal of reflection on the ability of the individual to chose for themselves, and have a willingness to accept the outcomes of those choices. I myself do believe in God, I just don't believe in a lot of his earthly messengers.

My current prayer: Dear God, if I can hear my alarm clock in the morning, then all is well. Amen.

Loopz said:

Been doing a shitload of thinking lately, since I'm staying quite far from my workplace after breaking up with my girl. Lots of drivetime.

I think for too long I have confused the idea of having a personal relationship with God/spiritual outlook with my own negative views on organized religion. I still view organized religion to largely be a divisive tool ripe for abuse by those who seek to impose their own limited beliefs on the rest of humanity. However, I do know plenty of people who who simply use it as a guiding force in their lives, providing comfort and a certain level of discipline without any kind of need to shove their practices on other folk. I still find it really amazing how similar many belief systems are, yet the gulf of hatred that exists between many of these sects is really mind-blowing.

I, for the first time in my life, feel the need to cultivate some form of personal faith. Relying solely on cold, hard humanity and scientific fact simply isn't enough. Anyone else ever taken or feel like taking a really long, intense look at the forces that drive you and what your overall place in the world should be?

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Sorry to hear about your breakup, I hope it wasn't to terrible.
But I believe in God ,life feels better to believe in something. .......my two cents

I've dealt with some pretty severe depression and anxiety for over half my life (I'm 24). Simply put, whenever I'm feeling REALLY low it comforts me to know that someday, I'll be re-acquainted with lost family and friends. I know that may sound sappy, but eternal happiness is a hard thing to NOT look forward to (and strive for) when you're stuck in a rut.

I dunno-

Look at it this way - a religion, will provide you happiness and guidance on earth. And when you die, if said religion is true, there will be benefits in death.

Atheism won't really emotionally help you in life, and it offers no benefits in death.

I mean, what do you have to lose from taking up a religion?

Franco Bash said:

Following an organized religion does not preclude the use of logic. Belonging to one religion and having studied and attended several others, a lot of the precepts and fundamental beliefs revolve around the fact that it is your responsibility to make choices in your life. The teachings are there to present you with someones interpretation of what that religions deity or deities teachings were, how they think they were intended and possible consequences of actions that do not align with those teachings/beliefs. But, ultimately most of them do a great deal of reflection on the ability of the individual to chose for themselves, and have a willingness to accept the outcomes of those choices. I myself do believe in God, I just don't believe in a lot of his earthly messengers.

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I gotta' back up Don on this one. This more or less sums it up Loopz. Those feelings you have (i.e. the hunger) for something beyond yourself are normal man. In truth all humans have it and at times feel exactly what you're feeling because we are to be in a relationship with the divine creator. However, most of us are so used to a life of "Double Think" and "Double Talk" just as quickly as something bigger than ourselves becomes a factor most of us blow it off and convince ourselves that's it's silly or we didn't just have that ackward moment of spiritual need. This is more or less how I came to Jesus and became "Born Again". I had the basics down from my parents, but they were both back sliding... between 17 and 21 I was a Buddhist and to this day most of them behave more like a Chrisitan is supossed to than Christians do, they just don't believe in Christ or in a divine creator. Somewhere in that fray I fell apart, and I just knew without knowing how I knew that I had to get my butt back in line with Chrisitanity. ---That meant I left the Buddhist sect and found the "Religion" of Christianity, but I had two more years of ups and downs with that before accepting Christ personally and actually applying faith to that... thus that was the method/"The Religion" of it all, not any kind of personal growth or relationship/application of GOD. Personally I'd say that was the time that GOD tested me. Things happened to me, family members and in general that made no logical sense, but happend (generally for the better) and there was no doubt it was GOD. *Now I'm "Born Again" and it's harder than before. I know what Jesus commands us to do, and that we are to turn the other cheek but I always don't.

This stems more from the fact that I understand now that GOD never intended for me to have a personality transplant from the "Go-Getter, Adventerous, deep thinking, warrior" I always was... it just meant that that same gusto would be applied to his (GOD's) divine appointment, and as I grow certain things will grow less and less important to me, while still retaining the very personality that was molded in Heaven before my Earth father's sperm fertilized the egg in this realm that became the vessel for the man typing this on the edge of cyber space. *What's important LOOPZ is to form that relationship with GOD the father in the belief that Jesus Christ is messiah, and then merely to fight the good fight on a daily basis in your willingness to share with others the infalliable truth most want to stone you for. While it can be argued that there may be better ways of doing it... you can only do it in the way that is right for you. A guy who's never spent time in prison isn't going to reach people in prison ministries, and a cardigan sweater wearing rich boy isn't going to sway hardcore bad asses unless that guy was/is still a Predator in a sheep's clothing.... and vise versa. YOU WILL however, make more mistakes than you ever dreamed up, and mark my word dawg... every human being saved or not will SIN at least 180 times in one day. Most transgressions are so seemingly benign to us that we don't know it... also the reason Christ died for the sin's of man, because we're just clueless. So I'd like to encourage whatever you're feeling right now directed towards GOD. Find a group of people who are learning/teaching out of the HOLY BIBLE and not just formulating a "Feel Good" seminar, and from there the fight will be on... learning more about yourself and what your level of involvement in the war against deception (ultimately Satan) is, and how to better avoid being only a "born again" who's GOD given talents/gifts only serve the congregational religion and it's own aims, versus the much bigger and endless boundaries of the spiritual faith you have in and with Jesus Christ. Leading you on when all seems like it's unwinnable.

...Just my $5.00 entry.

MERCENARY X99

c.t.h said:

I dunno-

Look at it this way - a religion, will provide you happiness and guidance on earth. And when you die, if said religion is true, there will be benefits in death.

Atheism won't really emotionally help you in life, and it offers no benefits in death.

I mean, what do you have to lose from taking up a religion?

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haha, you know what? c.t.h. is right, actually

Being able to have faith in a religion is something that makes alot of people, all over the world, much happier than they'd be if they didn't believe. I can admit it.

But for me, I can never 'suspend my disbelief' enough to be able to accept any religion as true. It all just smacks of incredibly predictable bullshit.

I remember a long time ago, in this forum, when I said I was an Atheist- some guy asked me "Wouldn't I rather know that after I die I would go to heaven and be able to be with my loved ones again? Doesn't the idea of never seeing the people you love again disturb you?" Well, YES it fucking disturbs me. Of course it does- but I cannot try and bullshit myself into having 'faith' in ideas my logical, thinking brain tells me are nonsense.

Hell, I'd probably be alot happier if I could override logic and just throw my brain into a state of comforting religious belief.

And, in the end, I think that having a comforting faith can be very beneficial to certain people. There are some religious people who really do 'walk the talk' and those cats are seriously admirable. Unfortunately- the flip side of the coin (and one of the reasons I don't buy into religion, oddly enough) is that alot of religious types (Christians in my circles) are a bunch of overbearing, judgemental, hypocritical bastards who sicken me.

But that's a whole other discussion.

To sum up Loopz- just always remember that God hates fags and you'll be just fine

SonGohan said:

My thoughts on God:

He looks like Santa Clause, and has no problems whatsoever kicking you out of heaven for fighting with a sword-weilding girl in a bikini.

Click to expand...

I'm an athiest and to be honest I have found that life is easier knowing that you can explain tragedy's without saying "It was just God's will"

Too many things in life get passed off with that excuse and always made me question the higher power thing (Yes I know it's Vince McMahon)

According to the bible the earth is only a few thousand years old but science has proven that to be false. Also the bible claims that the Earth is the only planet with life...that as well is false.

Look up at the stars..there are billions. With most of the stars there are planets so for the sake of argument let's say 2 planets to every star....minimum 2 billion.

Now do you really think that on a scale as big as that, we are alone?

There are too many inconsistencies in all religious beliefs and typically instead of facing the problems they usually just pass it off or atack the one who questions it.

Lame. All the cool kids are Atheists.

"Could god himself microwave a burrito so hot that even he couldn't eat it?"

_Homer Simpson_

The meaning of life is fucking(well, procreation). And if you're not fucking right now, then you might as well be dead.

God, religion, dogma, the unexplained, the supernatural, the paranormal....whatever the fuck you want to call it, means nothing to me.

I so much want to believe that life has meaning, that we all have a purpose, but I know it's not the truth. The truth is, we're all a part of a natural process, and when we die that's the end.

Loopz said:

Been doing a shitload of thinking lately, since I'm staying quite far from my workplace after breaking up with my girl. Lots of drivetime.

I think for too long I have confused the idea of having a personal relationship with God/spiritual outlook with my own negative views on organized religion. I still view organized religion to largely be a divisive tool ripe for abuse by those who seek to impose their own limited beliefs on the rest of humanity. However, I do know plenty of people who who simply use it as a guiding force in their lives, providing comfort and a certain level of discipline without any kind of need to shove their practices on other folk. I still find it really amazing how similar many belief systems are, yet the gulf of hatred that exists between many of these sects is really mind-blowing.

I, for the first time in my life, feel the need to cultivate some form of personal faith. Relying solely on cold, hard humanity and scientific fact simply isn't enough. Anyone else ever taken or feel like taking a really long, intense look at the forces that drive you and what your overall place in the world should be?

Click to expand...

Yup, started studying taoism about three years ago.

tsukaesugi said:

You know there's a part of your brain that's hardwired to have a religious experience when stimulated.

Subjects in a test had that particular part either chemically or electrically (I can't remember which) stimulated without being told why... and a majority of them reported having a religious vision.

I don't mean to come across as being callous, but maybe that part of your brain is just getting overactive lately.

Click to expand...

Is that the same part of the brain responsible for sexual ecstasy when stimulated? It would explain a lot why males and females go 'Oh god, oh god, oh god!!!' during a sexual act.

neobuyer said:

haha, you know what? c.t.h. is right, actually

Being able to have faith in a religion is something that makes alot of people, all over the world, much happier than they'd be if they didn't believe. I can admit it.

But for me, I can never 'suspend my disbelief' enough to be able to accept any religion as true. It all just smacks of incredibly predictable bullshit.

I remember a long time ago, in this forum, when I said I was an Atheist- some guy asked me "Wouldn't I rather know that after I die I would go to heaven and be able to be with my loved ones again? Doesn't the idea of never seeing the people you love again disturb you?" Well, YES it fucking disturbs me. Of course it does- but I cannot try and bullshit myself into having 'faith' in ideas my logical, thinking brain tells me are nonsense.

Hell, I'd probably be alot happier if I could override logic and just throw my brain into a state of comforting religious belief.

And, in the end, I think that having a comforting faith can be very beneficial to certain people. There are some religious people who really do 'walk the talk' and those cats are seriously admirable. Unfortunately- the flip side of the coin (and one of the reasons I don't buy into religion, oddly enough) is that alot of religious types (Christians in my circles) are a bunch of overbearing, judgemental, hypocritical bastards who sicken me.

But that's a whole other discussion.

To sum up Loopz- just always remember that God hates fags and you'll be just fine

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Nice that I read your post before posting myself, because I would have ended up writing more or less the same. LOL. However: I am basically an agnostic, rather than an atheist. I do not believe in the existence of any god, but I would rather there was one (or two, or three, the more the merrier). The obvious fact that there is no such a thing as an afterlife is pretty much scaring to me. Personally I would love to enjoy Valhalla (from a consumer's point of view, I find Norse religion much to my taste), but alas! I fear it is not to be.

c.t.h said:

I mean, what do you have to lose from taking up a religion?

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Dignity.

In the sense that if you truly value truth, you cannot fully value faith. And if you want to follow the path of truth, you'd betray yourself on the path of faith. Compromises, I guess.

The concept of god is based on faith, not truth. We cannot factualize the existence of a God beyond money. But people can rationalize the existence of a God and very well put faith in a kind God that loves people.

In my opinion though, this is simply self delusion. I'll do okay without a fantasy beyond that which I already live.

You're alive for a little while....then you're dead. Forvever.

If there is a god he would be like a big cloud over the sea...
And we are raindrops.
We fall to earth and take different paths....some find beautiful streams....others wind up in the gutter....
With every transition from drop to trickle to stream to river....that raindrop "dies" only to realize it becomes part of something greater until one day it finds the sea and is reunited with its cloud....only to start again....

I really wish I could believe this shit....I thought it up in highschool when contemplating the meaning of life/what happens when you die...but recently I experienced one night what it trully means to die...and it was oblivion...I have trouble even picturing it in my head...it's LESS than nothing because nothing can be percieved. Sorry if that takes the wind out of your sails, to NE1 looking to find God/comfort, but humanity just isn't important(spiritual) enough to remain conscious after death, we are nothing but worthless, proliferating, bacteria and our "souls" are nothing more than some recycled static charge passing over the earths mantle.

This however doesn't prove that "god" is non-existent...ask your self what pain, sorrow, joy, thought or hell, even what THEORY is...it is nothing physically, yet it is something POTENTIALLY.
Like the cloud which COULD make a river, or keep a tree alive, the same can be said about GOD: he is everywhere, but thats impossible, unless you're nowhere which does technically surround everything...so in closing I leave you with this summarry of how shit works:

Matter(everything in existence)
l
V
Space(where things COULD exist)
l
V
Way the fuck out there (your thoughts, POTENTIAL, GOD, Things that cant be measured or even percieved in some cases)

If there is a god he would be like a big cloud over the sea...
And we are raindrops.
We fall to earth and take different paths....some find beautiful streams....others wind up in the gutter....
With every transition from drop to trickle to stream to river....that raindrop "dies" only to realize it becomes part of something greater until one day it finds the sea and is reunited with its cloud....only to start again....

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Thats how they describe Brahman. Wierd.

The point of most religions though is how to live your life, not necessarily the belief in any god. (although most do emphasize it)